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Official 2012 Election Day Thread

Debating with the enemy


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Old 11-08-2012, 07:59 PM   #181
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Originally Posted by JoeRedskin View Post
Was race a part of the vote? Sure. But lets not pretend it was a one way street.
Less than 60% of whites voted for Romney.
More than 90% of blacks voted for Obama.
Racism works both ways: there are whites who would never vote for a black and vice versa.
Of course it is. A lot of blacks who won't vote for Romney because he's white.

I do think that's slightly different vs. when i hear people in the south drape themselves with the Confederate flag and call Obama a terrorist n*****.

Seen it plenty just down in Charlottesville, VA.
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Old 11-08-2012, 08:03 PM   #182
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Re: Official 2012 Election Day Thread

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Originally Posted by JoeRedskin View Post
Was race a part of the vote? Sure. But lets not pretend it was a one way street.
Less than 60% of whites voted for Romney.
More than 90% of blacks voted for Obama.
Racism works both ways: there are whites who would never vote for a black and vice versa.
This is not a chicken and egg problem. It's a problem that spawned from years of repressive tactics, the southern dog whistles, and more recently the blatant disrespect of 47% of the population. Here is the break down of the African American vote over the last 7 cycles...the truth is in the last 12 years you managed to not only lose it further but to agitate and encourage it to not vote for you.


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1984 Walter Mondale 90% Ronald Reagan 9%
1988 Michael Dukakis 90% George H.W. Bush 10%
1992 Bill Clinton 83% George H.W. Bush 10%
1996 Bill Clinton 84% Bob Dole 12%
2000 Al Gore 90% George W. Bush 9%
2004 John Kerry 88%, George W. Bush 11%
2008 Barack Obama 95%, John McCain 13%
It is easier to blame African Americans than look in the mirror. Mark my words, come 2020 your little redistricting gimmicks to control the house won't work as well as it has been the last 30 years.

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Old 11-08-2012, 08:06 PM   #183
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Re: Official 2012 Election Day Thread

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Originally Posted by JoeRedskin View Post
Was race a part of the vote? Sure. But lets not pretend it was a one way street.
Less than 60% of whites voted for Romney.
More than 90% of blacks voted for Obama.
Racism works both ways: there are whites who would never vote for a black and vice versa.
It's not like Romney was pandering for minority votes anyway. The religious right is much more important.
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Old 11-08-2012, 08:11 PM   #184
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Re: Official 2012 Election Day Thread

On a lighter note.

Cat Takes Third In Virginia's Senate Race
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Old 11-08-2012, 08:19 PM   #185
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Re: Official 2012 Election Day Thread

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I watched a ton of fox news and happened to catch that, as well. It was hilarious. Daily Show is going to eat it up.
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Old 11-08-2012, 08:24 PM   #186
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In 2008 and 2012 blacks turned out in historic numbers. In 2008, for the first time, the percentage eligible number of black voters who actually voted was the same as the percentage for whites for the first time ever. I would humbly suggest that this surge in black voter turnout was possibly related to something other than a change in the policy stances of the two parties and would not have occurred had the Dems put forth a white candidate in 2008/12.
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Old 11-08-2012, 08:32 PM   #187
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The race element is definitely out there. As someone who has spent some time in the deep south the past few years, I've heard it loud and clear with my own ears. To deny it's out there is just plain ignorant.
Its alive and well everywhere. I got friends here in NJ that say things sometimes that blow my freakin mind. I go in to see customers and some guy ive been dealing with for years will lean over and say "cant believe were gonna have a n$&ger president again". Blows my ****ing mind. Anyone who thinks race doesnt play a huge part in everyday life let alone the elections doesnt get out of the house enough.
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Old 11-08-2012, 08:35 PM   #188
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In 2008 and 2012 blacks turned out in historic numbers. In 2008, for the first time, the percentage eligible number of black voters who actually voted was the same as the percentage for whites for the first time ever. I would humbly suggest that this surge in black voter turnout was possibly related to something other than a change in the policy stances of the two parties and would not have occurred had the Dems put forth a white candidate in 2008/12.
Absolutely. Reverse racism in a way. However due to the history of our country and even the political/ economic landscape of present day America Im going to say that the black people have alittle more substance to their disdain for white folks than vice versa.
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Old 11-08-2012, 08:39 PM   #189
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Re: Official 2012 Election Day Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeRedskin View Post
In 2008 and 2012 blacks turned out in historic numbers. In 2008, for the first time, the percentage eligible number of black voters who actually voted was the same as the percentage for whites for the first time ever. I would humbly suggest that this surge in black voter turnout was possibly related to something other than a change in the policy stances of the two parties and would not have occurred had the Dems put forth a white candidate in 2008/12.
I would like to hear your theory on Latinos, Asians, Muslims and Jews as well. If you didnt have anything close to 50% and are now further losing in every demo, maybe, just maybe they aren't the problem.


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Old 11-08-2012, 08:50 PM   #190
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Re: Official 2012 Election Day Thread

Furthermore Obama's ground game and community outreach was beyond reproach. Quite frankly, it is the reason why even more African Americans voted and Latinos voted. This theory that somehow it is because he is black is bankrupt and intellectually lazy. If Herman Cain was running the result would have been the same.
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Old 11-08-2012, 08:59 PM   #191
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Re: Official 2012 Election Day Thread

Your right of course ... only whites can be racist or motivated by impure racial thoughts.
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Old 11-08-2012, 09:07 PM   #192
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Re: Official 2012 Election Day Thread

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Your right of course ... only whites can be racist or motivated by impure racial thoughts.
Are you so salty that you to turn to sarcasm and deflection? You implied there is racisim and I said "there isnt any evidence to backup your claim." For people who champion personal responsibility you sure know how to blame others.


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Old 11-08-2012, 09:30 PM   #193
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Re: Official 2012 Election Day Thread

I don't believe that 93% of blacks agree with the fiscal policies of the democrats, I do believe that 93% of blacks don't trust republicans to look out for their interests. I also believe that while white racism mainly is due to skin color and is fading as the younger generations grow up, black racism is mainly due to lack of trust and that the media works hard to perpetuate that, so that you don't see it receding as quickly as you see white racism is. And for those who want to use personal references, my dad couldn't conceive of me having black friends, when one in 6th grade had a crossed burned in his yard, it was considered acceptable, now, my junior high is named for a champion of the racial equality fight, my son wanted to vote for Obama, and he could care less of what color his friends are (nor do I) and I doubt he even considers it in any fashion.

Yes my dad still struggles with his racist upbringing, my 12 yo daughter had a birthday party at his pool and her friends came over. One young black girl's family dropped her off, and hung around, and my dad struggled - you could see it, but my daughter would never have considered it as a thought pattern at all.

Again I believe white racism is shrinking, though I don't deny at all that it exists. On the other side, the perception of racism, and perpetuation of reverse racism is shrinking at an extremely slower rate, and to Saden's point, yes it did occur for a long time, and that does explain a large part, but at some point all sides need to acknowledge that it is in the past and belongs in the past.
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Old 11-08-2012, 09:34 PM   #194
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Furthermore Obama's ground game and community outreach was beyond reproach. Quite frankly, it is the reason why even more African Americans voted and Latinos voted. This theory that somehow it is because he is black is bankrupt and intellectually lazy. If Herman Cain was running the result would have been the same.
You have to admit that there are certainly black people who voted for Obama based solely on skin color. I am white and I voted for Obama based solely on the fact that I dont trust guys named Mitt. Seriously though im sure there were both blacks and whites who voted for Obama based on policy. There were certainly blacks who voted for him based on his skin color and whites who voted against him based on skin color also. Dont think the issue is as "black and white" - no pun intended - as you guys are making it out to be.
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Old 11-08-2012, 09:46 PM   #195
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I don't believe that 93% of blacks agree with the fiscal policies of the democrats, I do believe that 93% of blacks don't trust republicans to look out for their interests. I also believe that while white racism mainly is due to skin color and is fading as the younger generations grow up, black racism is mainly due to lack of trust and that the media works hard to perpetuate that, so that you don't see it receding as quickly as you see white racism is. And for those who want to use personal references, my dad couldn't conceive of me having black friends, when one in 6th grade had a crossed burned in his yard, it was considered acceptable, now, my junior high is named for a champion of the racial equality fight, my son wanted to vote for Obama, and he could care less of what color his friends are (nor do I) and I doubt he even considers it in any fashion.

Yes my dad still struggles with his racist upbringing, my 12 yo daughter had a birthday party at his pool and her friends came over. One young black girl's family dropped her off, and hung around, and my dad struggled - you could see it, but my daughter would never have considered it as a thought pattern at all.

Again I believe white racism is shrinking, though I don't deny at all that it exists. On the other side, the perception of racism, and perpetuation of reverse racism is shrinking at an extremely slower rate, and to Saden's point, yes it did occur for a long time, and that does explain a large part, but at some point all sides need to acknowledge that it is in the past and belongs in the past.
My father in law the other day got a call from FEMA about his house that was damaged in the hurricane. He is 70 and i have never heard him make a racist comment in my life. He would never use the N word. However, he got off the phone and said " that was the Fema person. A lady. You could tell she was black." My wife and I looked at each other and back at him. My wife goes "dad!" He did not understand that we were upset that he would even mention that. I said "well - she might be but she also might be really good at her job so who cares what color she is"?
I am very fortunate that the racism stopped dead in its tracks with both my parents. To me skin color is as important as a persons preference for boxers or briefs. But it was strange to hear my father in law say that. He doesnt even realize it is in him in a little way but it is. It has been bothering me since he said it. I would like to think it is a dying emotion belonging to old folks but I have too many contemporaries that i have heard utter the same nonsense from time to time and unfortunately they can breed as well as I can.
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