Warpath  

Home | Forums | Salary Cap Info | Shop | Donate | Stay Connected




Go Back   Warpath > Off-Topic Discussion > Debating with the enemy


Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Debating with the enemy


Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-19-2012, 05:00 PM   #256
Fire Bruce NOW
 
Lotus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hattiesburg, MS
Posts: 11,434
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedskinRat View Post
There is no mention of Lee and/or Suardi or their work in the first link and the second makes some vague rebuttal that there may have been a lag between the implementation and the effect.

However it does make this comment you obviously overlooked:

It does not appear that the Australian experience with gun buybacks is fully replicable in the United States. Levitt provides three reasons why gun buybacks in the United States have apparently been ineffective: (a) the buybacks are relatively small in scale (b) guns are surrendered voluntarily, and so are not like the ones used in crime; and (c) replacement guns are easy to obtain.

Once again you try to bluster or bluff your way through an argument you can't validate.
Thank you for actually reading a link.

The first link I posted does not mention Lee and Suardi but it directly rebuts points made in the Lee and Suardi paper. The second article actually critiques Lee and Suardi more deeply than you indicate. The second article, in nice academic prose, essentially calls Lee and Suardi fools. Thus both articles I posted refute Lee and Suardi.

But you are right - the Harvard article I posted says that the Aussie experience is not fully replicable in the USA. I hinted at this in a post above. But the article does point to positive gains from the Aussie experience which we Americans can learn from and, if not "fully" replicate, still enact to our betterment.

I'm not trying to "bluff" through anything here. I have provided sound research and a logical argument which can be used to help us find our way out of our current gun regulations, which clearly are not working.
__________________
Bruce Allen when in charge alone: 4-12 (.250)
Bruce Allen's overall Redskins record : 28-52 (.350)
Vinny Cerrato's record when in charge alone: 52-65 (.444)
Vinny's overall Redskins record: 62-82 (.430)
We won more with Vinny
Lotus is offline  

Advertisements
Old 12-19-2012, 05:02 PM   #257
Fire Bruce NOW
 
Lotus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hattiesburg, MS
Posts: 11,434
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mredskins View Post
One of the more powerful statements I have heard:

If only the first victim, Adam Lanza's mother, had been a gun owner, she could have stopped this before it started.
Yeah, the whole situation in CT makes arguments of the type, "If only someone else had a gun...", even more ludicrous than they already were.
__________________
Bruce Allen when in charge alone: 4-12 (.250)
Bruce Allen's overall Redskins record : 28-52 (.350)
Vinny Cerrato's record when in charge alone: 52-65 (.444)
Vinny's overall Redskins record: 62-82 (.430)
We won more with Vinny
Lotus is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 05:15 PM   #258
New HC, new hope!
 
RedskinRat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: I'm in LA, trick!
Posts: 8,700
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lotus View Post
Yeah, the whole situation in CT makes arguments of the type, "If only someone else had a gun...", even more ludicrous than they already were.
Would it make the statement easier to comprehend, do you think, if it were more accurately stated as "If only someone had a gun and were able to use it" instead of couching it in an obviously loaded (no pun intended) way?
RedskinRat is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 05:25 PM   #259
New HC, new hope!
 
RedskinRat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: I'm in LA, trick!
Posts: 8,700
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

And if we're going to throw out soundbite style quotes, I like this one from US News:

With just one single exception, every public shooting since at least 1950 in the United States in which more than three people have been killed has taken place where citizens are not allowed to carry guns.
RedskinRat is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 05:38 PM   #260
MVP
 
dmek25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: lancaster,pa
Age: 53
Posts: 10,525
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedskinRat View Post
From the point of self defense, I am exceedingly self absorbed or as I prefer to look at it: Proactive.

I live in a remote, high crime area. There is no way that cops are getting to my location, should I need their help, in under 30 minutes at best. I choose to have a defensive solution to hand.

I could understand your stance if I was out brandishing my handgun and big pimpin'.

Tell me what you think the bigger picture is? Kumbayah around the firepit with marshmallows? Eff that!
and i never said gun control meant turning in all guns. the assault weapons are just that. there is absolutely no need for them. in the end, the people that do the right thing will be suffering. but i guarantee you will not suffer as much as those kids did
__________________
"It's better to be quiet and thought a fool than to open ones mouth and remove all doubt."
courtesy of 53fan
dmek25 is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 05:44 PM   #261
Fire Bruce NOW
 
Lotus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hattiesburg, MS
Posts: 11,434
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedskinRat View Post
Would it make the statement easier to comprehend, do you think, if it were more accurately stated as "If only someone had a gun and were able to use it" instead of couching it in an obviously loaded (no pun intended) way?
No. Your revision does not make the statement easier to comprehend. It also does not make the statement any less ludicrous.

It is not difficult to see that if the problem is that there are too many guns, adding guns is not a solution, whether people know how to use those guns or not.

I live in the 21st century and thus am not swayed by this 18th century argument of the gun lobby.
__________________
Bruce Allen when in charge alone: 4-12 (.250)
Bruce Allen's overall Redskins record : 28-52 (.350)
Vinny Cerrato's record when in charge alone: 52-65 (.444)
Vinny's overall Redskins record: 62-82 (.430)
We won more with Vinny
Lotus is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 05:51 PM   #262
New HC, new hope!
 
RedskinRat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: I'm in LA, trick!
Posts: 8,700
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lotus View Post
No. Your revision does not make the statement easier to comprehend. It also does not make the statement any less ludicrous.

It is not difficult to see that if the problem is that there are too many guns, adding guns is not a solution, whether people know how to use those guns or not.

I live in the 21st century and thus am not swayed by this 18th century argument of the gun lobby.
You're thinking of the musket lobby. How are you defining 'too many guns'? I have one, it has always been exactly the right amount, I wouldn't presume to tell anyone how many they should have, and that amount includes zero.

Please do me the favor of reading this rehash of the data by John Lott.

I appreciate your thoughts, Lotus, even though I may not agree.
RedskinRat is offline  
Old 12-20-2012, 08:00 AM   #263
MVP
 
dmek25's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: lancaster,pa
Age: 53
Posts: 10,525
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

and thats where he got his weapons^^^^
__________________
"It's better to be quiet and thought a fool than to open ones mouth and remove all doubt."
courtesy of 53fan
dmek25 is offline  
Old 12-20-2012, 08:38 AM   #264
Franchise Player
 
mredskins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,949
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by firstdown View Post
Actually its pretty stupid because its his mother.
No it's quite ironic seeing that every gun argument out there is we need to arm ourselves against evil yet his mom had guns and should could not stop him; SHE ACTUALLY HELPED HIM BY HAVING THE GUNS!
__________________
When life gives you paper jams, turn them into paper footballs!
mredskins is offline  
Old 12-20-2012, 10:20 AM   #265
New HC, new hope!
 
RedskinRat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: I'm in LA, trick!
Posts: 8,700
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mredskins View Post
No it's quite ironic seeing that every gun argument out there is we need to arm ourselves against evil yet his mom had guns and should could not stop him; SHE ACTUALLY HELPED HIM BY HAVING THE GUNS!
A crime was committed initially when he took her gun without her permission. She should have secured the weapon correctly, he shouldn't have taken it.

Who's to say he wouldn't have used another method to dispatch his mother if she had secured the weapons?
RedskinRat is offline  
Old 12-20-2012, 12:05 PM   #266
Playmaker
 
Alvin Walton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Holland, Michigan
Posts: 4,692
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mredskins View Post
No it's quite ironic seeing that every gun argument out there is we need to arm ourselves against evil yet his mom had guns and should could not stop him; SHE ACTUALLY HELPED HIM BY HAVING THE GUNS!
She was asleep when he shot her. Please tell me about what heroic feats you perform while asleep.

That is the most idiotic thing I have read on the internet this year.
__________________
REDSKINS FAN SINCE 1968
Alvin Walton is offline  
Old 12-20-2012, 12:50 PM   #267
Pro Bowl
 
punch it in's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: toms river, nj
Age: 43
Posts: 6,932
Quote:
Originally Posted by mredskins View Post
One of the more powerful statements I have heard:

If only the first victim, Adam Lanza's mother, had been a gun owner, she could have stopped this before it started.
They were her guns? If only she was more responsible with them it wouldnt have happened.
__________________
I'm living in yesterday's tomorrows.
punch it in is offline  
Old 12-20-2012, 01:53 PM   #268
Fire Bruce NOW
 
Lotus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Hattiesburg, MS
Posts: 11,434
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mredskins View Post
No it's quite ironic seeing that every gun argument out there is we need to arm ourselves against evil yet his mom had guns and should could not stop him; SHE ACTUALLY HELPED HIM BY HAVING THE GUNS!
Yup.

So you gun fans, guarantee me that there is zero percent chance that a gun of yours will not be stolen and used to kill children. Zero percent chance. If you cannot make me this guarantee, then you can appreciate the important point that mredskins is trying to make.
__________________
Bruce Allen when in charge alone: 4-12 (.250)
Bruce Allen's overall Redskins record : 28-52 (.350)
Vinny Cerrato's record when in charge alone: 52-65 (.444)
Vinny's overall Redskins record: 62-82 (.430)
We won more with Vinny
Lotus is offline  
Old 12-20-2012, 02:12 PM   #269
New HC, new hope!
 
RedskinRat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: I'm in LA, trick!
Posts: 8,700
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lotus View Post
Yup.

So you gun fans, guarantee me that there is zero percent chance that a gun of yours will not be stolen and used to kill children. Zero percent chance. If you cannot make me this guarantee, then you can appreciate the important point that mredskins is trying to make.
Always making demands.

There is zero % chance my Glock could ever be found, let alone stolen. Now what guarantees do we have from you that our rights under the Constitution will remain intact?
RedskinRat is offline  
Old 12-20-2012, 02:33 PM   #270
Puppy Kicker
 
Daseal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Arlington, Virginia
Age: 32
Posts: 8,270
Re: Gun Control Thread- Should we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedskinRat View Post
Always making demands.

There is zero % chance my Glock could ever be found, let alone stolen. Now what guarantees do we have from you that our rights under the Constitution will remain intact?
Once you show me what 'well regulated militia' you're in.
__________________
Best. Player. Available.
Daseal is offline  
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:27 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site is not officially affiliated with the Washington Redskins or the NFL.
Page generated in 0.31470 seconds with 9 queries

Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0 RC5

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25