Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

fix the o line..everyone who thinks Campbell should be replaced should have their posting rights curtailed

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=saden1;639836][b]Yeah but you can't solve a picture puzzle with pieces missing. Games really are won and lost in the trenches. JC has been making plays with his feet as well and he deserves credit but let's not forget the big guys upfront.[/b]

BTW I do think Zorn is the new Steve Spurrier and his ineffectiveness was at display the first 8 games of the season.[/quote]Thank you. It is a symbiotic relationship. The line may not be playing "overwhelmingly" well (it isn't, it's lacking serious depth, it's a patchwork that's fighting to stay viable), but it is playing an arseload better than before the bye ... this, in turn, is affecting how J-Cam is playing, you can tell he trusts them ... and then they in turn play better and so forth. Add to that the improved play-calling and we have what we have now.

The problems we face and faced were never primarly Campbell's fault. That the team is playing better now is not just the result of him playing better.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

I think Campbell's agent and the Redskins are secretly working on a long term deal. I think we're going to name someone General Manager this off-season and we won't be looking far to get him. I think the Redskins have Levi Jones penciled in as the starting LT for opening day 2010. I think Samuels, Betts, Randle El, Daniels, Randy Thomas, and Rock Cartwright are all gone. I think CJ Spiller will be our first pick. I think I'd rather they wait until the 2nd round and take Best or Dwyer. I think we don't take a OL before the 3rd round and we take 2 in the draft. I think I'm getting tired and need to stop rambling.
I think I need to stop reading Peter King's 10 Things I Think I Think

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=SmootSmack;639953]I think Campbell's agent and the Redskins are secretly working on a long term deal. I think we're going to name someone General Manager this off-season and we won't be looking far to get him. I think the Redskins have Levi Jones penciled in as the starting LT for opening day 2010. I think Samuels, Betts, Randle El, Daniels, Randy Thomas, and Rock Cartwright are all gone. I think CJ Spiller will be our first pick. I think I'd rather they wait until the 2nd round and take Best or Dwyer. I think we don't take a OL before the 3rd round and we take 2 in the draft. I think I'm getting tired and need to stop rambling.
I think I need to stop reading Peter King's 10 Things I Think I Think[/quote]

If they don't take an OL with their first 2 picks then I would consider this stupid and they haven't learned their lesson. They can find a good RB in the 4th or 3rd if a trade is made. I hope they are blowing smoke.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=SmootSmack;639953]I think Campbell's agent and the Redskins are secretly working on a long term deal. I think we're going to name someone General Manager this off-season and we won't be looking far to get him. I think the Redskins have Levi Jones penciled in as the starting LT for opening day 2010. I think Samuels, Betts, Randle El, Daniels, Randy Thomas, and Rock Cartwright are all gone. I think CJ Spiller will be our first pick. I think I'd rather they wait until the 2nd round and take Best or Dwyer. I think we don't take a OL before the 3rd round and we take 2 in the draft. I think I'm getting tired and need to stop rambling.
I think I need to stop reading Peter King's 10 Things I Think I Think[/quote]

This would be a pretty nice scenario to me.

Do you think Morocco Brown could in the running for GM?

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=SmootSmack;639953]I think Campbell's agent and the Redskins are secretly working on a long term deal. I think we're going to name someone General Manager this off-season and we won't be looking far to get him. I think the Redskins have Levi Jones penciled in as the starting LT for opening day 2010. I think Samuels, Betts, Randle El, Daniels, Randy Thomas, and Rock Cartwright are all gone. I think CJ Spiller will be our first pick. I think I'd rather they wait until the 2nd round and take Best or Dwyer. I think we don't take a OL before the 3rd round and we take 2 in the draft. I think I'm getting tired and need to stop rambling.
I think I need to stop reading Peter King's 10 Things I Think I Think[/quote]

I think you know something:)

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=SmootSmack;639953][B]I think Campbell's agent and the Redskins are secretly working on a long term deal. I think we're going to name someone General Manager this off-season and we won't be looking far to get him. I think the Redskins have Levi Jones penciled in as the starting LT for opening day 2010. I think Samuels, Betts, Randle El, Daniels, Randy Thomas, and Rock Cartwright are all gone. I think CJ Spiller will be our first pick.[/B] I think I'd rather they wait until the 2nd round and take Best or Dwyer. I think we don't take a OL before the 3rd round and we take 2 in the draft. I think I'm getting tired and need to stop rambling.
I think I need to stop reading Peter King's 10 Things I Think I Think[/quote]

From your fingers to God's eyes. I wouldn't be too disappointed in this scenario. I watched Spiller a few times this season and thought that he is EXACTLY what our offense needed but didn't think he'd really be viable with our other needs. If we're in the top 10 I think that's too high for him but if we can trade down into the mid teens that's about right.

We as a fan base need to avoid the 'draft an OL at any cost' mentality. We drafted an OL early last year, how's that worked for us? We need to get quality OL in here, whether by trade, draft or FA. Drafting well is a priority, quality over quantity.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=Paintrain;639975]From your fingers to God's eyes. I wouldn't be too disappointed in this scenario. I watched Spiller a few times this season and thought that he is EXACTLY what our offense needed but didn't think he'd really be viable with our other needs. If we're in the top 10 I think that's too high for him but if we can trade down into the mid teens that's about right.

[B]We as a fan base need to avoid the 'draft an OL at any cost' mentality. We drafted an OL early last year, how's that worked for us?[/B] We need to get quality OL in here, whether by trade, draft or FA. Drafting well is a priority, quality over quantity.[/quote]

Agree with the first part, you lost me on the second part.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=Mattyk72;639993]Agree with the first part, you lost me on the second part.[/quote]

2008 Chad Rinehart.. 3rd round is still early (expected to start/contribute) and he's arguably been a disappointment. He was drafted with an eye towards '09 to replace Thomas but didn't really develop as Vinny hoped. He showed signs of improvement but going into '10 he's not a sure fire starter.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=Paintrain;639995]2008 Chad Rinehart.. 3rd round is still early (expected to start/contribute) and he's arguably been a disappointment. He was drafted with an eye towards '09 to replace Thomas but didn't really develop as Vinny hoped. He showed signs of improvement but going into '10 he's not a sure fire starter.[/quote]

Pain, what do you think about Batiste? lol

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=12thMan;639998]Pain, what do you think about Batiste? lol[/quote]

Championship.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=Paintrain;640000]Championship.[/quote]


No...no...no....Bridges! Jeremy Bridges! That's who I meant.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=Paintrain;639995]2008 Chad Rinehart.. 3rd round is still early (expected to start/contribute) and he's arguably been a disappointment. He was drafted with an eye towards '09 to replace Thomas but didn't really develop as Vinny hoped. He showed signs of improvement but going into '10 he's not a sure fire starter.[/quote]

Eh. Rinehart is kind of a bad example for your argument. He was always a project and probably drafted too high. He wasn't exactly playing against NFL caliber D-lineman at Northern Iowa. The thing about wiffing on Rinehart that stings so much is that we passed up on the best class of OTs in recent history in the early rounds.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=GMScud;640006]Eh.The thing about wiffing on Rinehart that stings so much is that we passed up on the best class of OTs in recent history in the early rounds.[/quote]

And if we don't pick OL with our 1st 2 picks then we will repeat that story.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;640008]And if we don't pick OL with our 1st 2 picks then we will repeat that story.[/quote]

And yet we'll use our 1st round pick on a QB or a RB. If Cerrato is still around that is.

I'd LOVE to move our high 1st round pick down for multiple later picks. For all those that want to trade Cooley for the extra picks, I'd rather keep him and move that top 10 pick for multiple early round picks.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=GMScud;640013]And yet we'll use our 1st round pick on a QB or a RB. If Cerrato is still around that is.

I'd LOVE to move our high 1st round pick down for multiple later picks. For all those that want to trade Cooley for the extra picks, I'd rather keep him and move that top 10 pick for multiple early round picks.[/quote]

Couldn't agree more. If they draft a QB or RB with the 1st pick most fans will forfeit their tickets, we know damn well what killed this team in '09 and they better address the OL early and with at least 2 picks.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=GMScud;640013]And yet we'll use our 1st round pick on a QB or a RB. If Cerrato is still around that is.

I'd LOVE to move our high 1st round pick down for multiple later picks. For all those that want to trade Cooley for the extra picks, I'd rather keep him and move that top 10 pick for multiple early round picks.[/quote]

Probably more likely we'll use our 2nd round pick to try to trade down.

As for OL, there's really only one T in this draft legitimately considered a top 5 pick. And that's Russel Okung. And who knows if he's there when the Redskins pick. After that there's nobody that most scouts and execs see as a bonafide T. And by that I mean LT. Trent Williams is slipping in many draft boards because he's seen as a right tackle in the NFL. OL won't be neglected, it just won't necessarily be addressed in the first round. I don't think.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=12thMan;639964]I think you know something:)[/quote]

I know a lot of things...and nothing at the same time. The Redskins are very secretive

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=GMScud;640006]Eh. Rinehart is kind of a bad example for your argument. He was always a project and probably drafted too high. He wasn't exactly playing against NFL caliber D-lineman at Northern Iowa. The thing about wiffing on Rinehart that stings so much is that we passed up on the best class of OTs in recent history in the early rounds.[/quote]

Actually it makes my point perfectly. We'd been clamoring for drafting a OL and we did. He was someone that wasn't slotted to be picked where he was but 'we drafted an OL'. Like in the '09 draft where no OL were picked for like 3 rounds but people were still up in arms we didn't choose one in the 3rd round. If there's a quality guy, get him, but don't just pick an OL for the sake of picking an OL.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=12thMan;640002]No...no...no....Bridges! Jeremy Bridges! That's who I meant.[/quote]

Same answer. Championship.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=SmootSmack;640017]Probably more likely we'll use our 2nd round pick to try to trade down.

As for OL, there's really only one T in this draft legitimately considered a top 5 pick. And that's Russel Okung. And who knows if he's there when the Redskins pick. After that there's nobody that most scouts and execs see as a bonafide T. And by that I mean LT. Trent Williams is slipping in many draft boards because he's seen as a right tackle in the NFL. OL won't be neglected, it just won't necessarily be addressed in the first round. I don't think.[/quote]

I get that, but is Okung really going to be top 5? I'm not sure. The reason I said I'd love to trade down is the exact reason you stated- it's a weak OL class. I'd rather get multiple picks for our high 1st rounder and stockpile rather than rolling the dice early on an Okung.

I do NOT NOT NOT want a QB in the 1st round, but as long as we paid significant attention to OL later in the draft an in FA, I could really smile about a CJ Spiller.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=Paintrain;640021]Actually it makes my point perfectly. We'd been clamoring for drafting a OL and we did. He was someone that wasn't slotted to be picked where he was but 'we drafted an OL'. Like in the '09 draft where no OL were picked for like 3 rounds but people were still up in arms we didn't choose one in the 3rd round. If there's a quality guy, get him, but don't just pick an OL for the sake of picking an OL.[/quote]

I don't know. If Rinehart was the obligatory "draft an OL" pick, why take such a gamble?

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

JC should be back. He has played well throughout the season. Plus there are too many other holes that need to be filled. OL, RB, and DB all need to be filled before QB. I would devote this draft to those positions. If possible take CJ Spiller with 1 ( I live in SC and he is a beast). Like Portis but SPiller is explosive and could make Defenses thinking more. Then go OL in the middle rounds and CB in the late round. Or a QB in the mid late rounds like the kid from Central Mich or Ole Miss. There are some QBs next year that shoudl be good: The kids from Cincy, Washington, and Arkansas.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

Good article about Campbell; [url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/12/14/AR2009121403282.html]Jason Campbell plays well, even as Redskins have not - washingtonpost.com[/url]

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

Well the next few weeks will be interesting because right now we draft 6th, but when all is said and done we may be drafting as low as 15th. Which makes trading a lot easier. Right now I think the top 5 is:

1. Rams-Jimmy Clausen
2. Bucs-Russell Okung
3. Browns-Sam Bradford
4. Lions-Ndamukong Suh
5. Chiefs-Eric Berry

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

This team needs OT,G,RB,LB,QB,DB.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=GMScud;640024]I don't know. If Rinehart was the obligatory "draft an OL" pick, why take such a gamble?[/quote]

Just to be clear, I am not arguing the merits of drafting Rinehart, merely pointing out the notion of 'draft an OL' for the sake of drafting an OL is flawed. It's about quality players, not drafting a position.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=GridIron26;640026]Good article about Campbell; [url=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/12/14/AR2009121403282.html]Jason Campbell plays well, even as Redskins have not - washingtonpost.com[/url][/quote]

It is a good article but what it doesnt say is that JC is playing well now that its garbage time. Early in the season when the games still mattered for making the post-season he stunk up the place but now that nothing is on the line he's playing better.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

The wash post ran an article last week about Skins RBs, said they haven't drafted a rb on the first day since 2002 (Betts) I believe. I know that O line is a high priority, maybe the highest, but take a look at our RB corps. RB is a position they've neglected just like O line.

I would love to see CJ Spiller here. While I agree that rb is a position that can be filled in later rounds, if you think a guy is really special it's worth a 1st round pick. The difference w/drafting RBs is they can pay immediate dividends as a rookie. They have a shorter shelf life, but there is a lof of value in their early years, provided they're good.

IMO Spiller is worth taking w/a 1st round pick in the teens.He's an all down back & has big play potential. He can be used in the passing game to create problems for defenses like C. Johnson is used in TEnn.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=SmootSmack;639953]I think Campbell's agent and the Redskins are secretly working on a long term deal. I think we're going to name someone General Manager this off-season and we won't be looking far to get him. I think the Redskins have Levi Jones penciled in as the starting LT for opening day 2010. I think Samuels, Betts, Randle El, Daniels, Randy Thomas, and Rock Cartwright are all gone. I think CJ Spiller will be our first pick. I think I'd rather they wait until the 2nd round and take Best or Dwyer. I think we don't take a OL before the 3rd round and we take 2 in the draft. I think I'm getting tired and need to stop rambling.
I think I need to stop reading Peter King's 10 Things I Think I Think[/quote]

Smack you sound as if you have an inside track and it sounds good. I look for Levi Jones and Mike Williams to both play prominent roles in 2010. We could very easily have our RG & LT, Williams is a better player at G than he is at T. RT and depth is now key for the OL.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=Longtimefan;640079]Smack you sound as if you have an inside track and it sounds good. I look for Levi Jones and Mike Williams to both play prominent roles in 2010. We could very easily have our RG & LT, Williams is a better player at G than he is at T. RT and depth is now key for the OL.[/quote]

Really it's just mostly things I think (some of it based on other "knowledge" I guess).

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=irish;640074]It is a good article but what it doesnt say is that JC is playing well now that its garbage time. Early in the season when the games still mattered for making the post-season he stunk up the place but now that nothing is on the line he's playing better.[/quote]

I think there's more to it than that.

He's been getting better protection, the offense & playcalling has been tightened up under Sherm Lewis, he's clearly more comfortable now that he's nearing the end of year 2 in this system, guys like Thomas & Davis have stepped up, the running game has been more effective, etc.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=Mattyk72;640096]I think there's more to it than that.

He's been getting better protection, the offense & playcalling has been tightened up under Sherm Lewis, he's clearly more comfortable now that he's nearing the end of year 2 in this system, guys like Thomas & Davis have stepped up, the running game has been more effective, etc.[/quote]

I agree that the line has been a bit better (not much but some) and the playcalling is somewhat tighter but in the end he's more comfortable because the pressure is off. Heck, even when the pressure was sort of on vs NO late in the game he found a way to not get it done.

JC is a real conundrum because he puts up decent stats so when you look he appears to be a pretty good QB but when you watch the games you realize he does his best work when the game is, for all intents & purposes, over.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

The pressure is off? He's still playing for a job/contract.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=irish;640074]It is a good article but what it doesnt say is that JC is playing well now that its garbage time. Early in the season when the games still mattered for making the post-season he stunk up the place but now that nothing is on the line he's playing better.[/quote]

The Saints were in 'garbage time' seeking an unbeaten season? The Raiders went from beating a division leader in the Bengals and the SB Champs at their house to 'garbage time' overnight? The lengths some of you guys go to in order to not give credit when it's due is amazing.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=Paintrain;640115]The Saints were in 'garbage time' seeking an unbeaten season? The Raiders went from beating a division leader in the Bengals and the SB Champs at their house to 'garbage time' overnight? [B]The lengths some of you guys go to in order to not give credit when it's due is amazing.[/b][/quote]Amazing? I'd call it laughable.

If I were Campbell, there's no way in Gaea's name I'd stay in this goddamn circus if there were other teams interested in having me.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

By the way the line play has been significantly better as of late.

JC was sacked 28 times through the first 9 games, while he's been sacked 5 times in the last 4.

Some of that's on him and the offense getting the ball out quicker, but just by watching the games you can see the improvement has been there.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=Paintrain;640115]The Saints were in 'garbage time' seeking an unbeaten season? The Raiders went from beating a division leader in the Bengals and the SB Champs at their house to 'garbage time' overnight? The lengths some of you guys go to in order to not give credit when it's due is amazing.[/quote]

Thats what I said, when the pressure was on late in the game vs NO he found a way to not get it done.

Oak played/won those games with Gradkowski. When JaMarcus Russell came in vs the Skins the game was essentailly over. Everybody watching that game knew Oak wasnt a threat to do anything on O with JR at QB.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

Let's see what Campbell can do in the next 3 games so we can put this argument to rest. They will be playing a huge game against the Giants, who are fighting for a playoff spot and then Dallas the following week which is in the same situation and the SD in SD.

Re: Jurgensen thinks Campbell will be back
 

[quote=Mattyk72;640120]By the way the line play has been significantly better as of late.

JC was sacked 28 times through the first 9 games, while he's been sacked 5 times in the last 4.

Some of that's on him and the offense getting the ball out quicker, but just by watching the games you can see the improvement has been there.[/quote]

There's a conspicious difference in Jason's play since his protection has been just a little better. So yes, I would say his improvement goes hand in hand with the improvement along the OL.