Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;518059]I would cease to be a Redskins fan if they signed Vick. To hell with him and his scum bag family. It would be the same as signing a pedophile or rapist. Vick and his brother are nothing but trash who should be banned from football period. Vick is a sicker puppy than the ones he HUNG, DROWNED, and ELECTROCUTED. Paid he's debt to society my a**! Not in Virginia he hasn't! The Old Dominion isn't through with sick Vick. They only got Vick because they busted his cousin selling dope and he snitched. The were looking for drugs not dogs. I bet he had both.

Every month it was something new with Marcus. Marcus is drinking with underage girls. Marcus is caught doing 90 drunk and stoned. I watched Marcus stick his cleats in the chest of a man on his back and grind them in. I watched him flick off his own stadium.

We had this discussion today at work and you Vick apologist make me want to vomit. If you get convicted of a felony you shouldn't play in the NFL period. Why don't we sign the beltway snippers and Dr. Death Jack Kevorkian? Why don't we get Madoff to run our front office? How about Cheech and Chong as our offensive and defensive coordinators?
Go ahead and sign the filth. I'll write a letter to the commissioner with my spit enclosed and send in my Redskins gear to Vinnie Cerrato with a big fat dump on it.

If you don't like what I have to say about scum bags brothers Vick BAN ME FROM POSTING. I though it was bad enough when we signed Deion. I'll take a million Deions over one Vick.[/quote]


What a morale stance from someone who wants to kill off old people. Pfff...

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

I figured this tone of response, but am kinda surprised at the lack of on field impact people think Vick will have. Like him as a QB or not, his playmaking ability was undeniable. It would be hard MERELY FROM A FOOTBALL VIEW to not acknowledge the benefit he will bring to whomever he signs with, especially as a Slash/Wildcat/Athlete specialist.

To the morality police, would you accept Leonard Little if the Redskins traded for or signed him as a free agent?

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

I'm a Hokie & watched Vick come into his own at Lane Stadium. I WANT to believe there's a good person somewhere in him. He seemed humble at VT, but part of that was likely his ineptitude in public speaking & the fact that stardom was just starting to hit him.

I am rooting for him & by that I mean I truly hope he learns magnitude of his crimes. I hope he can salvage something of his career & actually apologize on national tv in one of the pregame shows.

That said, if mgmt. determines Vick is a changed man & can help the team, I'd be for it. I would seriously hope that Vinny & Danny would take extra precautions & do extensive research on his recent past before even thinking of it (scouting of free agents has been problematic at times).

As for his football ability, I don't see how anyone can say we don't need a guy w/his ability, his baggage aside. Based solely on his ability, he could return punts, maybe play a little wr, run the wildcat & serve as emergency qb. Unless he's totally let his body go, he could definitely help what is right now a lackluster offense & punt return team.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

Absolutely NOT and if he were on the team, he better NOT wear #7.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=Paintrain;518135]I figured this tone of response, but am kinda surprised at the lack of on field impact people think Vick will have. Like him as a QB or not, his playmaking ability was undeniable. It would be hard MERELY FROM A FOOTBALL VIEW to not acknowledge the benefit he will bring to whomever he signs with, especially as a Slash/Wildcat/Athlete specialist.

To the morality police, would you accept Leonard Little if the Redskins traded for or signed him as a free agent?[/quote]

Vick was a great athlete, but not a good QB at all. His passing game was horrible at times and the Falcons didn't get over the playoff hump until he left the team...tells you something, doesn't it? They were also in a Super Bowl just before Vick came to the team. His stay there was one of unfulfilled expectations on the field and a complete piece of trash off the field.

He hasn't even played for several years (well, when and if he ever gets back to some unfortunate team)...so who is to say he can still perform to the level he even did before?

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=Buster;518140]Vick was a great athlete, but not a good QB at all. His passing game was horrible at times and the Falcons didn't get over the playoff hump until he left the team...tells you something, doesn't it? They were also in a Super Bowl just before Vick came to the team. His stay there was one of unfulfilled expectations on the field and a complete piece of trash off the field.

He hasn't even played for several years (well, when and if he ever gets back to some unfortunate team)...so who is to say he can still perform to the level he even did before?[/quote]

I agree, Vick is a great athlete but his skill set just doesnt match what's needed to be a successful NFL QB (see Vince Young). I'm sure in an all around test of athletic skill Vick would run rings around Matt Ryan but Matt Ryan has the skill set that a successful NFL QB needs and that's why the Falcons were so successful under him and less so under VIck.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=Buster;518140]Vick was a great athlete, but not a good QB at all. His passing game was horrible at times and the Falcons didn't get over the playoff hump until he left the team...tells you something, doesn't it? They were also in a Super Bowl just before Vick came to the team. His stay there was one of unfulfilled expectations on the field and a complete piece of trash off the field.

He hasn't even played for several years (well, when and if he ever gets back to some unfortunate team)...so who is to say he can still perform to the level he even did before?[/quote]
Vick did lead them to the playoffs a few times, including to an NFC Championship game, the Super Bowl predated him by about 3-4 years. They were terrible with and without him over the past 10 years. I agree that as a pure QB, he was not, nor will he ever be a star. As a slash/wildcat qb/athlete I think he could do significant damage for an offense.

I'm not a Vick apologist for his off field actions, I believe in second chances once a debt has been paid to society though.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

Vick is a BAD man.
Trying to rationalize or equate his behavior to eating meat......is silly. I personally have NO desire to add TRASH like this to the team. THAT would make us the Cowboys.........

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

This thread's pretty retarded.

I actually saw somebody compare the cruelty of slaughterhouses where they kill animals for food to the cruelty of Vick's dogfighting.

Stiffler, f*ck! I mean, why do you have to be so insensitive.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=maroonandblack30;518130]Sign Vick, run the "wildcat", eat hamburgers at half-time.[/quote]

No serve Hot Dogs at half-time. LOL

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

If we needed a QB yes i would accept Vick.
But, we don't.
I bet that if Vick truely has 'changed' and was committed to football 100% he would be an apt pupil for Zorn.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=Buster;518140]Vick was a great athlete, but not a good QB at all. His passing game was horrible at times and the Falcons didn't get over the playoff hump until he left the team...tells you something, doesn't it? [/quote]

For the sake of being factual, the Falcons made the playoffs in 2002, beating the Packers in Lambeau. They also made the playoffs in 2004, making it all the way to the NFC Championship game. Vick was the quarterback in both of those seasons.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

I say no unless he's extremely cheap. I like to think positively and say that hopefully he has learned his lesson after paying his debt to society. I would also like to think part of his punishment would be to make public service announcements for PETA.

My main concern is not his whole animal issue. People around the world treat animals differently and that includes people within the U.S. I would not train an animal to fight and I would not kill the animal with my bare hands or torture a pet. However, I believe people humanizing pets way too much. I can remember taking a dog to the vet and it only cost between $50-$150 dollars. Now vets want to be treated like doctors and an office visit is $75-$100 dollars not including anything you have done to the animal. I understand new medicine and new techniques and new equipement enable the vet to do more things but when you spend under $400 for your dog or pick him up practically free from the pound and then your spending more on one visit to the vet then the whole cost of the dog is rediculous. I think we are in an age where we need to look into pet insurance to cover the cost of anything the animal needs medically do to high costs. I laugh every time someone tells me their vet bill was $2000 ..X-rays, endoscopy, surgery....

My issues with Vick are due to his non-marijuana use. :) Remember he denied using it. lol. but how many times did he almost get caught in the airport? It just seems it was always around him but he was not a user. My other issue is it seemed he was the team. When he was not in the team played as a team as they are now. But when he was with the team he was a one man show. Coach's tried to make him a pocket passer and it never worked. He's better off passing rolling out or scrambling. Don't get me wrong he was a threat everytime he had the ball but I'm not sure if his issues are worth the head ache. Only if he knows he is second fiddle or third string. I can't for the life of me figure out what he would teach our QB's though. He was never confortable being a WCO pocket passer.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

Vick is a cold-hearted piece of human garbage. Even if we were guaranteed a Super Bowl....NO WAY!!!!

If I'm Goddell no way Vick gets back in the NFL. For those saying "he has a right to make a living", you are correct. Once his debt to society is paid, he has a right to be gainfully employeed if a company wants to hire a convicted felon. My company sure wouldn't, if I did a small fraction of what Vick did it would be a very cold day in hell before my company would hire me back. If the CFL, Arena or the new start-up league want him fine, but he would never wear the NFL logo again if I was commish.

For you folks trying to equate eating meat with torturing / killing dogs and forcing them to bite/claw/chew each other to death over the course of 15 min to an hour and to not only watch but RUN THE WHOLE OPERATION...give me an f-ing break. I love a good steak, and I tend to believe most meat in the U.S. is produced fairly humanely with minimal fear/pain/suffering to the animals.

From a purely football perspective, he was a poor QB definitely not a WCO guy. The "Wildcat" is a fad that D-Coordinators will have completely stopped by early in the '09 season, he has lost speed which was really his only asset, no way Snyder would take on that kind of negative publicity for the Skins anyway.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

No way. If he comes to the Redskins I'm done as a STH and a fan.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

as a football player, yes. as a human being, no. that's up to ownership to decide. and ss33, your company discriminates against people with a record. i personally dont want thugs on the team i root for

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=The Goat;518078]Convicted felon who ran illegal gambling/dog-fighting ring signs with... the Dallas Cowboys.

(we should just pass on this one).[/quote]

oakland raiders will take vick he is a cancer and total loser piece of #$%&

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

Think of what it takes to hold a struggling dog uderwater until it dies. Could you bring yourself to do it? It takes a dark twisted person to do that of his own will. I agree he paid for his crime. But that doesn't change what he is inside. He has the right to employment but not as a representative of/in the NFL. IMO

I'm not that desperate to win. Not that he could do anything for us anyway!
I'll stick with JC thank you.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=44ever;518162][COLOR=red]Think of what it takes to hold a struggling dog uderwater until it dies. Could you bring yourself to do it? It takes a dark[/COLOR] [COLOR=red]twisted person to do that of his own will.[/COLOR] I agree he paid for his crime. But that doesn't change what he is inside. He has the right to employment but not as a representative of/in the NFL. IMO

I'm not that desperate to win. Not that he could do anything for us anyway!
I'll stick with JC thank you.[/quote]
Spin the humanity BS any way you want, 44 got it right.........BAD MAN, and we DON'T need more problems. We need more solutions.

MV will make a nice....Cowboy
WWJ2D

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=dmek25;518158]as a football player, yes. as a human being, no. that's up to ownership to decide. and ss33, your company discriminates against people with a record. i personally dont want thugs on the team i root for[/quote]

To be accurate, discrimination is the wrong term. Employers are not permitted to deny opportunity for employment based on race, religion, gender, age, or nationality. So says Amendment 16 of the US Constitution, thereby qualifying as discrimination.

There are no laws against denying employment opportunity against those with criminal records. This is perfectly legal, done all the time, and something I wholeheartedly support.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

There aren't too many things that could make me question my love and support for this great football franchise. Signing Vick would be one of them. I heard lots of bad stuff about this fool long before the horrible dog fighting stuff came out.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

i have 2 dogs now, have always had pups since the day i was born but i think vick paid more than his debt to "society" compared to what other people get for far more serious crimes (i served as a judicial clerk for a criminal judge, do criminal defense now = seen alot of foul stuff). this kind of thing every person is allowed to be the judge and jury as it comes to their own personal opinion on the matter, no one is wrong in how they feel.

that being said, NO. from a football standpoint we dont need him on the field nor would he sell seats in our sold out stadium.

go skins!!

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

I'm not sure Vick would agree to be anything other than a QB. Someone will check him out. Hopefully not us.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=Schneed10;518168]To be accurate, discrimination is the wrong term. Employers are not permitted to deny opportunity for employment based on race, religion, gender, age, or nationality. So says Amendment 16 of the US Constitution, thereby qualifying as discrimination.

There are no laws against denying employment opportunity against those with criminal records. This is perfectly legal, done all the time, and [B]something I wholeheartedly support[/B].[/quote]
so you don't think people can be rehabbed? or change? if you don't give people a second chance, they just continue going down the wrong path, creating headaches for normal, productive members of society

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=Schneed10;518168]To be accurate, discrimination is the wrong term. Employers are not permitted to deny opportunity for employment based on race, religion, gender, age, or nationality. So says Amendment 16 of the US Constitution, thereby qualifying as discrimination.

[B]There are no laws against denying employment opportunity against those with criminal records. This is perfectly legal, done all the time, and something I wholeheartedly support[/B].[/quote]

I support this as well, however I think there's a gray area. For example, if I'm running a bank, I wouldn't hire someone who had a conviction for anything related to theft or financial crimes. However if they were totally qualified but had an arrest for, say, driving with a suspended license or a DWI, I could probably look past it. If every single person with any kind of criminal record was denied employment, the unemployment rate in this country would be through the roof.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=dmek25;518174]so you don't think people can be rehabbed? or change? if you don't give people a second chance, they just continue going down the wrong path, creating headaches for normal, productive members of society[/quote]
In THIS case, I do not believe you can "rehab" mentally defective behavior. What brings a person to torture innocent animals? I think 44ever said it. He's a dark twisted soul. He may not repeat as he has no desire to go back to the slam and deal his cellmate "Ben Dover"............but THAT is not getting rehabbed. Abstenance.....possibly, but not rehabilitation. He'll probably be a good guy until he watches "Silence of the lambs" one to many times......

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=Schneed10;518168]To be accurate, discrimination is the wrong term. [B]Employers are not permitted to deny opportunity for employment based on[/B] race, religion, [B]gender[/B], age, or nationality. So says Amendment 16 of the US Constitution, thereby qualifying as discrimination.

There are no laws against denying employment opportunity against those with criminal records. This is perfectly legal, done all the time, and something I wholeheartedly support.[/quote]

I am not a con law atty but i believe this only applies to gov't, quasi gov't (water, utilities, schools, etc) and private corporations that receive a certain sum of gov't funding.

if i had a small business that did not provide a gov't type service to the public and rec'v no gov't funding i could hire whoever i wanted. look at hooters, if i apply for a job as a waiter i would be denied b/c i am a guy and they are allowed to do that as a totaly private company.

sorry about the rant . . . point is the constitution in this regard only applies and restricts the gov't and gov't type entities. in america you can be as racist as you want on your dime.

go skins!!

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=dmek25;518158]as a football player, yes. as a human being, no. that's up to ownership to decide. and ss33, your company discriminates against people with a record. i personally dont want thugs on the team i root for[/quote]
To echo what Schneed said. In my "day" job for an IT/telecom no way would I hire a convicted felon, too much potential risk and we can find much better candidates for positions. At my small restaurant, same thing, why take the risk? Do I want a convicted felon with access to my cash register or someone with a clean record?

Vick decided to murder animals for fun, no one forced him to. I have absolutely no sympathy for him.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=dmek25;518174]so you don't think people can be rehabbed? or change? if you don't give people a second chance, they just continue going down the wrong path, creating headaches for normal, productive members of society[/quote]
You're showing your liberal stripes again :)

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=Slingin Sammy 33;518155]Vick is a cold-hearted piece of human garbage. Even if we were guaranteed a Super Bowl....NO WAY!!!!

For you folks trying to equate eating meat with torturing / killing dogs and forcing them to bite/claw/chew each other to death over the course of 15 min to an hour and to not only watch but RUN THE WHOLE OPERATION...give me an f-ing break. I love a good steak, and I tend to believe most meat in the U.S. is produced fairly humanely with minimal fear/pain/suffering to the animals.
[/quote]

Dahmer was probably humanely killing his prey before he ate them.

...ok that's ridiculous but so is trying to rationalize the wholesale killing of animals for your personal gain. I'm a meataterian, I've come to grips with it and I try not to lie to myself when the subject of the treatment of animals comes up.

Humanely or not animals by the millions are put to death and consumed by people...that's pretty barbaric.

Enough with the animals subject. It's distracting the main point. He doesn't belong on the Redskins due to his high profile crimes and he has probably lost his elite atheltic talent.


No to Vick is final answer but we took the scenic route to get to it.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

It seems like there is an ass-load of bickering and negativity going on around here in multiple threads lately. Couple that with the shitty cold rain we're having in the DC area, and it's really making my Tuesday a downer.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

sorry scud. if it makes you feel any better, its sleeting/ snowing up here

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=over the mountain;518188]I am not a con law atty but i believe this only applies to gov't, quasi gov't (water, utilities, schools, etc) and private corporations that receive a certain sum of gov't funding.

if i had a small business that did not provide a gov't type service to the public and rec'v no gov't funding i could hire whoever i wanted. look at hooters, if i apply for a job as a waiter i would be denied b/c i am a guy and they are allowed to do that as a totaly private company.

sorry about the rant . . . point is the constitution in this regard only applies and restricts the gov't and gov't type entities. in america you can be as racist as you want on your dime.

go skins!![/quote]
I own a small business and Sneed10 is correct and it does apply to the private market.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=over the mountain;518188]I am not a con law atty but i believe this only applies to gov't, quasi gov't (water, utilities, schools, etc) and private corporations that receive a certain sum of gov't funding.

if i had a small business that did not provide a gov't type service to the public and rec'v no gov't funding i could hire whoever i wanted. look at hooters, if i apply for a job as a waiter i would be denied b/c i am a guy and they are allowed to do that as a totaly private company.

sorry about the rant . . . point is the constitution in this regard only applies and restricts the gov't and gov't type entities. in america you can be as racist as you want on your dime.

go skins!![/quote]

Incorrect, it applies to every single employer in the United States. If someone can prove you're guilty of this, you get in a rather large amount of trouble.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

I dont think Vicks past is even relevant in this questions. By the time he can return to the NFL in 2010, he'll be 30 years old. Vick was never that great of a passer - his strength was always scrambling and at his age, he will be much less effective doing that. If anyone takes a chance on vick when he returns to the NFL, they will be sorely disappointed.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=dmek25;518174]so you don't think people can be rehabbed? or change? if you don't give people a second chance, they just continue going down the wrong path, creating headaches for normal, productive members of society[/quote]

I think some people can be rehabbed, but that's not the point. I support giving employers the [B]option[/B] to decide who they want to give that second chance to. If they don't want to give that second chance, they shouldn't have to.

GMScud makes great points, there is gray area galore. I'm of the same mind that I can overlook a DWI offense for certain positions, while someone convicted of aggravated assault probably wouldn't stand a chance with me.

There are positions where you just don't want to take the chance. If I'm hiring someone to clean the bathrooms of my office building, I probably don't care if they've been convicted of drug charges in the past. If I'm a car dealership hiring a car salesmen, I absolutely want someone with a 100% clean record.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=GMScud;518193]It seems like there is an ass-load of bickering and negativity going on around here in multiple threads lately. Couple that with the shitty cold rain we're having in the DC area, and it's really making my Tuesday a downer.[/quote]
That's a REAL shame...........75, and Sunny

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=dmek25;518174]so you don't think people can be rehabbed? or change? if you don't give people a second chance, they just continue going down the wrong path, creating headaches for normal, productive members of society[/quote]
ALSO, I think PC and possibly some Federal laws may mandate that as a convicted felon (having served your due) you deserve the same consideration as the next candidate for a job. In reality, in all but a small percentage of circumstances.....the AIN'T happening

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=Hog1;518208]That's a REAL shame...........75, and Sunny[/quote]

I know all about it. My mom and stepdad are at their place on Siesta Key right now and have been bragging about the weather. Plus I lived in Gainesville for 8 years. I miss the Florida sunshine today.

Re: Would you accept Michael Vick on the Redskins?
 

[quote=GMScud;518215]I know all about it. My mom and stepdad are at their place on Siesta Key right now and have been bragging about the weather. Plus I lived in Gainesville for 8 years. I miss the Florida sunshine today.[/quote]
..........sorry........