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Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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Old 08-05-2010, 11:55 AM   #166
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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But your definition of marriage as two people is necessarily as limiting as defining what gender those two people are. The comparison between gay marriage, straight marriage, polygamy and so forth is legit. The problem as I see it isn't whether the gov't should legally recognize gay marriage but why the gov't recognizes marriage at all. It is social contract that really shouldn't be ordained by the gov't because then it forces the gov't to then decree what is "right" and what is "wrong". The gov't ought to get out of the marriage business. That fixes the whole argument. We have bigger issues to deal with really. Issues that actually affect all of us.

Here here
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Old 08-05-2010, 11:56 AM   #167
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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But your definition of marriage as two people is necessarily as limiting as defining what gender those two people are. The comparison between gay marriage, straight marriage, polygamy and so forth is legit. The problem as I see it isn't whether the gov't should legally recognize gay marriage but why the gov't recognizes marriage at all. It is social contract that really shouldn't be ordained by the gov't because then it forces the gov't to then decree what is "right" and what is "wrong". The gov't ought to get out of the marriage business. That fixes the whole argument. We have bigger issues to deal with really. Issues that actually affect all of us.
I'm with your premise, however the gov't (state, not Fed) does have to be involved to a point with adoption/welfare of children, dispostion of property in the event of divorce or death with no will, etc.

I don't agree with gay marriage, but if that's what someone wants to do, have at it. To me the Fed should get out of the "defining marriage" business one way or the other. This is a state level issue IMO. If there comes a time where there's a dispute between states concerning gay marriage that needs to be settled, let the SCOTUS do it's job and decide the specific dispute, not try to legislate gay marriage laws on a national level.
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:04 PM   #168
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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A comrade in arms, I like you already. This is great stuff.

saden, you're just a few years away from the conservative table. You can sit between me and LastDon. Don't worry you can thank us later.
TheLastDon always tells me there is no hope for me so drink up, enjoy yourselves and don't wait for me cause I ain't coming. Plus you probably don't want me there as I might set the tent on fire.
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:05 PM   #169
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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I'm guessing two dudes being married does involve the sodomy... lol
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:05 PM   #170
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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Originally Posted by FRPLG View Post
But your definition of marriage as two people is necessarily as limiting as defining what gender those two people are. The comparison between gay marriage, straight marriage, polygamy and so forth is legit. The problem as I see it isn't whether the gov't should legally recognize gay marriage but why the gov't recognizes marriage at all. It is social contract that really shouldn't be ordained by the gov't because then it forces the gov't to then decree what is "right" and what is "wrong". The gov't ought to get out of the marriage business. That fixes the whole argument. We have bigger issues to deal with really. Issues that actually affect all of us.
I've got no issues with that. I didn't mean to limit anything by saying two people. But how does beastiality or incest enter the conversation?
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:09 PM   #171
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33 View Post
I'm with your premise, however the gov't (state, not Fed) does have to be involved to a point with adoption/welfare of children, dispostion of property in the event of divorce or death with no will, etc.

I don't agree with gay marriage, but if that's what someone wants to do, have at it. To me the Fed should get out of the "defining marriage" business one way or the other. This is a state level issue IMO. If there comes a time where there's a dispute between states concerning gay marriage that needs to be settled, let the SCOTUS do it's job and decide the specific dispute, not try to legislate gay marriage laws on a national level.
I agree
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:09 PM   #172
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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I'm with your premise, however the gov't (state, not Fed) does have to be involved to a point with adoption/welfare of children, dispostion of property in the event of divorce or death with no will, etc.

I don't agree with gay marriage, but if that's what someone wants to do, have at it. To me the Fed should get out of the "defining marriage" business one way or the other. This is a state level issue IMO. If there comes a time where there's a dispute between states concerning gay marriage that needs to be settled, let the SCOTUS do it's job and decide the specific dispute, not try to legislate gay marriage laws on a national level.
This whole thing is about one state not recognizing marriage performed in another state as much as gay marriage itself. I believe there are cases pending regarding whether states that banned gay should recognize marriage licenses of a gay couple from another state.
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:09 PM   #173
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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I'll never understand why this is such a big deal. If two consenting adults want to get married, fine. If someone feels marriage should only be between a man and a woman, I can understand that and I'm ok with that debate. But comparing gay marriage to beastiality, sodomy, and incest? Sorry but you lost me with that line of caveman thinking.
You didn't answer my question.

So then, if I have three 16 year old cousins, then I should be able to marry them and have children with them?

Let's just say they're all 18 but they're my first cousins. Are you cool with that? If they consent it should be all good right? If I was a Mormon or a Muslim then it would be part of my religion.
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:16 PM   #174
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

So if we allow gay marriage, that opens the flood gates to people marrying their cousins or their dog?
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:24 PM   #175
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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So if we allow gay marriage, that opens the flood gates to people marrying their cousins or their dog?
Why wouldn't it? Can you tell me why it wouldn't? I'm already told I have accept transexuals or people who have had sex changes. If a Federal judge can tell the voters that their social norms and values are un-Constitutional, tell me how polygammy wouldn't come up? There are tons of them in Utah and it's accepted all over the world, especially in the Islamic world and Africa. If a Federal judge can say it's alright for a woman to stick a close hanger in between her legs, then why can't I stick a needle in my arm? It's my body right?

I would be fine with this being a state's rights issue. The states have no rights now because they get in the way of the progressive agenda.

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Old 08-05-2010, 12:45 PM   #176
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Right now we're talking about gay marriage. Let's cross one bridge at a time.
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:46 PM   #177
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

Polygamy should be legal if it is between consenting adults. Pedophilia should not be legal...you can wait a few years to bang your cousin TTL. We're not preventing you from satisfying your lust for your cousin, we just want to make sure she has reached the age of mental maturity.

Oh and if you ever decide goat-loving is your thing don't expect that to be legalized until goats can vocalize their will. The law against animal cruelty is permanent.
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:49 PM   #178
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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TheLastDon always tells me there is no hope for me so drink up, enjoy yourselves and don't wait for me cause I ain't coming. Plus you probably don't want me there as I might set the tent on fire.
LOL. I feel his pain, I've been waiting for my brother-in-law to see the light for over 10 years.
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Old 08-05-2010, 12:56 PM   #179
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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Right now we're talking about gay marriage. Let's cross one bridge at a time.
I'm looking at the storm, not the hail. We're talking about the sexual norms of a society. Californians have defined it for themselves but a judge said eff you, your votes don't count.
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Old 08-05-2010, 01:00 PM   #180
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Re: Steve Young's family up against Mormon church on Prop. 8

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So then, if I have three 16 year old cousins, then I should be able to marry them and have children with them? That doesn't infringe on your rights? I should be able to do that right? They do it in Saudi Arabia, why not here? If American culture means nothing now, then I should be able to act as I please right?
I dunno. Those were just some lyrics to a Ben Harper song. So, if you don't like my fire, then don't come around, cause I'm gonna burn one down.
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