This was discussed about a week ago and I was in favor of getting him. I have changed my mind. Although I don't think he is nearly the problem that most people think he is I do think he brings far too much baggage to the table. He is villified by every sportscaster and we really don't need the distraction.

[QUOTE=Daseal]You really think with Fitz, Boldin, and 1-2 other 1st round WRs down in Arizona that they'll go after Moss? Hell, Marcel Shipp is a great back down there in Arizona. I'd be suprised if they gave up what's necessary for Moss.

I'd also be suprised not to see either Bennett, Smith, or both dealt for some defense.[/QUOTE]
You're crazy if you think Green wouldn't trade Bouldin and a DL for Moss. Bouldin wasn't drafted by Green I don't think. Now Fitz aint going no where but I think they'd trade for Moss in about half a second.

Also...have you seen Shipp??? First off he is somewhat injury prone and second off he definitly is not the answer. Shipp is not a feature back in this league while Bennett when healthy is a capable feature back.

FRPLG, what I'm saying is Arizona has other pressing needs than a WR. They have three very good WR's, in my opinion. Shipp was hurt this year, but I feel he is a capable back and could carry the load for Arizona by himself. Arizona needs line help, along with a little help on defense and they'll be a good team. It would suprise me if they're willing to pay/trade what they'd have to to get Moss.

I vote no on Moss, but not becasue I think he is to big of a distraction to win with. I vote no becasue the Redskins have proven that big free agent splashes do not work for them. It's time to do it another way.

As for Moss, if he is such a cancer then why did the Vikings downfall start when he was out with an injury.

There's no denying the impact he would have on the field, there's also no denying the impact he would have off it as well.

Whether it's the media's fault or not, Moss is a distraction. The fact that the Vikings are considering dealing away the most dangerous WR in the game is telling, and it's definitely not all financial reasons. They're tired of his antics and they're tired of the distractions.

From him walking off the field to mooning the crowd to making wise ass comments about his fine, he's always drawing attention away from the team. As much as the rest of the team tries to say the right things and cover up for him, you can't tell me behind the scenes his teammates aren't tired of him.

We'll have to disagree on Shipp. Green will jump at a chance to bring in Moss. We're not talking about a slight upgrade here. Moss is far better than Bouldin and Fitz...that is saying a lot but it is true. Green will think he can control Moss and Moss gives Arz an immediate offense and could make McCown look like a real QB. If they have the bullets he is a Cardinal next year.

Seems like the Cards are pretty set at WR and could use an upgrade at RB more than WR.

I've also heard the rumor that Green may try to obtain Bennett from the Vikes.

I think if you ignore the antics and the potential issues he brings then a trade of Bouldin and a DL and maybe even like a 3rd rounder is could very well happen. They'll think it is worht it for the upgrade in skill he brings, the production he brings for other players and the respect he'll bring to the offense. I am not saying I think it would be a good trade but I think they would do it. They key is whether they can rationalize bringing him in by ignoring the issues he brings. The only guy in the league who could honestly ignore the issues is Green. He could rationalize away the issues all day. I'd say this is 60/40 for happening if I were betting.

No way I'd do it though.

I like Moss for talent & what his potential is, but I don't like Moss for his lack of maturity & his TO wanna-be b/s :cussing:

However, if Moss was available to trade for & the Skins would not have to give up Portis or Arrington I would consider trading for him.

I personally would not give up Arrington or portis for Moss because both players are superstars with great couchability & that's worth a hell of a lot more then Moss the retarded superstar freak WR that has the ability to make some of the greatest catches in football history, but his attitude is so bad that he'll be remember as a "what could have been" instead of the 2nd coming of Jerry Rice.

Final thought: I'd Pass on Mr. Moss

Contrary to many peoples thoughts, the biggest problem in the Skins, or any team for that matter, trading for Moss would not be his issues, but the huge amount it would cost, between players and/or draft picks, and money. Add his baggage that comes along with all that, and.....Thanks, but no thanks!!! Snyder circa 2000 would be all over it, but he has learned, plus as someone else said, Gibbs runs the show now. They would probably consider it, but once they factored everything in, I think they would decline.
For those that give the Riggins/Manley arguement: Riggins was a RB that got the ball 20+ times a game and basically the key to the offense, as opposed to a WR that will get it around 10 times a game, or less. And Manley's issues didn't come out until he was already with the team. I believe that Gibbs could handle Moss, but in my opinion, he will not think it's worth it. Better to just get Coles healthy and get a good, solid compliment for him to replace Gardner.
The media still tends to think of Snyder and the Redskins the way they were before when it comes to "big names" being available.....remember how everyone thought we would end up with Kearse this year, even if it meant overpaying? Well, his price went up too high, and we didn't.

Randy Moss should not and will not be a Redskin.

I assumed this argument saying if you want Moss on your team took all of the financial and trade variables out of the equation. I feel we'd have to give up too much to acquire him, and we couldn't stand it on the cap. However, if Snyder could work a trade for draft picks, and felt he could manage the cap with Moss, I'd take him in a second.

Bleedburgandy:

Sorry to keep you waiting for a response; I've been away from a reliable Internet connnection for almost 5 days.


Somebody earlier said that Danny Boy Snyder goes out and gets whatever players HIS CAOACHING STAFF wants. Sounds good but not exactly in line with the facts. Ask Norv how much he wanted to get Jeff George just for starters. And there are plenty of other examples. :Flush:


Somebody said earlier that there is no worry now because Gibbs is calling all the shots. Sounds good, but not exactly in line with the facts. When there is a difference of opinion that cannot beworked out between Gibbs and Cerrato, they take it to Danny Boy for resolution. That's what Gibbs and Cerrato tell us. They say it doesn't happen often, but that's the deal. TRANSLATION: Anytime Gibbs and Cerrato don't agree on something, Danny makes the call. So who has the final say? And if he has the final say there, who is gonna tell him who to sign/trade for and who not to sign/trade for? :frusty:

Riggins was kinda goofy off the field but once the game started he was all business. That isn't exactly Randy Moss.

Manley was a problem child because of substance abuse and illiteracy. Moss is a problem because he is an immature spoiled brat. Those are not the same problems.



Should the Skins get Moss? No.

Is he better than any WR the Skins have had since Charley Taylor? Absolutely.

Is he another Meathead? Absolutely.

Is he someone you can rely on to make a big play in a big game? No.

If Moss were to come here, think about this:

When Ramsey doesn't throw the ball his way enough or misses him when he is open for a TD, will he go and chew out Ramsey on the sidelines? Yes he will. And how is that going to help a young QB to develop... Or would Moss only get upset with a young and mistake prone QB like Kyle Boller because he knows that Ramsey is a sure-fire first ballot HoF inductee??? :)

The problem with the poll question is that different people will have different ideas on what the "right price" of financial and trade variables would be. If you take out the financial aspects of what is would cost to acquire him, with the strong-minded coaching staff we have, of course it would be very nice to have him on the Redskins. Gibbs and company could handle him, and with Ramsey's strong arm, the Ramsey to Moss combo would be be pretty sweet. Remember that Gibbs also dealt with Tony Stewart, who even to someone like me that is not into Nascar at all, is known to be a huge pain in the ass.
But to me, you cannot ignore that side of it, so I don't think the right price could be attained to make the deal.

SC - I said he made rookie mistakes when he first came in, including the George, Deion, Smith signings. Since then how many FAs has Snyder gotten against a coaches will?

Daseal:

Well, last year when your boy Spurrier wanted to keep Danny Woeful, Snyder cut him and kept some jamoke that Cerrato liked better. That was a while after Snyder's "rookie period".

I don't redcall Steve Spurrier or any of the coaches on the Redskins last year frothing at the mouth to add Darrell Russell to the mix. But Danny Boy signed him in mid-season with the idea he would quickly get into football shape after he did an extensive background investigation on Russell to determine his character. How'd that work out?

I don't remember hearing Spurrier say he didn't want those guys. Daniel Snyder has a process where he's the tie breaker. It came into effect. For the most part, he doesn't go after big name FAs that the coaches don't want. I feel fortunate to have an owner that tries, unlike York who said he's worried about the bottom line.

Are u all crazy, moss would be awsome pick up no one else in the NFL creates so many match up problems for defenses. I would not give up Lavar, Coles or portis. I would give a couple years of draft picks smoot and gardner. with coles, portis and moss all healthy someone tell me how could you stop that offense.

And everyone says Lavar is over rated... no he's been in what 5 different defenses since being drafted, and has the ability to take over a game. plus he was hurt this season a guy gets injured in this town and u want to ship him out. like trotter who is by the way killing for the eagles.
I think u guys been listening to the media way to much... They have to create heroes ie patriots, Manning, and also bad guys (Moss, TO, redskins). He doesn't have a bad ego moss is just a dumb country boy from west virginia who deosen't know how to talk to the media, and that makes him a great target for the media. So if the media hates him, let him come here, they already don't like to give us credit, and I would like to be the bad guys nobody can stop. a true NFC bully.

diehardskins: How many times is LaVar found totally out of position. That's why we think LaVar is overrated. He's a spectacular player, but I question if he has the mental toughness to play the game sometimes.

I agree with the media demonizing Moss. He's not nearly as bad as Joe Buck wants you to think.

[QUOTE=Daseal]diehardskins: How many times is LaVar found totally out of position. That's why we think LaVar is overrated. He's a spectacular player, but I question if he has the mental toughness to play the game sometimes.



do you know how many times he's been out of position? the guy has never played in the same defensive system for more than 1 year since entering the nfl. i'll take him being out of position a few times just to have him on the field. next year with lavar, washington and ,hopefully pierce starting you'll be kicking yourself for even saying that lavar is overrated.he's the best linebacker the skins have, yes , he is better than washington. and i'm not knocking washington at all.

Moss will never be a redskin so long as Gibb's is in charge which he is, Moss gives up on play's and is afraid to be hit, Pinkston was hammered for pulling up on that ball against us, any idea how many ball's Moss has done that very same thing? He grow's alligator arm's in a hurray when the going is tough, and that's when you need him when the going's tough and he won't be there, all he want's to do is go deep where he's not taking the big hit and trying to out jump the defender, and that's why he usually disapears in the big game, once a team takes away the big play from him he becomes very ordinary, if Moss feel's the game is out of reach he mail's it in, they may put up with that in minnesota but every guy on this board would kill him if they saw him giving up during a game, that's the kind of thing that would keep him from being a redskin, GIBB'S DOESN'T TOLERATE QUITER'S!

I look at it this way .. Thrash is a quintesential Gibbs guy big heart, lot of effort contributes every way he can on special teams etc, will play hurt (seperated/dislocated shoulder in his first redskins tenure) but not a whole lot of god given talent or attributes .

Moss is the anti-Trash. Not to say he wouldn't be a good pick...actually I am saying that. Maybe he is demonised as not a team player but he doesn't get that reputation from no-where. Time and time again you see a couple of good games from him then disappears totally when it matters and the spirit on the Vikes team doesn't lead you to belive he is an invaluble team leader which is what you would want from a player of that stature.

Why would Moss want to come here. He would have to renegociate his contract with where ever he ended up and that gives him some leverage. Rember Owens last year? He is going to a team where he feels he can win Baltimore is a possibility and even Arizona are more likley than here.

The thing that anoys me is the fact that whenever there is a big name FA we instantly get associated with them. The FO has done a great job in recent years of getting the players it wants without chasing headlines like we did and will forever be damned for in 2000. Also Snyder is always going to be seen as an interfearing owner for what he did 4 years ago. No matter how much he does to support his coaches and stay away from the team he will be villified .

SC points out some issues where Snyder had his hands in the team such as Danny W ... well i think anyone would have agreed with that Danny W should never have been anywhere need a NFL QB job ...only in Washington was he considered . Rob Johnston wasn't much better but did have starting experience in an NFL system . Darrell Russell yes we gave up the world for him to try and breath some life into a terrible defence with his just above leuge minimum deal. it was a gamble we took a shot on and came up empty.

Wolfeskins: He certainly has more talent than any linebacker we have, but I feel we need him to step up to the contract we gave him. I'd like to see him stop freelancing all the time, stop complaining about getting a say in personel decesions, stop complaining about being moved to the 3 point stance, stop complaining about missing money on a contract he SIGNED, and play.

[QUOTE=Daseal]Wolfeskins: He certainly has more talent than any linebacker we have, but I feel we need him to step up to the contract we gave him. I'd like to see him stop freelancing all the time, stop complaining about getting a say in personel decesions, stop complaining about being moved to the 3 point stance, stop complaining about missing money on a contract he SIGNED, and play.[/QUOTE]


Daseal, all those complaints you mentioned are from years past. He never once complained this year about getting in a 3 point stance (maybe because he didn't play).


My point is, is that Lavar this season really didn't do any complaining. The only thing he complained about was the whole contract issue. Besides that, he was more humble this year.....in my opinion. Don't you think so?

I could have worded the poll a little better, what I meant was financial concerns aside, would you want Moss?

If the price was right... how could you say no?? I think we have enough leaders on our team to keep his ass in check. Look at the Vikings, the only real leader on that team in Culpepper and he really dosent even do a good job. I think we got some guys in Arrington, Jansen, (hopefully Smoot), who could hold him down if he got out of control. However, I dont think the price will be right. But if it was, our team talent wise is so much better.

We don't need Moss! The guy has a terrible attitude and would not help the team. He also would be fairly expensive, and we could probably get a receiver in the first round for less. However, I am in favor of trading Lavar to another team for perhaps a few high picks in the draft and either a reliable receiver or interior offensive lineman. The defense is good enough without Lavar, and he would free up a lot of money so we could re-sign players like Smoot and Pierce.

Our needs for the upcoming season are:

1. Re-sign key players from last season (guys like Pierce, Smoot, L. Marshall, etc.).

2. Get a legitimate #2 or #3 receiver (someone who can push Gardner, Thrash, and Jacobs for a roster spot). This might end up being our first pick of the draft.

3. Find a good center or left guard to solidify the offensive line and provide competition for a starting spot (possible trade acquisition or mid-round draft pick).

4. Get a good pash rushing d-lineman (preferably a DE) in the draft. This could possibly wait until the middle rounds or come through a trade.

[QUOTE=Redskins_P]Daseal, all those complaints you mentioned are from years past. He never once complained this year about getting in a 3 point stance (maybe because he didn't play).


My point is, is that Lavar this season really didn't do any complaining. The only thing he complained about was the whole contract issue. Besides that, he was more humble this year.....in my opinion. Don't you think so?[/QUOTE]

From what I understand, the contract issue is dead now. Lavar stated (if I recall correctly) that he wasn't going to press the issue after being unable to play effectively this year.

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]I could have worded the poll a little better, what I meant was financial concerns aside, would you want Moss?[/QUOTE]


LOL.....Matty I think it's a little too late for that.

like I said before Moss, coles, Jacobs, thrash who could stop that? Portis out of the backfeild and maybe the signing of lamont Jordan as a change of pace. If the line does their job we could go undefeated no one could stop that much talent. we have a defense already, we just need the offense to match and moss would instantly make that happen. I keep on seeing "he's not a Gibbs guy" who the f*$k cares, this is not 1986. Look at are team we got now a team of florida thugs, everyone has a past, so get real. would u rather see him cause us problems as player on dallas. Moss is an instant deep threat. plain simple, and the only reason the vikes made it as far as they did in the playoffs is because of him he can't perform in the big game huh, if i remember correctly Greenbay was supposed to be the only challenge to philly according to the media, the vikes where supposed to lose. what happened, moss dicked them plain simple. I guess if we had the chance u guys wouldn't take payton manning either, he can't perform in thebig game as u saw with the patriots. yeah right... Then lets see what else have i read "moss is like pinkston fears the hit" are u crazy have you ever watched a minnesota game. nobody can really tackle the guy first of all he's two fast and has the best hand in the NFL.

how bout this lets analyze what he did agianst the skins well if they didn't take that play where he dicked taylor for the td we would have a higher draft pick and a loss as our last game. Attitude wise he doesn't have to be a leader, we have portis, lavar, coles, jansen, etc. he can finally do what he was put on this earth to do dick the opposing team. And as far as the the playoffs imagine everone would focus their attention on moss that means everone else ( Coles, portis, 3rd reciever, and cooley would excel) and lets not forget how it would effect ramsey we'll finally see how deep he can actually throw. dog be realistic with moss on the team we'll be superbowl favorites.

Redskins P: He wasn't playing and the defense was absolutely thriving without him. What did he have to bitch about. GIve me that 6 million dollars OR ELSE?

[QUOTE=Daseal]Redskins P: He wasn't playing and the defense was absolutely thriving without him. What did he have to bitch about. GIve me that 6 million dollars OR ELSE?[/QUOTE]


Just imagine how much better our defense would've been w/ him. Do you remember the preseason game against Atlanta? Lavar was all over the field making plays. I feel like he adds so much to our defense. With his pass rushing ability, and coverage skills...maybe our defense would've been able to create more turnovers.

I think he's over the 6 million dollars......at least he says he is.

Redskins Uni!
 

[QUOTE=Redskins_P]Just imagine how much better our defense would've been w/ him. ..... With his pass rushing ability, and coverage skills...maybe our defense would've been able to create more turnovers.
.[/QUOTE]

I can imagine it easier than I can a Moss in a Redskins Uni! I voted no to a trade! I think Moss is a great reciever! But, I think LaVarr is great as well! No matter what the deal, vi-queens would take us to the cleaners!

I'd Prefer to trade Brunnell & Gardner! But, hey, vi-queens probably wouldn't have that!

u kno y moss hates da cowboyz rite cause during da nfl draft during his tyme he wanted to be wit da cowboyz but since he had a prison record cowboys didnt want him so he hates em now

i would'nt give you jack shit for randy moss.i certainly would'nt give arrington for him.

[quote]u kno y moss hates da cowboyz rite cause during da nfl draft during his tyme he wanted to be wit da cowboyz but since he had a prison record cowboys didnt want him so he hates em now[/quote]

Dear Jordan, please stop skipping English class. It's painful to read that.

HAHAHA... eye dont kno whot ure talking abowt daseal

no to moss the moon
 

nope, we should not get after moss

let's immitate the patriots, steelers,
they build their team on high character guys
who are willing to work and sacrifice

to bad randy the moon
doesn't have this characteristics

there are many wide receivers who are not talented as moss
but is successful
like the troy browns, hines ward, larry fitzgerald

high character guys baby

Moss works hard and has all the god given talent in the world. TO works harder than everyone on the team. When Rod Gardner was dropping passes he stayed after practice to catch more balls and get back into the groove. That's a high character guy. Why are we dumping him?

Jordan:

The Cowboys would not take Randy Moss because he had a prison record and this was in the mid-late 1990s? Hell, a prison record - or at minimimum an arrest leading to a trial - was almost a prerequisite to be on the Cowboys back then. Your assertion sounds like wishful thinking at best.

[QUOTE=Daseal]Moss works hard and has all the god given talent in the world. TO works harder than everyone on the team. When Rod Gardner was dropping passes he stayed after practice to catch more balls and get back into the groove. That's a high character guy. Why are we dumping him?[/QUOTE]


What groove are you talking about daseal? Whatever he's doing after practice ain't working, we don't need a player who you can't trust to make a routine catch let alone a tough one there is a reason his nickname is 50/50.

Offiss: Gardner didn't drop many passes later in the season at all. He honestly maybe dropped 5 - 8 more than Coles this year. Nicknames are sometimes a bit unfair, he normally makes the hard catches but is known to drop the easy catches. Rod Gardner isn't exactly the worst we could do. What I was showing was that Rod Gardner shows all the signs of a "Gibbs Guy" that apparently we're so after, yet everyone here want's him gone.