Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=firstdown;940086]I wonder if they used the weapons that Obama gave them to kill our own?[/quote]

:doh:

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[IMG]http://i.qkme.me/3qxbgv.jpg[/IMG]

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=saden1;939873]This is gut wrenching and truly upsetting. Once live fire is heard there's no such thing as a civilian...you fire at will and in all directions.[/quote]

I agree with you fully on this.



[quote=Alvin Walton;939888]Yea right....thats what got Blackwater in such deep sh1t.[/quote]

First off, the Blackwater thing is totally different. Not even in the same ball park. Secondly, the US Embassy is American soil, and any attempt to breach that land is a act of aggression and it should be dealt with severely.

[quote=That Guy;939939]yeah, cause one idiot fires a gun, you have full authority to murder 2000 peaceful protestors (though these guys weren't exactly entirely peaceful).[/quote]

Like I said above, the US embassy is American soil. It's no different if they landed on our beaches and started attacking random places. They needed to be put down swiftly and harshly. The peaceful protestors wouldn't be trying to breach the compound, they would be outside still protesting. For anybody trying to climb the walls, or enter the compound, it should be a shoot to kill type scenario. These are simple rules of engagement.


They have a movie about this VERY type of scenario that happened(breached embassy by armed crowd). It rightfully is called Rules of Engagement. Watch it.

[YT]usKVcBTxkfk[/YT]

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=firstdown;940086]I wonder if they used the weapons that Obama gave them to kill our own?[/quote]

um, unless i'm mistaken we didn't give them weapons. we gave them training/uniforms/food/medical aid, but not guns. the dudes in the pics i saw had ak's, so unless you have a link or something, i think you're sensationalizing and making a pointless/stupid dig at obama.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=NC_Skins;940510]
They have a movie about this VERY type of scenario that happened(breached embassy by armed crowd). It rightfully is called Rules of Engagement.

[/quote]

trust me, i understand RoE ;) I was just saying, we shouldn't be throwing around invasions of foreign countries like that should be our first response to every american death (unless those suggesting it are about to go enlist or are cool with being drafted and sent to the desert for the next 10-20 years). We had some very extreme reactionary suggestions in the thread that just weren't/aren't based in reality.

if you read my other post, based on embassy defense in africa, the best course is to snipe the leaders/heavy weapons and it tends to chill the crowd the %$^ out pretty quick. I heard reports they might not have even had live ammo though, and certainly not enough people to protect against the size of crowd that showed up.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=That Guy;940553]trust me, i understand RoE ;) I was just saying, we shouldn't be throwing around invasions of foreign countries like that should be our first response to every american death (unless those suggesting it are about to go enlist or are cool with being drafted and sent to the desert for the next 10-20 years). We had some very extreme reactionary suggestions in the thread that just weren't/aren't based in reality.

if you read my other post, based on embassy defense in africa, the best course is to snipe the leaders/heavy weapons and it tends to chill the crowd the %$^ out pretty quick. I heard reports they might not have even had live ammo though, and certainly not enough people to protect against the size of crowd that showed up.[/quote]


Correct. You don't invade a country because a band of insurgents raided your embassy. Had the Libyan government raided the compound, that would be a different story. I'm all for mounting heavy machine guns on the corners of the embassy buildings.


...or set up some motion detector machine guns in the courtyard like these.

[YT]CGE_h4jBBXc[/YT]



Also, this:


[IMG]http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/644163_4294615770832_230047037_n.jpg[/IMG]

Re: All things Middle East related
 

pffftttt....we're not going to invade Libya over this, not even close.....

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[url=http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/18/jon-stewart-conservative-hypocrisy-middle-eastern-democracy-video_n_1892946.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000003]Jon Stewart Takes On Conservative Hypocrisy Over Middle Eastern Democracy (VIDEO)[/url]


Do these idiots really even listen to themselves? Foreign policies under Bush is good. The same foreign policies under Obama is bad. Morons.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[url=http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/09/18/protester-dies-after-inhaling-fumes-from-burning-american-flag/?intcmp=trending]Protester dies after inhaling fumes from burning American flag | Fox News[/url]

I generally don't like to laugh at people's deaths or misfortune's, but Ill make an exception in this guy's case. Darwin award candidate?

[QUOTE=firstdown;940086]I wonder if they used the weapons that Obama gave them to kill our own?[/QUOTE]

Haha what? Source please. This is the biggest pile of bullshit ever.

Weapons came into Libya from neighboring nations.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=NC_Skins;942071][url=http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/18/jon-stewart-conservative-hypocrisy-middle-eastern-democracy-video_n_1892946.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000003]Jon Stewart Takes On Conservative Hypocrisy Over Middle Eastern Democracy (VIDEO)[/url]


Do these idiots really even listen to themselves? Foreign policies under Bush is good. The same foreign policies under Obama is bad. Morons.[/quote]

great video. Its very true, GOP play horrible politics when it comes to foreign policy, its a disgrace.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

I enjoyed Sam Harris' take on the recent Shenanigans from the ME:

[URL="http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/on-the-freedom-to-offend-an-imaginary-god"]Freedom to offend[/URL]

[I]At moments like this, we inevitably hear—from people who don’t know what it’s like to believe in paradise—that religion is just a way of channeling popular unrest. The true source of the problem can be found in the history of western aggression in the region. It is our policies, rather than our freedoms, that they hate. I believe that the future of liberalism—and much else—depends on our overcoming this ruinous self-deception. Religion only works as a pretext for political violence because many millions of people actually believe what they say they believe: that imaginary crimes like blasphemy and apostasy are killing offenses. [/I]

Re: All things Middle East related
 

So I'm hearing Obama and company had 3 day warning about the uprising in the Middle East and did nothing. Where has this been in the news?

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=firstdown;942985]So I'm hearing Obama and company had 3 day warning about the uprising in the Middle East and did nothing. Where has this been in the news?[/quote]

Thats old news. It was all over Drudge when it came out.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;942991]Thats old news. It was all over Drudge when it came out.[/quote]

I have not seen it on the national news but I could have missed the coverage.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=firstdown;942985]So I'm hearing Obama and company had 3 day warning about the uprising in the Middle East and did nothing. Where has this been in the news?[/quote]

Show some respect, firstdown, the man is running for re-election. He doesn't have time for trivial shit like this.

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[IMG]http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/26657_4519250696730_182427066_n.jpg[/IMG]

Re: All things Middle East related
 

Interesting.

[URL="http://news.yahoo.com/libyans-storm-militia-backlash-attack-us-225317193.html"]Libyans storm militia in backlash of attack on US. - By MAGGIE MICHAEL | Associated Press, yahoo news.[/URL]

Re: All things Middle East related
 

Really bad news from the middle east today -

[I]This morning the Muslim Brotherhood sent a warning that if the United States continued meddling in Egypt , Libya , and other potential hot Spots in the Middle East, they intend to cut off America 's supply of 7-11 and Motel 6 managers.

If this action does not yield sufficient results, cab drivers will be next, followed by Dell, AT&T and AOL customer service reps.

Finally, if all else fails, they have threatened not to send us any more Presidents.[/I]

Re: All things Middle East related
 

um, how are they going to get the indians to play along with that? sounds like more empty threats ;)

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[url=http://news.yahoo.com/netanyahu-says-world-must-draw-red-line-iran-183329844.html?bcmt=1348779646990-88353008-53e4-4315-acbc-d4662bb5e8dc&bcmt_s=u#ugccmt-container-b]Netanyahu says world must draw "red line" for Iran - Yahoo! News[/url]

**** this guy. Really.


Also, what's with this drawing? It's as if he had some 5 year old kid make this.


[IMG]http://l2.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/tYp59z7xpmDbWdfjZqYdWg--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Y2g9MTk1Mztjcj0xO2N3PTI3MzI7ZHg9MDtkeT0wO2ZpPXVsY3JvcDtoPTQ1MTtxPTg1O3c9NjMw/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/0c9f93574610621b1c0f6a70670090b0.jpg[/IMG]

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=NC_Skins;946326][URL="http://news.yahoo.com/netanyahu-says-world-must-draw-red-line-iran-183329844.html?bcmt=1348779646990-88353008-53e4-4315-acbc-d4662bb5e8dc&bcmt_s=u#ugccmt-container-b"]Netanyahu says world must draw "red line" for Iran - Yahoo! News[/URL]

**** this guy. Really.[/quote]

Name three heads-of-state in the ME that you'd sooner trust?

[quote=NC_Skins;946326]Also, what's with this drawing? It's as if he had some 5 year old kid make this.[/quote]

Take a look at the UN Council Chamber, see how well a detailed picture would work for the Third-World countries sat at the back.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[url=http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/iranian-news-agency-duped-onion-story-obama-poll-180154413.html]Iranian news agency duped by Onion story on Obama poll | The Sideshow - Yahoo! News[/url]

lol iran

[QUOTE=Chico23231;946390][url=http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/iranian-news-agency-duped-onion-story-obama-poll-180154413.html]Iranian news agency duped by Onion story on Obama poll | The Sideshow - Yahoo! News[/url]

lol iran[/QUOTE]

That's awesome. They aren't use to that sort of freedom of speech, and asssumed it was fact.

[QUOTE=NC_Skins;946326][url=http://news.yahoo.com/netanyahu-says-world-must-draw-red-line-iran-183329844.html?bcmt=1348779646990-88353008-53e4-4315-acbc-d4662bb5e8dc&bcmt_s=u#ugccmt-container-b]Netanyahu says world must draw "red line" for Iran - Yahoo! News[/url]

**** this guy. Really.


Also, what's with this drawing? It's as if he had some 5 year old kid make this.


[IMG]http://l2.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/tYp59z7xpmDbWdfjZqYdWg--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Y2g9MTk1Mztjcj0xO2N3PTI3MzI7ZHg9MDtkeT0wO2ZpPXVsY3JvcDtoPTQ1MTtxPTg1O3c9NjMw/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/0c9f93574610621b1c0f6a70670090b0.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]

He's the worst. really.

On a related note, The Daily Show had a great bit about this.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

What makes him the worst?
Hes representing a country that will potentially be nuked in the next 8 to 10 months.
I'd be trying to get anyones attention any way I could.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[url=http://www.bostonherald.com/news/international/asia_pacific/view.bg?articleid=1061172582&srvc=rss]Pakistan parents killed daughter for eyeing boy - BostonHerald.com[/url]

sick people

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[url=http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/08/first-on-cnn-iranian-jets-fire-on-u-s-drone/?hpt=hp_t3]FIRST ON CNN: Iranian jets fire on U.S. drone – CNN Security Clearance - CNN.com Blogs[/url]

Iranians shooting at our drones in international air space.
Pretty funny that they are using SU-25s for this.
:doh:

[QUOTE=Chico23231;961390][url=http://www.bostonherald.com/news/international/asia_pacific/view.bg?articleid=1061172582&srvc=rss]Pakistan parents killed daughter for eyeing boy - BostonHerald.com[/url]

sick people[/QUOTE]

Really is horrible.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;962486][URL="http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/08/first-on-cnn-iranian-jets-fire-on-u-s-drone/?hpt=hp_t3"]FIRST ON CNN: Iranian jets fire on U.S. drone – CNN Security Clearance - CNN.com Blogs[/URL]

Iranians shooting at our drones in international air space.
Pretty funny that they are using SU-25s for this.
:doh:[/quote]

Less amusing that the story was sat on so as not to negatively impact POTUS. Same with the Seal Team discipline.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=RedskinRat;962754]Less amusing that the story was sat on so as not to negatively impact POTUS. Same with the Seal Team discipline.[/quote]

Funny how that works....

Re: All things Middle East related
 

I clearly don't understand the assassination of a man who just brokered a peace deal with your country 3 hours earlier.

[url=http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/17/opinion/israels-shortsighted-assassination.html?smid=tw-share]Israel’s Shortsighted Assassination - NYTimes.com[/url]



[quote] Passing messages between the two sides, I was able to learn firsthand that Mr. Jabari wasn’t just interested in a long-term cease-fire; he was also the person responsible for enforcing previous cease-fire understandings brokered by the Egyptian intelligence agency. Mr. Jabari enforced those cease-fires only after confirming that Israel was prepared to stop its attacks on Gaza. On the morning that he was killed, Mr. Jabari received a draft proposal for an extended cease-fire with Israel, including mechanisms that would verify intentions and ensure compliance. This draft was agreed upon by me and Hamas’s deputy foreign minister, Mr. Hamad, when we met last week in Egypt.

The goal was to move beyond the patterns of the past. For years, it has been the same story: Israeli intelligence discovers information about an impending terrorist attack from Gaza. The Israeli Army takes pre-emptive action with an airstrike against the suspected terror cells, which are often made up of fighters from groups like Islamic Jihad, the Popular Resistance Committees or Salafi groups not under Hamas’s control but functioning within its territory. These cells launch rockets into Israeli towns near Gaza, and they often miss their targets. The Israeli Air Force responds swiftly. The typical result is between 10 and 25 casualties in Gaza, zero casualties in Israel and huge amounts of property damage on both sides. [/quote]

[quote] Instead, Mr. Jabari is dead — and with him died the possibility of a long-term cease-fire. Israel may have also compromised the ability of Egyptian intelligence officials to mediate a short-term cease-fire and placed Israel’s peace treaty with Egypt at risk.

This was not inevitable, and cooler heads could have prevailed. Mr. Jabari’s assassination removes one of the more practical actors on the Hamas side. [/quote]


Israel doesn't want peace. They want to take the Palestine land. That much has been clear over the course of the past 50 years.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[url=http://www.npr.org/2012/11/19/165453147/palestinian-civilian-toll-climbs-in-gaza]Palestinian Civilian Toll Climbs In Gaza : NPR[/url]


Guess the UN isn't completely useless.
[url=http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/11/20/us-palestinians-israel-un-idUSBRE8AI19720121120]U.N. chief warns Israel against Gaza incursion | Reuters[/url]


I agree with this guy.
[url=http://www.npr.org/2011/09/26/140790657/turkeys-erdogan-blasts-syria-israel]Turkey's Prime Minister Erdogan Blasts Syria, Israel : NPR[/url]

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=NC_Skins;965890]Israel doesn't want peace. They want to take the Palestine land. That much has been clear over the course of the past 50 years.[/quote]

While I do not agree with much of Israel's actions, I would strongly disagree with this. What Israel wants is security within its borders. They have vacated the Gaza Strip, the Sinai Peninsula and the Golan Heights in exchange for the promise of peace. If the Hamas stop shooting rockets at them, I would suggest that the Israelites would be happy to leave them alone. As it is, they respond with overwhelming force to these attacks. Further, the Hamas is fundamentally a group opposed to the existence of Israel.

It's like your neighbor, who hates you, throwing rocks into your yard when your kids are playing and, with no police to stop him from doing so, you take it upon yourself to throw hand grenades into his yard to make it stop.

Neither party is blameless in this latest round.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=NC_Skins;965890]I clearly don't understand the assassination of a man who just brokered a peace deal with your country 3 hours earlier.

[URL="http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/17/opinion/israels-shortsighted-assassination.html?smid=tw-share"]Israel’s Shortsighted Assassination - NYTimes.com[/URL]








Israel doesn't want peace. They want to take the Palestine land. That much has been clear over the course of the past 50 years.[/quote]


You kind of left out this part.

AHMED AL-JABARI — the strongman of [URL="http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/organizations/h/hamas/index.html?inline=nyt-org"][COLOR=#0066cc]Hamas[/COLOR][/URL], the head of its military wing, [B]the man responsible for the abduction of the Israeli soldier Gilad Shalit[/B] — [URL="http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/15/world/middleeast/israeli-strike-in-gaza-kills-the-military-leader-of-hamas.html"][COLOR=#0066cc]was assassinated[/COLOR][/URL] on Wednesday by Israeli missiles.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

Gaza/Palestine/Hamas whatever....one continuous batch of little pricks emboldened and funded by Iran and Eygypt, who in a very stupid way continue to poke the tiger with a stick and then scream foul when the tiger bites them. They get whatever Israel gives them and I hope the USA stands behind Israel 100 %.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=NC_Skins;965899][URL="http://www.npr.org/2012/11/19/165453147/palestinian-civilian-toll-climbs-in-gaza"]Palestinian Civilian Toll Climbs In Gaza : NPR[/URL]


[B]Guess the UN isn't completely useless.[/B]
[URL="http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/11/20/us-palestinians-israel-un-idUSBRE8AI19720121120"]U.N. chief warns Israel against Gaza incursion | Reuters[/URL]


I agree with this guy.
[URL="http://www.npr.org/2011/09/26/140790657/turkeys-erdogan-blasts-syria-israel"]Turkey's Prime Minister Erdogan Blasts Syria, Israel : NPR[/URL][/quote]


The UN won't do shit. First the US is pretty much the UN and the US is not going to go in with the UN. So if the UN tried to go up against Israel they would get their ass kicked.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=firstdown;965939]You kind of left out this part.

AHMED AL-JABARI — the strongman of [URL="http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/organizations/h/hamas/index.html?inline=nyt-org"][COLOR=#0066cc]Hamas[/COLOR][/URL], the head of its military wing, [B]the man responsible for the abduction of the Israeli soldier Gilad Shalit[/B] — [URL="http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/15/world/middleeast/israeli-strike-in-gaza-kills-the-military-leader-of-hamas.html"][COLOR=#0066cc]was assassinated[/COLOR][/URL] on Wednesday by Israeli missiles.[/quote]


NO, I didn't leave that part out.


[quote] Since Mr. Jabari took over the military wing of Hamas, the only Israeli who spoke with him directly was Mr. Shalit, who was escorted out of Gaza by Mr. Jabari himself. (It is important to recall that Mr. Jabari not only abducted Mr. Shalit, but he also kept him alive and ensured that he was cared for during his captivity.) [/quote]

Changes nothing.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=Alvin Walton;965951]Gaza/Palestine/Hamas whatever....one continuous batch of little pricks emboldened and funded by Iran and Eygypt, who in a very stupid way continue to poke the tiger with a stick and then scream foul when the tiger bites them. They get whatever Israel gives them and I hope the USA stands behind Israel 100 %.[/quote]

Spoken like a person who's 100% clueless on Israel/Palestine history. Our citizens really need to be educated on world matters, that much is for certain.

Re: All things Middle East related
 

[quote=NC_Skins;966047]NO, I didn't leave that part out.




Changes nothing.[/quote]

Your highlights left that out and I'd say obducting one of their military is the bigger part of why he got hit. He could have also been in the wrong place at the right time.