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Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

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Old 03-14-2011, 10:18 AM   #61
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

Second explosion at nuclear power plant in Japan - CSMonitor.com
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Old 03-14-2011, 10:49 AM   #62
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

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THIS is......Horrific

Tide of 1,000 bodies overwhelms quake-hit Japan - Toshiba

And now they are in they're fourth day without power and water. HELL it could be months before they have power? IF they don't have a meltdown in any of the reactors. HOw long does it take to clean up a disaster like this and get a Nuke back online???
HOLY......Hell.
ABC News - Japan Earthquake: before and after
My dad is a retired AF officer, and has a degree in Nuc Engineering. We were talking about this yesterday, and it was a very interesting discussion, but bottomline, the reactors that have had the partial meltdowns are done. Just put a barrier around them and let them sit for a loooooong time. The good news though is that in all the cases so far, the actual containment vessels have reportedly held. The outer shells that blew up were outer structures, not primarily responsible for limiting radioactivity, although they did serve that function for any extraneous radiation.

Another note, as to the difference to Chernobyl, just as an interesting aside, is that Chernobyl used a graphite moderator, which collects radiation and slows the nuclear reaction. When it was on fire, the graphite moderators actually caught on fire, and spewed the radiation up high in to the atmosphere, thus causing the extensive following damage. These reactors, and all united states reactors use a water based moderator, so if it there is a meltdown, the radioactive particles are hooked to steam, which while it needs to be released to avoid pressure buildup, will dissipate quickly, and will not harm the primary containment vessel.

Even with all that, let's hope that these reactors are neutralized quickly, and the surrounding population cared for.
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Old 03-14-2011, 11:55 AM   #63
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

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My dad is a retired AF officer, and has a degree in Nuc Engineering. We were talking about this yesterday, and it was a very interesting discussion, but bottomline, the reactors that have had the partial meltdowns are done. Just put a barrier around them and let them sit for a loooooong time. The good news though is that in all the cases so far, the actual containment vessels have reportedly held. The outer shells that blew up were outer structures, not primarily responsible for limiting radioactivity, although they did serve that function for any extraneous radiation.

Another note, as to the difference to Chernobyl, just as an interesting aside, is that Chernobyl used a graphite moderator, which collects radiation and slows the nuclear reaction. When it was on fire, the graphite moderators actually caught on fire, and spewed the radiation up high in to the atmosphere, thus causing the extensive following damage. These reactors, and all united states reactors use a water based moderator, so if it there is a meltdown, the radioactive particles are hooked to steam, which while it needs to be released to avoid pressure buildup, will dissipate quickly, and will not harm the primary containment vessel.

Even with all that, let's hope that these reactors are neutralized quickly, and the surrounding population cared for.

What I don't understand is the cooling down issue and why it takes so long. Did your dad talk about that?
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Old 03-14-2011, 12:24 PM   #64
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

It takes so long because even when they shut them down they keep generating heat. Kind of like when you turn off your oven and it takes a while to fully cool down.
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Old 03-14-2011, 12:45 PM   #65
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

I mean, sure she apologized after the fact, but talk about ignorance:

New York Liberty's Cappie Pondexter apologizes for Japan tweets - ESPN New York
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Old 03-14-2011, 12:49 PM   #66
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

BS apology. How could you not think what you were saying isn't offensive or dumb. People don't go out of their way to say stuff like that unless they are truly dumb. WNBA must have cracked down.
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Old 03-14-2011, 12:54 PM   #67
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

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I mean, sure she apologized after the fact, but talk about ignorance:

New York Liberty's Cappie Pondexter apologizes for Japan tweets - ESPN New York
I feel much the same way about my earlier joke but at first it didn't seem like it was the huge of a disaster.
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Old 03-14-2011, 12:55 PM   #68
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

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BS apology. How could you not think what you were saying isn't offensive or dumb. People don't go out of their way to say stuff like that unless they are truly dumb. WNBA must have cracked down.

Really the only laughing matter in all of that is the WNBA, seriously how is that league still operating?
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Old 03-14-2011, 12:56 PM   #69
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

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It takes so long because even when they shut them down they keep generating heat. Kind of like when you turn off your oven and it takes a while to fully cool down.
I realize they retain heat but they must also keep producing heat for some period because of how much time has passed and they are still that hot. The only other thing I could think of is that they have to lower the temp slowly to prevent cracking issues.
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Old 03-14-2011, 01:03 PM   #70
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

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I realize they retain heat but they must also keep producing heat for some period because of how much time has passed and they are still that hot. The only other thing I could think of is that they have to lower the temp slowly to prevent cracking issues.

Something tells me it is not that easy and you may need a good understanding of nuclear physics to truly appreciate how it "cools" itself.
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Old 03-14-2011, 01:04 PM   #71
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

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I realize they retain heat but they must also keep producing heat for some period because of how much time has passed and they are still that hot. The only other thing I could think of is that they have to lower the temp slowly to prevent cracking issues.
Nuclear Fission by definition is superheated. It is not fusion like a sun but you are cracking neutrons together to in order to break the bonds of atoms. This material is not just a car engine, or solar panel. from wiki:

A kilogram of uranium-235 (U-235) converted via nuclear processes contains approximately three million times the energy of a kilogram of coal burned conventionally (7.2 1013 joules per kilogram of uranium-235 versus 2.4 107 joules per kilogram of coal).[3][4]

That's really hot.
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Old 03-14-2011, 01:08 PM   #72
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

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I mean, sure she apologized after the fact, but talk about ignorance:

New York Liberty's Cappie Pondexter apologizes for Japan tweets - ESPN New York

They should have written in their contracts that they aren't allowed to Twitter. I would say it's amazing that so many people are stupid as ****, but our country does rank 14th in the world in education scores. Not to mention idiots like her probably majored in some two bit degree so she could bounce a ball.
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Old 03-14-2011, 01:25 PM   #73
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

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Originally Posted by CRedskinsRule View Post
Nuclear Fission by definition is superheated. It is not fusion like a sun but you are cracking neutrons together to in order to break the bonds of atoms. This material is not just a car engine, or solar panel. from wiki:

A kilogram of uranium-235 (U-235) converted via nuclear processes contains approximately three million times the energy of a kilogram of coal burned conventionally (7.2 1013 joules per kilogram of uranium-235 versus 2.4 107 joules per kilogram of coal).[3][4]

That's really hot.
It makes sense now. It keeps generating heat and thats why they have to keep up the cooling system. I was think after they shut down the reactor the heat would drop like a car or oven and that is not the case.
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Old 03-14-2011, 01:32 PM   #74
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

What makes no sense is that they have all this planning for an earth quake and a Tsunami but this plant was on the ocean. It was not the quake that has caused the problems it was the Tsunami that ultimatly killed the cooling system.
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Old 03-14-2011, 03:38 PM   #75
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Re: Massive quake hits Japan; Tsunami in Pacific, nations on alert

So this weekend I'm watching CNN and the home reporter asked the one in Japan about looting. The reporter on the ground said that there was no looting and they didn't expect to see any looting. The home reporter seemed perplexed about no looting and seem sure that there had to be looting going on. The ground reporter said they have done reporting in Japan for 20 some years and said they would be very, very surprised if there was any looting. The home reporter still seem baffled at how they could have this much destruction without any looting. I laughed thinking how they always make excuses for people looting everything they can get their hands on here. I guess reporters don't understand integrity or honor.
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