Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

I looked at the pics of the wounds of the kid online. If those pics don't piss you off then so be it. The excuse that he did that cause he was raised that way is a weak one. I don't want him on the team I root for. Go to Dallas or the Bengals.

Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[QUOTE=FrenchSkin;1198456]My point is not that with enough elements I might approve or be less disgusted by [B]what he did[/B]. I might not, what he did is [I][U][B]un-excusable[/B] under any circumstances.[/U][/I]



My points are:



1) I don't think it is [I][U]up to me to decide[/U][/I] if he paid enough or not for what he did



2) I don't think people should be [I][U]reduced to one thing they did[/U][/I], because:

a) people can be multiple things, [I][U][U]good and bad at the same time[/U][/U][/I]

b) people can [I][U]change[/U][/I]



3) I don't think people should be [I][U]eternally and publicly bashed[/U][/I] for something they did, especially once they paid for it, because it creates a [I][U]vicious circle[/U][/I] and I don't think it helps people becoming [I][U]better versions of themselves[/U][/I], thus neither does it help a [I][U]society becoming better[/U][/I].



4) I don't think [I][U]not ever being allowed to do your job again[/U][/I] should be part of any legal sentence, unless that job is a political one.



5) I have [I][U]absolutely no idea if any of the Redskins players are good people or not[/U][/I], having met and discussed with none of them. I root for this team, thus for the football performances of its players, not for their souls.



Now, I'm not denying your [I][U]right to not root for somebody[/U][/I] for any reason of your choice.

I'm just expressing my discomfort with today's common habit of everybody voicing opinions about an act and the person committing that act, without knowing a lot about neither of the two.[/QUOTE]



I agree with an awful lot of what you are saying here. However, and it is a big however, we do know for a fact that he beat a four year old all over his body and on his nut sack with a stick so bad that he needed hospitalization. That is not opinion. That is not conjecture. That is a fact. So as for your very last paragraph, well that is simply not the case. There is just nothing else that you could tell me about AP or the incident that would make that less evil of an act. I do not need to know more about the man to better form my opinion of how i feel about what he did.

Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[quote=Buffalo Bob;1198462]I think I am most disturbed by the fact some fans are [B]very dismissive[/B] of what Adrian Peterson did, not that the Redskins signed him. What he did was abuse no matter what era or culture he came from. It shows some major mental issues if a grown man could do that to a helpless 4 year old child. To me it is one of those things you just can't take back. Unfortunately, as a Redskin fan I will have to root for him while he is on the field. I would prefer the competition at his position improve enough to keep him on the bench.[/quote]

Hold up now, I haven't seen anyone here dismiss what happened. Everyone agrees it was inexcusable and disgusting.

Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[quote=punch it in;1198464]I agree with an awful lot of what you are saying here. However, and it is a big however, we do know for a fact that he beat a four year old all over his body and on his nut sack with a stick so bad that he needed hospitalization. That is not opinion. That is not conjecture. That is a fact. So as for your very last paragraph, well that is simply not the case. [B]There is just nothing else that you could tell me about AP or the incident that would make that less evil of an act[/B]. I do not need to know more about the man to better form my opinion of how i feel about what he did.[/quote]

We agree 100% on that, there's nothing that would make what he did less horrendous.
I never intended to discuss that.

My point simply is, as a football fan, I don't consider my role is to morally judge the players. I try to have an opinion on their football performances... and I already manage to sometimes be wrong about that, so I won't venture in evaluating them as individuals... I leave that to the justice system.

Now, I would feel very different about it had he not been legally punished. But he has been, so for me it's now between him, his consciousness, his close ones and his God if he believes in one, none of which is my business.

Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[QUOTE=FrenchSkin;1198469]We agree 100% on that, there's nothing that would make what he did less horrendous.

I never intended to discuss that.



My point simply is, as a football fan, I don't consider my role is to morally judge the players. I try to have an opinion on their football performances... and I already manage to sometimes be wrong about that, so I won't venture in evaluating them as individuals... I leave that to the justice system.



Now, I would feel very different about it had he not been legally punished. But he has been, so for me it's now between him, his consciousness, his close ones and his God if he believes in one, none of which is my business.[/QUOTE]



Even if he had not been punished legally (the punishment was a joke btw) i would still agree with your last paragraph there.

This was the comment you made in your previous post,


I'm just expressing my discomfort with today's common habit of everybody voicing opinions about an act and the person committing that act, without knowing a lot about neither of the two.

Now, that has nothing to do with football does it? That is what my post was in reply to specifically. We know alot about the act. We know he did it. We have seen pictures. And again i dont need to know anything else about AP.
Look there are two ways to look at this signing, from a football perspective and from a moral perspective- as in “do i want to root for someone I consider to be a bad guy”?
I have absolutely no problem with it as a football move, and for what we paid him and what was available I think you are nuts if you do.
As for a moral perspective I can actually see both sides. Totally understand why you would not want to see good things happen for this man - on or off the field. Also totally understand that no matter what happens on the field it will not change what he did - and God (whatever it is as you put it) is his ultimate judge not Redskin fans.
I think my dream scenario here is that they win the Superbowl and AP gets cut due to a scrotum laceration in his first game. Ahhhh sweet justice.

Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[QUOTE=punch it in;1198470]Even if he had not been punished legally (the punishment was a joke btw) i would still agree with your last paragraph there.

This was the comment you made in your previous post,


I'm just expressing my discomfort with today's common habit of everybody voicing opinions about an act and the person committing that act, without knowing a lot about neither of the two.

Now, that has nothing to do with football does it? That is what my post was in reply to specifically. We know alot about the act. We know he did it. We have seen pictures. And again i dont need to know anything else about AP.
Look there are two ways to look at this signing, from a football perspective and from a moral perspective- as in “do i want to root for someone I consider to be a bad guy”?
I have absolutely no problem with it as a football move, and for what we paid him and what was available I think you are nuts if you do.
As for a moral perspective I can actually see both sides. Totally understand why you would not want to see good things happen for this man - on or off the field. Also totally understand that no matter what happens on the field it will not change what he did - and God (whatever it is as you put it) is his ultimate judge not Redskin fans.
I think my dream scenario here is that they win the Superbowl and AP gets cut due to a scrotum laceration in his first game. Ahhhh sweet justice.[/QUOTE]Completely understand your POV, I think we agree and just happen to take a different stand on this matter.
In the end we all think what he did was wrong, and we all want the Skins to win the SB.
The only difference is I won't feel bad about cheering when/if he scores a TD for us, because I don't consider I must have an opinion about him as a person when I'm watching a game.

I was wrong to imply we cannot have an opinion on what he did, we definitely can, what I meant is I don't feel I can, nor should, morally judge his overall life, because I don't know him and am not paying for what he is but for what he does on the field.

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Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

This thread is depressing. The only thing I don't like about the signing is how divisive it is. That has nothing to do with whether a player will help us win games, which ideally is the only thing that matters. He's legally allowed to play and the NFL has cleared him to play. So I'm 100% fine with him playing if he can produce. My stance typically is if he/she is legally cleared and/or served his/her legal punishment already, then the matter is done with. I've never physically abused someone but I have a million of my own past sins that thank God don't dictate the rest of my future. Hopefully regardless of our personal opinions we all stick together here and root for the Skins like its 1999.

Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[QUOTE=FrenchSkin;1198471]Completely understand your POV, I think we agree and just happen to take a different stand on this matter.
In the end we all think what he did was wrong, and we all want the Skins to win the SB.
The only difference is I won't feel bad about cheering when/if he scores a TD for us, because I don't consider I must have an opinion about him as a person when I'm watching a game.

I was wrong to imply we cannot have an opinion on what he did, we definitely can, what I meant is I don't feel I can, nor should, morally judge his overall life, because I don't know him and am not paying for what he is but for what he does on the field.

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Before we both stop beating this dead horse(no pun intended ) let me just ask you one question, let us say that it was a close friend or family member that he had abused, would that make it hard for you to cheer for him?

Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[quote=punch it in;1198473]Before we both stop beating this dead horse(no pun intended ) let me just ask you one question, let us say that it was a close friend or family member that he had abused, would that make it hard for you to cheer for him?[/quote]

In that instance, one would think you would have a lot more first hand knowledge of him as a person, right? So, without diminishing his act, you would know if this was, as FrenchSkins was saying, his whole persona, whether he had truly come to a changed point in his life, or if the mea culpa was more show than substance.

If I knew a person was continuing the acts, no I wouldn't cheer for him, would wonder why the NFL allowed him to continue playing, and if close enough to have proof that evil acts continued, I would do what I could to keep him from working.

If I knew the same person was indeed contrite, and had "paid his dues" and made restitution as best as he could, I would try to help him back on his feet.

Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[QUOTE=CRedskinsRule;1198474]In that instance, one would think you would have a lot more first hand knowledge of him as a person, right? So, without diminishing his act, you would know if this was, as FrenchSkins was saying, his whole persona, whether he had truly come to a changed point in his life, or if the mea culpa was more show than substance.



If I knew a person was continuing the acts, no I wouldn't cheer for him, would wonder why the NFL allowed him to continue playing, and if close enough to have proof that evil acts continued, I would do what I could to keep him from working.



If I knew the same person was indeed contrite, and had "paid his dues" and made restitution as best as he could, I would try to help him back on his feet.[/QUOTE]



I thought I was supposed to be the liberal. Lol. You are a lot more forgiving than i am CRED. If someone beats a kid that bad - whether it is mine or not - there aint no helping him back on his feet coming out of me. I admire your ability to forgive and forget though. I mean that.
I have a real tough time getting past the thought of an innocent 4 year old child bleeding from his scrotum and entire body and the pain and horror he must have endured. Also the mental scar that can leave you with for the rest of your life.

Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[quote=punch it in;1198477]I thought I was supposed to be the liberal. Lol. You are a lot more forgiving than i am CRED. If someone beats a kid that bad - whether it is mine or not - there aint no helping him back on his feet coming out of me. I admire your ability to forgive and forget though. I mean that.
I have a real tough time getting past the thought of an innocent 4 year old child bleeding from his scrotum and entire body and the pain and horror he must have endured. Also the mental scar that can leave you with for the rest of your life.[/quote]


The mental scars are far worse than the physical abuse. This is why some family's have generations of abuse.

Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[quote=punch it in;1198477]I thought I was supposed to be the liberal. Lol. You are a lot more forgiving than i am CRED. If someone beats a kid that bad - whether it is mine or not - there aint no helping him back on his feet coming out of me. I admire your ability to forgive and forget though. I mean that.
I have a real tough time getting past the thought of an innocent 4 year old child bleeding from his scrotum and entire body and the pain and horror he must have endured. Also the mental scar that can leave you with for the rest of your life.[/quote]

note, that I said made restitution, in AP's case that would mean counseling and as the boy grows up helping him heal. We as a society are so more knowledgeable of these issues than even 20 years ago, and the chance of true healing, which I believe forgiveness plays a HUGE part of, is far greater. In this particular instance the 4yo will have the chance to hear his father apologize, and hopefully AP is making amends in everyway possible.

Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1198463]I looked at the pics of the wounds of the kid online. If those pics don't piss you off then so be it. The excuse that he did that cause he was raised that way is a weak one. I don't want him on the team I root for. Go to Dallas or the Bengals.[/quote]

He's a redskin now. Out of our hands

Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[QUOTE=punch it in;1198473]Before we both stop beating this dead horse(no pun intended ) let me just ask you one question, let us say that it was a close friend or family member that he had abused, would that make it hard for you to cheer for him?[/QUOTE]Of course it would... but not sure this is a very good way of thinking: if the whole society act as if they were the victim, or a relative of the victim, then we might just go ahead and sentence everybody to death ^^
It is not my role to act as if I was close to that kid. If we all did that all the time, it would be the end of justice, society, people having second chances etc...

Now, as Isaid, I do think I understand and respect your POV, and as you said, that dead horse has been beaten to a second death... so let it rest in peace
... have a nice one, and HTTR my friend !

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Re: Redskins Signing Adrian Peterson
 

[url]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2014/09/12/the-details-of-adrian-petersons-arrest-are-disturbing/[/url]
I probably read this a few years ago, but just wanted to refresh my memory of what exactly went down for the sake of my current thoughts on this guy now that I will be watching him play every weekend. Really seems like , at least at one point, this guy had some real issues. Maybe he has changed. Who knows.