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The legacy of 'W'?

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Old 07-14-2007, 09:07 AM   #76
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

i think this administrations biggest problems are the arrogance they possess, and their lack of being able to adapt if one of their plans fail. too many life long politicians hands in the cookie jar. they have made mistakes, as anyone will, but will NEVER admit to being wrong. i cant believe the the far right isn't screaming about Bush's manipulation of the Constitution, and how they are stripping Americans of their rights. the patriot act was good in thought, but bad in the way it is being executed.Bush's appointees have been nothing but dads friends, and contributors to his career. alot of bad decisions were made here. and smooty, whats up with all the Buchanan bashing? my boy lived right down the road from me
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Old 07-14-2007, 09:12 AM   #77
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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Originally Posted by GhettoDogAllStars View Post
It is true that one vote can win an election, in theory. However, in practice I do not believe that every vote is counted. Usually the margins are wide enough for a solid statistical conclusion to be made about the outcome -- at which time, the loser usually concedes.

Many votes are not accepted for a variety of reasons, and this is usually not a problem. In the case of 2000, with such a close election, these votes could have changed the outcome. So, you have unambiguous votes for one candidate, that were not accepted because they were cast in the incorrect precinct. Or, you have votes from overseas which arrived late. Should the outcome of the Presidential election come down to a technicality? I think this is why they went to court.
There are always votes that get tossed out because they are improperly cast. For Gore to say, "those were votes for me, and I'm the winner" is unreasonable. It may be that his voters were less competent and more likely to have cast an overvote or an undervote but there is no way to know that. The best indication of what Gore was up to is the fact that he tried to exclude those absentee votes from mostly military people. At that point it should have been obvious that he didn't really believe he had won, but was rather trying to steal the thing.

I think what confused some people was the fact that the exit polling incorrectly predicted Gore to be the winner. That caused TV to give him the state (at about 8:45 PM EST, before all the polls in the state were closed, amazingly) and when they realized their mistake and changed their prediction it seemed as though there were some shenanigans when it was really just TV and the people they hire to do those exit polls making a mistake. Exit polls have become worthless as have polls generally, IMO, because conservatives will often tell a pollster to go eff himself. With caller ID, I think the polls that we see touted on TV are extremely suspect. Nobody with a life is going to talk to them.
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Old 07-14-2007, 09:23 AM   #78
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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i think this administrations biggest problems are the arrogance they possess, and their lack of being able to adapt if one of their plans fail. too many life long politicians hands in the cookie jar. they have made mistakes, as anyone will, but will NEVER admit to being wrong. i cant believe the the far right isn't screaming about Bush's manipulation of the Constitution, and how they are stripping Americans of their rights. the patriot act was good in thought, but bad in the way it is being executed.Bush's appointees have been nothing but dads friends, and contributors to his career. alot of bad decisions were made here. and smooty, whats up with all the Buchanan bashing? my boy lived right down the road from me
This is typically superficial analysis from the Left: Don't forget to mention Dad! And just so you know, Dad's advisors were people like Brent Skowcroft and James Baker whose views have nothing in common with Dick Cheney and Don Rumsfeld. 41 was what is referred to as a foreign policy "realist" and 43 is more of an "idealist".

And don't forget to mention Katrina and Big Oil next time.
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Old 07-14-2007, 09:45 AM   #79
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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This is typically superficial analysis from the Left: Don't forget to mention Dad! And just so you know, Dad's advisors were people like Brent Skowcroft and James Baker whose views have nothing in common with Dick Cheney and Don Rumsfeld. 41 was what is referred to as a foreign policy "realist" and 43 is more of an "idealist".

And don't forget to mention Katrina and Big Oil next time.
this is a given. Katrina will help define Bush's legacy as a bumbling idiot, that freezes in adversity. remember Bush's reaction to the 9-11 bombing? he kept on reading to school kids. and i forgot. every fallacy, and mistake, and screw up that occurred during this administration is somehow directly bill Clinton's fault. 41 understood what politics is about. 43 does not. he stands as the leader of the free world, as a big bully telling people what we are going to do. thats why the rest of the world hates us right now. please explain to me what an idealist is? i look at president bush as his own man, responsible for everything, but not yet responsible for anything
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Old 07-14-2007, 10:08 AM   #80
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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OK Matty, still waiting for you here. I was good enough to post 10 things Bush has done right by your asking, you made no comment about them...then you asked for the bad things...which I did in good faith and asked you what you think Bush has done correctly and I still have not seen any response. I thought we were having good banter, but you didn't respond to my comments.
Sorry I got sidetracked by that little distraction.

Honestly I don't think he's done anything very well. I think he's been a complete disaster between 9/11, the war, the economy ( gas prices through the roof), and Katrina, just to name the major issues.
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Old 07-14-2007, 12:39 PM   #81
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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Originally Posted by dmek25 View Post
i think this administrations biggest problems are the arrogance they possess, and their lack of being able to adapt if one of their plans fail. too many life long politicians hands in the cookie jar. they have made mistakes, as anyone will, but will NEVER admit to being wrong. i cant believe the the far right isn't screaming about Bush's manipulation of the Constitution, and how they are stripping Americans of their rights. the patriot act was good in thought, but bad in the way it is being executed.Bush's appointees have been nothing but dads friends, and contributors to his career. alot of bad decisions were made here. and smooty, whats up with all the Buchanan bashing? my boy lived right down the road from me
Well the Buchanan bashing wasn't so much bashing but just to point out that he's considered the worst (or one of the worst) for basically doing nothing while the country fell to pieces by saying "Hey, Constitution says I can't intervene" while W is pilloried for doing too much perhaps and saying "I have to do what I need to do. Let's worry about the Constitution later"
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Old 07-14-2007, 12:44 PM   #82
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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Yeah dewd it's all about me. Make it so if you wish. My comment was just like others but I see you quoted me. That's ok.

~same as it ever was, same as it ever was

Don't like the message shoot the messanger.
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Old 07-14-2007, 12:46 PM   #83
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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Sorry I got sidetracked by that little distraction.

Honestly I don't think he's done anything very well. I think he's been a complete disaster between 9/11, the war, the economy ( gas prices through the roof), and Katrina, just to name the major issues.
I agree that his foreign policy (i.e., Iraq) has been a total failure. I don't think, however, that he has been a total failure as a domestic president. The economy has been pretty good; it's not as good as it was during the internet boom, but the economy during the internet boom wasn't as good as it seemed. I don't really fault Bush for Katrina. If you pretty much demolish a city, it's going to take a while to fix it. I also applaud the basic concept of No Child Left Behind. Finally, I have no problem, in fact I support, his tax cuts. I don't care for the Dems slogan "but they're tax cuts for the rich." Those rich guys are already paying more than their share of the budget.
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Old 07-14-2007, 01:04 PM   #84
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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I agree that his foreign policy (i.e., Iraq) has been a total failure. I don't think, however, that he has been a total failure as a domestic president. The economy has been pretty good; it's not as good as it was during the internet boom, but the economy during the internet boom wasn't as good as it seemed. I don't really fault Bush for Katrina. If you pretty much demolish a city, it's going to take a while to fix it. I also applaud the basic concept of No Child Left Behind. Finally, I have no problem, in fact I support, his tax cuts. I don't care for the Dems slogan "but they're tax cuts for the rich." Those rich guys are already paying more than their share of the budget.
My main gripe with Katrina was their painfully slow reaction time and their lack of a plan. It's not like this was any sort of huge surprise, it was bound to happen some day. I'm not totally blaming Bush because there probably should have been a plan of action in place a long time ago, but since it did happen on his watch he has to be held responsible to a degree.

Plus, and I admit this is a personal gripe of mine, I can't stand how the guy can't even speak correctly, and he comes off so damn smug I just want to strangle him. And as far as charisma and that "it factor" when it comes to leadership, the guy is so completely lacking it's downright embarrassing.
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Old 07-14-2007, 01:18 PM   #85
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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Originally Posted by Mattyk72 View Post
Plus, and I admit this is a personal gripe of mine, I can't stand how the guy can't even speak correctly, and he comes off so damn smug I just want to strangle him. And as far as charisma and that "it factor" when it comes to leadership, the guy is so completely lacking it's downright embarrassing.
It's funny because when I hear him speak, I can feel myself wanting to tell him to "sound it out....you can read it."
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Old 07-14-2007, 01:33 PM   #86
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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Originally Posted by dmek25 View Post
i think this administrations biggest problems are the arrogance they possess, and their lack of being able to adapt if one of their plans fail. too many life long politicians hands in the cookie jar. they have made mistakes, as anyone will, but will NEVER admit to being wrong. i cant believe the the far right isn't screaming about Bush's manipulation of the Constitution, and how they are stripping Americans of their rights. the patriot act was good in thought, but bad in the way it is being executed.Bush's appointees have been nothing but dads friends, and contributors to his career. alot of bad decisions were made here. and smooty, whats up with all the Buchanan bashing? my boy lived right down the road from me
I love this one...

The Raw Story | Cheney tells agency that Vice President's office is not part of the executive branch

I would call it a comedy, but it's pretty sad at this point. Left, Right, whatever.... this is ridiculous.
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Old 07-14-2007, 01:36 PM   #87
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

Sorry to go nuts with the videos... but these are priceless.




Legacy you ask?

I really think that Bush will be considered correct in his ideals, but incorrect in his methods. I think the threat of terrorism is legit, and Bush had the right mindset about it.

He is just simply so flawed in creating the policies (or appointed the correct people to do so) that address his idealistic objectives. I know that sounds generic, but it's the only way I can describe it.
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Old 07-14-2007, 01:42 PM   #88
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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has said that Osama "can run but he can't hide" but ..boy can he hide..We can't find him with missles, satellites, million dollar bribes
Due to the fact that there is MASSIVE bounty on his head and we have had an all out man hunt for him, AND we haven't seen him on the tube, I am assuming he's dead. He's not the type to stay silent this long, and it's not like anyone is going to bring it up that he's dead. At this point he would have said something...Bush killed him. Make that #11.
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Old 07-14-2007, 01:45 PM   #89
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

Has anyone in here seen the most recent episode of Bill Moyers Journal? If you haven't, it's an absolute must see!
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Old 07-14-2007, 01:47 PM   #90
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Re: The legacy of 'W'?

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Due to the fact that there is MASSIVE bounty on his head and we have had an all out man hunt for him, AND we haven't seen him on the tube, I am assuming he's dead. He's not the type to stay silent this long, and it's not like anyone is going to bring it up that he's dead. At this point he would have said something...Bush killed him. Make that #11.
OMG, wow. Just wow, that's all I'm going to say.
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