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2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Old 12-19-2011, 03:13 PM   #76
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Originally Posted by T.O.Killa View Post
I am telling right now, Minnesota takes Luck without even a debate. Bradford becomes a 60/40 proposition, in favor of keeping Bradford and getting a truck load of draft picks for years to come, that could solidify the teams Oline and secondary. Wh
While I doubt this is true - I think Minn trades for picks as Ponder has shown potential as a starter - I wouldn't rule it out. I mean, Carolina took Newton one year after drafting a QB in the first round (Clausen).

Still, I think Ponder>Clausen and with Frazier in his second year, I doubt he dumps his first round QB.

The "Luck Pick" is too valuable to both Minn and the Rams to spend it on one player, they will use it to improve other areas of the team.
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Old 12-19-2011, 03:23 PM   #77
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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While I doubt this is true - I think Minn trades for picks as Ponder has shown potential as a starter - I wouldn't rule it out. I mean, Carolina took Newton one year after drafting a QB in the first round (Clausen).

Still, I think Ponder>Clausen and with Frazier in his second year, I doubt he dumps his first round QB.

The "Luck Pick" is too valuable to both Minn and the Rams to spend it on one player, they will use it to improve other areas of the team.
In the end Frazier and the Vikes can potentially take a QB, but I think there is a big difference between their situation and the Panthers. Clausen was drafted by the old Panther's regime, and the new regime (Rivera) drafted Newton. Frazier drafted Ponder and it would look bad on his part to dump him after a year (especially coming off an abbreviated offseason).
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Old 12-19-2011, 03:29 PM   #78
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

Luck is the most saught after QB since Payton Manning. Considered by most a once in a generation QB. Ponder has shown OK, was a stretch to say the least last year, at 12. This was mostly due to the lack of a free agent period and uncertanty of a lock out. Luck being available is a game changer. No way Minnisota walks away from this pick, unless they are incompetent.
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Old 12-19-2011, 03:49 PM   #79
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Luck is the most saught after QB since Payton Manning. Considered by most a once in a generation QB. Ponder has shown OK, was a stretch to say the least last year, at 12. This was mostly due to the lack of a free agent period and uncertanty of a lock out. Luck being available is a game changer. No way Minnisota walks away from this pick, unless they are incompetent.
I was talking about Minny picking after #1. Still, the Colts and the Vikes are in different situations in regards to QB. But, I am saying that if the Vikes have the #2 or #3 pick, they could trade down and build around Ponder.
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Old 12-19-2011, 03:57 PM   #80
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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I was talking about Minny picking after #1. Still, the Colts and the Vikes are in different situations in regards to QB. But, I am saying that if the Vikes have the #2 or #3 pick, they could trade down and build around Ponder.
This whole arguement is based on these teams getting the first pick. I agree that the Rams and Vikes dont take a QB, unless they get the first pick. If they get the first pick things get real cloudy, real fast.
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Old 12-19-2011, 04:30 PM   #81
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

If things stay as they are I see something like

1. Colts-Luck
2. Rams-Blackmon
3. Vikings-Kalil
4. Dolphins (trade with Jaguars)-Barkley
5. Browns-RG III
6. Bucs-Quentin Coples
7. Bills (trade with Redskins)-Michael Floyd
8. Panthers-Morris Claiborne
9. Jaguars-Alshon Jeffery
10. Redskins-Landry Tannehill
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Old 12-19-2011, 04:36 PM   #82
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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In the end Frazier and the Vikes can potentially take a QB, but I think there is a big difference between their situation and the Panthers. Clausen was drafted by the old Panther's regime, and the new regime (Rivera) drafted Newton. Frazier drafted Ponder and it would look bad on his part to dump him after a year (especially coming off an abbreviated offseason).
You are correct, especially since Ponder was taken at #12 while Clausen was taken at #48. You can't give up on your own #12 pick as easily as you can someone else's #48.
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Old 12-19-2011, 04:38 PM   #83
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
If things stay as they are I see something like

1. Colts-Luck
2. Rams-Blackmon
3. Vikings-Kalil
4. Dolphins (trade with Jaguars)-Barkley
5. Browns-RG III
6. Bucs-Quentin Coples
7. Bills (trade with Redskins)-Michael Floyd
8. Panthers-Morris Claiborne
9. Jaguars-Alshon Jeffery
10. Redskins-Landry Tannehill
Landry Tannehill is awesome! He combines the best qualities of Landry Jones and Ryan Tannehill!
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Old 12-19-2011, 04:53 PM   #84
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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While I doubt this is true - I think Minn trades for picks as Ponder has shown potential as a starter - I wouldn't rule it out. I mean, Carolina took Newton one year after drafting a QB in the first round (Clausen).

Still, I think Ponder>Clausen and with Frazier in his second year, I doubt he dumps his first round QB.

The "Luck Pick" is too valuable to both Minn and the Rams to spend it on one player, they will use it to improve other areas of the team.
From what little I've seen of Ponder, he looks much more promising than Clausen. I think Ponder is someone Minnesota needs to hang on to and build around. IF Minnesota got the Luck pick, I also agree, I think Minnesota trades that pick for more picks. However, moot point as I feel Indy will have the Luck pick regardless AND I feel they'll draft Andrew Luck.
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Old 12-19-2011, 05:54 PM   #85
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Landry Tannehill is awesome! He combines the best qualities of Landry Jones and Ryan Tannehill!
So a mustache and the ability to throw on the run?
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Old 12-19-2011, 05:55 PM   #86
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
If things stay as they are I see something like

1. Colts-Luck
2. Rams-Blackmon
3. Vikings-Kalil
4. Dolphins (trade with Jaguars)-Barkley
5. Browns-RG III
6. Bucs-Quentin Coples
7. Bills (trade with Redskins)-Michael Floyd
8. Panthers-Morris Claiborne
9. Jaguars-Alshon Jeffery
10. Redskins-Landry Tannehill
I will cry if we draft Landry Jones
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:13 PM   #87
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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I think we bottomed out as a franchise the last year of Zorn---a bottom out from every perspective of an organization. No matter who they brought in, we werent gonna win, for at least several years. Has he been perfect? nope...i think he is moving in the right direction
I think what we are accomplishing right now has a shot to be a positive move in the right direction. There's hardly anything to complain about from yesterdays game. But right now, as we speak, it's still an isolated stretch in a long season, kind of like that six week stretch for Zorn where things looked good after a 2-5 start.

What I'm saying is that the Shanahan era -- as a whole -- has been awful. But I am also saying that this by itself doesn't have to mean anything. If the Redskins really are on the right track, who cares how bad the last two years looked in comparison to other two year stretches in the Snyder era?

I think we'll learn a lot about the track the team is on in the next two weeks. If they get exposed, then we should say they got exposed. If they are making tangible, positive progress, then we should say that.
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:21 PM   #88
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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Originally Posted by SmootSmack View Post
If things stay as they are I see something like

1. Colts-Luck
2. Rams-Blackmon
3. Vikings-Kalil
4. Dolphins (trade with Jaguars)-Barkley
5. Browns-RG III
6. Bucs-Quentin Coples
7. Bills (trade with Redskins)-Michael Floyd
8. Panthers-Morris Claiborne
9. Jaguars-Alshon Jeffery
10. Redskins-Landry Tannehill
Ugh that's seems a big stretch i.e. bad value at 10th overall. I guess in this scenario I hope we trade w/ the Jags...
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:33 PM   #89
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

I mean looking at the entire draft we need a QB worse than any other team picking in the top 10 (assuming Manning plays another couple/few years), if anyone should be trading up to get one of the top talents it should be us.
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:34 PM   #90
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Re: 2012 Draft-QB Prospects (Part III)

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What facts are you speaking about? The obvious, well-known ones (McNabb, his actual win-loss record, his preseason comments about Beck/Grossman)?

Or - are you suggesting that you know additional facts which are not public knowledge?

If the first, true enough, their have been missteps - clearly. At the same time, after two seasons with a losing record and no hope of playoffs, the team clearly still believes in Shanahan and is willing to play for him. Not so at the end of either Zorn or Sprurrier. Those teams just quit and were playing out the string. As you implied, these last two games are important for this team going forward. Minnesota is a team that a "good" team should beat at home. Going out with a win against a division opponent, in their stadium, is a way to make a statement for the following year. I hope it breaks down that Philly needs to win that game and we then beat them.

Bottom line, Shanahan's numbers may not reflect a sea change in the way this organization is being run but, I would suggest, the way this team is playing at the end of a second losing season does.

I think these last two games are important for the team going forward. Avoiding double digit losses would be significant.
Sorry, there was an inconsistent emphasis in that sentence. Reading again makes it seem like I'm working some sort of inside slant. With regards some sort of secret organizational disdain for the job the head coach is doing, I can really only say that other organizations are skeptical. I don't know anything about what the team or other coaches or execs or owners of the Redskins think.

Anything I actually say about Mike Shanahan's line of thinking is pure observation or speculation.

I don't think it's accurate to say that Spurrier or Zorn's teams quit on them. I think it's accurate to say that the organization quit on Zorn at some point during the 2009 season (which it hasn't yet -- at least obviously -- done with Shanahan).

Obviously, with a team that hasn't won three games in a row for Shanahan yet and with a team that hasn't gone 3-3 in the division since Zorn was the coach, there is plenty for the team to prove down the stretch here. I'd say a 7-9 record with this kind of finish would put the team on schedule, pending future moves. It does not mean, to me at least, that the team is on the right track in spite of all the other evidence, but it would be an important first step, particularly with all the youth that is playing for this team.

I think the record would show with the history of this team that they probably aren't going to be that competitive in both of these last two games. So hopefully they can go out and show a couple more opponents that they can play a little bit.
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