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Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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Old 02-15-2011, 10:54 AM   #16
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
Fair enough, what would 1.65 trillion be in 2003 dollars?

~1.35 trillion.
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Old 02-15-2011, 10:57 AM   #17
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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LOL...and this chart is meaningful how? I mean, it doesn't even answer your own question which implies there's a huge disconnect in your thinking

This is a more appropriate chart because a billion in 1940 is not the same as a billion in 2011...I'm confidant you know this and are not as silly as your post.
This really is the best chart to look at because it expresses the debt as a % of GDP. The limitation is that the graph doesn't show what will happen in 2011 and beyond; Obama's budget is projecting the blue to spike above the 100 line, the only other time that happened was the 1940s and WW2.

Shortly following that time our economy boomed in the 1950s, but that was a different world. Economies are globalized now, the US has a great deal more competition than in the 1950s.

We won't be able to grow our way out of debt, we're going to have to do it through very hard spending cuts.
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Old 02-15-2011, 10:57 AM   #18
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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Originally Posted by saden1 View Post
~1.35 trillion.
So, when I used the chart as a simple way to highlight the difference between Bush's outrageous spending, and Obama's Outrageous spending in response to dmek, it reasonably demonstrated my point.
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Old 02-15-2011, 11:03 AM   #19
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
So, when I used the chart as a simple way to highlight the difference between Bush's outrageous spending, and Obama's Outrageous spending in response to dmek, it reasonably demonstrated my point.
It doesn't because it is deceptive. For one thing it is meaningless and secondly like I stated in my previous post Bush's last budget proposal was ~1.3 trillion dollars. These budgets aren't as disjoint as your "point" would have you believe.
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Old 02-15-2011, 11:05 AM   #20
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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Originally Posted by Schneed10 View Post
This really is the best chart to look at because it expresses the debt as a % of GDP. The limitation is that the graph doesn't show what will happen in 2011 and beyond; Obama's budget is projecting the blue to spike above the 100 line, the only other time that happened was the 1940s and WW2.

Shortly following that time our economy boomed in the 1950s, but that was a different world. Economies are globalized now, the US has a great deal more competition than in the 1950s.

We won't be able to grow our way out of debt, we're going to have to do it through very hard spending cuts.
It most certainly won't. Cuts in spending alone won't cut it, the rich will have to cough up some dough too.


Going above 100% GDP is definitely going to be problematic. The wealth of a nation can't be spent on paying your debt.
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Old 02-15-2011, 11:10 AM   #21
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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Why the rich how about the 40 plus % that pay nothing.
I agree, screw the large catholic families and take away their child tax credit. 25% flat tax across the board anyone?
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Old 02-15-2011, 11:49 AM   #22
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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I agree, screw the large catholic families and take away their child tax credit. 25% flat tax across the board anyone?
If the gov't goes to the FairTax yes, 25% until we're back in the black. Then revert to around 22% or so.

I didn't know it was the Catholics who were screwing the gov't with the child tax credit all along that put us in this mess.
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Old 02-15-2011, 12:04 PM   #23
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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If the gov't goes to the FairTax yes, 25% until we're back in the black. Then revert to around 22% or so.

I didn't know it was the Catholics who were screwing the gov't with the child tax credit all along that put us in this mess.
It worked for my boy's dad. Had him five kids paid absolutely zero taxes for 40 years. I mean, we got to get away from encouraging credit for kids. I got zero kids and my effective tax rate 25%. What's your effective tax rate?

On behalf of all single people I accept the gratitude of all catholics with baby mama's and 3 kids :p
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Old 02-15-2011, 12:07 PM   #24
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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The child tax credit is not that much money compared to the cost of a child.
These are life choices you made and the problem is the more kids you have the more credit you get. You shouldn't be rewarded for having more kids.
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Old 02-15-2011, 12:11 PM   #25
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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Originally Posted by Slingin Sammy 33 View Post
If the gov't goes to the FairTax yes, 25% until we're back in the black. Then revert to around 22% or so.

...
Agreed
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Old 02-15-2011, 12:36 PM   #26
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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For him to pay zero in tax then he must have been low income and actually received a tax credit because he was low income. There is a limit that a family can claim no matter how many kids they have. I think its capped at $6000 so if they are in a 25% tax bracket then they can reduce their tax liability by $1500. Its not really that big of a tax break.

Now if your boy is consider low income they get a tax credit even if they did not pay taxes. So if your boy did not have to pay any taxes then claimed his child then he could actually get a refund and not paid a penny into the system. Thats the screwed up part if you ask me. You pay zero federal tax over the year but you get a child tax credit and get back like $1200 for up to 2 or 3 children. Not sure how many you can claim because back in the 90's it was capped but that cap could have been removed.
For someone who complains about taxes you sure don't know much about taxes. How much taxes does someone who makes 70k, has 5 kids and a mortgage pay today? He was s Boeing engineer for 35 years and now has a lake house and travels the world on the big cheese he made on Boeing stock! Low income my ass.

SS33 is getting a sweetheart deal from uncle sam that I am sure he won't give up.
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Old 02-15-2011, 12:54 PM   #27
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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Making 70 in todays world is low income and I know enough about taxes. What he is making today off his stock has nothing to do with his past income. If he is getting that great of a return then he is getting hit now with some taxes.
Wow, 70K is low income? Ooookaaay! I get that it might not be enough for a family of that size but I'm pretty sure it's not low income.

You don't get it, he invested in Boeing common stock while working there and took advantage of their discount in their ESPP. The scheme allowed him to save his money and get rich after retirement. Of course now that he's collecting he pay taxes but he will really pay taxes when he's dead or hits 79 unless the GOP has it's way.
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Old 02-15-2011, 01:10 PM   #28
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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SS33 is getting a sweetheart deal from uncle sam that I am sure he won't give up.
Nah, I'm just getting the one extra deduction....and that's going away after this year. You'll be the one getting the dedcutions fairly soon anyway.....right?

But I agree, the whole decduction game is crap. Social engineering at its finest. But, I'm damn sure gonna take every one I'm allowed while they're in place, but I'd much rather see FairTax.
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Old 02-15-2011, 03:13 PM   #29
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

not to argue but.... if your making 70k thats not low income
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Old 02-15-2011, 03:16 PM   #30
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Re: Obama and his new budget: Debt will surpass total US Economy

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not to argue but.... if your making 70k thats not low income
If it is there's a lot of us doing something wrong
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