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Bill Maher's New Movie "Religulous"

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Old 09-23-2008, 01:27 PM   #46
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Re: Bill Maher's New Movie "Religulous"

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Old 09-23-2008, 02:09 PM   #47
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Re: Bill Maher's New Movie "Religulous"

Life is too short to let things get to you and if they do don't keep your thoughts and feelings bottled up. Speak freely, be free, be happy and afford others the freedom to speak freely and be happy. Be you, do you, live long and prosper.

That's all I got to say.
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Old 09-23-2008, 03:15 PM   #48
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Re: Bill Maher's New Movie "Religulous"

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Life is too short to let things get to you and if they do don't keep your thoughts and feelings bottled up. Speak freely, be free, be happy and afford others the freedom to speak freely and be happy. Be you, do you, live long and prosper.

That's all I got to say.
Saden we agree again maybe you are coming over to the other side.LOL
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Old 09-23-2008, 08:53 PM   #49
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Re: Bill Maher's New Movie "Religulous"

It's one thing to say religion is a personal matter and that it is condescending to judge someone else's private beliefs. Fine. But we have just lived through an 8 year administration in which religious beliefs were pushed to the forefront of not only government discourse, but government policy; in which Biblical passages were invoked to justify the loosening of environmental regulations; in which a war in the Middle East was at least supported by people who, fluent in Biblical prophecy, believe the world will end in our lifetime, and that the US must expedite this prophecy through military force; in which the United States fell behind the rest of the world in medical stem-cell technology for religious reasons; in which our President claimed to speak with God and spoke often of his relationship with Him, once saying that he "believes God wants me to be president"; in which family planning and AIDS prevention overseas was hamstrung by requirements to teach abstinence education; in which hawkish and corrupt politicians like Tom Delay claimed to know and work for the will of God.

Are all or even most religious people culpable in this? Of course not. But you have to understand the context in which this new atheistic virulence has arisen. While I question the effectiveness of the tactics of someone like Richard Dawkins or Maher, both of whom come off as incredibly condescending, we can't just ignore the climate in which they speak. Secular people feel as if they are under attack and they are pushing back.

Finally I don't get getting offended when one's faith is questioned. The truly religious people I have known in my lifetime have welcomed such challenges, and found them to only strengthen their faith. It's the people who are harboring doubts inside who take their ball and go home. From my limited life experience at least.
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Old 09-23-2008, 11:41 PM   #50
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Re: Bill Maher's New Movie "Religulous"

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It's one thing to say religion is a personal matter and that it is condescending to judge someone else's private beliefs. Fine. But we have just lived through an 8 year administration in which religious beliefs were pushed to the forefront of not only government discourse, but government policy; in which Biblical passages were invoked to justify the loosening of environmental regulations; in which a war in the Middle East was at least supported by people who, fluent in Biblical prophecy, believe the world will end in our lifetime, and that the US must expedite this prophecy through military force; in which the United States fell behind the rest of the world in medical stem-cell technology for religious reasons; in which our President claimed to speak with God and spoke often of his relationship with Him, once saying that he "believes God wants me to be president"; in which family planning and AIDS prevention overseas was hamstrung by requirements to teach abstinence education; in which hawkish and corrupt politicians like Tom Delay claimed to know and work for the will of God.

Are all or even most religious people culpable in this? Of course not. But you have to understand the context in which this new atheistic virulence has arisen. While I question the effectiveness of the tactics of someone like Richard Dawkins or Maher, both of whom come off as incredibly condescending, we can't just ignore the climate in which they speak. Secular people feel as if they are under attack and they are pushing back.

Finally I don't get getting offended when one's faith is questioned. The truly religious people I have known in my lifetime have welcomed such challenges, and found them to only strengthen their faith. It's the people who are harboring doubts inside who take their ball and go home. From my limited life experience at least.
Well said djnemo. I will argue that as an atheist I have seen some people in my group, which I presume is your group as well, that are just as stupid and stubborn as the evangelicals that refuse to believe in evolution. Though this is still a minority among the non-religous there are still many who will watch films like Zeitgiest and The God Who Wasn't There and think that these are reputable films. They don't even bother to check up if the claims of these films are valid. As a result they try and debate with Christians how Horus is exactly like Jesus (of couse this is just one of many examples).

If it were up to me at the very least I would like to show people that the so called Holy Books are written by men and taking them literally could lead one to do things that no normal person in this world would do. Why if I wanted I could justify a war against non-christians I would just have to cite passages of the bible to fanitcal believers. Never mind convincing people that homsexuality is wrong. I could even justify taking virgins from a conqured village if I so pleased or slaves for that matter.

However I refuse to believe for a second that any sane person, christian, atheist, buddhist, etc, condones these passages. Unfortunately sometimes people just need to hear "the Bible says it" from a priest or a reverand and that ends up being a selling point on certain issues like homsexuality and sexual eduction. Why just this past offseason on ES I saw a guy who randomly started a thread basically stating that he believed every word in the Bible was true. Then when confronted with outdated passages he ended up just brushing them off.

Personally I don't even care to change peoples religous beliefs or sects (for example changing a christian to a jew, an atheist, or a muslim). So long as people have basic rights I'm happy. However the insane religous right in this country seemed to be gaining ground for a while and the ironic thing is that most non-religous types along with moderate christians are sick of this, "I'm speaking with God" type attitude that parts of the far religous right feels is acceptable in their endorsement of what I would consider small mindness and bigotry.

I also feel djnemo is right from the perspective of questioning ones faith in that those that can explain it and debate it develop stronger faith. There are some that can't even begin to question because their religous sect might consider that blasphmous. If anything discussion of the metaphysical universe should always be allowed so long as the people discussing it can remain level headed and civil.
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Old 09-23-2008, 11:55 PM   #51
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Re: Bill Maher's New Movie "Religulous"

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No outlet would give these people a medium to express their views. You think CNN/NBC/ABC/CBS/Comedy Central would be caught dead giving air time to a conservative who was funny and could convey a point? You think Fox News gains anything financially by giving a hour long nightly show to say, Dennis Miller? They already corner the market on cable news for people frustrated with a left-leaning media.
Dennis Miller was on CNBC for a little while and he's pretty conservative and South Park routinely rips on hippies and members of the left, but I get your point. Conservatives tend to get blackballed in Hollywood.
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Old 09-24-2008, 12:49 AM   #52
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Re: Bill Maher's New Movie "Religulous"

the only thing i don't like is using the bible to say things like being gay is an abomination and then forgetting the other passages like "eating shrimp is an abomination" or that its a sin for a divorced woman to remarry (EVER) etc... either follow ALL of it, or be understanding that things change and there is no sole proprietor of right and wrong on earth (except for the catholics).

i mean, i believe muslims don't eat pork, because, thousands of years ago, pigs had worms... and unlike most things, cooking the pigs didn't kill the worms, so for public safety, eating pigs was a bad idea. technology obviously can remedy such an issue now, but even though the problem's solved, the now out-dated norm/belief lives on... not that there's anything wrong with not eating pork, but there's never going to be a revision to the koran to account for changes in society/technology/ecogology etc (and again, i'm basing this all off memory, so mileage may vary).

as far as teaching people to be good to each other and not steal etc - that's a great service of religion, but when you see pat robertson using god to sell soft drinks, or asking people to praying for the violent murder or death of multiple people, well... that's the corruption you see in some organized religions, and that's why for me, denomination is much less important than the message and who's actually preaching.
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Old 09-24-2008, 12:53 AM   #53
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Re: Bill Maher's New Movie "Religulous"

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That's the thing about religion, it's all opinion. How come some Muslims can take the Koran and stay peaceful and others end up extremists? Just like some people believe God and Christianity as all hellfire and brimstone and others think God is a stern yet merciful God.

But for real, are there any Jewish people on this site? I'm Black and I feel pulled more towards Judaism than anything else. I've learned some about Buddhism this year and I quite enjoy the philosophy of that. The fact that it's so peaceful and individually faith-based instead of collective is pretty intriguing for me.

The thing about Christians (SOME. NOT ALL) is that people get all caught up and want to impose what they think is right on others, when the Bible can be taken so many different ways. Some people wanna pick and choose what to follow and then point their finger at the people that don't follow it. "The Bible condemns sodomy". Yeah well. It also says you shouldn't mix fibers, so you better get naked real fast.

Everyone has the right to believe what they want and hold steadfastly to them. For someone to be a Christian and still accept people for who they are not what they do, who they sleep with at night, what the other person's religious beliefs are and to follow their God and not bat an eye to someone who may be the 180 to their beliefs, to me that's a good true Christian.

Anyone who automatically needs to throw Christianity in someones face (out of nowhere) and tell them their wrong because of xyz, is what my problem is with it and lately (especially in older generations.. 35-40+) is a huge problem for me.

Aristotle said the path to happiness is to be virtuous and if Christianity gives you that virtuosity, props to you. And if going binge drinking on Saturday nights with my college friends makes me virtuous at this point in my life, props to me.

Pretty much, I feel for each their own Aristotle also said that there is a middle that each one has to achieve to never be too extreme which I guess in the case of religion (though this wasn't addressed by then) the left extreme would be a religious extremist and right would be a full-blown atheist. Once you find that happy medium (which I feel is a individual spirituality) then one can continue to be truly virtuous in other spectrums of life. Unfortunately I don't think there are very many people to find that medium and again, that medium is all relative to the person. Someone might think they've found it when another person might think that they are way too extreme.

I guess what I'm trying to say is to each his own. Absolutely nothing wrong with religion. I'm down for organized religion. But there's no telling what is right or wrong or if there even is a right or wrong.. But I think it's all about respect. I can respect church going, God-fearing Christians but then when I see some Evangelists I can't help but cringe, but I guess that's cause they contradict my own beliefs and I assume they do the same thing when they come across someone like me. (or they just tell me I'm going straight to hell).

I just wish everyone could just respect everyone else.
Agreed. I'm an athiest, but I don't feel the need to go pushing my beliefs on everyone else. I think if religion is helpful to anyone in their individual lives, then good for them. It's just that my views don't coincide with everyone else's. As a person who has a Scientologist mother (please spare me, I've already taken enough crap for it) and an undetermined (to this day I have never spoken about organized religion with my dad, and growing up my family was never one to go to church every Sunday, so I just assume he believes in God but doesn't really care about religion) father, the thing that really pushed me over the edge was everybody trying to push their religion on me, including my mother, my extended family (My mom's side is mainly Prothestant <sp?>, and my father's side is none, I think they all believe in God too but they aren't hardcore followers or bible pushers), and all of my friends that believe in God.

Basically I'm an athiest, but I do believe that everyone is entitled to their own opinions and beliefs. And I can't stand people who push religion on others. I think the reason I don't believe in a God is just definitive proof, and if you feel that you need to enlighten me, please spare yourself the time and effort as I would probably respect you less.
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Old 09-24-2008, 11:47 AM   #54
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Re: Bill Maher's New Movie "Religulous"

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Originally Posted by djnemo65 View Post
It's one thing to say religion is a personal matter and that it is condescending to judge someone else's private beliefs. Fine. But we have just lived through an 8 year administration in which religious beliefs were pushed to the forefront of not only government discourse, but government policy; in which Biblical passages were invoked to justify the loosening of environmental regulations; in which a war in the Middle East was at least supported by people who, fluent in Biblical prophecy, believe the world will end in our lifetime, and that the US must expedite this prophecy through military force; in which the United States fell behind the rest of the world in medical stem-cell technology for religious reasons; in which our President claimed to speak with God and spoke often of his relationship with Him, once saying that he "believes God wants me to be president"; in which family planning and AIDS prevention overseas was hamstrung by requirements to teach abstinence education; in which hawkish and corrupt politicians like Tom Delay claimed to know and work for the will of God.

Are all or even most religious people culpable in this? Of course not. But you have to understand the context in which this new atheistic virulence has arisen. While I question the effectiveness of the tactics of someone like Richard Dawkins or Maher, both of whom come off as incredibly condescending, we can't just ignore the climate in which they speak. Secular people feel as if they are under attack and they are pushing back.

Finally I don't get getting offended when one's faith is questioned. The truly religious people I have known in my lifetime have welcomed such challenges, and found them to only strengthen their faith. It's the people who are harboring doubts inside who take their ball and go home. From my limited life experience at least.
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