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3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

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Old 03-30-2018, 09:46 AM   #16
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

tl;dr It's easier to criticize our own teams drafting, but comparing to other teams, imo, shows that it was pretty damn good.

Here is Seattle's equivalent (I used them based on Schneed's Richard Sherman example)
2013
2 62 SEA Christine Michael RB (current Colts)
3 87 SEA Jordan Hill DT (current IR Lions)
4 123 SEA Chris Harper WR (out of league -OOL))
5 158 SEA Luke Willson TE (current Lions)
5 138 SEA Tharold Simon DB (OOL)
5 137 SEA Jesse Williams DT (OOL)
6 194 SEA Spencer Ware RB (current KC)
7 242 SEA Michael Bowie T (OOL)
7 241 SEA Jared Smith DT (OOL)
7 220 SEA Ryan Seymour G (OOL)

2014

2 64 SEA Justin Britt T Current SEA
2 45 SEA Paul Richardson WR Current WAS
4 132 SEA Kevin Pierre-Louis LB Current NYJ
4 123 SEA Kevin Norwood WR OOL
4 108 SEA Cassius Marsh DE current SF
5 172 SEA Jimmy Staten DT OOL
6 208 SEA Eric Pinkins DB OOL
6 199 SEA Garrett Scott OL OOL
7 227 SEA Kiero Small RB OOL

2015

2 63 SEA Frank Clark DE Current SEA
3 69 SEA Tyler Lockett WR Current SEA
4 134 SEA Mark Glowinski G Current IND
4 130 SEA Terry Poole G OOL
5 170 SEA Tye Smith CB Current TEN
6 214 SEA Kristjan Sokoli DT Current NYG
6 209 SEA Obum Gwacham DE Current NYJ
7 248 SEA Ryan Murphy DB Current NYJ

So their equivalent players on roster for those 3 years are:

3 on roster out of 27 picks (or for Jamf's 2 year note, 1 out of 17 picks for 2013-2014)

Tyler Lockett strikes me as their main standout
13 of 27, or just under 50% are out of the league

All 3 years they traded their first round picks (none of the resulting players are on their team -- Percy Harvin, Jimmy Graham, Kyle Van Noy, Cassius Marsh

Interestingly Paul Richardson was picked 2 spots ahead of Trent Murphy both moved on because the drafting team didn't want to keep them
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Old 03-30-2018, 11:33 AM   #17
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

These bad drafts are part of the reason why they have been on the decline.

Seattle built their Super Bowl teams from picks after the second round who became pro bowlers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
tl;dr It's easier to criticize our own teams drafting, but comparing to other teams, imo, shows that it was pretty damn good.

Here is Seattle's equivalent (I used them based on Schneed's Richard Sherman example)
2013
2 62 SEA Christine Michael RB (current Colts)
3 87 SEA Jordan Hill DT (current IR Lions)
4 123 SEA Chris Harper WR (out of league -OOL))
5 158 SEA Luke Willson TE (current Lions)
5 138 SEA Tharold Simon DB (OOL)
5 137 SEA Jesse Williams DT (OOL)
6 194 SEA Spencer Ware RB (current KC)
7 242 SEA Michael Bowie T (OOL)
7 241 SEA Jared Smith DT (OOL)
7 220 SEA Ryan Seymour G (OOL)

2014

2 64 SEA Justin Britt T Current SEA
2 45 SEA Paul Richardson WR Current WAS
4 132 SEA Kevin Pierre-Louis LB Current NYJ
4 123 SEA Kevin Norwood WR OOL
4 108 SEA Cassius Marsh DE current SF
5 172 SEA Jimmy Staten DT OOL
6 208 SEA Eric Pinkins DB OOL
6 199 SEA Garrett Scott OL OOL
7 227 SEA Kiero Small RB OOL

2015

2 63 SEA Frank Clark DE Current SEA
3 69 SEA Tyler Lockett WR Current SEA
4 134 SEA Mark Glowinski G Current IND
4 130 SEA Terry Poole G OOL
5 170 SEA Tye Smith CB Current TEN
6 214 SEA Kristjan Sokoli DT Current NYG
6 209 SEA Obum Gwacham DE Current NYJ
7 248 SEA Ryan Murphy DB Current NYJ

So their equivalent players on roster for those 3 years are:

3 on roster out of 27 picks (or for Jamf's 2 year note, 1 out of 17 picks for 2013-2014)

Tyler Lockett strikes me as their main standout
13 of 27, or just under 50% are out of the league

All 3 years they traded their first round picks (none of the resulting players are on their team -- Percy Harvin, Jimmy Graham, Kyle Van Noy, Cassius Marsh

Interestingly Paul Richardson was picked 2 spots ahead of Trent Murphy both moved on because the drafting team didn't want to keep them
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Old 03-30-2018, 11:35 AM   #18
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

We got nothing out of the Murphy pick and we traded with Dallas and gave them a pro bowl pass rusher. Itís not s good pick any way you spin it.
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This is indeed where we disagree... when it comes to evaluating our drafts.

We can question our FO's decision making when managing players contracts:
Like why on earth wasn't Murphy extended during this season ? Injured, he would have been glad to get a contract, wouldn't he?
Instead we have to let him walk after only one solid contributing season because he's getting a big contract he deserves...
But that still was a good pick. Not retaining good picks is indeed pretty dumb though.
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Old 03-30-2018, 11:40 AM   #19
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamf View Post
These bad drafts are part of the reason why they have been on the decline.

Seattle built their Super Bowl teams from picks after the second round who became pro bowlers.
What 3 teams would you list as top drafting teams from 2013-2015?
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Old 03-30-2018, 11:48 AM   #20
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamf View Post
We got nothing out of the Murphy pick and we traded with Dallas and gave them a pro bowl pass rusher. Itís not s good pick any way you spin it.
Well it is a good pick in the way we picked a good player... the failure to retain him doesn't erase the fact he was a good draft choice. Does it?

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Old 03-30-2018, 12:20 PM   #21
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamf View Post
We got nothing out of the Murphy pick and we traded with Dallas and gave them a pro bowl pass rusher. Itís not s good pick any way you spin it.
Player A vs Player B career stats:
SUMMARY

G AV Sk Tkl FF
47 13 15.0 61 6
48 24 23.5 87 7
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Old 03-30-2018, 01:01 PM   #22
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

A few different sites rankings:
None of these are definitive but to give a general flavor:

https://nypost.com/2017/04/22/studyi...ms-at-picking/
They rank us 7 over the past 5 years ( They have the Seahawks at number 5)

https://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/04/nfl...sses-2012-2016
They have us at number 5, Seahawks at Number 1

https://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissm.../#34977d0d5dcd
They have us at 16, Seahawks at 2

https://www.foxsports.com/nfl/galler...present-030117
They have us at 9, Seahawks at 12.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/new...by-draft-class
They rank us 12th, Seahawks 3rd

I guess the point of this is that ranking drafting is a pretty damn subjective task. The Skins FO isn't perfect at it, BUT to say that they can't get anything past the 20th pick like you said at one time is not very realistic understanding of how difficult NFL drafting really is.
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Old 03-30-2018, 05:39 PM   #23
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

Quote:
Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
Player A vs Player B career stats:
SUMMARY

G AV Sk Tkl FF
47 13 15.0 61 6
48 24 23.5 87 7
You forgot a couple of stats for player B:
Defensive player of the week - 2
Defensive player of the month - 1
Pro bowls - 1
Double digit sack seasons - 1

Player A:
Roid suspensions- 1
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Old 03-30-2018, 05:42 PM   #24
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamf View Post
You forgot a couple of stats for player B:
Defensive player of the week - 2
Defensive player of the month - 1
Pro bowls - 1
Double digit sack seasons - 1

Player A:
Roid suspensions- 1
We also got Spencer Long in that trade.

You can hate on the FO, it's subjective enough and they aren't an elite team, but they aren't incompetent either.
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Old 03-30-2018, 05:55 PM   #25
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

Quote:
Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
What 3 teams would you list as top drafting teams from 2013-2015?
Unfortunately I donít have time to review drafts but I would say any team that has turned their team around the last few years has drafted well.

Itís all about wins.
Redskins win loss record is mediocre just like their drafts.
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Old 03-30-2018, 06:01 PM   #26
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamf View Post
Unfortunately I donít have time to review drafts but I would say any team that has turned their team around the last few years has drafted well.

Itís all about wins.
Redskins win loss record is mediocre just like their drafts.
That is a false equivalence. There are a lot of factors as to how a team does in the win loss records. The Eagles by all accounts have drafted terribly The Last 5 Years yet they won the Super Bowl. Our drafting has been average to above-average our injuries have been higher, our QB situation / drama has been higher, I would say our coaching has been average, and our win loss record is average or medium. I doubt it's the drafting because you can look at the history and see how the players have panned out and by and large the Redskins drafted players have panned out in the NFL. There are a lot of other factors.
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Old 03-30-2018, 06:03 PM   #27
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

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Well it is a good pick in the way we picked a good player... the failure to retain him doesn't erase the fact he was a good draft choice. Does it?

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Did the team even attempt to sign him?

The Redskins arenít going to pay him $7mil per year to backup Smith.

Wasted a 2nd round pick for a guy who maxed out at 9 sacks while on steroids.
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Old 03-31-2018, 07:48 AM   #28
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Re: 3 year review : 2013-2016 Drafts

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Did the team even attempt to sign him?

The Redskins arenít going to pay him $7mil per year to backup Smith.

Wasted a 2nd round pick for a guy who maxed out at 9 sacks while on steroids.
I do think I've read they made an offer, but too low too late.

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