Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[QUOTE=joekes;232557]So why did we change systems to Saunders' stuff. Yes it's a proven winning system, but its NOT a proven CHAMPIONSHIP system. Ball control is a proven championship system year after year.
There is a reason Payton Manning hasn't won a super bowl- Finnesse wins regular season games - Intimidation (defense, running and playaction) wins Championships.
There was no reason to add Saunders after last year. Gibb's system was making progress - like you said, why change a proven system.
Gibbs = 3 super bowls.
Saunders = 0
It's not about winning in October, I'm sure after one or two more years Saunders giant playbook can give you an 11-5 season, but I'll guarantee it won't give you a super bowls. Why wait 2 years to be back where we were last year, when this season could have been special.
HUGE MISTAKE[/QUOTE]

You might want to take a closer look at things, G. Williams defense has been carrying this team for the last 2 years, Gibbs offense was pathetic, we were getting better on offense? Theres a joke, take a look at our last 3 games last season, if thats your idea of progress than you will never understand the game.

Saunders was the guru behind the greatest show on turf, and I do believe they won a SB. Just because he may not be cut out as a head coach doesn't mean he can't be a tremendous O-coordiantor. Kind of tough to run an offense when your hamstrung with a QB that Gibbs can't part ways with in Brunell, Saunders turned a bag boy in Warner into an MVP he knows how to deal with QB's. In which right now he doesn't have one.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[quote=offiss;232637]Saunders was the guru behind the greatest show on turf, and I do believe they won a SB. [/quote]

Uhmmm No, Saunders was not the "guru" of the Rams Super Bowl team. Mike Martz was the O-coordinator and Vermeil was the Coach. Saunders was.... drum roll... wide recievers coach.. not really the hardest job when your receivers are Torry Holt and Isaac Bruce in their primes.
Why does everyone want to ball wash Saunders so much? and with wrong information?
He wasn't a "guru"
yes he was O-coordinator at KC and they racked up a bunch of yards, but let's check the Chiefs playoff record in Saunders five years there.
Hmm. ONE playoff game- ONE, and they lost- That's NO playoff wins in five years-
NONE
We don't need that crap.
His is NOT an offense designed to win playoff games.
The kind of Offense you run affects what kind of defense you have. His offense sets a tempo that the defense has to follow and the defense gets exhausted and gives up big plays. That's one big reason KC's defense was always terrible.
The concept of Ball control is foreign to Saunders.
He can take his fancy playbook and shove it up his A$$ - that is if there's any room up there next to all you guys who love him so much.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

who cares? it didn't look good, but we've got bigger problems, like defence, depth, protection, and a bad QB.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[quote=joekes;232640]Uhmmm No, Saunders was not the "guru" of the Rams Super Bowl team. Mike Martz was the O-coordinator and Vermeil was the Coach. Saunders was.... drum roll... wide recievers coach.. not really the hardest job when your receivers are Torry Holt and Isaac Bruce in their primes.
Why does everyone want to ball wash Saunders so much? and with wrong information?
He wasn't a "guru"
yes he was O-coordinator at KC and they racked up a bunch of yards, but let's check the Chiefs playoff record in Saunders five years there.
Hmm. ONE playoff game- ONE, and they lost- That's NO playoff wins in five years-
NONE
We don't need that crap.
His is NOT an offense designed to win playoff games.
The kind of Offense you run affects what kind of defense you have. His offense sets a tempo that the defense has to follow and the defense gets exhausted and gives up big plays. That's one big reason KC's defense was always terrible.
The concept of Ball control is foreign to Saunders.
He can take his fancy playbook and shove it up his A$$ - that is if there's any room up there next to all you guys who love him so much.[/quote]

not to mention, it's much easier to call plays and look good when you've got 2 HoF players on your o line. after losing both tackles, larry johnson isn't exactly looking like he-man any more.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

You guys can get upset and call for Jason Campbell or Gibbs to retire etc.
I'll keep on trusting Joe Gibbs, the Redskins players and 95% of the staff! Ofcourse it'd be awesome if we ran the table and got in playoffs and all you fairweather people could read your own pathetic fan woe texts.

IN GIBBS I TRUST!

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

Saunders' offenses score POINTS. They scored lots of points in KC (I think it was the most in one season for a single team ever). To say that his offense is not setup to win games is ridiculous. If they score points, what the hell is the problem? gimme a break!

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[quote]You guys can get upset and call for Jason Campbell or Gibbs to retire etc.
I'll keep on trusting Joe Gibbs, the Redskins players and 95% of the staff! Ofcourse it'd be awesome if we ran the table and got in playoffs and all you fairweather people could read your own pathetic fan woe texts.[/quote]
The attitude of the loser. Lube up, bend over, and take whatever The Redskins decide to stick in. As fans, this is our team too. If we're not happy, we're not going to take it.

I agree, give Saunders a QB of his choice and lets see what this system can do in another year. This offense is hard to pick up no doubt, and they're still getting things together. But this is a proven defense, you know, something that wasn't nearly 30 years ago. Gibbs himself has said the X's and O's have changed dramatically since his first run. In my book, he doesn't have a proven offense anymore. Sure, he was great in the 80s, but this isn't the 80s.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[quote=Luxorreb;232647]You guys can get upset and call for Jason Campbell or Gibbs to retire etc.
I'll keep on trusting Joe Gibbs, the Redskins players and 95% of the staff! Ofcourse it'd be awesome if we ran the table and got in playoffs and all you fairweather people could read your own pathetic fan woe texts.

IN GIBBS I TRUST![/quote]

damn, how many times do i have to repeat this.

last year WE HAD A DEFENSE. last year, at 5-6, we had 3 losses that we could have won on the last play of the game. last year brunell WAS throwing deep and keeping teams from shoving 9 and 10 in the box play after play.

this year we have NONE of those things, and injury problems to boot.

keep trusting them though, at 5-11, we've have your own pathetic homer ignorance in text :P.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[quote=Grim21Reaper;232449]I am glad he is pissed. At least he cares and has a pulse. Does #8 have a pulse?[/quote]

That's the worst part - every time they show a closeup of Brunell, he looks totally disengaged, like he couldn't care less about the game. We need a QB with fire in his eyes.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[QUOTE=Grim21Reaper;232465]Who do you want to hear from?

Gibbs said Brunell had a good game? HA HA HA HA HHA

Can someone check Joe's medicine?[/QUOTE]

I don't want to hear negativity from any player publicly...it does not do any good. If he has a problem then take it up in the locker room. They may not be winning right now but they need to stick together...Maybe Lloyd was allowed to lip off in San Fran but that doesn't happen here.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

lloyds outburst doesnt bother me at all. accept poor play and losing? any player on the skins that is ok with the way the things are going, i dont want on my team

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

It was only a matter of time before someone had a little outburst. I really don't think it's a big issue though. We have much bigger problems.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

I mean damn, he came from the FORTY NINERS expecting our previous playoff team to give him a chance to make the Skins a Super Bowl contender. I'd be pissed too.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[QUOTE=joekes;232640]Uhmmm No, Saunders was not the "guru" of the Rams Super Bowl team. Mike Martz was the O-coordinator and Vermeil was the Coach. Saunders was.... drum roll... wide recievers coach.. not really the hardest job when your receivers are Torry Holt and Isaac Bruce in their primes.
Why does everyone want to ball wash Saunders so much? and with wrong information?
He wasn't a "guru"
yes he was O-coordinator at KC and they racked up a bunch of yards, but let's check the Chiefs playoff record in Saunders five years there.
Hmm. ONE playoff game- ONE, and they lost- That's NO playoff wins in five years-
NONE
We don't need that crap.
His is NOT an offense designed to win playoff games.
The kind of Offense you run affects what kind of defense you have. His offense sets a tempo that the defense has to follow and the defense gets exhausted and gives up big plays. That's one big reason KC's defense was always terrible.
The concept of Ball control is foreign to Saunders.
He can take his fancy playbook and shove it up his A$$ - that is if there's any room up there next to all you guys who love him so much.[/QUOTE]


Funny wherever Saunders has been the teams offense is phenomonal, St.Louis, San diego, and KC, his problem has been lack of defense, has Martz done anything significant before or after Saunders was with him? No. and yes Saunders was also assistant head coach to Martz when Vermeil left. The fact is we had more 3 and outs last year than I can ever remember seeing, that is why the team was running on fumes at the end of the year, our entire team relied on the defense. Your not paying attention if you think we have a quick strike offense, or a high scoring offense which doesn't control the ball, which is what you are saying Saunders is, everything he has run is designed to control the ball and eat the clock because Brunell can't get the ball downfield, it's not his fault if Brunell continues to throw to the first guy he see's in a Skins uniform regardless of yards neeeded or pressure. I guess Williams is a problem as well if he could deliver more 3 and outs the offense would eventually score, regardless of how well Williams has proven he knows how to coach defense. Personel and Brunell are the problems with this team not Saunders.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[quote=offiss;232857]Funny wherever Saunders has been the teams offense is phenomonal, St.Louis, San diego, and KC, his problem has been lack of defense, has Martz done anything significant before or after Saunders was with him? No. and yes Saunders was also assistant head coach to Martz when Vermeil left. The fact is we had more 3 and outs last year than I can ever remember seeing, that is why the team was running on fumes at the end of the year, our entire team relied on the defense. Your not paying attention if you think we have a quick strike offense, or a high scoring offense which doesn't control the ball, which is what you are saying Saunders is, everything he has run is designed to control the ball and eat the clock because Brunell can't get the ball downfield, it's not his fault if Brunell continues to throw to the first guy he see's in a Skins uniform regardless of yards neeeded or pressure. I guess Williams is a problem as well if he could deliver more 3 and outs the offense would eventually score, regardless of how well Williams has proven he knows how to coach defense. Personel and Brunell are the problems with this team not Saunders.[/quote]

four points:

1. KC (backup QB) and detroit (crappy crappy team) are doing better than us right now.
2. the rams in 2000 (he was the WR coach, NOT the HC, NOT the OC) had tory holt (HoF), marshall faulk (HoF), Isaac Bruce, etc... he had great RBs and OL in KC (like insanely good - roaf and shields = winning). maybe we just don't have that kind of talent here.
3. they had better QB play.
4. at the end of last year, we were playing without a QB, yet still finished 11th in offense. that's not bad and if brunell wasn't playing hurt and worn out at the end maybe we could have done better.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

brunell may or may not be the problem; but he's definitely not the solution.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[quote=celts32;232791]Maybe Lloyd was allowed to lip off in San Fran but that doesn't happen here.[/quote]He wasn't allowed to and that's one of the reasons he got traded. Nolan has more power as a HC than almost any other in the league and he really doesn't take much shit from his players.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[quote=celts32;232791]I don't want to hear negativity from any player publicly...it does not do any good. If he has a problem then take it up in the locker room. They may not be winning right now but they need to stick together...Maybe Lloyd was allowed to lip off in San Fran but that doesn't happen here.[/quote]

Portis never went public did he.... It was on the sideline. From what I have heard, Gary Clark used to yell at the coaches all the time. There is nothing wrong with a player getting frustrated on the sidelines. It happens all the time.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

I'm pretty sure Portis had some public comments after he only got 14 touches last week. His comments weren't completely direct, but pretty close as I recall.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[QUOTE=Daseal;232710]The attitude of the loser. Lube up, bend over, and take whatever The Redskins decide to stick in.[/QUOTE]

That's just nasty.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

[quote=celts32;232791]I don't want to hear negativity from any player publicly...it does not do any good. If he has a problem then take it up in the locker room. They may not be winning right now but they need to stick together...Maybe Lloyd was allowed to lip off in San Fran but that doesn't happen here.[/quote]
Yeah, I mean generally speaking I agree with you, but take into context this "little outburst"... He wasn't really yelling at anyone in particular, opposite of Mr. Owens who always has directed anger.

Lloyd may develop into a very good receiver, and I think he's proving himself more and more each week. This little outburst shouldn't bother anyone and I think the general vibe is that it's more reflective of his passion as a football player, and less of his lack of self control.

Santana Moss on the other hand needs to not retaliate... Be the bigger guy, suck it up... draw the penalty, and then walk of the field with a win. Don't fight back, cause you'll always get caught. You will hardly hear a complaint about Santana from anyone, but obviously we'd rather have the yards and some points vs. the last word/hit.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

BTW, for anyone who cares, when I used the word "hissyfit" in the thread title I did not mean to imply that Lloyd was acting like T.O. or some punk. I simply did not know what to call "the incident" as I had no idea what it was all about.

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

I remember thinking several times the last few weeks that I wish lloyd would make a little stir about not getting the ball. He seems to catch almost every one of the very few balls they throw to him. This is the main reason I want Campbell in, Lloyd and ARE can play, but they need to get the ball.

They should be taking two deep shots per game to Lloyd minimum just to loosen he defense!

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

Per the [URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/23/AR2006102301134.html"]Washington Post[/URL], Lloyd and ARE are fine, it was just Lloyd going Keyshawn on everyone:
[quote]Television cameras captured an animated exchange between wide receivers Brandon Lloyd and Randle El on Sunday, but numerous players and Gibbs said that Randle El was trying to calm his frustrated teammate. Lloyd has been unproductive this season -- 11 catches -- and was again invisible Sunday after making three early catches. "We were keeping each other cool," Randle El said.[/quote]

Re: Lloyd's Sideline Hissyfit
 

Gibbs said they walked off the field together. Really not an issue. A struggling team with some guys who are frustrated. Not surprising.