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Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Old 06-18-2010, 08:09 PM   #16
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Originally Posted by Schneed10 View Post
Total up the millions being spent on death row cases, divide it by the number of taxpayers in this country, and you're talking about a cost of no more than $1 per taxpayer per year.

Sometimes it's important to keep numbers in perspective. "Millions" is nothing when it comes to the US budget.

Yes, I'll gladly pay my $1 to see these people get what's coming.
My guess is that a school near you is firing teachers because there is not enough money. So let me put the equation this way: abolish the death penalty and provide better educations by keeping teachers on the job or keep killing people and provide worse educations because teachers must be fired.
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Old 06-18-2010, 09:38 PM   #17
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Originally Posted by firstdown View Post
Not many people are convicted in todays world without DNA evidence to convict them. I say when we are 100% sure we have the right person give them one appeal then death.
Dna gets screwed up all the time,the lab here in houston has fucked up so many cases its unreal.Also I watched a show the iother night and part of it was about some woman who had 4 kids and none of them matched her dna.So its pretty damn hard to be 100% sure.As far as the death penalty is concerned,I dont care if they keep it or do away with it
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Old 06-21-2010, 08:45 AM   #18
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Originally Posted by Trample the Elderly View Post
It's not about the money. It's about justice. And don't give me all that jazz about innocent people getting convicted. More innocent people die every year on our highways than have ever been mistakenly executed by the criminal justice system. That's life!
Dude, you're smarter than this. Just because innocent people die every day doesn't justify killing them intentionally. Is-Ought Confusion.

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All of you moralist will whistle a different tune when your wife, mother, or daughter is raped and strangled to death by an illegal alien.
Another fallacy -- Appeal to Emotion maybe?
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Old 06-21-2010, 09:41 AM   #19
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Originally Posted by Lotus View Post
My guess is that a school near you is firing teachers because there is not enough money. So let me put the equation this way: abolish the death penalty and provide better educations by keeping teachers on the job or keep killing people and provide worse educations because teachers must be fired.
So....your ok with firing teachers to pay for "housing" prisoners for life? OR did you just want to let em' all go so we can save that expense in order to hire more teachers?
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Old 06-21-2010, 11:21 AM   #20
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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So....your ok with firing teachers to pay for "housing" prisoners for life? OR did you just want to let em' all go so we can save that expense in order to hire more teachers?
I say let 'em all go, and make them teach our kids.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:09 AM   #21
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Originally Posted by Lotus View Post
My guess is that a school near you is firing teachers because there is not enough money. So let me put the equation this way: abolish the death penalty and provide better educations by keeping teachers on the job or keep killing people and provide worse educations because teachers must be fired.
Public schools are largely supported by local real estate taxes, not the federal budget. Some of the poorer areas get supported by federal money. But my school district is doing fine, and that's all I give a rat's ass about.

Your point does not withstand. The millions we "waste" on the death penalty amounts to a drop in the bucket for even the poorest of Americans.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:15 AM   #22
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

The death penalty should be abolished for so many reasons. The cost, the hypocrisy of it, the fact that too many innocent people are wrongly put to death, etc. It's just barbaric. As a so called "civilized" society we should be better than this.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:29 AM   #23
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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The death penalty should be abolished for so many reasons. The cost, the hypocrisy of it, the fact that too many innocent people are wrongly put to death, etc. It's just barbaric. As a so called "civilized" society we should be better than this.
Part of the state's authority in administering justice is to provide retribution to the victims and society in general. Someone rapes/murders my wife, sister or kills my son, godson, or niece, the state damn well better execute the SOB. If not, I'd do everything in my power to find a way to handle it.

The number of innocent people executed is extremely small and even smaller with today's better technology. What about the people who commit murder that would classify as a death penalty punishment, aren't they barbaric? A civilized society is ruled by laws, and violation of those laws requires punishment.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:32 AM   #24
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Originally Posted by GhettoDogAllStars View Post
I say let 'em all go, and make them teach our kids.
Death Penalty? maybe
MAKE them teach our kids......to cruel even for me......
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:37 AM   #25
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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So how many innocent people are wrongly put to death?
Isn't just one person one too many?

Wrongful execution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Alot of good info on this site

Death Penalty Information Center
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:45 AM   #26
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33 View Post
Part of the state's authority in administering justice is to provide retribution to the victims and society in general. Someone rapes/murders my wife, sister or kills my son, godson, or niece, the state damn well better execute the SOB. If not, I'd do everything in my power to find a way to handle it.

The number of innocent people executed is extremely small and even smaller with today's better technology. What about the people who commit murder that would classify as a death penalty punishment, aren't they barbaric? A civilized society is ruled by laws, and violation of those laws requires punishment.
Murder is murder, period. Saying it's only justified as a punishment makes no sense to me at all. Yes, the act of murder should be punished. Life in prison is just fine. This eye for an eye bullshit however is absurd and caveman-esque thinking.

There are no statistics to show that the death penalty acts as a deterent and most families with a murdered family member report no feeling of satisfaction when their killer is put to death.
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Old 06-22-2010, 11:17 AM   #27
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Originally Posted by Mattyk View Post
Murder is murder, period. Saying it's only justified as a punishment makes no sense to me at all. Yes, the act of murder should be punished. Life in prison is just fine. This eye for an eye bullshit however is absurd and caveman-esque thinking.

There are no statistics to show that the death penalty acts as a deterent and most families with a murdered family member report no feeling of satisfaction when their killer is put to death.
You may want to read some of these victim statements. Is there satisfaction in watching a murderer die, of course not, because his death doesn't bring a loved one back.

Victim Impact Statements

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Old 06-22-2010, 11:20 AM   #28
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Are you just making stuff up there are statistics

Pro Capital Punishment Page
Sure there are stats, but of course there's another side to the story

Discussion of Recent Deterrence Studies | Death Penalty Information Center
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Old 06-22-2010, 11:43 AM   #29
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Originally Posted by Lotus View Post
A firing squad is abnormal as a method of execution. They only used it because he requested it.

We as a country need to wake up and abolish the death penalty. It is an expensive waste.

Note:
1) contrary to popular belief, the death penalty is more expensive. It costs about $750,000 to keep someone in maximum security for life, and maximum security protects society by keeping the murderer locked up. However, because of legal appeals, each death penalty case costs $3-4 million. So, for example, a recent study showed that Florida could save $51 million a year by abolishing the death penalty. The old argument that "I'm not gonna pay to keep a murderer alive" is financial nonsense. This is a big reason why New Jersey abolished the death penalty last year.

2) numerous studies have shown that the death penalty does not deter crime. Almost all of the states with the highest murder rates have the death penalty. Almost all of the states with the lowest murder rates do not have the death penalty.
While I don't disagree with you on your main point I would say your reasoning is the type of reasoning that will never ever result in the death penalty being really abolished.

1) As far as I know there isn't a large contingent of death penalty advocates who are for it simply because they think it's cheaper. Mostly because that is blatantly immoral. They're for it because they think the killers deserve it. A cost argument is completely lost on them.

2) Here you have presented a statistical fallacy. Or more accurately been presented a statistical fallacy that you then bought hook line and sinker. Most of these studies are woeful. They are conducted by biased organizations and done in a poorly devised economical analysis. Basically the studies don't actually study whether the death penalty is a quality deterrent...they study whether the death penalty eliminates murder. Subtle distinction. For example...none of the studies I know of have adequately addressed whether Fla actually has less murder because of the death penalty or not. For all we know the death penalty in Fla does the best job in preventing murder but it simply isn't good enough to actually eliminate it. Maybe without the death penalty the murder rate would sky rocket to crazy levels.

I would guess you and I would agree that on the face of it I can't see how the death penalty actually deters murder. It seems like basic common sense to me that if you are the type that is going to kill someone in a manner "deserving" of the death penalty then the threat of the death penalty is probably moot.

The best argument in my mind is that killing people for anything is just wrong. It is what we're trying to punish. Seems damn hypocritical and damn ironic to punish someone by doing to them what they did to somebody.
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Old 06-22-2010, 11:48 AM   #30
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Re: Utah killer executed by firing squad

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Originally Posted by FRPLG View Post
While I don't disagree with you on your main point I would say your reasoning is the type of reasoning that will never ever result in the death penalty being really abolished.

1) As far as I know there isn't a large contingent of death penalty advocates who are for it simply because they think it's cheaper. Mostly because that is blatantly immoral. They're for it because they think the killers deserve it. A cost argument is completely lost on them.

2) Here you have presented a statistical fallacy. Or more accurately been presented a statistical fallacy that you then bought hook line and sinker. Most of these studies are woeful. They are conducted by biased organizations and done in a poorly devised economical analysis. Basically the studies don't actually study whether the death penalty is a quality deterrent...they study whether the death penalty eliminates murder. Subtle distinction. For example...none of the studies I know of have adequately addressed whether Fla actually has less murder because of the death penalty or not. For all we know the death penalty in Fla does the best job in preventing murder but it simply isn't good enough to actually eliminate it. Maybe without the death penalty the murder rate would sky rocket to crazy levels.

I would guess you and I would agree that on the face of it I can't see how the death penalty actually deters murder. It seems like basic common sense to me that if you are the type that is going to kill someone in a manner "deserving" of the death penalty then the threat of the death penalty is probably moot.

The best argument in my mind is that killing people for anything is just wrong. It is what we're trying to punish. Seems damn hypocritical and damn ironic to punish someone by doing to them what they did to somebody.
Pretty much what it boils down to for me.

Killing is wrong, end of story. There shouldn't be any exceptions.
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