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Old 04-18-2006, 11:18 AM   #1
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F...Insurance Companies

Ok, I've had a motor cycle license for two years and haven't dropped any dough to get a Bike yet. Why? Because of f'ing insurance! Get this, Geico quoted me $4000 a year for a bike that's worth $6300.
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Old 04-18-2006, 11:18 AM   #2
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

Yup, they don't have any problem taking your money but when you need it, it's like pulling teeth.
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Old 04-18-2006, 11:46 AM   #3
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

Easy....I am in the insurance industry. There must be a reason for the high premium...Any previous claims? Any tickets? If not, shop around, there are sure to be better pricing for motorcycle insurance.
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Old 04-18-2006, 12:12 PM   #4
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

Bikes are a high risk pool too. Premiums can also depend on your age, area you live in, drivers record, etc.

I've worked in auto, disability and now worker's comp. Comp is by far full of the most scammers. Sometimes it feels like the entire world is out on comp.
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Old 04-18-2006, 12:15 PM   #5
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

tmc, your right on the money.insurance companies are your best friends until something happens and you need them.with the amount of money involved,there is no reason to conduct business the way most insurance companies do
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Old 04-18-2006, 12:23 PM   #6
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

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Originally Posted by dmek25
tmc, your right on the money.insurance companies are your best friends until something happens and you need them.with the amount of money involved,there is no reason to conduct business the way most insurance companies do
You can blame all the scammers out there for why insurance companies have to scrutinize every claim.

Maybe I'm just jaded, but you wouldn't believe how many people work over insurance companies.

The amount of time and resources insurance companies have to spend on protecting themselves and investigating fraud are the main reasons for higher premiums.
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Old 04-18-2006, 12:33 PM   #7
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

Once again, its the fraud and uninsured motorists that cause insurance premiums to be where they are. In regards to paying claims, I don't know many insurance companies that do not pay what they owe according to the policy language - Hence the bigger problem, people don't understand what their policy covers and does not cover. Its easy for the lay insurance person to just say insurance companies don't pay, but think about it for a minute if it was your money at risk and you had a policy that says we will NOT pay for x loss, would you pay it?????

Now I am not saying there aren't crooked people in the insurance industry because there are but in general it is highly regulated and claims practices are scrutinized by the regulatory authorities. When I worked on the company level we drove home the idea that the AGENT selling the insurance MUST tell his/her policyholders what is covered and/or not covered to alleviate any problems in the claims process. I have a good agent that does that, you may need to find one as well!
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Old 04-18-2006, 12:49 PM   #8
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

I'm just pissed about how your tickets correlate to what you pay in insurance. I had ONE ticket that doubled my insurance. It was a SIX miles over the speed limit ticket. The place I have gives me a great rate though, but DOUBLE after one ticket. I've even gotten quotes from other places and still this is the cheapest. Insurance sucks.

And jbcjr14 and Matty, I think some people defraud the insurance companies because of that bullshit "deductible". I personally think it's totally insane if your car has some damage done to it and you can't get it fixed. Say in my case, I hit some things that flew off the back of a truck and they said that the estimate to have it fixed is $1000 and my deductible is $750. Since I got this car I've paid well over $4000 in insurance to them and I feel EVERY DAMN CENT should be paid on that damage. I mean that's why I get this stuff. In the case of homeowner's insurance or theft, I can see people padding a bit to make sure they're not losing money on any type of deductible. Sure it's illegal and immoral, but the insurance companies are screwing people too.
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Old 04-18-2006, 01:09 PM   #9
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

I got a speeding ticket (was doing 41mph in a 35mph zone) and a bumper accident ticket within a two week span two years ago and that's all that's in my record. Now, these guys want to charge me a whole lot of money for that? They didn't even pay a cent on the bumper accident. I do understand that people try to screw the insurance company but that doesn't make it right to screw me in return. And the bit about if you aren't married, we are going to charge you more is bullshit to me. That's blatant open discrimination against single males. How can the law let them get away with that?

I'm a reasonable man but $4000 isn't reasonable. I heard NJ is the worst state to be in. You get screwed in insurance no matter what your driving record is.
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Old 04-18-2006, 01:12 PM   #10
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

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Originally Posted by TheMalcolmConnection
And jbcjr14 and Matty, I think some people defraud the insurance companies because of that bullshit "deductible". I personally think it's totally insane if your car has some damage done to it and you can't get it fixed. Say in my case, I hit some things that flew off the back of a truck and they said that the estimate to have it fixed is $1000 and my deductible is $750. Since I got this car I've paid well over $4000 in insurance to them and I feel EVERY DAMN CENT should be paid on that damage.
And if the cost comes to $7000 dollars are you willing to pay the extra $2000 out of pocket? What we need is tougher laws and enforcement against insurance fraud to bring the cost down.
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Old 04-18-2006, 01:57 PM   #11
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

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Originally Posted by saden1
And if the cost comes to $7000 dollars are you willing to pay the extra $2000 out of pocket? What we need is tougher laws and enforcement against insurance fraud to bring the cost down.
Saden, you hit it right on the head bro! There needs to be tougher laws out there!

Also I think its important to say that insurance is to protect YOU from catastrophic loss. It is not there for the nickel and dime type losses from a windshield crack. It is there when you are riding along and run a red light and smoke a family of 4. In regards to the deductible, you should always have a large deductible $500+ if you can afford to pay the first $500 of a loss. I have always had a $1k deductible and it lowers your premiums drastically. Now if you can't afford to pay the deductible, by all means don't stretch yourself to do so because sure enough a loss will happen.

Also, as an underwriter (pricing) of risk, motor vehicle records are PROVEN statistical indicators. A driver that has had 1 moving violation in the past 12 months is TEN times more likely to have an accident than a driver with no violations. That is a HUGE statistic. Insurance is a numbers game and with odds like this you can bet the pricing is inflated for tickets and the like.
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Old 04-18-2006, 02:05 PM   #12
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

I work as an state attorney that regulates the insurance industry. For those who bitch about insurance, first understand what it is.

It is based on risk pools and characteristics and math. Statistics cannot say for certain what any one person will do, but they can predict with GREAT accuracy what a well defined group will do if the group is large enough. So - even if you, as a single male, haven't caused any accidents - the statistics show that, historically, for every x number of dollars in premium collected from single males, the insurance company will pay y amount in claims. The key for insurance companies, of course, is to find the point where x>y.

Your past claims affect your future costs b/c, based on acturially justified statistical basis, people who have past claims (even if the past claims cost no money) are likely to COST more in the future (like it or not, it is a statistical truism).

As for padding your claim to cover the deductible - Well, the rate you pay is based on the deductible you claim. You want coverage from dollar 0, well then pay for it. By padding your claim, you only drive EVERYONE's insurance rates higher. Because, by doing so, you render the actuarially justified rate (i.e. people with a deductible of x, make cost us no more than y) inaccurate and the company must reevalute and refile its rates (btw, incurring more costs increasing premiums more).

Do companies fail to pay claims for no good reason? Sometimes, usually its the smaller companies trying to scrape by - they tend to be fast and loose with their contract terms. The larger ones will sometimes screw you over to, usually when you fall into a company's Kafkaesque bureaucracy.

The key is - you are buying a product. The seller of that product is a) trying to make a profit; b) highly regulated; c) relies on statistical evidence to PREDICT what you will cost them in the future.

Please don't misunderstand, I think companies often try to cut corners in the name of good business and sometimes do so to the detriment of their customers (Admit it - "collect money, pay none out" is an exellent business plan if you can get it to work). Generally, though, they rely on their contracts and statistics to try and find the most attractive product for their customers.

In general, understand what you are buying, read your contract, shop around.
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Old 04-18-2006, 02:08 PM   #13
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

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Originally Posted by JoeRedskin
I work as an state attorney that regulates the insurance industry. For those who bitch about insurance, first understand what it is.

It is based on risk pools and characteristics and math. Statistics cannot say for certain what any one person will do, but they can predict with GREAT accuracy what a well defined group will do if the group is large enough. So - even if you, as a single male, haven't caused any accidents - the statistics show that, historically, for every x number of dollars in premium collected from single white males, the insurance company will pay y amount in claims. The key for insurance companies, of course, is to find the point where x>y.

Your past claims affect your future costs b/c, based on acturially justified statistical basis, people who have past claims (even if the past claims cost no money) are likely to COST more in the future (like it or not, it is a statistical truism).

As for padding your claim to cover the deductible - Well, the rate you pay is based on the deductible you claim. You want coverage from dollar 0, well then pay for it. By padding your claim, you only drive EVERYONE's insurance rates higher. Because, by doing so, you render the actuarially justified rate (i.e. people with a deductible of x, make cost us no more than y) inaccurate and the company must reevalute and refile its rates (btw, incurring more costs increasing premiums more).

Do companies fail to pay claims for no good reason? Sometimes, usually its the smaller companies trying to scrape by - they tend to be fast and loose with their contract terms. The larger ones will sometimes screw you over to, usually when you fall into a company's Kafkaesque bureaucracy.

The key is - you are buying a product. The seller of that product is a) trying to make a profit; b) highly regulated; c) relies on statistical evidence to PREDICT what you will cost them in the future.

Please don't misunderstand, I think companies often try to cut corners in the name of good business and sometimes do so to the detriment of their customers (Admit it - "collect money, pay none out" is an exellent business plan if you can get it to work). Generally, though, they rely on their contracts and statistics to try and find the most attractive product for their customers.

In general, understand what you are buying, read your contract, shop around.
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Old 04-18-2006, 02:19 PM   #14
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMalcolmConnection
Say in my case, I hit some things that flew off the back of a truck and they said that the estimate to have it fixed is $1000 and my deductible is $750. Since I got this car I've paid well over $4000 in insurance to them and I feel EVERY DAMN CENT should be paid on that damage.
And would you feel the same way if you had an accident on Day 2 of the policy that cost the insurance company the max in your liability and property damage limits? Would it be okay for the company to come back and say "Well, Malcolm, we know our contract says we have to pay X, but since you have paid only $150 in premiums, that's all we are going to cover. You're responsible for the other 300,000 in damages."?


No, of course it wouldn't. You entered a contract that is, effectively, gambling on future contingencies. The twist is, the company is betting on you (saying that you will pay more for insurance than you will cost them in the future) and you are really just hedging your bets (by buying this insurance at X, I will protect myself from having to pay out Y). Remember, you will still be liable for what the insurance doesn't cover.

Is it possible you will pay out more than you will ever recover - yup. In fact, for most people it's likely - otherwise the insurance companies couldn't remain solvent. But, are you willing to take the risk that you will be lifelong debtor due to an accident that causes serious injuries (either to yourself or others) b/c you were unable to pay the compensation?
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Old 04-18-2006, 02:58 PM   #15
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Re: F...Insurance Companies

I used to be on the "big bad insurance company" bandwagon too. But after 4+ years of working on the other side, I've never seen any claims get denied without just reason, I've in fact paid claims that probably shouldn't have been paid in the interest of doing good business, and more times than not, any perceived wrong doings have been honest errors and/or oversights, and not due to evil insurance reps who are just out to get the customers.

The first insurance company I worked for had a big feature done on them by 60 Minutes, and they basically did a hack job on it. I lost all respect I had for 60 minutes, they did interviews with disgruntled ex-employees who of course wouldn't reveal their identity, and the claims they "exposed" were grossly overexagerated in the interest of playing into the common myths people have about insurance companies.
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