Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[quote=#56fanatic;862261]wow. am i the only one that thinks this is really harsh assessment of Orakpo?? THe guy has been really really good over the last couple of years. I dont think he is playing horrible this year. Do you know think that Kerrigan may be taking away some of his sack numbers? I just think as a whole our D line is better as a whole as well, which may have taken a couple sacks away from him. I didn't see him getting mushed all day. He got pressure, made some plays. On the TD late in the game, he was visibly held that should have been called. Still dont understand how the ref missed that when he was 5 yards away. He was basically pulling him down by the neck of his jersey. anyway, I think bashing Orakpo or calling him out is a little nit picky[/quote]

Our best is not Jared Allen's, Dwight Freeney's, etc's best. You watch the goddamn tape, and you see LTs always struggling to hold their own against guys like those. Not the case with Orakpo. Stats are [I]not[/I] comprehensive logs of what goes on the field. Getting owned by Doug Free 1-on-1 multiple times is not going to land on stat sheet anywhere, but the visual evidence is there.

That is not to say Orakpo is horrible. I only said that he's not as good as other guys. That DOES NOT mean he is horrible. Those guys I listed would be rated 90 out of 100. Orakpo would be lower, say 75 or 80 out of 100. You call this bashing? What am I supposed to do? Say he's better than Ware? That's bullshit.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

I think it is obvious that, when it comes to sheer athleticism, Rak is a cut above Kerrigan. On top of that, he seems to have the same non-stop motor and desire that is touted in Kerrigan.

Which is why it seems both surprising and slightly disappointing that Rak is not [I]dominant.[/I] He clearly has the physical ability to be and he clearly has the desire to be. Maybe it is just offenses catching up to Rak's game a little, maybe it's just he doesn't have a complete D around him (improved - but still with holes).

Don't get me wrong, even if he stays at his current level, I think he and Kerrigan are great bookends for the future. I just don't see Kerrigan ever being game changing dominant (Beastly, great, really good? All the things Orakpo is [I]now[/I]? Yup). On the other hand, I think Orakpo has the physical ability to be a player other teams must game plan for and who then blows up their plans for him. I truly hope he gets to that level and he may well do so - I mean he is only in his 3rd year. Right now, however, he's merely a very very good player.

I am not Rak bashing, I think he is one of the best players on the team, possibly THE best, and would be one of the top players on his team no matter who he played for. I just want him to be the guy who destroys the opposition.

I long for the day when we can say "Release the KerRakpo!!" and other teams f'ing pee themselves.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[QUOTE]NC Skins asks:

What's been the difference between playing with a guy like DeMarcus Ware compared to a guy like Brian Orakpo? How do they differ in playing styles?

[B]Brian is more of a physical pass rusher. He is very strong at the point of attack. He tries to beat people with brute force. DeMarcus you don’t really know how he is going to beat you- he can beat you with speed, fitness, or go right through you. Both are amazing players.[/B][/QUOTE]


Read what Bowen says in his answer to my question. One is strictly power, the other is all three. Probably answers why LTs can prepare better for Orakpo because he's only bringing one move.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[quote=#56fanatic;862261]wow. am i the only one that thinks this is really harsh assessment of Orakpo?? THe guy has been really really good over the last couple of years. I dont think he is playing horrible this year. Do you know think that Kerrigan may be taking away some of his sack numbers? I just think as a whole our D line is better as a whole as well, which may have taken a couple sacks away from him. I didn't see him getting mushed all day. He got pressure, made some plays. On the TD late in the game, he was visibly held that should have been called. Still dont understand how the ref missed that when he was 5 yards away. He was basically pulling him down by the neck of his jersey. anyway, [B]I think bashing Orakpo or calling him out is a little nit picky[/B][/quote]

Agreed 110%. Especially with all of our other problems to consider, and we're sitting here picking apart one of our better players.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[quote=NC_Skins;862268]Read what Bowen says in his answer to my question. One is strictly power, the other is all three. Probably answers why LTs can prepare better for Orakpo because he's only bringing one move.[/quote]

sums it up well, if he wants to be an elite rusher he's got to expand his repertoire. I remember Haslett or one of the coaches last year talking about him needing to learn to use his hands to keep tackles from holding him. That's still the case.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[quote=Mattyk;862271]Agreed 110%. Especially with all of our other problems to consider, and we're sitting here picking apart one of our better players.[/quote]

I may have missed some "bashing" of Rak, but that's certainly not my intent. Like SirClintonPortis I'm pointing out that he's not winning his 1 on 1 matchups much of the time. Even Shanahan alluded to the pass rush being partly to blame for the 3rd & 15 when Hall took the blame.

He's definitely a cornerstone of this D, and I would go farther to say that re-signing him in the next couple years should be budgeted for now. I would not want to see him walk, but at the same time his game needs some evolution & he's capable of improving.

Maybe this is just a case of standards & expectations. As one of our best players & a no. 1 pick, we're expecting him to be great. Ditto for Landry.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[quote=freddyg12;862275]I may have missed some "bashing" of Rak, but that's certainly not my intent. Like SirClintonPortis I'm pointing out that he's not winning his 1 on 1 matchups much of the time. Even Shanahan alluded to the pass rush being partly to blame for the 3rd & 15 when Hall took the blame.

He's definitely a cornerstone of this D, and I would go farther to say that re-signing him in the next couple years should be budgeted for now. I would not want to see him walk, but at the same time his game needs some evolution & he's capable of improving.

Maybe this is just a case of standards & expectations. As one of our best players & a no. 1 pick, we're expecting him to be great. Ditto for Landry.[/quote]

He's certainly not above criticism, it just strikes me as a little odd how much time we've spent talking about him lately considering how many more glaring problems we have. I'd argue he has been a great player for us, just not great enough for some I guess.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;861988]I think the biggest loser yeterday was DeAngelo Hall.
[INDENT]He was the defender on Bryant's TD catch in the first quarter. He was beaten so badly that Atogwe was actually the closest defender.

He could not run down Jason Witten on that 60-yard TD play.

He was stone-cold punked by DeMarco Murray on a running play that the Skins needed to stuff to stall a Cowboys' drive. Murray hit him and carried him about 5 yards until help arrived.

He gave up the catch to Bryant that set up the field goal that ended the game.[/INDENT]
Even if he had played perfectly for the rest of the game - - and he did not - - he was the defender who made a difference on the plays that decided the game. Problem is that he made a difference in the wrong direction.

Oh well, he can take solace in the fact that he has that $25M guarantee for his contract...[/quote]
I just watched the highlights of the game and noticed that Hall was covering Robinson on that 7 yard TD pass in the 3rd quarter that tied the game at 17 each.

So he got torched by Witten, Bryant and Robinson in one game.

Esstenially, 21 of the 27 points the Cowboys scored were against Hall in coverage. Thats all 3 of Romo's TD's.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;862282]I just watched the highlights of the game and noticed that Hall was covering Robinson on that 7 yard TD pass in the 3rd quarter that tied the game at 17 each.

So he got torched by Witten, Bryant and Robinson in one game.

Esstenially, 21 of the 27 points the Cowboys scored were against Hall in coverage. Thats all 3 of Romo's TD's.[/quote]

He wasn't covering Whitten or Robinson on those TDs, he came after them off of his man once the ball was in the air.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[quote=freddyg12;862294]He wasn't covering Whitten or Robinson on those TDs, he came after them off of his man once the ball was in the air.[/quote]


I swear Deangelo Hall is the most criticized redskin ever, he's our best CB by far on the team thats not saying much but who else are we going to throw at the number 1 spot???? Think people

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[quote=SirClintonPortis;862265]Those guys I listed would be rated 90 out of 100. Orakpo would be lower, say 75 or 80 out of 100. You call this bashing? What am I supposed to do? Say he's better than Ware? That's bullshit.[/quote]

Rak is just entering his 3rd season, Ware is something like a 7 or 8 year vet.

Ware - Rak
58 tkls, 8 sacks - 50 tkls, 11 sacks
73 tkls, 11.5 sacks - 56 tkls, 8.5 sacks

If all-pro, HOF players like Allen and Ware are 90s, Id say Rak is a solid 83-85 perennial probowler.

So what that Rak is a straight up one dimensional pass rusher like t suggs or d ware and not an all around backer like matthews or urlacher.

different peices to complete the puzzle. Rak, flethcher and kerrigan all fit and fill different needs. I do wish Haslett would move rak and kerrigan around some.

Given the choice between a 3rd year Rak or 7 year Ware going forward, Id take the younger Rak who has some of his best seasons right around the corner.

Better D personnel and more time in the system = Rak putting up bigger and bigger numbers. its just a matter of time b/c he has the physical tools and right mind state to be one of the best pass rushers in the league for the rest of the decade.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[quote=sandtrapjack;862282]I just watched the highlights of the game and noticed that Hall was covering Robinson on that 7 yard TD pass in the 3rd quarter that tied the game at 17 each.

So he got torched by Witten, Bryant and Robinson in one game.

Esstenially, 21 of the 27 points the Cowboys scored were against Hall in coverage. Thats all 3 of Romo's TD's.[/quote]

Hall was only covering Bryant. I don't know about the Witten TD, but in the Robinson TD, Wilson was the one covering him not Hall. If you see the play, you will notice Wilson running behind Robinson trying to catch up to him. Romo did a good job of putting the ball in a spot where Robinson could catch it before Hall or Wilson got there (yeah I just threw up in my mouth a little).

The way I see it, both of our starting CBs gave up a TD each, and the entire secondary f'ed up with the Witten TD. In the end, the team is going to need to figure out how to make the secondary work or see what changes in players AND scheme need to happen to make this unit successful next season.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

The Whitten TD was on Riley, but I don't expect Riley to cover Whitten for that long.

The Bryant TD was on Hall and Otagwe. Otagwe was having a bagel and was waaayyyy late on his deep third protection

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

Would witten have scored that TD if landry was on the field?

Yes or No.

Re: Smoot Lays the Smack Down (Cowboys at Redskins)
 

[quote=over the mountain;862343]Would witten have scored that TD if landry was on the field?

Yes or No.[/quote]

I doubt it would have made a difference because it was a total breakdown in coverage. Maybe Landry could have stopped him, since he's bigger than our CBs...but Witten caught that ball in stride and just took off.