Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=diehardskin2982;639494]change is gonna happen at the rb position next year for sure. if there is a cap i could see portis, ganther, young rookie combination. no cap portis is gone. i didn't see the game, did rock return kicks against the raiders?[/quote]
No that bum Randle el did. Moss and Thomas did too

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

I'd keep Ganther if I had to choose between the two. Honestly, I'd rather have both of them instead of Portis and Betts.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

I hope both will be Skins, and a part of me hopes that Portis & Betts can come back strong too. I know that may be highly unlikely, but w/Portis & Betts there's no telling at this point how their recovery & contract situations will play out.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;639474]Sure didn't take long for people to turn on Rock... again.[/quote]

I just don't understand it. The guy has ran the ball very well and simply doesn't get any respect. The coaches shit on him and he doesn't deserve it.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Buster;639523]It has to be Ganther, so much potential and he's young. I love Rock as a player, he's a true Redskin, but he's had many chances and Ganther has just outplayed him.

Portis/Ganther full timeshare next year. Portis will be able to stay healthier hopefully and they'll make an explosive tandem.[/quote]

what has rock done wrong?

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=SBXVII;639477]Don't look at me....I never stopped. Even after his nice game "with" Betts a few games ago I said don't get too high on him. He sucks by himself.

But if we are looking towards to future of this team and trying to get younger "everywhere" then all 3 RB's need to go. I said that last year as well although I also said Mason was our man. LOL.[/quote]

i'm all for getting younger in certain areas but you need solid vets on the team. you can't win with all young guys.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

A poll would be nice with this thread, but Ganther, no doubt.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

You have to keep rock but if possible both.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=skinsfan69;639561]I just don't understand it. The guy has ran the ball very well and simply doesn't get any respect. The coaches shit on him and he doesn't deserve it.[/quote]

Rock Cartwright is definitely a guy you want on your team, but let's also consider the fact that running backs get old really fast, so if you have a good quality, hard working, young running back who is productive, you keep him over the vet if you have to choose only one.

Right now, I think Portis is the odd man out.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Hail to the Redskins;639287]Just have to point out, and I'm sure someone else will remember this and back me up, in Ganther's first play as a Redskin he picked up a blitzer and STUCK him.. I remember thinking then, hey he blocks like Portis but he must not be able to run (trying to figure out why he was FA, but I think it was mostly because he is slow... lol... you see him get run down in no time on the one play today? lol)

Regardless, he is a tough S.O.B. and will block and run hard... which will make him susceptible to injury, hence the need for him to split carries... but he can block[/quote]

He was run down by a coner which most of the time are the fastest players on the field which I don't think is that big of a deal/ I say we keep him Betts and Rock and say good by to CP.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

I pick Ganther, but lets split the carries with Rock and him the last 3 games. We will have a better sample size.

What we know is Rock is solid and good special teamer. And as others have said, lets not forget Betts. I wonder if Portis knows, that a lot of fans are sick of his bs and ready to move on. I dont know if he would be ready to accept that. Not that I care what he thinks.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

Why can't we keep both? Why give up either?

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;639479]The guy has proven his worth over the course of his 8 seasons here. I'm not going to even bother addressing this silly crap about him "sucking".[/quote]

What has Rock done? He had one year under Spurrier that he was given the chance to be the #1 RB. Betts came in and did better. Then we brought in Portis. I know he's been a team guy, but exactly what has he done at the RB level that shows he is worthy to be the #1 RB or back up? Apparently he has not lived up to the hype to be a #1 other wise they would not have picked up other RB and put ahead of him on the roster. Portis never would have been brought in had Rock been worthy to be a #1 RB.

I thank him for his contributions as a KR and team leader, but at some point you have to make way for youth. Thomas has been filling in nicely as a KR and getting the same if not more yards as a KR.

If the sole purpose you want him on the team is because of his team leadership then turn him into a coach or an assistant for a coach and keep the leadership. Atleast that way he doesn't count against a CAP we hopefully won't have next year.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

I am sick of Rock complaining all the time. I understand his frustration, but no need to moan and groan to the media all the time.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=firstdown;639598]He was run down by a coner which most of the time are the fastest players on the field which I don't think is that big of a deal/ I say we keep him Betts and Rock and say good by to CP.[/quote]

True, plus someone mentioned he ran over a LB yesterday so you have to pick what you want. A bruising back who is not affraid to run over people or a fast RB like Alridge who will out run everyone to include CB's.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=hooskins;639692]I am sick of Rock complaining all the time. I understand his frustration, but no need to moan and groan to the media all the time.[/quote]

Maybe if he would actually produce as a RB the team wouldn't have to keep looking for someone else who can do the job better.

I for one was happy with the two back system when Betts and Rock were both in the game. Both runners had an excellent day. The following week when he had to step in for Betts he couldn't get more yards then the 2nd stringer who had the same amount of carries (Ganther) or the QB.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Redskin Warrior;639220]Ganther has played hard since joining the team but Rock has contributed as well. Who do you keep?[/quote]


Who else is in the mix? That will certainly be part of my choice here.
[INDENT]I would keep Ganther and Cartwright before I kept Mason next year.

I would keep a [B]healthy[/B] Ladell Betts but not one who is still rehabbing.

I would keep Portis only if he exhibited significantly modified practice behavior.

What other RBs will be in camp?[/INDENT]

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=sportscurmudgeon;639704]Who else is in the mix? That will certainly be part of my choice here. [INDENT]I would keep Ganther and Cartwright before I kept Mason next year.

I would keep a [B]healthy[/B] Ladell Betts but not one who is still rehabbing.

I would keep Portis only if he exhibited significantly modified practice behavior.

What other RBs will be in camp?
[/INDENT][/quote]

Actually I'm with you. Somewhat.

At this point we have:
Portis
Betts
Rock
Ganther
Mason
Alridge.

I would let Portis go. He's getting old, beat up, and doesn't want to practice or play preseason. Clearly a cancer or starting to be. If Betts can come back then keep him let Rock go, we have Thomas who can KR. If Betts is done or is significantly hampered then keep Ganther, Rock, Mason, and Alridge and let them all battle it out next preseason.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

Cut ties w/Portis and let Betts and Cartwright set their own market. They're both valuable on teams and will be more than serviceable backing up Ganther.

Mason has little value because he sucks in the return game and hasn't had a great opportunity to show consistency running the ball.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=diehard;639759]Cut ties w/Portis and let Betts and Cartwright set their own market. They're both valuable on teams and will be more than serviceable backing up Ganther.

Mason has little value because he sucks in the return game and hasn't had a great opportunity to show consistency running the ball.[/quote]

Alternate...Ganther, Betts,Cartwright, and yes even Mason, teams seem not to know what to do when we bring multiple looks like this

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

I think they may need Ganther and Rock.

If it were me, I would keep CP one more year and cut Betts. Betts has a 2 year injury and gets banged up too much anyway. So cut him loose.

I also think that one of those middle picks should be a runningback.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

Keep Both.

My cloudy crystal ball reveals cutting Betts loose, Portis retiring, and Ganther splitting carries with...your choice of Mike Bell, whomever the Falcons don't re-sign between Jerious Norwood/Jason Snelling, or LenDale White. Rock stays on as Special Teamer/3rd RB. Mike Bell loses out to Pierre Thomas and Reggie Bush, the Falcons won't keep both letting one of them test the market, and LenDale has Javon Ringer waiting to take his place.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

I met Q's family yesterday at the game -- they were awesome. Hope he stays with us.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

I'd cut Cartwright. He's not going to start here and maybe he even lost the KR job. Let him try somewhere else...hopefully it'll work this time for him.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

keep ganther, draft a running back and do running back by committee, should be okay

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

I like the way the Cowgirls utilize there 3 RB's plus it will add more years to Barber's career maybe we need to try that instead of trying to force Portis into a featured back role at the end of his career.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

Ganther, younger and I think quicker. He's like Rock, but has some moves as well. I love Rock, but I don't see the need for him anymore.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

Before the season I wouldn't have been upset if Rock wasn't on the team and I figure that I'll be the same after this one. That being said he's given it everything that he's got and it really comes down to who else we have around in the off-season. Not trying to knock on him at all though, he's always done what's been asked of him. If we want to do a split-carry system next year, keep him around. If we're looking for a feature back, once again we'll have to see who else we bring in. Cutting him due to production or salary wouldn't make a lot of sense to me though, unless he's only good enough to be the number 3 back, in which case we may as well get younger.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

I didn't want to start a new thread for this so I figured this was the most appropriate place for RB discussion..

From Mort's chat today:
Do NFL people think CJ Spiller is an every down NFL back or more of a Felix Jones-Reggie Bush fast but fragile type of player?
Chris Mortensen (12:01 PM)

What I'm hearing about Spiller is that NFL teams love him. He could even be a top 10 pick. He also has great character.

I wouldn't be opposed to Spiller, if we address OL in free agency and with our 2nd round pick.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Paintrain;640562]I didn't want to start a new thread for this so I figured this was the most appropriate place for RB discussion..

From Mort's chat today:
Do NFL people think CJ Spiller is an every down NFL back or more of a Felix Jones-Reggie Bush fast but fragile type of player?
Chris Mortensen (12:01 PM)

What I'm hearing about Spiller is that NFL teams love him. He could even be a top 10 pick. He also has great character.

I wouldn't be opposed to Spiller, if we address OL in free agency and with our 2nd round pick.[/quote]


I would rather have one of the quarterbacks than Spiller and I want no part of the quarterbacks.

The best offensive lineman available is the only choice that makes sense to me with our number one pick.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;640565]I would rather have one of the quarterbacks than Spiller and I want no part of the quarterbacks.

[B]The best offensive lineman available is the only choice that makes sense to me with our number one pick[/B].[/quote]

Sure, as long as there's a guy available worthy of that pick.

I don't follow college ball much so I don't know who the top lineman are just yet. Are there some lineman that will go high?

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;640565]I would rather have one of the quarterbacks than Spiller and I want no part of the quarterbacks.

The best offensive lineman available is the only choice that makes sense to me with our number one pick.[/quote]

So if we are drafting #8 and Russell Okung, the top rated lineman and only tackle with a 1st round grade, is off the board the next best offensive lineman available is the only choice that makes sense? I understand we need to draft linemen but drafting a position just for the sake of drafting that position is foolish.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Paintrain;640568]So if we are drafting #8 and Russell Okung, the top rated lineman and only tackle with a 1st round grade, is off the board the next best offensive lineman available is the only choice that makes sense? I understand we need to draft linemen but drafting a position just for the sake of drafting that position is foolish.[/quote]

at #8, I would think(hope) we try hard to trade down and pick up some extra picks.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Paintrain;640568]So if we are drafting #8 and Russell Okung, the top rated lineman and only tackle with a 1st round grade, is off the board the next best offensive lineman available is the only choice that makes sense? I understand we need to draft linemen but drafting a position just for the sake of drafting that position is foolish.[/quote]

It is early but Kiper has 3 tackles in the top 14. I would argue that drafting a QB or RB and putting them behind this line would be foolish.

The "best player available" tact has given us below average results for quite a while.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;640572]at #8, I would think(hope) we try hard to trade down and pick up some extra picks.[/quote]

I would hope so too but I am happy with them falling in love with Orakpo and jumping on him.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;640583]It is early but Kiper has 3 tackles in the top 14. I would argue that drafting a QB or RB and putting them behind this line would be foolish.

The "best player available" tact has given us below average results for quite a while.[/quote]

I only see Okung in his top 25, [url=http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft10/insider/news/story?id=4727227]2010 NFL draft -- Mel Kiper Jr.: The newest Big Board (Dec. 9, 2009) - ESPN[/url]

I never advocated leaving this line intact. There are going to be some very good players available in free agency because of the uncapped year. Let's see how that plays out before assessing our 2010 OL based on the 2009 roster.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Paintrain;640585]I only see Okung in his top 25, [URL="http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft10/insider/news/story?id=4727227"]2010 NFL draft -- Mel Kiper Jr.: The newest Big Board (Dec. 9, 2009) - ESPN[/URL]

I never advocated leaving this line intact. There are going to be some very good players available in free agency because of the uncapped year. Let's see how that plays out before assessing our 2010 OL based on the 2009 roster.[/quote]


My fault, I was looking at Scout's inc on ESPN's draft page.

Isn't the consensus that the uncapped year would prevent good players from hitting the market?

It would allow us to control JC and Rogers for example.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;640589]My fault, I was looking at Scout's inc on ESPN's draft page.

Isn't the consensus that the uncapped year would prevent good players from hitting the market?

It would allow us to control JC and Rogers for example.[/quote]

Only for 4th or 5th year players. The trigger for free agency will go to 6 years of service rather than 5. The biggest boom will be teams who are trying to escape large contracts with no cap ramifications. That's how we can potentially cut Portis, Randle-El, etc. with no damage financially.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Paintrain;640595]Only for 4th or 5th year players. The trigger for free agency will go to 6 years of service rather than 5. The biggest boom will be teams who are trying to escape large contracts with no cap ramifications. That's how we can potentially cut Portis, Randle-El, etc. with no damage financially.[/quote]


There are going to be cutting Portis arguments up and down over the next few months but I don't know if I would say no damage financially. Most of his '10 contract is guaranteed so we would be paying roughly 8 million to cut him and 10 to keep him.

Rosenhaus was a genius with his contract.

Re: At Seasons End Ganther or Rock Who Do You Keep?
 

[quote=Pocket$ $traight;640596]There are going to be cutting Portis arguments up and down over the next few months but I don't know if I would say no damage financially. Most of his '10 contract is guaranteed so we would be paying roughly 8 million to cut him and 10 to keep him.

Rosenhaus was a genius with his contract.[/quote]

I think that the FO was more foolish than Rosenhaus was genius; hence the constant restructuring. Not to take anything away from Rosenhaus.