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Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

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Old 07-09-2007, 04:22 AM   #121
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

that was me and it just reeks when a Texas oil man, that resides in the white house, governs over the highest oil prices in this nations history. i just say when i see a spade, i call it a spade. the last time i checked, Michael Moore is still in the private sect
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Old 07-09-2007, 04:24 AM   #122
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

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Moore is a piece of shit hypocrit! If he did it with honest intentions, then most of us wouldn't have a problem with him.
and how the hell do you know what his intentions are? just because someone makes money when doing something, doesnt mean they arent trying to do the right thing
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Old 07-09-2007, 09:29 AM   #123
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

alright so back to the topic, does anyone else feel that it's a huge conflict of interest when you mix health care with private industry?
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Old 07-09-2007, 03:34 PM   #124
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

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and how the hell do you know what his intentions are? just because someone makes money when doing something, doesnt mean they arent trying to do the right thing
Bacause he has done nothing to help the situation, nor would he donate his money to help the situation. He has already shown this to be true with other issues.
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Old 07-09-2007, 03:39 PM   #125
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

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alright so back to the topic, does anyone else feel that it's a huge conflict of interest when you mix health care with private industry?
How is it a conflict of interest when health care already is a private industry? I guess I don't see health care as a right...you are asking someone that is highly trained to help you. Just like you ask a mechanic to fix your car.
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Old 07-09-2007, 03:55 PM   #126
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

i feel moore does a good job opening discussion and i feel discussion is one of the most important things. I don't care which way things go. As long as the american people want it. That is what a democracy is all about. I don't care for moore. He does a great job but moore the person means nothing to me.

While yes, most people have health insurance, and many of those that don't choose not to have it,doesn't mean everyone is comfortable. I would like to look into the issue a lot more. Now some of the things in the movie are extremely disturbing. Some say that if your plan doesn't cover a treatment you shouldn't have your claim accepted if you apply for it. However, moore shows people having their claims denied for 'lying' on their application for insurance. Now some lies, i am sure are legitamely people lying, however moore shows people being denied for minor cases that they did not report. Things that have no bearing on their future health.

Moreover, what is important is the intent behind that. It seems like insurance companies don't look into the paper work UNTIL there is a health related issue. They have no problem taking your money until its their time to pay up. Also it is messed up that those hired to decide whether a claim is accepted get bonuses for denying you treatment. This is ludacris. This is people's health. It doesn't make sense to have a profit making industry behind this. Its not like the police and fire depts. are deciding who to help and not help. This is a basic function of life(actually it is life) and it should be protected by a governing body.

Now I felt these were compelling issues that were brought up. The evidence of people testifying in court and the testomony shown by those in the industry seem to support it. Now we all know that Moore techniques have been called into question many times so i'll want to discuss and research this a lot more before i vote.

However, i know universal healthcare would benefit me personally. My parents don't make much money. Their jobs don't give them benefits. I have healthcare but not dental. I am telling you, i've had this f...ing chipped tooth in the back of my mouth that hurts like a mother f...er. I wouldn't tell my parents because they'd insist that i have it checked but without dental i really don't want to have to pay the money it would cost. I haven't seen a dentist in 5-6 years.

They feel that healthcare is so important that they would never cancel it. However it is draining 1200 a month from us and that is a HUGE amount of money for us to spend per month. We get a lot of help from our family and our extended family is EXTREMELY close to us. My cousins are no different than my sister. I am to my uncle as his son is to him, i honestly believe that. 1200 a month would be fantastic when it comes to my college costs. I didn't get as much financial aid as i would have hoped for this year. That has made me even think about many options like sitting out a year and saving up. However, my extended family is helping me with loans and I am taking out a few on the side. I will owe quite a bit when i get out but that is ok. I say all this just to say, while most people have healthcare, many cannot really afford it. I would love 1200 more a month. Not that all of it would go to college costs but it would help out so much. I feel that healthcare is a basic utility that should be provided to all people and it shouldn't be an expense that they weigh decisions over.
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Old 07-09-2007, 04:04 PM   #127
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

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Drug addiction is one of the mandates and why should I be forced to buy this coverage if I do not use drugs?
I think it is a basic thing about society, people help people. If someone is introuble you can't turn your backs on them. It is completely understandable that people don't want to pay for other people's problems but who knows what can happen tomorrow? You could be the one in need of help. I've just always grown up under the understanding that if you can, you help those in need.

However, not everyone is going to agree on that and that is ok. That is what makes voting great. I hope that people's opinions on this issue are really expressed in the next election. That is why we should be happy that moore made this movie because it encourages people to make up their minds. Now it is true that many people will watch his movie and believe what he says regardless but i would hope that the american people study an issue before they vote for those who are for and against it.
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Old 07-09-2007, 04:12 PM   #128
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

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How is it a conflict of interest when health care already is a private industry? I guess I don't see health care as a right...you are asking someone that is highly trained to help you. Just like you ask a mechanic to fix your car.
Jeez I'd like to think human life is a little more valuable than a car.

I believe everyone should be entitled to health care. I don't know where we got lost along the way, but the basics of helping your fellow man and caring for those less fortunate somehow got twisted into being things that have a price on them. I think that's sad... and when doctors have to make decisions based on financial considerations, I think that's where the conflict of interest comes into play.
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Old 07-09-2007, 04:20 PM   #129
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

I will have to do more looking into it but i would like the government to provide a healthcare plan and the people have the option to switch to private, either by their employer or self. Now I would feel a tax break would be in line for those on private healthcare but it is a luxury so it shouldn't be substancial. I would like this form to be implemented in the next 5-9 years. I really need to look at the plans of barack and hilary to decide which one makes more sense. I know hilary is saying she'll have it done by 2016 and obama is saying 2012. Kucinich is one person all for complete universal healthcare only but he has no chance at this election. I would like to see a private and universal healthcare system first and see how it works and possibily transition to a non-privatized industry.

All this saying, there should be more govt regulation over the private healthcare systems regardless.
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Old 07-09-2007, 04:24 PM   #130
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

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Jeez I'd like to think human life is a little more valuable than a car.

I believe everyone should be entitled to health care. I don't know where we got lost along the way, but the basics of helping your fellow man and caring for those less fortunate somehow got twisted into being things that have a price on them. I think that's sad... and when doctors have to make decisions based on financial considerations, I think that's where the conflict of interest comes into play.
Agreed. Now again, i don't know how much moore was twisting but everywhere he went financial considerations were not taken. The british doctor said he would hate his job if he had to take that consideration. Doesn't it just sound like a better society? People being able to be treated for their health related problems without having to worry about money. If the government is to regulate anything it is our safety, education of our future, and our health. Really what is more important?

And again our safety can be privatized as well as our education so i have no problem allowing people to have private healthcare, so long as those that cannot afford it have a healthcare system that will take care of them when they need it.

Why do we need a middleman. Treatment shouldn't be from the doctor to the insurance company then to the patient. Insurance companies shouldn't have to decide. Your treatment should be choosen by you and your doctor. Whats best for you and your health. I don't understand why we are the only country in the top 25 industrialized countries that doesn't have universal healthcare. I can't say we are right and everyone is wrong. As moore says, we need to take something from each healthcare system around the world that works. We don't need to copy a whole system but take what each country does best and put it together. Make it the american system.
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Old 07-09-2007, 04:26 PM   #131
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

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Bacause he has done nothing to help the situation, nor would he donate his money to help the situation. He has already shown this to be true with other issues.
He's helped to bring this critical issue back to the front burner.

And he gives significant portions of the revenue from these movies to the appropriate charities.
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Old 07-09-2007, 04:31 PM   #132
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

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Agreed. Now again, i don't know how much moore was twisting but everywhere he went financial considerations were not taken. The british doctor said he would hate his job if he had to take that consideration. Doesn't it just sound like a better society. People being able to be treated for their health related problems without having to worry about money? If the government is to regulate anything it is our safety, education of our future, and our health. Really what is more important?
I know this point may have been oversimplified in the movie but yeah, how much better of a society could we be if people didn't have the stresses of the costs involved with health care?

If you are sick you should be able to seek treatment without having to worry about what it's going to cost you. The stories in the movie of the old guy working at the supermarket just for benefits for him and his wife, and the man and woman who had to sell their house and move in with their daughter due to all the debt they had from health costs really just breaks your heart.
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Old 07-09-2007, 05:11 PM   #133
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

With the way we're spending money and mortgaging the future the question we should ask ourselves is not should we have a national healthcare but rather can we afford to have a national healthcare program.

Head of U.S. Government Accountability Office:


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Old 07-09-2007, 06:06 PM   #134
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

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Originally Posted by Mattyk72 View Post
Jeez I'd like to think human life is a little more valuable than a car.

I believe everyone should be entitled to health care. I don't know where we got lost along the way, but the basics of helping your fellow man and caring for those less fortunate somehow got twisted into being things that have a price on them. I think that's sad... and when doctors have to make decisions based on financial considerations, I think that's where the conflict of interest comes into play.
Can we not put doctor's up on these huge pedestals please. To me, they are the reason that health care costs have gone through the roof. They have allowed the drug companies to compromise their interests for years now, but nobody wants to call them out. Go to a used bookstore, get a copy of the P.D.R. (physicians desk reference) and you will have enough info to do what 95% of these doctors do all day everyday: prescribe drugs. I haven't been to one since 1992 and I am fit as a fiddle. Eat healthy and exercise, stay away drom doctors, and then we can help out the people who really need treatment for the cancer and such. If something costs too much, don't buy it unless you absolutely have to. Look at anti-biotics. These doctors have caused dangerous new strains of germs to emerge because they have given out anti-biotics like candy since the 1950s. I blame the doctors first and foremost. If they deserved the reputations they seem to have with people, they would have put a stop to this a long time ago. I guess they couldn't find the answer in the P.D.R. so they were stumped. Doctors blow.
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Old 07-09-2007, 07:54 PM   #135
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Re: Michael Moore's Latest Target: Your HMO

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With the way we're spending money and mortgaging the future the question we should ask ourselves is not should we have a national healthcare but rather can we afford to have a national healthcare program.

Head of U.S. Government Accountability Office:
Man, that sucks. But I still feel that the most basic of services is not being provided. Even if this is not a possibility today I still want the wheels to start turning. This has to be done in the next 20 years. All countries can do it, why can't the greatest country in the world do it?

That guy beats around the bush to much too. I like how he clearly is against medicaid and Social Security but refers to them as "tough decisions". I also like how the war ONLY takes up 100 Billion a year.
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