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OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

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Old 01-09-2009, 09:28 PM   #31
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

The average age of our OL is high and getting older. We simply must start to draft new blood this season.

One or two new rookies would extend the careers of Jansen , Samuels, etc.

If we draft for the OL over the next two years we can build OL for the long-term. Regardless of who is the coach.
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Old 01-09-2009, 10:16 PM   #32
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

Alex Mack C get him, whatever it takes. He's the smartest player in the draft and is a center which requires to make the calls in the line just like MLB. Portis can then pounded straight ahead instead of running to the outside.
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Old 01-09-2009, 11:57 PM   #33
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

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Originally Posted by Mattyk72 View Post
I think we were all hoping for that this year and it didn't happen.

I'm not banking on Heyer ever becoming a quality NFL starter. He's a backup at best to me. I think we need to look elsewhere for the future at RT.
In my perfect world, we sign Vernon Carey (I'm leaning toward him over Gross lately) to be our starting RT in 2009. Heyer becomes the backup to Carey and Samuels, and Jansen becomes a jack of all trades backup across the line.

We trade down in the draft and get both Duke Robinson and Jonathan Luigs. By the start of the 2010 season, L to R we are Samuels, Robinson, Luigs, Rinehart, Carey.
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Old 01-10-2009, 12:01 AM   #34
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

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Alex Mack C get him, whatever it takes. He's the smartest player in the draft and is a center which requires to make the calls in the line just like MLB. Portis can then pounded straight ahead instead of running to the outside.
I agree! It may not be the standard thing to draft a center with a high pick, but how much is it worth to have a big ass, smart center play at a high level for years and years? This guy is a HOG, and barring injury, could anchor this line for a decade or more. This is a "special" player. This guy does not stop until the whistle blows and can handle the "Big Guys". He would help this line TREMENDOUSLY.
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Old 01-10-2009, 12:17 AM   #35
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

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I've readily admitted that he has lost a step. But if I had to choose between the lesser of two evils I would take Jansen. Heyer just stinks at run blocking and he still has a lot to work on in pass pro. Jansen at least has the experience and is still effective in the running game.
I still don't understand.
Heyer beat out Jansen for RT.
As you state: Jansen has lost a step.
Older players like JJ don't improve they plateau or decline.
I think we should play Heyer and have him learn the ropes and watch him improve.
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Old 01-10-2009, 09:36 AM   #36
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

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I still don't understand.
Heyer beat out Jansen for RT.
As you state: Jansen has lost a step.
Older players like JJ don't improve they plateau or decline.
I think we should play Heyer and have him learn the ropes and watch him improve.
Not sure what's so hard to understand.

Heyer beat out JJ, then later on once JJ got the job back Heyer couldn't get back into the lineup. Neither of them are a long term solution. If I had to choose one to start going into next season, it would be Jansen.
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Old 01-10-2009, 10:36 AM   #37
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

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Not sure what's so hard to understand.

Heyer beat out JJ, then later on once JJ got the job back Heyer couldn't get back into the lineup. Neither of them are a long term solution. If I had to choose one to start going into next season, it would be Jansen.
Why not draft an OL monster with our #13 and let JJ, Heyers or this FNG compete for this spot. The second best player is the backup.

We need to get our OL younger - starting this year.
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Old 01-10-2009, 11:29 AM   #38
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

The answer you guys are looking for is Mr. Crabtree!
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Old 01-10-2009, 11:31 AM   #39
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

I wonder which players people would agree with us drafting at a position we do not need, if they dropped to us at 13. Would people be okay with Crabtree or Taylor Mays or the best QB prospect(Bradford/Stafford)? Most agree we still need a #2 WR, and SS isn't exactly stable with Horton, he was injured almost half the season, and there are those that don't believe in Campbell. For reference I'm in favor of trading down and drafting D-line, O-line, or linebackers but I would be okay if we drafted based on the best player available, excluding some positions (in my opinion TE, QB, secondary). O-line is the safest bet because they seem to be pretty easy to judge. You rarely here about first round offensive line busts.
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Old 01-10-2009, 11:47 AM   #40
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

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I agree! It may not be the standard thing to draft a center with a high pick, but how much is it worth to have a big ass, smart center play at a high level for years and years? This guy is a HOG, and barring injury, could anchor this line for a decade or more. This is a "special" player. This guy does not stop until the whistle blows and can handle the "Big Guys". He would help this line TREMENDOUSLY.
This is a good choice for number one. Do I think it will happen . . . . Nope.
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Old 01-10-2009, 12:14 PM   #41
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

Even though there might be better options than Mack at 13, I'll say this: a line with him in the middle of Kendall and Rinehart/Thomas would be strong even with Jon Jansen at RT.
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Old 01-10-2009, 12:59 PM   #42
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

We are one of the only teams that consistently rejects OL and DL choices in the draft. Our record under Snyder reflects that bias.

Until we use our best draft choices for the OL and DL, we will never get better than we are. Jason Campbell needs pass protection.
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Old 01-10-2009, 01:09 PM   #43
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

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Even though there might be better options than Mack at 13, I'll say this: a line with him in the middle of Kendall and Rinehart/Thomas would be strong even with Jon Jansen at RT.
Most of the draft sites have him(Mack) going way lower then 13.
We could likely trade down and still get him, the earliest i've seen him go in a mock is to the Steelers @ 30.
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Old 01-10-2009, 06:37 PM   #44
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

Talk about semantics. Center a bigger need than guard. Guard a bigger need than center. Tackle a bigger need than guard or center. For the oldest, smallest and slowest line in the division and arguably one of the worst in the league period this debate wins the inane award.

... the line needs to be replaced within a year or two w/ the exception of Samuels (who may just need to switch to RT). Where/how we start the replacement process is probably best decided as a matter of pragmatism. If Jansen can be effective on the interior then he needs to make the switch since we're stuck w/ him. Draft a franchise tackle and decide whether he'll play on the left (moving Samuels to RT) or plug the rook into RT. We need franchise players on the line. If the FO 1) allows Jansen or Heyer to start at either tackle position and/or 2) stupidly settles for 2nd tier/3rd tier line talent through this replacement process this team will not even go 8-8 in each the next few seasons.
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Old 01-10-2009, 08:11 PM   #45
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Re: OG and OC are bigger needs than OT

I agree with Goat.

In my dream scenario, we are able to trade down in the 20's and pick up Duke Robinson and get a 2nd round pick. Then we pick up Alex Mack or Luigs with that selection. In the third, we pick up Ziggy Hood to play DT. In the 5th, we pick up Alex Boone to eventually take over at RT.

No pretty picks in this draft. Just bring on the big uglies.
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