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2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Old 12-19-2011, 12:20 PM   #61
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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This makes the most sense to me. I, personally, would much rather see the Redskins win out, finish the season out strong, and be in line for virtually the same QBs as if they lost the next two games. Plus, they would end at 7-9, which is where most of us pegged them at the start of the season anyway. So, that means a good supporting cast to help the young rookie QB.
To me though, the big thing is that the Redskins need to show that they are finally on the right track. The thing is: there are a lot of indicators, very real indicators, that suggest that Mike Shanahan is the worst coach in the recent history of the Redskins. But all of them are small sample indicators: consecutive home losses, lack of a meaningful winning streak, historically poor performance within the division.

If Shanahan can put together a three game winning streak here, a lot of the evidence that he's the worst coach in recent memory weakens considerably. And I would be more than happy to point out that my arguments that suggest he should be fired after two years are weakening, if in fact he can weaken them.

So the Redskins should go out these last two weeks, win by two touchdowns each week and show, finally, that Mike Shanahan deserves to be the head coach of this team. Dan Snyder and Bruce Allen have been incredibly careful to not give a public vote of confidence to their head coach. If the Redskins win these last two games, they'll look very smart by comparison because a vote of confidence will not be necessary. We'll be pretty close to (if not on) the proverbial right track.
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Old 12-19-2011, 12:26 PM   #62
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

Shanny is worse than Zorn and the Ole' Ball Coach? yeah dont know bout that
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Old 12-19-2011, 12:27 PM   #63
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Has anyone calculated if the Colts beat the Jags if they still would have the first pick assuming that Minnisota or the rams or all three are 2-14. Because that could change the entire draft. If Minnasota gets the number one pick they will draft Luck, I would think. Same thing with the Rams. I would be all for trading to get Bradford, but not to interested in Ponder.
Stop, just stop. The Rams will not draft Luck nor trade Bradford. Minnesota will not draft Luck nor trade Ponder. Just stop.
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Old 12-19-2011, 12:34 PM   #64
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Has anyone calculated if the Colts beat the Jags if they still would have the first pick assuming that Minnisota or the rams or all three are 2-14. Because that could change the entire draft. If Minnasota gets the number one pick they will draft Luck, I would think. Same thing with the Rams. I would be all for trading to get Bradford, but not to interested in Ponder.
With current records, the Colts still get the first pick at 2-14. But it's close enough where if the NFC North or NFC West totally tanks as a division down the stretch, the Colts could miss the first pick at 2-14.

Remaining non-conference games for NFC North, NFC West:

Steelers at 49ers (tonight)
Chargers at Lions
Cardinlas at Bengals

If the Steelers beat the 49ers, the Bengals beat the Cardinals, and the Colts beat the Jags or Texans while the Rams lose out, there's at least a small chance the Rams could pick at first overall. Otherwise, no real chance.
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Old 12-19-2011, 12:34 PM   #65
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

Colts opponents this year have 120 wins.
Vikings opponents this year have 128 wins.
Rams opponents this year have 132 wins.
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Old 12-19-2011, 12:41 PM   #66
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Shanny is worse than Zorn and the Ole' Ball Coach? yeah dont know bout that
Maybe as bad as?

I think Spurrier is a different animal though. Horrible head coach, put the franchise in a terrible spot. Still, longest losing streak was four games, longest home losing streak was three games, worst home record was 3-5. Shanahan's got all that beat, and against an easier schedule than Spurrier faced. Overall record favors Spurrier by a game. But I don't care so much about that.

Spurrier was unspeakably awful inside the division though. A division that was just as down then as the one Shanahan is competing in now.

I know facts about the job Shanahan has done make people queasy though.
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Old 12-19-2011, 12:48 PM   #67
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Maybe as bad as?

I think Spurrier is a different animal though. Horrible head coach, put the franchise in a terrible spot. Still, longest losing streak was four games, longest home losing streak was three games, worst home record was 3-5. Shanahan's got all that beat, and against an easier schedule than Spurrier faced. Overall record favors Spurrier by a game. But I don't care so much about that.

Spurrier was unspeakably awful inside the division though. A division that was just as down then as the one Shanahan is competing in now.

I know facts about the job Shanahan has done make people queasy though.
I think we bottomed out as a franchise the last year of Zorn---a bottom out from every perspective of an organization. No matter who they brought in, we werent gonna win, for at least several years. Has he been perfect? nope...i think he is moving in the right direction
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Old 12-19-2011, 12:49 PM   #68
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

In the off chance that either Minn or St. L. get the first pick, I suspect they will have a Luck auction with plenty of suiters offering multiple 1st and 2nd round picks. Each have their "QB of the Future" on the roster but have holes to fill around him.
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Old 12-19-2011, 12:50 PM   #69
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Stop, just stop. The Rams will not draft Luck nor trade Bradford. Minnesota will not draft Luck nor trade Ponder. Just stop.
I think your wrong, but either way they will either pick him or deal the pick. The pick will be worth crazy money. If the Colts dont pick first it changes everything.
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Old 12-19-2011, 02:00 PM   #70
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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I think your wrong, but either way they will either pick him or deal the pick. The pick will be worth crazy money. If the Colts dont pick first it changes everything.
Trade the pick? Sure, could happen. Draft Luck and trade Bradford or Ponder? Not a chance.
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Old 12-19-2011, 02:10 PM   #71
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Has anyone calculated if the Colts beat the Jags if they still would have the first pick assuming that Minnisota or the rams or all three are 2-14. Because that could change the entire draft. If Minnasota gets the number one pick they will draft Luck, I would think. Same thing with the Rams. I would be all for trading to get Bradford, but not to interested in Ponder.
Absolutely no way the Rams or the Vikings pick Andrew Luck in the draft.
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Old 12-19-2011, 02:12 PM   #72
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

I am telling right now, Minnesota takes Luck without even a debate. Bradford becomes a 60/40 proposition, in favor of keeping Bradford and getting a truck load of draft picks for years to come, that could solidify the teams Oline and secondary. Wh
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Old 12-19-2011, 02:30 PM   #73
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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I am telling right now, Minnesota takes Luck without even a debate. Bradford becomes a 60/40 proposition, in favor of keeping Bradford and getting a truck load of draft picks for years to come, that could solidify the teams Oline and secondary. Wh
So your saying that Minnesota takes Luck, trades Ponder to St. Louis for draft picks? Nope, I do not see that happening at all. First of all, these trades have to benefit both or all parties involved, and I just don't see how trading Ponder to St. Louis benefits St. Louis in the least. They already have their QB, just like Minnesota already has Ponder. And, if Minnesota drafted Luck as a bargaining chip, I think that's very risky on Minnesota's part. It would make more sense just to trade that pick down for more draft picks than holding Andrew Luck hostage.
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Old 12-19-2011, 02:38 PM   #74
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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So your saying that Minnesota takes Luck, trades Ponder to St. Louis for draft picks? Nope, I do not see that happening at all. First of all, these trades have to benefit both or all parties involved, and I just don't see how trading Ponder to St. Louis benefits St. Louis in the least. They already have their QB, just like Minnesota already has Ponder. And, if Minnesota drafted Luck as a bargaining chip, I think that's very risky on Minnesota's part. It would make more sense just to trade that pick down for more draft picks than holding Andrew Luck hostage.
When did he suggest trading Ponder to St. Louis?
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Old 12-19-2011, 03:07 PM   #75
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Maybe as bad as?

I think Spurrier is a different animal though. Horrible head coach, put the franchise in a terrible spot. Still, longest losing streak was four games, longest home losing streak was three games, worst home record was 3-5. Shanahan's got all that beat, and against an easier schedule than Spurrier faced. Overall record favors Spurrier by a game. But I don't care so much about that.

Spurrier was unspeakably awful inside the division though. A division that was just as down then as the one Shanahan is competing in now.

I know facts about the job Shanahan has done make people queasy though.
What facts are you speaking about? The obvious, well-known ones (McNabb, his actual win-loss record, his preseason comments about Beck/Grossman)?

Or - are you suggesting that you know additional facts which are not public knowledge?

If the first, true enough, their have been missteps - clearly. At the same time, after two seasons with a losing record and no hope of playoffs, the team clearly still believes in Shanahan and is willing to play for him. Not so at the end of either Zorn or Sprurrier. Those teams just quit and were playing out the string. As you implied, these last two games are important for this team going forward. Minnesota is a team that a "good" team should beat at home. Going out with a win against a division opponent, in their stadium, is a way to make a statement for the following year. I hope it breaks down that Philly needs to win that game and we then beat them.

Bottom line, Shanahan's numbers may not reflect a sea change in the way this organization is being run but, I would suggest, the way this team is playing at the end of a second losing season does.



I think these last two games are important for the team going forward. Avoiding double digit losses would be significant.
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