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FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

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Old 07-10-2008, 12:27 PM   #16
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

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So then what your saying is that Obama votes based on what he thinks will get him the most votes and does not vote on his belief.
Not saying that all. But it still remains a fact. He's damned if doesn't and damned if he doesn't. Is he a politician? Absoulutely.

Votes? I'm not sure how this get's him more votes though.
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Old 07-10-2008, 12:32 PM   #17
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

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Also what isn't being reported is that earlier that same day Obama voted for a similiar bill, sponsored by Chris Dodd, that would have stripped out the immunity portion. It was defeated overwhelmingly. Later that day Obama voted for the other version of the bill that passed through the Senate.
I don't understand why some folks wanted the telecoms liable for cooperating with a Federal investigation. If they could've been held liable the result would've been a group of lawyers representing terrorist/anti-American interests and suing the telecoms for damages. This would then force the telecoms to not allow the government to access their information for investigations involving national security. The cost of the judgements if the telecoms lost would've been passed to the American people in the form of higher rates. It's a lose/lose for the American people we've hampered the government's ability to track and disrupt terrorist activity and we've raised our costs for phone/E-mail/internet.

I personally don't have a problem with the government(led by Rep or Dem) being able to access my phone/E-mail/Internet records if it has reasonable suspicion that I am involved in supporting terrorist activity. For the government to actually prosecute me or negatively affect me in any way they've got to jump through numerous legal hoops to make it happen. They can't break through my front door and cart me away to prison because I looked at a terrorist web-site one time.

I'll go down with a fight anyway, thanks to the recent 2nd Ammendment ruling (sarcasm)
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Old 07-10-2008, 12:33 PM   #18
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

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First off the President was using a law which gives him power to do things in a time of war. They used that as their way to tap people and some say he over reached and some said he was within his his powers. This judge said it was not illegal.

FISA Judge: Bush Wiretapping Broke No Law
WHAT!?!??! You actually believe that crap? The "Bush wiretapping broke no law" one.

If Bush's wiretapping broke no law then why is immunity included in this law THAT WAS JUST PASSED? It makes no sense dude! No offense, but this bill SUCKS!
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Old 07-10-2008, 12:35 PM   #19
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

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WHAT!?!??! You actually believe that crap? The "Bush wiretapping broke no law" one.

If Bush's wiretapping broke no law then why is immunity included in this law THAT WAS JUST PASSED? It makes no sense dude! No offense, but this bill SUCKS!
I haven't read the bill, but the immunity was for the telecom companies that cooperated with the governments requests/demands for information. I don't see how any rational person would think they should be liable.
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Old 07-10-2008, 12:44 PM   #20
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

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I haven't read the bill, but the immunity was for the telecom companies that cooperated with the governments requests/demands for information. I don't see how any rational person would think they should be liable.

I too find it hard to prosecute a company when the White House were the ones requesting the information. I understand that they were complicit, but if the POTUS is asking for information to make our country 'safer', how could they deny such a request.
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Old 07-10-2008, 01:07 PM   #21
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

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One thing I have noticed is that the people who had a problem with the gun rulling last week and supported gun bands now oppose this citing their constitutional right. The ones who liked the ruling about guns which they stated the 2nd now support this. So I guess we prove that people use the constitution as it fits their believes.
Basically. We bend the Constitution to suit our needs. We're no better than the politians at the end of the day.
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Old 07-10-2008, 01:22 PM   #22
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

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NSA has the capability to decipher a 256 bit key in minutes. Otherwise this encryption technology wouldn't be available to the public.

While many of our politicians are not the "sharpest tacks in the box", the folks doing the work at NSA are pretty smart and they have almost limitless funding.

marxbitware.com - Cipher Strengths - Are They To Weak?

Computerworld > Researcher finds RSA 1024-bit encryption not enough
I do not believe that the NSA can break RSA reliably. They may get lucky here and there, but I would have a hard time believing that they can crack a totally random key in a matter of minutes.

Even if they could crack RSA, they would have to catch the key negotiation when the AES keys are passed, in order to listen in on the good stuff. No way do I believe they can crack an AES stream on its own, though.

The openness of the these cryptographic standards is what makes them safe. The world is filled with brilliant mathematicians; they don't all work at the NSA. If there was a flaw besides brute force, I'm confident that the world would know about it.
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Old 07-10-2008, 03:43 PM   #23
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

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NSA has the capability to decipher a 256 bit key in minutes. Otherwise this encryption technology wouldn't be available to the public.

While many of our politicians are not the "sharpest tacks in the box", the folks doing the work at NSA are pretty smart and they have almost limitless funding.

marxbitware.com - Cipher Strengths - Are They To Weak?

Computerworld > Researcher finds RSA 1024-bit encryption not enough
It's about the algorithm used and the key size. Even at 1024-bit key size RSA encryption is trash when it comes to encrypting data. No one in their right mind would use it nowadays because it's susceptible to chosen-plaintext attacks and there are better encryption schemes out there. What you really want is AES (Rijndael) which the NSA approved for encrypting classified documents or Twofish which is even better.
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Old 07-10-2008, 05:18 PM   #24
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

saden, are you really bin laden?
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Old 07-10-2008, 06:38 PM   #25
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

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saden, are you really bin laden?
No, I'm just paranoid mofo...I do use Skype so my liberties are pretty safe. I'm just pissed because this whole FISA thing is a f'ing sham. Might as well hope for security becasue terrorists on Skype can "win."
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Old 07-10-2008, 07:42 PM   #26
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

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It's about the algorithm used and the key size. Even at 1024-bit key size RSA encryption is trash when it comes to encrypting data. No one in their right mind would use it nowadays because it's susceptible to chosen-plaintext attacks and there are better encryption schemes out there. What you really want is AES (Rijndael) which the NSA approved for encrypting classified documents or Twofish which is even better.
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No, I'm just paranoid mofo...I do use Skype so my liberties are pretty safe. I'm just pissed because this whole FISA thing is a f'ing sham. Might as well hope for security becasue terrorists on Skype can "win."
Pretty safe is correct, I guess. Skype uses RSA for AES key negotiation. If you can in fact use a chosen plaintext attack on RSA, then by using AES for the actual data stream is kind of pointless (other than the performance gained), I would think. Once you get the agreed upon key, you can then trivially decrypt all communications between the two parties.

But that all rides on a successfully executed chosen text attack. I've never seen RSA broken in that fashion, and if it has been successfully done, I'd love to see some performance stats.

All of this is neither here nor there, though. You can have the strongest encryption in the world, but in the end humans are the ones using it. Generally speaking, humans are terrible at securing their security. That is why you do not need brute force, chosen text, distributed brute force, mathematical cracks, etc to break encryption. Bluntly, people are stupid and lazy.
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Old 07-10-2008, 08:39 PM   #27
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

btw, the whole "get a court order" thing is a sham, cause the courts just rubber stamped everything, so it really didn't provide any oversight or checks on power.
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Old 07-11-2008, 11:13 AM   #28
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

I'm reading a lot of people who justify the removal of liberties with "improved" security.

While removing liberties might protect us from one threat, it will only expose another -- the government. There has to be a better solution.
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Old 07-11-2008, 11:26 AM   #29
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

ah, ghetto. the voice of reason. every time this administration wants some thing done, they use the fear of terrorism. they have said it so much, people are starting to become immune to it
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Old 07-11-2008, 12:30 PM   #30
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Re: FISA with Telecom Immunity Passed

no one does everything right. i was a Bill Clinton supporter, but think NAFTA is a piece of trash. the democrats have talked about all they were going to accomplish. yet, they have done little/ to nothing. i think he took what he thought was the best piece of legislation that was passable. but you are getting off topic alittle. this is a bad bill for the United States public
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