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Old 03-24-2011, 08:40 PM   #676
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hog1 View Post
Does that say anything about the relationship of "the numbers" and winning?
I basically look at it like this. The equivalent of a QB today posting a rating of 90+ is like a QB back in the mid 70's and early 80's posting a rating of at least 80.

In fairness to Bradshaw he came from an era where no one knew how to design a pass play. Corners were allowed to molest receivers to the point where they would probably get fined in this day and age. He also might have the best QB rating in Super Bowls of any other QB that played in more then one (112.8 Rating).

Still it's always funny to have people talking about how great Bradshaw was because he was on 4 Super Bowl teams when the fact of the matter is he was an average QB at best for more then half of his career who's team was successful mainly due to their defense and running game.

If there ever was a modern day equivelent of Bradshaw it has to be Sanchez. The guy is so up and down during the regular season that the only reason he gets to the postseason in the first place is due to the fact that he plays on a team with an elite defense and running game. However once he gets to the postseason he suddenly becomes an elite QB.
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Old 03-24-2011, 09:11 PM   #677
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

Senior Bowl Prospect: Colin Kaepernick, QB, Nevada
by Parks Smith on Jan 26, 2011 10:40 AM EST in Redskins 2011 Draft

Several sources have confirmed that the Redskins met with Nevada QB Colin Kaepernick yesterday "for an inordinate amount of time," and have had their eyes on him all week. Kaepernick is a 64, 220 lbs QB that lead the Wolfpack to a 13-1 season, a share of the WAC title, and a win over Boston College in the Kraft Fight Hunger Bowl.
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Old 03-24-2011, 09:31 PM   #678
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

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Originally Posted by BuckSkin View Post
KaepKrusader, what have you seen or heard about this kid that made you change your mind. For the past couple of months you made no apologies about Miller then Hudson with the second rd.
BuckSkin, I am flattered you have followed my draft selections so closely. I would love Miller but he will probably be gone by #10. Everyone is saying Quinn now, and I would be okay with that.

We do need a center and I originally picked it because it is a huge need. I think Rabach is essentially garbage at this point. I think we can get a ZB scheme center in the draft or free agency much easier than we can a good QB who could best fit our system. The only FA QB I would want to bring in would be Kyle Orton and I'm not confident that will happen.

I have become enamored with Kaepernick after watching his tape and game film. Here are the things I like about him:
1. He is a 4 year starter, so he has experience.

2. He has improved most of his numbers every year he has been at Nevada, especially focusing on his senior year which was his most outstanding.

Stats Overview Passing
YEAR - CMP- ATT -YDS -CMP% - YPA -LNG- TD-INT-SACK-RAT
2007 - 133 - 247 - 2175 - 53.8 - 8.81 - 74 - 19 - 3 - 18 - 150.77
2008 - 208 - 383 - 2849 - 54.3 - 7.44 - 75 - 22 - 7 - 16 - 132.10
2009 - 166 - 282 - 2052 - 58.9 - 7.28 - 56 - 20 - 6 - 13 - 139.14
2010 - 233 - 359 - 3022 - 64.9 - 8.42 - 79 - 21 - 8 - 10 - 150.46

3. He is not a head case. This kid seems to have his head on straight and want to excel.

4. He is very speedy and athletic. His ability to be able to break containment and bootleg out or pick up yards with his legs is a major plus. He can extend the play which is a huge thing for QB's to be able to do. Look how well Rapistberger does extending plays. Kaepernick reminds me of a young McNabb in some ways when I see him roll out in a bootleg or scramble around. Kaepernick was second fastest QB at the combine with 4.53 forty time. He threw with great accuracy with 36 of 38 passing.

5. He has a cannon for an arm. Everyone that has seen him throw says his arm is huge. And his accuracy has increased EVERY SEASON. He's been clocked throwing the ball 59 mph which is faster than Cam Newton or Ryan Mallet.

6. At 6'6' he is very tall and can see the field well. Many detractors say he can not read defenses well, and I am not going to say he is the best at it, but it is something I think he can improve on. Another thing detractors say is he played in a modified pistol offense which is not the best for a pro style in the NFL. However, most QB's at the collegiate level don't come in having perfected the pro style offense.

Sincerely,

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Old 03-24-2011, 09:33 PM   #679
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

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Originally Posted by Dirtbag59 View Post
Senior Bowl Prospect: Colin Kaepernick, QB, Nevada
by Parks Smith on Jan 26, 2011 10:40 AM EST in Redskins 2011 Draft

Several sources have confirmed that the Redskins met with Nevada QB Colin Kaepernick yesterday "for an inordinate amount of time," and have had their eyes on him all week. Kaepernick is a 64, 220 lbs QB that lead the Wolfpack to a 13-1 season, a share of the WAC title, and a win over Boston College in the Kraft Fight Hunger Bowl.

Why not honestly?
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Old 03-24-2011, 10:36 PM   #680
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

KaepKrusader, what do you think about the idea that we already have a center - Kory L. Kory L. might be at his best at center. What we actually need is a guard. What think ye?
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Old 03-24-2011, 11:26 PM   #681
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
I think at best Kaepernick is a low first rounder, but probably more likely high to mid 2nd round. Still, all it takes is one...
Very few QB's make that JP Losman like jump to the middle of first round after being considered early 2nd round picks. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if one or two of these guys out of the Dalton, Ponder, Kapernick group lasted until round 3, maybe even as late as the 4th round.

I mean if any QB should have been a 2nd round pick last year Colt McCoy was it. Yet somehow he lasted until the 3rd round. I also remember people talking about Chris Simms before his draft and how he might sneak into the 1st (he ended up being the last pick of the third round). My boy Charlie was also given a second round grade by numerous draft outlets (he ended up being selected in the third).

Kaepernick seems different though. I think his physical gifts are enticing enough that he's not going to last long in the second round. Dalton will go in the second if theres an Andy Reid type guy that thinks he can develop him, otherwise he'll fall as well. Ponder I could easily see lasting through the second and most of the third, mainly due to concerns about numerous injuries.

Also keep in mind that a lot of these second round grade guys are going to have to compete for the attention of teams that might be able to pick a falling Locker or Mallet in round 2.
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Old 03-24-2011, 11:29 PM   #682
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

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Originally Posted by Dirtbag59 View Post
I basically look at it like this. The equivalent of a QB today posting a rating of 90+ is like a QB back in the mid 70's and early 80's posting a rating of at least 80.

In fairness to Bradshaw he came from an era where no one knew how to design a pass play. Corners were allowed to molest receivers to the point where they would probably get fined in this day and age. He also might have the best QB rating in Super Bowls of any other QB that played in more then one (112.8 Rating).

Still it's always funny to have people talking about how great Bradshaw was because he was on 4 Super Bowl teams when the fact of the matter is he was an average QB at best for more then half of his career who's team was successful mainly due to their defense and running game.

If there ever was a modern day equivelent of Bradshaw it has to be Sanchez. The guy is so up and down during the regular season that the only reason he gets to the postseason in the first place is due to the fact that he plays on a team with an elite defense and running game. However once he gets to the postseason he suddenly becomes an elite QB.
If you are saying that TB...NBA'd it during much of the regular season and delivered in the playoffs and SB when the chips were down to bring home the Lombardi....I could agree.
If not I would suggest the relationship between stats and winning is not or at least "was not" all that..as TB made an HOF and record breaking habit of under-achieving his ass into multiple division championships and SB wins.
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Old 03-24-2011, 11:47 PM   #683
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

Somebody at work, and I can't remember who-think it might have been Trevor Matich-has been hyping Kaepernick for almost two years now. I don't know, I just don't see it. But maybe I just haven't seen enough of him.
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Old 03-25-2011, 01:50 AM   #684
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
Somebody at work, and I can't remember who-think it might have been Trevor Matich-has been hyping Kaepernick for almost two years now. I don't know, I just don't see it. But maybe I just haven't seen enough of him.
I can understand hyping him up this offseason. Last offseason though, not so much.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CultBrennan59 View Post
I would respect Kaepernicks game more if he did these great numbers against a conference that was good, not the WAC, you know who also put great numbers against the WAC..Pineapple Jesus. On a similar note who was the last good WAC QB in the NFL?
I get your concern, especially since I have it to, but I think we weigh competition levels way more then we should. A lot of people don't realize that a lot of quality football players are going to these mid major programs like Boise State, Fresno State, and even Nevada. In fact Fresno State's coach has an anybody, anytime, anywhere policy when it comes to scheduling yet they get turned down constantly because college football is a "year long playoff" that lets you choose who you want to play and most schools across the country would rather play FCS schools then mid majors like Fresno.

Quote:
Fresno State is 12-14 against BCS teams since 2000, which has given birth to Hill's battle cry: Anybody, anytime, anywhere.
We're also in a day and age where we've seen Appalachian State beat Michigan in Ann Arbor. Boise State beating Oklahoma in a BcS bowl game. Joe Flacco is among the best young QB's in the game despite playing at an FCS school.

Anyway the point of all this soapbox ranting is the possibility (not the fact) that someone like Kaepernick was overlooked when he was 17 or 18 by the major schools and in 4 years at Nevada has taken his physical skill set and turned himself into a quality QB. If that's so then the strength of schedule should be an afterthought. At the very least he has intangibles that coaches love. Maybe not as good as Tebow but at least in the same ballpark.

Either way I won't know how I truly feel about Kaepernick (and Dalton/Ponder/Stanzi) until draft day. If Shanahan or some other QB guru takes him then thats a pretty good indication that he could turn into the real deal.
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Old 03-25-2011, 08:09 AM   #685
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

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Originally Posted by Lotus View Post
KaepKrusader, what do you think about the idea that we already have a center - Kory L. Kory L. might be at his best at center. What we actually need is a guard. What think ye?
I agree he would be best at the center position. At this point in his career is he better than Rabach? Yes. Is he a long term viable starter for this team? No. I think he is a good back up/role player for us since he is somewhat versatile. I just think a position along the line as important as center in the ZB scheme needs a new, fresh, young guy to come in and be a long time contributer. Or at least someone younger in FA.
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Old 03-25-2011, 08:34 AM   #686
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

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Originally Posted by Dirtbag59 View Post
I can understand hyping him up this offseason. Last offseason though, not so much.




I get your concern, especially since I have it to, but I think we weigh competition levels way more then we should. A lot of people don't realize that a lot of quality football players are going to these mid major programs like Boise State, Fresno State, and even Nevada. In fact Fresno State's coach has an anybody, anytime, anywhere policy when it comes to scheduling yet they get turned down constantly because college football is a "year long playoff" that lets you choose who you want to play and most schools across the country would rather play FCS schools then mid majors like Fresno.



We're also in a day and age where we've seen Appalachian State beat Michigan in Ann Arbor. Boise State beating Oklahoma in a BcS bowl game. Joe Flacco is among the best young QB's in the game despite playing at an FCS school.

Anyway the point of all this soapbox ranting is the possibility (not the fact) that someone like Kaepernick was overlooked when he was 17 or 18 by the major schools and in 4 years at Nevada has taken his physical skill set and turned himself into a quality QB. If that's so then the strength of schedule should be an afterthought. At the very least he has intangibles that coaches love. Maybe not as good as Tebow but at least in the same ballpark.

Either way I won't know how I truly feel about Kaepernick (and Dalton/Ponder/Stanzi) until draft day. If Shanahan or some other QB guru takes him then thats a pretty good indication that he could turn into the real deal.
Good points. This is nothing new for pro scouts either. Our beloved teams of the 80s & the 49ers were known for finding diamonds in the rough of small school teams, before the term "mid majors" was even used. Darrell Green & Jerry Rice to name a couple HOFers e.g.
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Old 03-25-2011, 09:50 AM   #687
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

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Originally Posted by SkinzWin View Post
I agree he would be best at the center position. At this point in his career is he better than Rabach? Yes. Is he a long term viable starter for this team? No. I think he is a good back up/role player for us since he is somewhat versatile. I just think a position along the line as important as center in the ZB scheme needs a new, fresh, young guy to come in and be a long time contributer. Or at least someone younger in FA.
Fair enough. I think I like Kory L. better than you do. But far be it from me to argue against feeding the front. You can never be too good up front.
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Old 03-25-2011, 10:14 AM   #688
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

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30gut, you've posted some of the most comprehensive QB stats here. What is your take on Kaepernick? I thought he looked good at the Sr. Bowl, but honestly that is the only time I've seen him play.
Kaep is the QB I know the least about, because unlike Gabbert, Locker and Newton I haven't charted any of Kaepernicks games.

I've only watched (not charted) some cut-ups.

My take:
NFL Size, his arm strength is right up there with Mallett,Newton and Locker some think he has the strongest arm in the draft.

His motion isn't as clean as those guys it looks like he pauses at some point in his release.
But although his motion isn't as efficient as the other guys he does get the ball out plenty quick and he hits what he's throwing at.
Is it a big deal? I don't know, it might not even need to be fixed and if it did it could probably be fixed much more easily then Tebow's motion.

Very athletic, good open field runner with good speed.

Increased his completion % as a senior which is a good sign.

In short I think he's a kid that has great physical tools NFL size, above average arm but doesn't have a clean throwing motion, above average athleticism, was a productive 4 year starter.
Imo he starts off behind the development curve because of his college offense and level competition and also depending on how teams view his throwing motion.

I would put him behind the top 4 prospects Newton, Locker, Gabbert, Mallett and somewhere in the mix with Ponder, Dalton but ahead of Stanzi.
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Old 03-25-2011, 10:43 AM   #689
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

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Originally Posted by CultBrennan59 View Post
I would respect Kaepernicks game more if he did these great numbers against a conference that was good, not the WAC, you know who also put great numbers against the WAC..Pineapple Jesus. On a similar note who was the last good WAC QB in the NFL?
I would refute this point but it has already been done for me by others. I don't think that you can respect a player less automatically just because he has not played in a power conference. My case in point. Let's compare Cam Newton to Kaepernick...

Cam Newton: 6'6' 250 lbs. Backup at Florida. Transfers to Binn College (JUCO). Transfers to Auburn for one season. Newton is a physical freak. He can run and extend the play and his stats this season were exceptionally good. 66.1% Completion Percentage. 2854 Yards. 30 TD. 7 INT. He has a history of academic cheating, and stealing. Seen as a head case with a big star mentality. Newton's knock besides this is that he had one year as a starter in a major college football setting.


Colin Kaepernick: 6'6' 225 lbs. 4 year starter out of Nevada. Most statistical numbers improved each of his four year. 64.9% Completion Percentage. 3022 Yards. 21 TD. 8 INT. Kaepernick has had four years to improve, and has, and while he is not as much of a physical freak as Newton, he has a ton of intangibles and upside, maybe more than anyone else, without the apparent headaches of premadonnaism and inflated egos that come with someone like Newton.

My point is this. Is Kaepernick as good as Newton? No. I think he could be and he has shown steady improvement. Is the ceiling higher for Newton? Probably, but it also could be a lot closer for Newton being a screw up IMO. If a guy like this had these similar skill and intangibles that people seem to covet, why take the risk on the ego of someone like Newton, when you can get virtually the same package at a lower cost?

Just because Newton went to Auburn and Kaepernick went to Nevada doesn't mean Newton is a hugely more talented player (albeit I will concede I think he does have more raw talent than Kaepernick). It simply means that scouts didn't see him like they did Newton. The tables could be turned and Kaepernick could have been recruited by a power conference. Their numbers are very similar statistically. I think as others have said, too many people take too much into account when looking at what conference a player was in and what teams they played against, instead of their athletic ability and skill sets.

Sincerely,
The KaepKrusader
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Old 03-25-2011, 10:48 AM   #690
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Re: 2011 NFL Draft

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jesus, no s. i never knew his numbers were that bad, his completion percentage is a joke..
Him and Joe Namath are two of the most overrated qbs to ever play. Neither one really has any business being in the HOF. Especially Bradshaw. He won 4 SB's playing behind a stout offensive line, handing the ball off to Franco and Rocky and heaving the ball down field hoping that Stallworth/Swann would make some kind of acrobatic catch, not to mention having one of the greatest defenses ever assembled. Damn I hate Pittsburgh!
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