Kirk Cousins pick 4.7

warriorzpath · 04-30-2012, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 30gut

I'm not sure what you mean by insight, but Grossman undoubtedly knows the offense better then Cousins.
And maybe Cousins does bring more confidence, I'm hoping he can win the back-up spot outright and become the back-up as a rookie like Tyrod Taylor did last year.

But, I'm refering to actual on the field contributions either through offense, defense or special teams as a rotational or depth player.

Going by the analysis by the ESPN experts, one insight that he provides that Grossman doesn't is progressions. And he also reportedly is the type that speaks up to help and contribute to the team. This will all help on the field and the team as soon as he starts working with the team.

Mattyk · 04-30-2012, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

Yeah, it was kind of funny to me how Tedy Bruschi is arguing that this was a luxury pick up because 4th rounders are usually for contributors at Special Teams and depth. And for team like the Redskins, they can't afford to use that pick for a qb. I'll give him the Special Teams contribution, but doesn't Cousins provide depth at the most important position - which solidifies the quarterback position for the redskins, a position that was arguably the weakest?

Then Bruschi turns around and praises the eagles for picking up depth at the qb position with Nick Foles... I don't get it. I guess it's a luxury that an 8-8 team can afford and not a 5-11 team that could have easily won 3 more games if the qb play was better.

Plus Foles was a 3rd rd pick.

EARTHQUAKE2689 · 04-30-2012, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

Yeah, it was kind of funny to me how Tedy Bruschi is arguing that this was a luxury pick up because 4th rounders are usually for contributors at Special Teams and depth. And for team like the Redskins, they can't afford to use that pick for a qb. I'll give him the Special Teams contribution, but doesn't Cousins provide depth at the most important position - which solidifies the quarterback position for the redskins, a position that was arguably the weakest?

Then Bruschi turns around and praises the eagles for picking up depth at the qb position with Nick Foles... I don't get it. I guess it's a luxury that an 8-8 team can afford and not a 5-11 team that could have easily won 3 more games if the qb play was better.

Can't fix stupid.

SirClintonPortis · 04-30-2012, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

Yeah, it was kind of funny to me how Tedy Bruschi is arguing that this was a luxury pick up because 4th rounders are usually for contributors at Special Teams and depth. And for team like the Redskins, they can't afford to use that pick for a qb. I'll give him the Special Teams contribution, but doesn't Cousins provide depth at the most important position - which solidifies the quarterback position for the redskins, a position that was arguably the weakest?

Then Bruschi turns around and praises the eagles for picking up depth at the qb position with Nick Foles... I don't get it. I guess it's a luxury that an 8-8 team can afford and not a 5-11 team that could have easily won 3 more games if the qb play was better.

Quite frankly, I think the majority of fans and media still are unconsciously operating under the schema that the Redskins can't do anything right. Hence, they pick out the negatives of our moves. Until we show them A LOT otherwise, this is the treatment we'll get.

And I remember they were pimping the Eagles' pick of Macho Harris and well, we know how that turned out in the end.

30gut · 04-30-2012, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by warriorzpath

Going by the analysis by the ESPN experts, one insight that he provides that Grossman doesn't is progressions. And he also reportedly is the type that speaks up to help and contribute to the team. This will all help on the field and the team as soon as he starts working with the team.

I'm not sure what they said on ESPN but I disagree that Cousin provides more insight on pass progressions he hasn't even run compared to Rex who's been in the is offense for 3 years. (this is coming from someone that loathes Wrecks mind you)
Also, Griffin is the QB leader of this team.
I'm not saying Cousins isn't a leader but his leadership only matters when he's undercenter, the 3rd string QB isn't a leader.

And again, I was refering to actual on the field contributions.

warriorzpath · 04-30-2012, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirClintonPortis

Quite frankly, I think the majority of fans and media still are unconsciously operating under the schema that the Redskins can't do anything right. Hence, they pick out the negatives of our moves. Until we show them A LOT otherwise, this is the treatment we'll get.

And I remember they were pimping the Eagles' pick of Macho Harris and well, we know how that turned out in the end.

Yes, all of the above. It will just be a wait and see for now. But I can't wait until the redskins suit up against another team. I have a good feeling, but I've had a good feeling in other seasons too. Like I said, we'll see.

SmootSmack · 04-30-2012, 01:37 PM

I love that we got Cousins but in fairness you can't compare drafting a QB in the 3rd round to learn under a 31 year old "brittle veteran" to drafting a QB in the 4th to learn under a 22 year old phenom you just moved multiple high round picks for. They're two totally different situations.

warriorzpath · 04-30-2012, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 30gut

I'm not sure what they said on ESPN but I disagree that Cousin provides more insight on pass progressions he hasn't even run compared to Rex who's been in the is offense for 3 years. (this is coming from someone that loathes Wrecks mind you)
Also, Griffin is the QB leader of this team.
I'm not saying Cousins isn't a leader but his leadership only matters when he's undercenter, the 3rd string QB isn't a leader.

And again, I was refering to actual on the field contributions.

Oh my... I don't think I can discuss this with you anymore with what you just said about Rex and his pass progressions being better - even with his familiarity within this offense, but manages to automatically throw 2 interceptions per game. His pass progressions are the worst of any veteran in the league. He's good Rex bad Rex for a reason - if the play goes as expected it's good Rex, if something doesn't go well on a particular play - it's bad Rex.

warriorzpath · 04-30-2012, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmootSmack

I love that we got Cousins but in fairness you can't compare drafting a QB in the 3rd round to learn under a 31 year old "brittle veteran" to drafting a QB in the 4th to learn under a 22 year old phenom you just moved multiple high round picks for. They're two totally different situations.

Comparisons or not -- bottomline - drafting Cousins made the Redskins team better.

warriorzpath · 04-30-2012, 01:54 PM

And I'm hoping that Cousins improves enough to become the backup as the season goes along. Rex was nice to re-sign because he has familiarity with the system and he hopefully speeds up the learning by RGIII and Cousins, but I don't trust Gross Rexman, even as a backup.

SmootSmack · 04-30-2012, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 30gut

I'm not sure what they said on ESPN but I disagree that Cousin provides more insight on pass progressions he hasn't even run compared to Rex who's been in the is offense for 3 years. (this is coming from someone that loathes Wrecks mind you)
Also, Griffin is the QB leader of this team.
I'm not saying Cousins isn't a leader but his leadership only matters when he's undercenter, the 3rd string QB isn't a leader.

And again, I was refering to actual on the field contributions.

Trent Dilfer said that what Cousins does better than RGIII right now is go through progressions. That right now Cousins is probably a better red zone QB than RGIII for that reason.

Rex wasn't mentioned

sportscurmudgeon · 04-30-2012, 02:15 PM

I would like to take this discussion in a slightly different direction.

First of all, I liked Kirk Cousins as a QB at Mich State. I thought he would go earlier in the draft than the 4th round. So, that is sort of a "value pick" for the Skins.

Second, there are more than a few examples of recent NFL teams who have needed a competent back-up Qb to make it thru the season. QBs get injured; RG3 is a mobile QB so he is likely to be hit more often than some other QBs; ergo... Cousins may not be a competent back-up by the first week of October in 2012, but if the Skins are looking for a back-up to take the field that early, there are far bigger problems facing this team.

From a "football perspective", I like the pick.

Here is my concern.

The Redskins now have two young QBs both of whom have always been "the man" on their teams. Cousins knows - - because the Shanahans have told him - - that he is going to be the backup and RG3 knows - - because the Shanahans have told him - - that he will be the franchise QB. That's fine and dandy - - unless - -

RG3 obviously struggles with the offense and Cousins has to come into a game in the 3rd or 4th quarter because RG3 is just not playing well.

I don't care about the fan reaction in the circumstance; what I would fear would be the way the Shanahans will deal with the two young QBs in that circumstance. Remember how deftly and smoothly they handled benching Donovan McNabb in Detroit. Remember how skillfully they pulled Rex for Beck last year - - asserting that Beck was the best QB to come out of college in his year - - only to have to go back to Rex in another smooth tranistion a few games later.

The coaches did not handle either situation well. And a few of the QB jugglings in Denver were not handled perfectly either...

My concern is that the Shanahans might - - I said MIGHT - - not be well-equipped to deal with an on-the-field problem of that nature.

Hopefully it will not come to that. If it does, hopefully the Shanahans will handle it just a tad better than they did the McNabb/Grossman fandango.

warriorzpath · 04-30-2012, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sportscurmudgeon

I would like to take this discussion in a slightly different direction.

First of all, I liked Kirk Cousins as a QB at Mich State. I thought he would go earlier in the draft than the 4th round. So, that is sort of a "value pick" for the Skins.

Second, there are more than a few examples of recent NFL teams who have needed a competent back-up Qb to make it thru the season. QBs get injured; RG3 is a mobile QB so he is likely to be hit more often than some other QBs; ergo... Cousins may not be a competent back-up by the first week of October in 2012, but if the Skins are looking for a back-up to take the field that early, there are far bigger problems facing this team.

From a "football perspective", I like the pick.

Here is my concern.

The Redskins now have two young QBs both of whom have always been "the man" on their teams. Cousins knows - - because the Shanahans have told him - - that he is going to be the backup and RG3 knows - - because the Shanahans have told him - - that he will be the franchise QB. That's fine and dandy - - unless - -

RG3 obviously struggles with the offense and Cousins has to come into a game in the 3rd or 4th quarter because RG3 is just not playing well.

I don't care about the fan reaction in the circumstance; what I would fear would be the way the Shanahans will deal with the two young QBs in that circumstance. Remember how deftly and smoothly they handled benching Donovan McNabb in Detroit. Remember how skillfully they pulled Rex for Beck last year - - asserting that Beck was the best QB to come out of college in his year - - only to have to go back to Rex in another smooth tranistion a few games later.

The coaches did not handle either situation well. And a few of the QB jugglings in Denver were not handled perfectly either...

My concern is that the Shanahans might - - I said MIGHT - - not be well-equipped to deal with an on-the-field problem of that nature.

Hopefully it will not come to that. If it does, hopefully the Shanahans will handle it just a tad better than they did the McNabb/Grossman fandango.

That would be my fear too because if it came down to that this season, it would Redskins Armagedon.

JoeRedskin · 04-30-2012, 02:27 PM

While I don't love the pick, (1) I get it - a QB the FO really likes, who is projected as an eventual starter in the league and who provides much better depth going forward then Grossman; (2) I like the pick a lot - now is the time to develop the young guy behind the annointed franchise, this is a guy who wasn't going to start for anybody this year but might do so in a year or two. We had 9 picks this draft and, to me, it was a clearly a depth depth depth draft - including at the game's most important position where we are now set.

All these talking heads hating the pick - okay, we had needs, but do you recognize the value of this pick both from a draft position and the improvement of the position for the Skins? Most of these same guys were saying how RGIII is more likely to have immediate success than Luck b/c the Skins are the more complete team.

So spending a value pick on a solid player who - hopefully - secures the QB position for several years on a team that, while faulty, is not abysmal is confusing to you? Can I have your job 'cause it seems pretty straight forward to me.

CultBrennan59 · 04-30-2012, 02:29 PM

When Kirk Cousins is being talked about more than your 1st pick, your starting QB, Robert Griffin, then thats never a good thing to have, especially for a rookie.

04-30-2012, 01:37 PM	#157
SmootSmack Mad Men Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 43,098	Re: Kirk Cousins pick 4.7 I love that we got Cousins but in fairness you can't compare drafting a QB in the 3rd round to learn under a 31 year old "brittle veteran" to drafting a QB in the 4th to learn under a 22 year old phenom you just moved multiple high round picks for. They're two totally different situations. __________________ You're So Vain...You Probably Think This Sig Is About You

04-30-2012, 01:54 PM	#160
warriorzpath The Starter Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,394	Re: Kirk Cousins pick 4.7 And I'm hoping that Cousins improves enough to become the backup as the season goes along. Rex was nice to re-sign because he has familiarity with the system and he hopefully speeds up the learning by RGIII and Cousins, but I don't trust Gross Rexman, even as a backup.

04-30-2012, 02:15 PM	#162
sportscurmudgeon Playmaker Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 3,159	I would like to take this discussion in a slightly different direction. First of all, I liked Kirk Cousins as a QB at Mich State. I thought he would go earlier in the draft than the 4th round. So, that is sort of a "value pick" for the Skins. Second, there are more than a few examples of recent NFL teams who have needed a competent back-up Qb to make it thru the season. QBs get injured; RG3 is a mobile QB so he is likely to be hit more often than some other QBs; ergo... Cousins may not be a competent back-up by the first week of October in 2012, but if the Skins are looking for a back-up to take the field that early, there are far bigger problems facing this team. From a "football perspective", I like the pick. Here is my concern. The Redskins now have two young QBs both of whom have always been "the man" on their teams. Cousins knows - - because the Shanahans have told him - - that he is going to be the backup and RG3 knows - - because the Shanahans have told him - - that he will be the franchise QB. That's fine and dandy - - unless - - RG3 obviously struggles with the offense and Cousins has to come into a game in the 3rd or 4th quarter because RG3 is just not playing well. I don't care about the fan reaction in the circumstance; what I would fear would be the way the Shanahans will deal with the two young QBs in that circumstance. Remember how deftly and smoothly they handled benching Donovan McNabb in Detroit. Remember how skillfully they pulled Rex for Beck last year - - asserting that Beck was the best QB to come out of college in his year - - only to have to go back to Rex in another smooth tranistion a few games later. The coaches did not handle either situation well. And a few of the QB jugglings in Denver were not handled perfectly either... My concern is that the Shanahans might - - I said MIGHT - - not be well-equipped to deal with an on-the-field problem of that nature. Hopefully it will not come to that. If it does, hopefully the Shanahans will handle it just a tad better than they did the McNabb/Grossman fandango. __________________ The Sports Curmudgeon www.sportscurmudgeon.com But don't get me wrong, I love sports...

04-30-2012, 02:27 PM	#164
JoeRedskin Contains football related knowledge Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Second Star On The Right Age: 50 Posts: 7,143	Re: Kirk Cousins pick 4.7 While I don't love the pick, (1) I get it - a QB the FO really likes, who is projected as an eventual starter in the league and who provides much better depth going forward then Grossman; (2) I like the pick a lot - now is the time to develop the young guy behind the annointed franchise, this is a guy who wasn't going to start for anybody this year but might do so in a year or two. We had 9 picks this draft and, to me, it was a clearly a depth depth depth draft - including at the game's most important position where we are now set. All these talking heads hating the pick - okay, we had needs, but do you recognize the value of this pick both from a draft position and the improvement of the position for the Skins? Most of these same guys were saying how RGIII is more likely to have immediate success than Luck b/c the Skins are the more complete team. So spending a value pick on a solid player who - hopefully - secures the QB position for several years on a team that, while faulty, is not abysmal is confusing to you? Can I have your job 'cause it seems pretty straight forward to me. __________________ My Little Pony: Friendship is magic? or ... a repressive matriarchal society where individuals' roles are defined by their immutable physical characteristics and governance is reserved for those who demonstrate the genetic purity of the pony master race?

04-30-2012, 02:29 PM	#165
CultBrennan59 Pro Bowl Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 5,579	Re: Kirk Cousins pick 4.7 When Kirk Cousins is being talked about more than your 1st pick, your starting QB, Robert Griffin, then thats never a good thing to have, especially for a rookie. __________________ When in doubt, go with the SEC

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Kirk Cousins pick 4.7

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