Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

I have a hard time worrying about the cap because we have one of these threads each year and each year it seems we find the cap money we need.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

morgan was quietly VERY solid for us last year, as a WR and a blocker... i honestly couldn't justify cutting him at all... but def try and re-structure his # ... and i couldn't really see cutting Moss either... who is going to replace the big plays, clutch plays and overall production he put up for us last year?

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

Id stay away from McClain. He just tryed the false name to a cop trick that never works in January. I couldnt trust him, bad news and actually a bust. We dont need him.

Wouldnt cut Morgan. He's proven to be a good player and will get better.

Morgan was our best WR last yr damn near

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=firstdown;996436]I have a hard time worrying about the cap because we have one of these threads each year and each year it seems we find the cap money we need.[/quote]

"Find the cap money we need" - thats interesting. We made the playoffs last year while dealing with an 18MM cap hit. Yes, we were under the cap and made a nice run... but how much further could we have gone if we'd spent that 18MM on some better offensive linemen to protect griffin. Or 2-3 really good starters in the secondary. Do you think, if we had a better secondary, we would have one 2 more games? I do. and that would have resulted in a 1st round bye. 3 more wins and we'd have clinched homefield throughout the playoffs.

The issue is not "finding the cap money we need" to get sign 53 players under the salary cap. The issue is how much less talented of a team we will to put on the field in 2013 because the NFL took 15% of our cap away.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

I don't know how people b*tch about Hall's attitude and want to bring batsh*t crazy characters like Pacman Jones, Talib, or McClain. I know they have talent, but these guys are a sneeze away from long term suspensions and have probably done worst things than any of our current players have (except TW and FD maybe).

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

Well I don't think Williams and Davis are in same category with whom you mentioned. Smoking weed isn't exactly bad as being charged with some kind of criminal charges like others did

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=firstdown;996436]I have a hard time worrying about the cap because we have one of these threads each year and each year it seems we find the cap money we need.[/quote]

This years different because they are over the cap AND they have several free agents that they want to re-sign. Last season - even with the same cap penalty, they didn't mind losing the players that they cut or didn't re-sign last offseason.

This year there is at least a handful of productive players that they would want to re-sign. And another small difference is - the free agents that were signed last offseason now are counting against the cap - the biggest are Garçon and Morgan.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=GridIron26;996489]Well I don't think Williams and Davis are in same category with whom you mentioned. Smoking weed isn't exactly bad as being charged with some kind of criminal charges like others did[/quote]

To me, its not the smoking weed that bothers me. It's the multiple warnings they got and continued to do it. They tested positive and basically were told don't do this again, and they still did it. I know a lot was said about the timing of the tests, ect.

That said, they both seemed to clean up fine. Williams from all accounts is motivated as hell, and he played fantastic last year. Davis did all the right things afterwards, and I really hope he comes back. The injury to me is 100x more of a concern to me than any "character" issues.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

... Not saying that they can't sign any new impact free agents but they might have to lose a key productive player (comtributing to a 10-6 playoff team) that will need to be replaced. Namely Hall and Moss.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;996445]Morgan was our best WR last yr damn near[/quote]

I agree. Garcon was easily the only "difference maker" but Morgan I thought was extremley solid. In addition, I really want Hank to step up, and I thought last year was gonna be the year he did, but I didn't think he really played as well as I would have liked in his spot. I wouldn't get rid of Morgan. That said, I'd have no problems rolling with the same group of WR's as we did last year (maybe replacing Brizcoe/Banks).

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

On a side note.

We talked about whether Lictensteiger was worth keeping or not as a starter.

nfldraftscout rated the top 70 guards in pro football for last year.

Lichtensteiger comes in at 52. Chris Chester comes in at 12. I say let Kory test the market and if he has no takers resign him to a backup deal and let LeRibeus and him battle it out (w/ LeRibeus being the more likely winner)

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

Contrary to what some feel- I think that Lichtensteiger should and will be re-signed because he is very good in Shanahans system, he's Shanahans guy, and he would be reasonably cheap to re-sign because no other team would value him as much (except maybe Houston or another zbs). And also Carriker will not be cut because he is and will be valuable to team and dline in the same way that Lichtensteiger is valuable to the oline. He's also a player that Haslett/shanahan traded for. Their contribution to the team is really not appreciated by fans but valued by coaches and teammates because they are doing their grunt work on the line.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

WHEN the redskins cut hall and moss, they will need to replace them with a starting cb and an above average wideout that produces with critical plays and tds. Or re-sign them to a reduced salary.

I think the later option is what they think is safer and what they will ultimately do.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

I think Shanahan tried to replace Moss with the younger Eddie Royal last offseason, but obviously that didn't work out. I don't think theres a wideout that can equal his production in fa this year.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

If Hankerson steps up, the loss of Moss is not so critical.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=Lotus;996509]If Hankerson steps up, the loss of Moss is not so critical.[/quote]

I agree but how will you know whether he steps up BEFORE losing Moss.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

Morgan didn't impress me. He's decent but we can get better at WR c'mon now.

Hankersons been my guy to start stepping up yet to see it. Moss/DeAngelo.. Guys with a chip.. They win games. U need attitude were a gritty team bottom line. I can see one more season each.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=warriorzpath;996512]I agree but how will you know whether he steps up BEFORE losing Moss.[/quote]

You gotta believe!!

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=warriorzpath;996512]I agree but how will you know whether he steps up BEFORE losing Moss.[/quote]

Hank looked pretty good in limited action last year. If he can fix his biggest problem - the dropsies - he could make us forget about Moss quickly.

Also don't forget about Aldrick Robinson. It should be expected that by September either Hank or Robinson will have developed to the point where they would beat out Moss anyway. Then we have Garcon - Morgan - Hankerson - Robinson as our 4 wideouts. In this scenario, paying Moss to be #5 makes little sense for several reasons.

I am not a Santana hater. I'm just trying to be realistic.

I'm sure my numbers are off....
 

CUTS:
Meriweather
Brown
Kory Lichtensteiger
Adam Carriker

Projected Savings - $12.7+? million

Restructuring:Hall, Moss
Projected Savings - $3+? million

Retiring:
none

Total Cap Room (adding the $4 million we are over): $18? million



Redskins free agents who re-sign:
Kehl
Polumbus
Jackson
Alexander
D. Young

Total spent - $7.5 million


Redskins un-restricted free agents who we tender:
Baker
Paulsen

Total spent - $2 million


Total left for free agents and draft picks: $16.5 million


Free Agent Signings:
Corey Lynch 3 year 3-4 ?
Total - the above million

Money left to sign draft picks and un-drafted free agents: $7.5 million

2nd: David Amerson CB
3rd: TJ McDonald FS
4th: John Bostic ILB
5th: Duke Williams FS
5th: Josh Boyce WR
6th: Cierre Wood RB
7th: Colby Cameron QB

UDFA: Vinton Painter OT

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=Lotus;996509]If Hankerson steps up, the loss of Moss is not so critical.[/quote]

...... a taller slower hankerson, improved or not can't fill Moss' position and what he specifically does for the wr corps

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=Meks;996528]...... a taller slower hankerson, improved or not can't fill Moss' position and what he specifically does for the wr corps[/quote]

Actually Hank ran in the 4.4's at his combine. He likely is faster than Moss right now, given Moss' age.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=Lotus;996521]Hank looked pretty good in limited action last year. If he can fix his biggest problem - the dropsies - he could make us forget about Moss quickly.

Also don't forget about [B]Aldrick Robinson[/B]. It should be expected that by September either Hank or Robinson will have developed to the point where they would beat out Moss anyway. Then we have Garcon - Morgan - Hankerson - Robinson as our 4 wideouts. In this scenario, paying Moss to be #5 makes little sense for several reasons.

I am not a Santana hater. I'm just trying to be realistic.[/quote]

He's more realistic to replace Moss in the slot. Hank is an outside WR.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=Lotus;996530]Actually Hank ran in the 4.4's at his combine. He likely is faster than Moss right now, given Moss' age.[/quote]

yeah but moss is the better wr. even at his old age (in football years) moss is way shiftier, quicker and runs better routes. bottom line is moss can play the slot better than hank. to me, hank has been a disappointment.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

I might be in the minority, but if we do not see any cap relief I think we have to go young and make cuts where we have too. Here is my moves.

1. Cut Santana Moss, we love to have him but the cap number is too big. I hope Robinson or Hankerson can fill those shoes.

2. Keep Kory L., with RG3 getting hit we have to keep a sound line

3. RT.... I dont know, I thought Polumbus did a good job, but could use an upgrade draft maybe... we wont know until April. We have no cap to find a premier RT through free agency

4. Cut or restructure D Hall. I actually thought he played great the second half of the season, but the cap hit is huge!

5. I think Fletcher has to go, we just cant afford him, the defense might have to suffer this year just to make things work.

6. I have said before I would love to keep F Davis, just dont see it unless he is willing to take less this year and more next year (maybe lock in next year salary???)

7.I think Lorenzo is gone, great while he was here, but a luxury we can not afford this year.

8.Banks..... really- see ya!

9.Golston is gone- there are several these 2nd to 3rd teir players that need to go due to cap hit vs. the value

10.Find away to keep Young, He does a great job for us, the cap to value has to be there.

11. I would cut Royster, flashes at times, way too inconsistent

12. Helu....... He can't stay healty, one blip at training camp he is gone

13. Find a scat back in the draft, speed and hands

14.Resign Paulsen at a cap freindly price, he has to understand he is not
Jason Witten.

15. If F Davis is not resigned, we have to find another TE in draft

16.Love to keep R Jackson, just dont see the money to do so. I think alot of teams that have cap will be after him. Another Antonio Pierce situation- this time due to the cap

If these moves are made the Defense will suffer the most, however are hands are tied behind our back. At all cost protect our QB's!!!!! The GM has tough choices to make, just a thought....where would we be if we never signed Haynesworth..............

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

Mind blowing people want to restructure and keep Hall. 7.5 off the books is a no brainer, should be the first cut

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=Chico23231;996572]Mind blowing people want to restructure and keep Hall. 7.5 off the books is a no brainer, should be the first cut[/quote]

Chico, while I agree that the 7.5 is a very large number, the second half of the season the defense really came around, I think the corners helped with that.
Do you feel we are better off with out him? If they do cut him, who is up? Grffin?

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=Jayroc24;996589]Chico, while I agree that the 7.5 is a very large number, the second half of the season the defense really came around, I think the corners helped with that.
Do you feel we are better off with out him? If they do cut him, who is up? Grffin?[/quote]

I wasnt criticizing directly you and i agree he played better down the stretch.

I certainly feel we are better off without him next year. If we cut 7.5 mil, I guarentee we can bring someone in next year at his spot for 3.5 mil and that player will perform better.

The conerback position is deep in FA and the draft. Id say with address it with both. Poyer and Toler would be a good start.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=Chico23231;996600]I wasnt criticizing directly you and i agree he played better down the stretch.

I certainly feel we are better off without him next year. If we cut 7.5 mil, I guarentee we can bring someone in next year at his spot for 3.5 mil and that player will perform better.

The conerback position is deep in FA and the draft. Id say with address it with both. Poyer and Toler would be a good start.[/quote]

Poyer is dropping in the draft rankings so we could definitely get him.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=Chico23231;996600]I wasnt criticizing directly you and i agree he played better down the stretch.

I certainly feel we are better off without him next year. If we cut 7.5 mil, I guarentee we can bring someone in next year at his spot for 3.5 mil and that player will perform better.

The conerback position is deep in FA and the draft. Id say with address it with both. Poyer and Toler would be a good start.[/quote]

Didn't take it as such..... At the end of the day I want BA to bolster the O line at all cost, and hope we find some hidden gems in draft. Just dont see alot of possibilities in FA this year for us with our current cap. Every year second/third year players who did not contribute much their first year have a coming out party. Let us hope we have a few defensive backs that do that this year.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

@Rich_TandlerCSN: The #Redskins will be able to clear about $20 million in cap space with 6 restructures, and 1 pay cut. Post coming soon.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=SOUL-SKINS;996617]@Rich_TandlerCSN: The #Redskins will be able to clear about $20 million in cap space with 6 restructures, and 1 pay cut. Post coming soon.[/quote]

Wow, they perform salary issues like I play Rummy......

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=SOUL-SKINS;996617]@Rich_TandlerCSN: The #Redskins will be able to clear about $20 million in cap space with 6 restructures, and 1 pay cut. Post coming soon.[/quote]

Damn good news. I was thinking that this is one way to somewhat circumvent the cap penalty, but was a perceived negative in ways the redskins did things in the past - pushing cap money to later years by converting salaries to guaranteed money up front. The biggest risk is the player(s) being cut early in the contract and increasing the redskins dead cap money.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

I wonder who was the first cut - Hall or Moss? ... or maybe someone else?

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

Hall is probably the pay cut.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=warriorzpath;996625]Damn good news. [B]I was thinking that this is one way to somewhat circumvent the cap penalty, but was a perceived negative in ways the redskins did things in the past - pushing cap money to later years by converting salaries to guaranteed money up front[/B]. The biggest risk is the player(s) being cut early in the contract and increasing the redskins dead cap money.[/quote]

That is standard practice by every team that it willing to spend the full cap. The penalty wasnt for moving cap money back by giving guaranteed money. It was for pulling money forward into an uncapped year.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=Skinzman;996631]That is standard practice by every team that it willing to spend the full cap. The penalty wasnt for moving cap money back by giving guaranteed money. It was for pulling money forward into an uncapped year.[/quote]

Not saying that this is why they were penalized. This is what they're doing now with the restructure.

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=Mattyk;996628]Hall is probably the pay cut.[/quote]

Yea ... I'd have to agree. I'm reading that J Wilson is a prime candidate for an extension to help out with the cap figure

Re: Hard Decisions: The solution to the $18MM offseason puzzle
 

[quote=warriorzpath;996625]Damn good news. I was thinking that this is one way to somewhat circumvent the cap penalty, but was a perceived negative in ways the redskins did things in the past - pushing cap money to later years by converting salaries to guaranteed money up front. The biggest risk is the player(s) being cut early in the contract and increasing the redskins dead cap money.[/quote]

Woah Kemosabi!

Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but I'm pretty sure Rich Tandler is saying that the Redskins "could" save money in these ways that he is ''suggesting''. I don't read this as this is going to happen.

again maybe I'm wrong.