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All things Middle East related

Debating with the enemy


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Old 07-01-2013, 03:06 PM   #181
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Re: All things Middle East related

Morsi is a Moslem Brotherhood stooge. He should never have been elected.

Democracy isn't compatible with islam.
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Old 07-03-2013, 12:37 AM   #182
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Re: All things Middle East related

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Originally Posted by Lotus View Post
If you read my links,
I'd be asleep by now.... I've read a multitude of those links before and it's mostly anti-Israeli nonsense.

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... you would see that I provided numbers including 200,000. If you read my links, you would find information on Israeli human rights violations from Nobel-prize-winning Amnesty International, not the OIC.
You're talking about the same group that gave Mr. Obama a prize, right? Must be worth having.

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But fine, have it your way:
Thanks, I will. Your figure, like a lot of your bombastic effluence, is merely to flush away the timid. I'm sure it works on the drones you're pretending to educate.

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....there are 143,000 Palestinian Christians who face the same human rights violations that Palestinian Muslims face. So, to bring this discussion back to its start, we know that calling out Israel for its human rights violations has NOTHING to do with being pro-Islam, as you previously stated.
Yes, it does, and for you to state otherwise shows an infantile grasp of the situation or a devious approach to truth of the matter. Which is it?

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Instead, calling out Israel and questioning American involvement has everything to do with justice.
Examining the facts and responding to them, sure. Shouldn't we call out the Palestinians aggressors also, or have you already decided they get a clean bill of health?

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Please learn about the issue before you pontificate more.
You were incorrect, I corrected you and yet you say I need to learn more? Sure thing, Prof.....

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Matty and NC, I heard you. I'm done.
Not bright enough to redirect a thread post.
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Old 07-03-2013, 10:49 AM   #183
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Re: All things Middle East related

Hundreds of protesters in Egypt aim laser pointers at a military helicopter

and Mursi says(per yahoonews twitter)
Mursi spokesman says president would rather "die like a standing tree" than step down. Updates: http://bit.ly/14Q9AGh

Talk about things getting real.
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Old 07-03-2013, 11:12 AM   #184
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Re: All things Middle East related

They sure love laser pointers over there eh?

I'm never sure if it's a Pink Floyd show or just a protest.
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Old 07-03-2013, 11:14 AM   #185
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Re: All things Middle East related

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I'm never sure if it's a Pink Floyd show or just a protest.
Just measure the ambient THC content, that's a great indicator.
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Old 07-03-2013, 12:12 PM   #186
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Re: All things Middle East related

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I'd be asleep by now.... I've read a multitude of those links before and it's mostly anti-Israeli nonsense.

You're talking about the same group that gave Mr. Obama a prize, right? Must be worth having.

Thanks, I will. Your figure, like a lot of your bombastic effluence, is merely to flush away the timid. I'm sure it works on the drones you're pretending to educate.

Yes, it does, and for you to state otherwise shows an infantile grasp of the situation or a devious approach to truth of the matter. Which is it?

Examining the facts and responding to them, sure. Shouldn't we call out the Palestinians aggressors also, or have you already decided they get a clean bill of health?

You were incorrect, I corrected you and yet you say I need to learn more? Sure thing, Prof.....

Not bright enough to redirect a thread post.
I am amazed at how radical people in this country are about this conflict and how much pro-Isreali sentiment dominates this country and its politics to the point that it is pretty much taboo to say anything against it.
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Old 07-03-2013, 12:22 PM   #187
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Re: All things Middle East related

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I am amazed at how radical people in this country are about this conflict and how much pro-Isreali sentiment dominates this country and its politics to the point that it is pretty much taboo to say anything against it.
I'm pro-Israel because I've worked with a few Israeli commandos, they've always been solid chaps.

I've been around some Arabs from the area who have relocated to Dearborn MI and they were hateful ****ers.

We're talking a country surrounded by self-confessed enemies, and yet still thrives.
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Old 07-03-2013, 12:42 PM   #188
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Re: All things Middle East related

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I'm pro-Israel because I've worked with a few Israeli commandos, they've always been solid chaps.

I've been around some Arabs from the area who have relocated to Dearborn MI and they were hateful ****ers.

We're talking a country surrounded by self-confessed enemies, and yet still thrives.
I've had the chance to talk to ordinary people from both sides that have suffered because of this conflict. This includes an Israeli professor who has lived through the terror of terrorist attacks and a Palestinian professor whose house was attacked by anti-tank missiles by the IDF. They are actually both friends and co-taught a class at my university regarding this conflict.

I learned a lot though this class, including that there are a lot of people on both sides that wish to have peace. I have also learned how biased US media is on this conflict, and how radical people are in this country. It is amazing how people can developed such sentiments without living under the conditions that both Israelis and Palestinians live, and this makes me pessimistic about this conflict ever having a peaceful ending.
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Old 07-03-2013, 02:17 PM   #189
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Re: All things Middle East related

‏@BreakingNews 3m

Report: Egypt's army erects barbed wire, barriers around barracks where President Morsi working, witnesses say - @Reuters
Expand

‏@BreakingNews 6m

Armored vehicles seen outside Cairo University in Egypt - @AJELive (fixes typo)
Expand
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Old 07-03-2013, 02:31 PM   #190
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Re: All things Middle East related

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‏@BreakingNews 3m

Report: Egypt's army erects barbed wire, barriers around barracks where President Morsi working, witnesses say - @Reuters
Expand

‏@BreakingNews 6m

Armored vehicles seen outside Cairo University in Egypt - @AJELive (fixes typo)
Expand
So much for democracy in Egypt.
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Old 07-03-2013, 02:39 PM   #191
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Re: All things Middle East related

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So much for democracy in Egypt.
Breaking News ‏@BreakingNews 9m

Communication with Egypt's President Morsi has been cut off as reported military coup continues - @NBCNews

Yep. One of the things about the US, which I always am amazed at, is the total commitment by the military to the ideal of civilian control. As large as the bureacracy of the military is, the top brass don't just offer lip service to that, they truly buy into it. It is one of the few trusts in US society which I feel hasn't ever been broken, and one which very few other societies really comprehend. The Egyptian military may very well be acting on behalf of alot of the public, but, it's still acting outside of democratic principles. I don't think they get the difference. And that's a shame.
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Old 07-03-2013, 02:51 PM   #192
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Re: All things Middle East related

Making the Egyptian scene murkier is the fact that the Muslim Brotherhood wrote the constitution and made it Brotherhood- rather than democracy-friendly. So, from the standpoint of many non-Brotherhood Egyptians, Egypt hasn't yet had democracy, as it was usurped by Morsi et.al. Throwing out Morsi with the army, from this point of view, is pro-democracy, not anti-democracy.

I'm not making an argument of my own, just mentioning the muddy waters.
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Old 07-03-2013, 04:46 PM   #193
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Re: All things Middle East related

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Making the Egyptian scene murkier is the fact that the Muslim Brotherhood wrote the constitution and made it Brotherhood- rather than democracy-friendly. So, from the standpoint of many non-Brotherhood Egyptians, Egypt hasn't yet had democracy, as it was usurped by Morsi et.al. Throwing out Morsi with the army, from this point of view, is pro-democracy, not anti-democracy.

I'm not making an argument of my own, just mentioning the muddy waters.
Interesting Lotus, and I admit I haven't followed it close, so I am just feeding off what Twitter feeds me. Here's my latest snack:

@AP 25m

BREAKING: Egypt's military chief says president is replaced by chief justice of constitutional court -MM
Retweeted by Laura E. Davis
Expand

If they actually do instill a democratic process, and then back out, it would be a good thing. Remember we went through a period under the Articles of Confederation where we didn't "get it right" either. Finding the right balance of military/civilian/politico's is tough to do, for any society.
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Old 07-03-2013, 04:59 PM   #194
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Re: All things Middle East related

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Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
Interesting Lotus, and I admit I haven't followed it close, so I am just feeding off what Twitter feeds me. Here's my latest snack:

@AP 25m

BREAKING: Egypt's military chief says president is replaced by chief justice of constitutional court -MM
Retweeted by Laura E. Davis
Expand

If they actually do instill a democratic process, and then back out, it would be a good thing. Remember we went through a period under the Articles of Confederation where we didn't "get it right" either. Finding the right balance of military/civilian/politico's is tough to do, for any society.
That's very good news. If it were a pure military coup, a general would now be President.

Hopefully this will be a wake-up call for the Islamic world. Islamist politics have their attraction to many Muslims, just as we have people here attracted to pro-Christian politics. But the economic and social history of Islamists in positions of power has been poor in recent decades. Muslim politicians with Islamist agendas typically don't know how to run a thriving economy and this was true for Morsi in Egypt. Egypt's problems could, by reaction, expand the numbers of political secularists across the Muslim world, where you vote for the guy with money sense rather than for the guy thumping his Qur'an.
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Last edited by Lotus; 07-03-2013 at 05:09 PM.
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Old 07-03-2013, 05:01 PM   #195
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Re: All things Middle East related

Part of them forming a new government. Millitary ensuring that their is minority protection under majority rule.
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