Warpath  

Home | Forums | Salary Cap Info | Shop | Donate | Stay Connected




Go Back   Warpath > Off-Topic Discussion > Parking Lot


The Grand New Party

Parking Lot


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-15-2009, 08:20 PM   #46
Pro Bowl
 
Beemnseven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Virginia Beach
Age: 42
Posts: 5,308
Re: The Grand New Party

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trample the Elderly View Post
I wouldn't say that all Libertarians are liberal on social issues. They're just so far to the right that they seem strange. Ron Paul and Bobb Barr are so far to the right that things like, let the States decide for themselves when it comes to drugs, abortion, and homosexual special interest seem almost foreign to the average person. Auditing the Federal Reserve is a libertarian / conservative Ron Paul idea that is gaining strength in the House right now. If you have to take the good and the bad, well . . . . there's a lot more good to that idea than bad.

I wouldn't say that no one notices either. You and I have. I'll go out on a limb and say that a lot of people on this thread have too. Capitalism isn't under attack because we're not really practicing it. Our government already had it's hand in the socialist cookie jar to begin with. Capitalism is the answer. The liberal media doesn't like capitalism so they smear it every chance they get.

Perhaps the majority of Americans don't do their homework. Many of the ones I know don't. A lot of them are just ignorant. Even they read the news papers and get fed up. No one that I know truly likes these bailouts.

The problem for many of the voters that I know is that they're to lazy to get involved in the process. I vote in the primary, or I used to. One thing that should be done IMO is to stop having the Northern wing of the Republican Party decide who the nominee is. Everyone knows that the Republican's bread and butter is in the South and Midwest. Yeah, there are conservatives up North and on the Left Coast, but they're out numbered five to one.

I liked Romney and Giuliani but I wouldn't have voted for them. Giuliani would've made a great addition to the State Department and Romney would've been nice to have in a public office with this economy. I might have voted for Romney. I dunno . . . .
On the first bolded point, you're correct. In fact, the word 'liberal' has been twisted and morphed into something that it never meant originally. If you go by the current use of the word, being 'liberal' on social issues would actually mean one would favor more gun control, being against the death penalty, that sort of thing. I should have said that libertarians are for freedom and individual rights when it comes to social issues.

On the second bolded point, you're correct there too. A system of public education, a progressive income tax, the creation of the federal reserve and moving more towards central planning on economics are all indicators of socialistic tendencies and they've been around for a long, long time.

So it is absolutely true that we are a mixed economy of some socialism and capitalism, and we haven't had a pure free market system for quite awhile.
Beemnseven is offline   Reply With Quote

Advertisements
Old 05-16-2009, 02:11 AM   #47
Gamebreaker
 
CRedskinsRule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Pasadena, Md
Age: 49
Posts: 13,858
Re: The Grand New Party

Quote:
Originally Posted by saden1 View Post
No, no one said stupid voters should be applauded their right to vote without having them qualify should be respect. If you bet me you will lose that bet. My beef is always centered around reason and policy.

We have to deal with lots of issues but lets not pretend America is getting worse. It isn't. Politics used to be much dirtier than it currently is. There's more money than use to be but money was always at play in Washington.

I leave you with this article I found interesting. You may not like what it has to say...click it at your own risk.
Ok, I clicked it. And surprisingly, it didn't bother me at all. My response may be jumbled, so read and respond at your own risk.
First, if you look at my list of reductions which you asked about, you would see I reduce our military to a self defense posture. The fact that we pay 22BILLION dollars for 1 fighter is insane, and guess what, those people who are so happy in Denmark Holland Norway and Sweden, they don't do that. It is no myth that northern Europe lives under the shield of America, and has had the peace derived from that. I am glad they are happy, now let them pay their taxes to build defenses from the natural predators in other countries that have lain fallow for the past 30 years.
While we spend hundreds of billions to support a tremendous military and the rest of the world, even those nations that hate us, benefit from the general peace that we have created. It is not surprising that you would find some who are happy to pay outrageous taxes. I can tell you also, that Germans, who basically get gouged are not so happy that others are living off of the German national wealth. My German aunt visited last month and while I didn't go to deep into politics with her, it is clear that the EU has taken deep cuts into the German nation.

There is a point for taxes. But not every solution requires a Federal answer, you say we should not pretend America is getting worse. I am not pretending, I am saying it that that is my belief. And I am not speaking about just under President Obama, he has only been in office 100+ days, the systemic problems that I believe are making it worse speak to the growing dependence on a large federal government.

Let me ask a question:
If you have a large problem, any large complex problem, what is the first step to solving it?
CRedskinsRule is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2009, 05:40 PM   #48
Pro Bowl
 
Beemnseven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Virginia Beach
Age: 42
Posts: 5,308
Re: The Grand New Party

Quote:
Originally Posted by saden1
I leave you with this article I found interesting. You may not like what it has to say...click it at your own risk.
Here's another way you can look at that poll which indicates people in northern Europe are so "happy" even when their taxes are so high: If they have a progressive tax structure like we do, meaning that a very small portion of their society pays the bulk of the taxes, then it's no wonder the majority say they're happy since they weren't taxed too much in the first place.

Ask ten people independently if they are happy with their financial situation -- if one of them had a gun pointed at their head by a government official forcing them to hand over 80% of their paycheck, while the other nine could keep most of theirs, the poll's results would say that 90% of respondents say their financial situation is just fine.

Last edited by Beemnseven; 05-16-2009 at 05:51 PM.
Beemnseven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2009, 06:59 PM   #49
Contains football related knowledge
 
JoeRedskin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Second Star On The Right
Age: 53
Posts: 9,895
Re: The Grand New Party

Quote:
Originally Posted by saden1 View Post
No, no one said stupid voters should be applauded their right to vote without having them qualify should be respect. If you bet me you will lose that bet. My beef is always centered around reason and policy.

We have to deal with lots of issues but lets not pretend America is getting worse. It isn't. Politics used to be much dirtier than it currently is. There's more money than use to be but money was always at play in Washington.

I leave you with this article I found interesting. You may not like what it has to say...click it at your own risk.
In addition to the arguments by CRedskin, another point to be considered is the basic homogenous populations of these countries. The populations have similar cultural and economic goals with small populations and land mass that simply don't require the same complex solutions presented by our larger much more diverse population.
__________________
You aren't worth the water in my spit but, maybe, just maybe, you're worth the lead in my shotgun.
JoeRedskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2009, 01:20 AM   #50
Playmaker
 
70Chip's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Manassas
Age: 45
Posts: 3,048
Re: The Grand New Party

Quote:
Originally Posted by tryfuhl View Post
Well without global cooling we really don't have that leg to stand on. The Kyoto treaty was not brought up in a time like now, the economy was much better, but I do agree that it could have a major economic impact. It's not so much that we need to ratify a treaty, just we need to take better steps towards preserving the environment.

People call talk about skewered facts or whatever they'd like, but the huge emission of pollutants teamed with deforestation can certainly not be helping or neutral.
It could be well be neutral. We have evolved in an environment that contained a certain amount of CO2. More CO2 might be bad, or it might be good for humans. Who knows. We're on our own, hurtling through spacetime on a big unfriendly rock. The pretense of control displayed by the political Left reminds me of my fundamentalist Christian grandmother. The Liberals will fix everything. Bullshit. Don't sell me a cup of bullshit and call it progress.

If you eliminate God from the equation, I can argue freely for the Chomskyite anarchist position which is really easy intelectually. "We're all alone so **** you". My opinion is just as valuable as yours and don't talk to me about your bloody science because that's just religion by another name. Fairy stories made up by crotchety old men trying to get a leg up. You see where this leads.
__________________
This Monkey's Gone to Heaven
70Chip is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2009, 01:59 PM   #51
Pro Bowl
 
Beemnseven's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Virginia Beach
Age: 42
Posts: 5,308
Re: The Grand New Party

Beemnseven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2009, 04:17 PM   #52
MVP
 
FRPLG's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Age: 37
Posts: 10,146
Re: The Grand New Party

Quote:
Originally Posted by tryfuhl View Post
Those scientists can usually be put into a list, the ones supporting man's impact is too long of a list to generate. It seems that quite a number of those who don't agree either say that it's too inconclusive or that man isn't the MAIN cause of it, which I didn't say that we were. In addition, a number of these professionals are geologists (many petroleum geologists) and many others are meteorologists, which may seem surprising, but they're more familiar with short term changes.

It is still of advantage of us to look into more efficient and responsible practices.
I didn't state my self well there. There exists a large contingent of uncrackpot scientists who would argue that Global Warming doesn't even exist. Forget who or what caused it. The main arguments that I have studied, and as far as I can tell don't have any real dog in the fight, go like this.

Warming data collected over the last 100 years is rather spotty. Think about it. A 100+ years ago there was widespread, accurate and scientifically relevant amounts of temperature data available that could be used in a definitive manner? Sounds dubious to me. Forget about using data from before that...it doesn't even really exist. Most of the global climate change data is built using human-derived models. Models are really a fancy way of saying...we drew a picture and this is what it looks like. They're human-made. Maybe they're accurate and maybe they're not. But from a scientific standpoint they aren't evidence of anything other than the model-builder's ability to use a computer and code. The large "consensus" who "believe" in global climate change are driven by contingents just as politically motivated as the ones driven by the oil companies. In fact there is probably more money in total at stake on the climate change side than the other. All of this isn't to say that global climate change is a crock. I have no idea...but I am not willing to go blindly down a path that will cost the human existence enormous time, effort and money just to fix a problem that may or may not exist.

Now your point about finding energy alternatives anyways, I can get on board with. From a political standpoint we need a strategy for extricating ourselves from the tyranny of oil. It puts us in harms way when we have to rely on others for our basic needs. We ought to really be pursuing energy independence in a serious way.
FRPLG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2009, 05:15 PM   #53
Contains football related knowledge
 
JoeRedskin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Second Star On The Right
Age: 53
Posts: 9,895
Re: The Grand New Party

FRPLG, nicely stated. I give your statement the "JoeRedskin Stamp Of Approval" (Recognized world-wide as the seal of quality posting).

My father, a retired airforce pilot who relied on accurate weather predictions for his safety, once said to me that weather prediction beyond the next three days is pretty much voodoo and tea leaves.

As I have studied the issues and opinions surrounding "global warming", I have become more and more convinced of the truth of my dad's statement.
__________________
You aren't worth the water in my spit but, maybe, just maybe, you're worth the lead in my shotgun.
JoeRedskin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2009, 05:28 PM   #54
Impact Rookie
 
BringBackJoeT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Van Ness, Washington D.C.
Posts: 596
Re: The Grand New Party

Quote:
Originally Posted by firstdown View Post
700? Is that the number of "international scientists" this report identifies as disputing a human connection to global warming? I'll bet you could find a greater number of "international scientists" who dispute a connection between smoking and cancer.
__________________
Super Trouper lights are gonna find me. Shining like the sun. Smiling having fun. Feeling like a number one.
BringBackJoeT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2009, 05:29 PM   #55
Playmaker
 
Slingin Sammy 33's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Virginia Beach
Posts: 4,347
Re: The Grand New Party

Quote:
Originally Posted by FRPLG View Post
Now your point about finding energy alternatives anyways, I can get on board with. From a political standpoint we need a strategy for extricating ourselves from the tyranny of oil. It puts us in harms way when we have to rely on others for our basic needs. We ought to really be pursuing energy independence in a serious way.
Agree with your whole post. Very well stated.
__________________
"I would bet.....(if), an angel fairy came down and said, '[You can have anything] in the world you would like to own,' I wouldn't be surprised if you said a football club and particularly the Washington Redskins.'' Jack Kent Cooke, 1996.
Slingin Sammy 33 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2009, 05:55 PM   #56
Impact Rookie
 
BringBackJoeT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Van Ness, Washington D.C.
Posts: 596
Re: The Grand New Party

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeRedskin View Post
FRPLG, nicely stated. I give your statement the "JoeRedskin Stamp Of Approval" (Recognized world-wide as the seal of quality posting).

My father, a retired airforce pilot who relied on accurate weather predictions for his safety, once said to me that weather prediction beyond the next three days is pretty much voodoo and tea leaves.

As I have studied the issues and opinions surrounding "global warming", I have become more and more convinced of the truth of my dad's statement.
What? I don't see the connection here. What you have you gleaned from your studies of global warming that leads you to agree with your father that weather forecasts beyond three days are inherently suspect? If you have in fact studied the issue of global warming, then you should have found that those who believe in it (for lack of a better phrase) consider there to be a very "present" element to it; i.e., that global warming is happening now. Assuming, arguendo, that global warming is in fact happening, it would be ridiculous to believe that NO future weather trends could be predicted based on such a fact. That the exactitude of future daily forecasts could not be guaranteed would not undermine the value of the predicted trends.
__________________
Super Trouper lights are gonna find me. Shining like the sun. Smiling having fun. Feeling like a number one.
BringBackJoeT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2009, 06:04 PM   #57
Impact Rookie
 
BringBackJoeT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Van Ness, Washington D.C.
Posts: 596
Re: The Grand New Party

Quote:
Originally Posted by firstdown View Post
Well now this new party will have to take into account that the Pro-Life now has more supporters then Pro-Choice for the first time sensen they have been tracking this galup poll.More Americans “Pro-Life” Than “Pro-Choice” for First Time
I did not want to start an abortion thread but I found this pool really interesting.

I found this poll interesting.
National (US) Poll * April 30, 2009 * Gays In The Military Should Be - Quinnipiac University Hamden, Connecticut
__________________
Super Trouper lights are gonna find me. Shining like the sun. Smiling having fun. Feeling like a number one.
BringBackJoeT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2009, 06:10 PM   #58
Gamebreaker
 
CRedskinsRule's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Pasadena, Md
Age: 49
Posts: 13,858
Re: The Grand New Party

Sadly the new party simply bickers like the old parties. Global Climate Change/No Global Climate Change, I have my opinion, But why should a new party whose goal is limited government be in the pot arguing this?

If any scientists of note are arguing that in the course of my generation/my children's generation the world is going to suddenly and catastrophically cool, they are most likely speaking hogwash. Maybe our actions cause it, maybe not. Let private citizens groups collect private funds, study it, and say yea or nay, but a limited resource Federal Government need not stamp it's approval/disapproval on it. I am sure the car companies will fund research against it, and I am sure men/women of great wealth and concern for the longterm future of our species, like Saden, can fund the pro group. But don't create a federal dept of global catastrophic and possibly unchangeable events, or a bureau of great handwringing.

The goal of a limited government party should not be to side with one or another political agenda, but to say ENOUGH, we are here to provide a framework for citizens, and localities to grow and prosper, and not fear external armed or economic attack. How each locality chooses to set it's standards, within our constitutional framework, is THEIR choice and freedom.

Again see the 10th amendment.

Last edited by CRedskinsRule; 05-18-2009 at 06:52 PM.
CRedskinsRule is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2009, 06:51 PM   #59
Playmaker
 
Trample the Elderly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Three Chopt Virginia
Age: 38
Posts: 2,906
Re: The Grand New Party

I thought that plants liked Co2?
Trample the Elderly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2009, 09:15 PM   #60
Playmaker
 
Slingin Sammy 33's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Virginia Beach
Posts: 4,347
Re: The Grand New Party

Quote:
Originally Posted by BringBackJoeT View Post
I found it interesting as well:"American voters reject 50 - 44 percent the argument that ending discrimination against homosexuals is as necessary today as ending discrimination against blacks was in the 1960s. Black voters say 45 - 44 percent it is as important, while whites say 51 - 43 percent it is not.

Voters support 50 - 44 percent the federal law allowing states to refuse to recognize same-sex marriages performed in other states, but say 54 - 39 percent that the federal law denying federal spousal benefits to same-sex partners should be repealed.

Society is paying too much attention to the needs of gays and lesbians, 49 percent of voters say, while 21 percent say there's too little attention and 22 percent say it's "about right."

I'd say this falls right in-line with CRedskins' point.
__________________
"I would bet.....(if), an angel fairy came down and said, '[You can have anything] in the world you would like to own,' I wouldn't be surprised if you said a football club and particularly the Washington Redskins.'' Jack Kent Cooke, 1996.
Slingin Sammy 33 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:28 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site is not officially affiliated with the Washington Redskins or the NFL.
Page generated in 0.38838 seconds with 9 queries

Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.2.0 RC5

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25