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Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

Debating with the enemy


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Old 03-23-2011, 06:58 PM   #271
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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Originally Posted by saden1 View Post
Lets see, Saudis went into Bahrain to defend the Royal Family there and squash revolution. So the question becomes what do you expect them to do when they decide to go into Libya? To defend a similarly revolting population from Gaddafi?

I really can't understand your thinking process here. It baffles the mind. I want no part in letting the wolves protect the sheep and neither should you!
Libya and Bahrain are apple vs. orange. In Bahrain, the Saudis (Sunnis) were defending a Sunni regime against a Shi'i popular revolt. In Libya, both the government and the rebels are Sunni. And the Saudis have never been great friends with Qaddafy.
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Old 03-23-2011, 07:48 PM   #272
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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Originally Posted by saden1 View Post
Lets see, Saudis went into Bahrain to defend the Royal Family there and squash revolution. So the question becomes what do you expect them to do when they decide to go into Libya? To defend a similarly revolting population from Gaddafi?

I really can't understand your thinking process here. It baffles the mind. I want no part in letting the wolves protect the sheep and neither should you!
Great points by Lotus.

Look all I'm saying is, the Arab League called for the No Fly Zone. The French and Brits drew up plans. Let them take the lead if they want it so bad. Again, I'm not saying we should've withheld support. But with all we're dealing with in the Middle East (not to mention our perception with much of the Muslim population), let these guys take the lead and just provide Logistics/Intel. We didn't need to take point.
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Old 03-23-2011, 08:18 PM   #273
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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Libya and Bahrain are apple vs. orange. In Bahrain, the Saudis (Sunnis) were defending a Sunni regime against a Shi'i popular revolt. In Libya, both the government and the rebels are Sunni. And the Saudis have never been great friends with Qaddafy.
What is your point? Sectarian conflict is more problematic than clan-centric conflict (see Somalia)? That one is more acceptable than the other? That Saudis who are battling their own unrest are more open to killing Shia population on behalf of the Royal Family of Bahrain and willing to defend Sunni population against Gaddafi?

When people are oppressed there are no apples and oranges to compare...just body count numbers. Simply don't trust an oppressor like Saudi Arabia to do the right thing...OKay?
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Old 03-23-2011, 08:19 PM   #274
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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Great points by Lotus.

Look all I'm saying is, the Arab League called for the No Fly Zone. The French and Brits drew up plans. Let them take the lead if they want it so bad. Again, I'm not saying we should've withheld support. But with all we're dealing with in the Middle East (not to mention our perception with much of the Muslim population), let these guys take the lead and just provide Logistics/Intel. We didn't need to take point.
Unacceptable! Talk about giving the keys to the car to a drunkard. If you don't want to take the point let the French take the point...they seem to be willing. I'm very disturbed that you place your faith in the Saudis to do the right thing.

BTW, the Arab League withdrew its support for the no Fly-Zone within hours of granting it.
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Old 03-23-2011, 09:27 PM   #275
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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Originally Posted by saden1 View Post
Unacceptable! Talk about giving the keys to the car to a drunkard. If you don't want to take the point let the French take the point...they seem to be willing. I'm very disturbed that you place your faith in the Saudis to do the right thing.

BTW, the Arab League withdrew its support for the no Fly-Zone within hours of granting it.
I think they've since clarified their position and they're still on board.

I'm kind of surprised, though, that SlinginSammy isn't endorsing a unilatteral (sp) intervention and calling for Obama's head like Romney, Pawlenty, and Gingrich. I guess I appreciate you seeing beyond the politics of all this.
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Old 03-23-2011, 11:45 PM   #276
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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I think they've since clarified their position and they're still on board.

I'm kind of surprised, though, that SlinginSammy isn't endorsing a unilatteral (sp) intervention and calling for Obama's head like Romney, Pawlenty, and Gingrich. I guess I appreciate you seeing beyond the politics of all this.
Agreed. Sammy is ruling the discussion in a good way.
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Old 03-24-2011, 12:01 AM   #277
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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Originally Posted by saden1 View Post
What is your point? Sectarian conflict is more problematic than clan-centric conflict (see Somalia)? That one is more acceptable than the other? That Saudis who are battling their own unrest are more open to killing Shia population on behalf of the Royal Family of Bahrain and willing to defend Sunni population against Gaddafi?

When people are oppressed there are no apples and oranges to compare...just body count numbers. Simply don't trust an oppressor like Saudi Arabia to do the right thing...OKay?
I agree that the Saudis cannot be trusted to do the right thing. I wasn't even arguing that they are doing the right thing. I simply indicated that Bahrain and Libya are different realities in their eyes, especially when it comes to the respective ruling regimes.
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Old 03-24-2011, 07:13 AM   #278
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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I'm kind of surprised, though, that SlinginSammy isn't endorsing a unilatteral (sp) intervention and calling for Obama's head like Romney, Pawlenty, and Gingrich. I guess I appreciate you seeing beyond the politics of all this.
LOL. Some of us conservatives can keep you guessing.
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Old 03-24-2011, 10:07 AM   #279
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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Must have been a typo Angry, but were you referring to Desert Fox in December of 1998 instead of OIF in 2008?
Yes, it was a typo, I was referring to Intrinsic Action 98-03, "Operation Desert Fox".

Thanks TOP!
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Old 03-24-2011, 04:43 PM   #280
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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Yes, it was a typo, I was referring to Intrinsic Action 98-03, "Operation Desert Fox".

Thanks TOP!
I just needed to ensure that the dossier that I am putting together on you contains the correct information.
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Old 03-25-2011, 09:39 AM   #281
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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I just needed to ensure that the dossier that I am putting together on you contains the correct information.
Now why in the world would you want to do something like that? Why dont I just send you a copy of my old ERB or DD-214?
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Old 03-25-2011, 03:04 PM   #282
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

Looks like Syria could be going tits up soon too.
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Old 03-28-2011, 07:34 PM   #283
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

So now after 9 days Obama is addressing the American people on his illegal war for oil. So far he has said bla, bla, bla.
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Old 03-28-2011, 07:42 PM   #284
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

Now I know why we went to war. Obam said that Gadhafi bombed Masque.
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Old 03-28-2011, 09:59 PM   #285
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Re: Updated Title: World Revolution 2011

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So now after 9 days Obama is addressing the American people on his illegal war for oil. So far he has said bla, bla, bla.
Really dude? Come on.

Look, as everyone on here knows, I'm no fan of Obama (seems like a cool guy, but I don't care for his politics at all), but I think we're absolutely doing the right thing here, and I think for the most part we're approaching it the right way.

I actually liked his speech tonight better than any I've heard him give since being elected.

We had to help with some kind of intervention in Lybia, we took the lead to get the no-fly established, now we're backing off and handing it over to NATO on Wednesday and will continue to support, but not lead the op, and no ground troops will be involved. A measured, sound decision IMO.

My only issue is we have no stated end-game, but then again this whole thing is only 4 weeks old, so stay tuned.
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