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Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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Old 10-17-2007, 04:29 PM   #31
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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Originally Posted by firstdown View Post
I have also heard the argument that smoking and obess people save medicare money because they die younger.
Incorrect, because even though they go out, they go out with catastrophically expensive cases.
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Old 10-17-2007, 04:35 PM   #32
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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Done, I will keep you posted. If you order some bean sprouts and there is no tax you will know my work is done.
Awesome!, I'm interested to hear if he has anything to say.
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Old 10-17-2007, 04:36 PM   #33
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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Originally Posted by saden1 View Post
I find it odd that we give income tax breaks only to raise taxes on goods and services. We get tax breaks for owning a home but you pay state property tax. I'm I the only one who finds our tax system crooked? They give you a break only to turnaround and fleece you from another angle. Or increase fines or tax the hell out of a product most people don't like.
We're back on the same wave length again. I 100% agree with you here.
For as many bad taxes there are out there, what about the death tax? Even after you die, they want taxes out of you. Jeesh.

I would really LOVE for the government to call me up and offer me a job to do nothing but look at the "budget" and trim the fat. This mean everything...$500 pens, $10,000 toilet seats etc. I know I could find all sorts of money.
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Old 10-17-2007, 04:37 PM   #34
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

Some may find it interesting that Montgomery County, MD has banned sales on all food containing trans fats. Way to go rich people.


Montgomery Bans Trans Fats in Restaurants, Markets - washingtonpost.com
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Old 10-17-2007, 04:40 PM   #35
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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Originally Posted by Schneed10 View Post
Incorrect, because even though they go out, they go out with catastrophically expensive cases.
I'm not sure either way, but is there any proof to this? A massive heart attack is pretty cheap when the ambulance arrives and the guy is dead.
On the flip side, those that live longer and get other issues such as memory problems (can't spell alz....), do suck off the government. We're paying medicare and social security, as well as supporting nursing homes...not to mention the MASSIVE amount of elderly people that are taking 10 or more meds a DAY.
I am just not sure either way is more expensive than the other...any one have stats on this?
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Old 10-17-2007, 04:47 PM   #36
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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How about no tax on health food. I bet that won't happen.
There are certain foods that are good for you that taken in massive quantities are bad for you. The "obese" people in the world aren't satisfied with 1 extra value meal when they go through the drive through line...they want a lot more.
Why don't people just realize it's about the lack of exercise in this country. Maybe they should make a mandatory 35 hour work week so we have more time to work out? Or we're only allowed to work 4 days a week or something? Then spend the extra tax dollars on a gym membership. If you don't use it, then you need to pay a fee or something? That would give people incentive. Taxing the food won't do a thing to help obesity. NOTHING. So why are they doing it? MONEY. Plain and simple.
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Old 10-17-2007, 05:14 PM   #37
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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I vote for the extra day off because thats when I do my healthest stuff like running to the frig for a cold one.
Hell yeah...I'd rather work 10 hours a day 4 days a week than work 8 hours a day 5 days a week.
Then again, I don't remember the last time I had a 40 hour a week job. All my jobs have been around 48 minimum, couple being about 60 minimum.

A lot of unhealthy eaters and people are unhealthy because they have very little time to sit down and eat healthy...they are always working.
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Old 10-18-2007, 07:49 AM   #38
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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Depends on who you're talking about...there are still several states with no Helmet laws, such as where I live in NM.

I understand the comments about these people should pay a higher premium to kill themselves, it's a valid argument, but my concern is the slippery slope we're heading down.
Seat belt laws, anti gun laws, cig taxes...they are all in an effort to somehow control the general population. Wearing a seat belt should be my choice. Wearing a helmet should be my choice. Eating a burger at McDonalds should be my choice without having to pay a higher premium. What you guys are failing to see is that if this tax goes through places like McDonalds, Burger king etc will lose business, if they lose business, what is going to happen to the economy? How many employees do those fast food places employ? By taxing the food, the gov is saying we the people are wrong for choosing it. In a lot of cases we are, but who is the Gov to step in and tell everyone so. I personally HATE McDonalds with a passion, but my wife (who is 115 pounds) LOVES it. (the big n tasty) She is not fat, nor out of shape. She exercises every day to every other day...why should she be over charged for that burger?
I wear a selt belt every time I get in a car, but I understand the rights of others to not want to. I grew up in a state where you didn't have to (Mass) until recently. I don't always wear a helmet when I ride my motorcycle, and it's quite a different experience for those that haven't done it. I wear it when I plan to ride fast, (highways), but I don't if I'm piddling around town. I should never be told I have to wear a helmet, or a seat belt.
AGain, I understand the counter point to this, but I feel a lot of people are missing the point that this is becoming an evermore slippery slope. What's next? We are allowing the government to tell us what to do in just about everything we do, and that's not why the government is here. The government should not say "well you're not going to take care of yourself, so we will take care of you for you." And who really takes the brunt of this general idea? The people who work hard for a living. Cause they are over taxed and no cig tax, or fast food tax will decrease the amount of tax burden on the working man.

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Old 10-18-2007, 08:14 AM   #39
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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Originally Posted by jsarno View Post
Hell yeah...I'd rather work 10 hours a day 4 days a week than work 8 hours a day 5 days a week.
Then again, I don't remember the last time I had a 40 hour a week job. All my jobs have been around 48 minimum, couple being about 60 minimum.

A lot of unhealthy eaters and people are unhealthy because they have very little time to sit down and eat healthy...they are always working.
That's a super lame excuse.

If you have time to go to these places and order, you have the time to pack a healthy lunch, and it's a heck of a lot cheaper to brown bag it.

Let's not sugar coat things, people are unhealthy eaters because they choose to be.
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Old 10-18-2007, 08:45 AM   #40
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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I think you're way off base and a little crazy at the same time.

If you think the tax is about anything other than trying to find a way to fund healthcare for the 40 million people who don't have coverage, then you're crazy. Politicians want votes, and if they pass a tax that helps 40 million people get coverage a bit easier, then they'll do it.

Politicians don't care if you die from eating fatty food. All they care about is getting elected, so they're not going to care about your freedom to eat a big mac. They just want votes.

Secondly, I think you're WAY overblowing this. For some reason, you're equating a tax with the government discouraging you (or even prohibiting you) from doing certain things. It sounds like you smoked some bad dope and you can't shake the paranoia. Trust me Hog, this fat tax is not a gateway to a mandatory nationwide 7:00 pm curfew. Nobody's trying to control you, they just want more money so they can make more people in the country vote for them.

Honestly Schneed, I don't normally find your posts amusing, but I really Laughed out loud on some of this.
I really don't care what political motivations are afoot here. The Fed demonstrates balderdash in their policy making daily. I am concerned only with the end result. Americans do not need any more govt intervention where they have no business.
Again, I have no idea if this is conspiratorial in nature, or just stupid, but, again, the end result is more (and increasingly more) intervention where they have no business. Things like this may at sometime impact something that "does" mean something to you, which may change your view?
We have become a "me" society, rather than a "we" society which helps the fed get away with things like this. Or................maybe..were just to damn lazy you care until things cause us problems personally.
That having been said, I find your view on this way to close the the "party line".....comrade
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Old 10-18-2007, 08:53 AM   #41
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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Originally Posted by Mattyk72 View Post
If you don't like insurance don't buy it. After all the odds are in your favor of probably never needing to use it.
Take it easy insurance guy! I'm sure it wasn't personal
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Old 10-18-2007, 09:13 AM   #42
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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Take it easy insurance guy! I'm sure it wasn't personal
I didn't take it personally... I'm simply stating the truth. Odds are you'll never use the insurance that you have.
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Old 10-18-2007, 11:03 AM   #43
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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If you don't like insurance don't buy it. After all the odds are in your favor of probably never needing to use it.
This highlights what I think is a divide in people's thinking.

I look at insurance and see it as something I am always using. To me the service it provides is that it sits there and waits. Ithas your back when you need to pay medical bills. The service is not just the paying of the medical bills but rather the ability to do so. In this way I am always using it.

It seems your way of thinking is that it is more like an account that you put money into and at some point you may or may not take money out.

I am not sure there is a right and wrong way of thinking about it but to me I like thinking that money spent on insurance that I never use is still money well spent because I know when I need it I will have it.

A slight distinction but huge in its effect or one's emotional reaction to insurance.
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Old 10-18-2007, 11:04 AM   #44
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

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This highlights what I think is a divide in people's thinking.

I look at insurance and see it as something I am always using. To me the service it provides is that it sits there and waits. Ithas your back when you need to pay medical bills. The service is not just the paying of the medical bills but rather the ability to do so. In this way I am always using it.

It seems your way of thinking is that it is more like an account that you put money into and at some point you may or may not take money out.

I am not sure there is a right and wrong way of thinking about it but to me I like thinking that money spent on insurance that I never use is still money well spent because I know when I need it I will have it.

A slight distinction but huge in its effect or one's emotional reaction to insurance.
Good way to put it.
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Old 10-18-2007, 02:09 PM   #45
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Re: Fat tax?? What next, Big Brother?

As to the fat tax, it is, like so many other taxes an incentive to act in a healthy manner and/or to forward a legitmate public goal - good public health.

Gov't consistently uses taxes and tax breaks to create incentives. The classic is the Mortgage Interest tax break - used as an incentive to home ownership. Why should renters subsidize those who buy homes? There are a multitude of breaks for kids, healthcare and etc. - Again, why should single people subsidize those who choose to have kids?

Since its inception, taxes have been used both as a revenue generator and as a means of discouraging behavior deemed bad for the public in general and encouraging behavior deemed good for the public in general.

Are there inefficiencies? Yes, of course their are. As Schneed said, there are 40 million people. And before you go gripping about 10k toilet seats etc. Can you show me where that is the norm? Compared to the fact that you can safely and reliably (on a daily basis) send a letter cross country for 40 cents, count on the government to ensure certain quality standards in the foods you buy, maintain interstates other avenues of travel, etc. etc. etc. I would suggest that the inefficiencies are greatly outweighed by the innumerable day to day benefits that are insured by the existence of the federal, state and local governments.

(If you want an efficient government, throw fairness out the window. Fairness costs money and we, as a society, have said that we are willing to pay that premium. It's cliched but true - Mussolini made the trains run on time).
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