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[quote=skinsfanthru&thru;1056868]Some pretty interesting figures here:
[url=http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1925307-washington-redskins-stats-that-mattered-in-2013]Washington Redskins Stats That Mattered in 2013 | Bleacher Report[/url][/quote]

Sometimes numbers do tell the story.

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[quote=Gary84Clark;1056718]What happened to Pick Magnet?[/quote]

Rape Alligation

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[quote=skinsfanthru&thru;1056868]Some pretty interesting figures here:
[url=http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1925307-washington-redskins-stats-that-mattered-in-2013]Washington Redskins Stats That Mattered in 2013 | Bleacher Report[/url][/quote]

I wish i hadn't read that. Thats fn terrible. What a waste of a year.

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I will argue this all day long. The stats on "pressures" do not accurately count the amount of times he dropped back and had one, two, or three of the KL/WL/CC pu pu platter butt bumping him within micro seconds. All year he was throwing from a compromised pocket with little in the way of passing lanes. He threw off his back foot 1/3 of the time so he wouldn't shred the Achilles of one of those guys constantly.

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[quote=FRPLG;1056900]I will argue this all day long. The stats on "pressures" do not accurately count the amount of times he dropped back and had one, two, or three of the KL/WL/CC pu pu platter butt bumping him within micro seconds. All year he was throwing from a compromised pocket with little in the way of passing lanes. He threw off his back foot 1/3 of the time so he wouldn't shred the Achilles of one of those guys constantly.[/quote]


Some of you guys make waaaaay to many excuses for Robert. Reminds me of the ole Jason Campbell supporters. Facts are facts. He didn't have good field vision, didn't read the defenses well, accuracy was way off, and he held onto the ball too long at times.

Sure, the offensive line was offensive at times, but the fact of the matter is our QB play stunk. (as well as other positions)

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[quote=skinsfanthru&thru;1056868]Some pretty interesting figures here:
[url=http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1925307-washington-redskins-stats-that-mattered-in-2013]Washington Redskins Stats That Mattered in 2013 | Bleacher Report[/url][/quote]

A while back I made a comment how all of our units were terrible and how at many times each unit negatively affected the other. This stat is just ridiculous but it also sort of proves my point:

"38: That's the number of times the Redskins defense was forced to take the field in its own territory, which was the highest total in the NFL by a margin of five, according to ESPN's John Keim. Historically bad special teams and a high turnover rate will do that. "

That's an average of 2 times per game that special teams and/or the offense let the opponents start in Washington's side of the field.

[QUOTE=Ruhskins;1056905]A while back I made a comment how all of our units were terrible and how at many times each unit negatively affected the other. This stat is just ridiculous but it also sort of proves my point:

"38: That's the number of times the Redskins defense was forced to take the field in its own territory, which was the highest total in the NFL by a margin of five, according to ESPN's John Keim. Historically bad special teams and a high turnover rate will do that. "

That's an average of 2 times per game that special teams and/or the offense let the opponents start in Washington's side of the field.[/QUOTE]

3-13 is what u get

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[quote=NC_Skins;1056902]Some of you guys make waaaaay to many excuses for Robert. Reminds me of the ole Jason Campbell supporters. Facts are facts. He didn't have good field vision, didn't read the defenses well, accuracy was way off, and he held onto the ball too long at times.

Sure, the offensive line was offensive at times, but the fact of the matter is our QB play stunk. (as well as other positions)[/quote]An excuse is something like blaming the 2012 knee injury. Or saying that all sophomores struggle. Those are excuses that don't address the on field play.

Saying that the interior lineman couldn't build a pocket or that a lot of times the offensive gameplan seemed counterproductive just means you understood what was happening.

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[quote=NC_Skins;1056902]Some of you guys make waaaaay to many excuses for Robert. Reminds me of the ole Jason Campbell supporters. Facts are facts. He didn't have good field vision, didn't read the defenses well, accuracy was way off, and he held onto the ball too long at times.

Sure, the offensive line was offensive at times, but the fact of the matter is our QB play stunk. (as well as other positions)[/quote]

Conversely, some people are acting like Griffin was Shuler-like last season. There were times he looked like crap and there were times he looked like what we expect him to be. In the middle of the season, there were stretches where he looked as good as any QB we faced this year outside of Manning. Unfortunately, it was never for long enough.

I'm already tired of the 'experts' talking about having to 'fix' Griffin. SVP & Russilo asked Tim Hasselbeck the other day if 'RG3 is the biggest question mark in the NFL heading into next season'. Seriously? He needs an offseason, healthy, to be coached and develop. If he still has ratings in the 70's, a high turnover ratio, has sloppy mechanics and runs/puts himself in danger too much, then let's have that discussion. Until then, people need to chill.

All of the smoke and noise that Shanahan & his camp put out the last 5 or 6 weeks of the season has worked to distract people from the piss poor job he did and was fired as a result of.

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[quote=skinsfanthru&thru;1056868]Some pretty interesting figures here:
[url=http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1925307-washington-redskins-stats-that-mattered-in-2013]Washington Redskins Stats That Mattered in 2013 | Bleacher Report[/url][/quote]


Insane, Robert was pressured 38% of his dropbacks and 46 dropped passes? No QB could succeed with those stats. On top of that, the D gave up 30 points a game!


[quote]
58.4: That was Kirk Cousins' passer rating in relief of Griffin, which if he qualified would have ranked dead last in the NFL by a huge margin. He threw seven interceptions on only 155 attempts, which is pretty much unacceptable. Griffin struggled in 2013, but Cousins was even worse. Jay Gruden is right about there being no quarterback competition. [/quote]

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[quote=Paintrain;1056990]Conversely, some people are acting like Griffin was Shuler-like last season. There were times he looked like crap and there were times he looked like what we expect him to be. In the middle of the season, there were stretches where he looked as good as any QB we faced this year outside of Manning. Unfortunately, it was never for long enough.

I'm already tired of the 'experts' talking about having to 'fix' Griffin. SVP & Russilo asked Tim Hasselbeck the other day if 'RG3 is the biggest question mark in the NFL heading into next season'. Seriously? He needs an offseason, healthy, to be coached and develop. If he still has ratings in the 70's, a high turnover ratio, has sloppy mechanics and runs/puts himself in danger too much, then let's have that discussion. Until then, people need to chill.

All of the smoke and noise that Shanahan & his camp put out the last 5 or 6 weeks of the season has worked to distract people from the piss poor job he did and was fired as a result of.[/quote]

It's as if 2012 never happened.

A guy coming off a serious knee injury with no offseason work gets no breaks I guess.

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[url=http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/66930520/Washington-Redskins-Jay-Gruden-wants-Robert-Griffin-III-in-pocket]Jay Gruden wants RGIII to succeed in the pocket. | SportsonEarth.com : Dan Pompei Article[/url]

Not sure if many of the Gruden quotes are from a one on one interview or an article written based on quotes the writer gathered from multiple sources (that's what it seemed to me) but some interesting insights into how Gruden is thinking about RGIII. Some things contradict what Gruden told Peter King which is why I think it's largely writer assumptions rather than a true interview.

Some highlights:
-Thinking 3 or 4 read option plays, max, per game
-Wants to focus on dropping back in the offseason
-Intrigued by passing options like Morgan, Moss, Davis and Paulsen (again why I think the writer is making some editorial assumptions since 3/4 of them won't be back)

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[quote=Monkeydad;1056993]Insane, Robert was pressured 38% of his dropbacks and 46 dropped passes? No QB could succeed with those stats. On top of that, the D gave up 30 points a game![/quote]

but the defensive stats are skewed because special needs teams gave up field position like an obese call girl in a Nevada brothel.

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People need to move on from 12 and 13. RG3 had a very good rookie year, but so did Vince Young. It doesn't mean you're a good NFL QB because you have one good year, just like it doesn't mean he sucks cause he had a down year. The injury obviously played a part. He's got a new coach who hopefully can get him to where he needs to be. I'm more concerned about building a good team around him.

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What I don't get, is even with last year's performance slump (table from the b/r article)
RGIII's sophomore slump
rank area 2012 (rank) 2013 (rank)
Comp. % 65.6 (5th) 60.1 (25th)
TD % 5.1 (8th) 3.5 (27th)
INT % 1.3 (1st) 2.6 (18th)
YPA 8.1 (1st) 7.0 (18th)
Rating 102.1 (3rd) 82.2 (22nd)
QBR 71.41 (5th) 40.12 (28th)
Rush YPA 6.8 (1st) 5.7 (4th)
Rush YPG 54.3 (1st) 38.3 (4th)
Rush TD 7 (2nd) 0 (T-27th)

Clearly his numbers dropped, imo due to three main parts:
part of that was injury,
part was coaching dysfunction, and
part was a decline/lack of growth in his skill set.

But even so, his numbers generally were NFL caliber talent. I would imagine we saw his floor this past year, and closer to his ceiling range in 2012. I just don't get the way a guy who was treated so highly one year drops so far in fans perception, when clearly there were obvious contributing factors...

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VY's rookie year is a joke compared to RG3's, just saying.

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If RG had put up last year's numbers as a rookie we would have been pretty pleased. 60% completions, more TDs than INTs.

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we still had an average offense, a bottom 3 defense and the worst ST unit since the 2000 buffalo bills.

no, he didn't play great, but there are bigger problems than slightly below average QB play.

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[quote=Mattyk;1057005]If RG had put up last year's numbers as a rookie we would have been pretty pleased. 60% completions, more TDs than INTs.[/quote]

We should also know from experience that a "sophomore slump" doesn't mean anything if the player bounces back.

Cam Newton. I had him written off too because of his attitude and "me, me me, I want to be an entertainer not a QB" comments but he proved everyone wrong.

Griffin DID start slow, which was to be expected. Peterson had a very slow start after his ACL before he want insane later in the year to go for 2000 yards. He'll be back next year, I'm not worried at all. His recovery coupled with the complete collapse of the whole team and coaching staff around him...yeah, he had a pretty good year when you consider everything.

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[quote=Monkeydad;1057016]We should also know from experience that a "sophomore slump" doesn't mean anything if the player bounces back.

[B][I][I]Cam Newton. I had him written off too because of his attitude and "me, me me, I want to be an entertainer not a QB" comments but he proved everyone wrong.[/I][/I][/B]

Griffin DID start slow, which was to be expected. Peterson had a very slow start after his ACL before he want insane later in the year to go for 2000 yards. He'll be back next year, I'm not worried at all. His recovery coupled with the complete collapse of the whole team and coaching staff around him...yeah, he had a pretty good year when you consider everything.[/quote]

Sorry to thread-jack and not to call you out for this at all, but this right here is the reason why I hate the media today. Those comments (or more accurately 'not only do I want to be a football player, but I want to be an entertainer and an icon) were given to Peter King in a promotional interview for Under Armour when asked about the endorsement deal. Broadcasters, bloggers and even King himself glommed on to that part of a quote, out of context, and ran with it.

Similar things happened to RG3 with all of the mess this season. People latched onto the negative narrative regardless of who it came from or if it was even valid.

/threadjacking

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[quote=paintrain;1057034]sorry to thread-jack and not to call you out for this at all, but this right here is the reason why i hate the media today. Those comments (or more accurately 'not only do i want to be a football player, but i want to be an entertainer and an icon) were given to peter king in a promotional interview for under armour when asked about the endorsement deal. Broadcasters, bloggers and even king himself glommed on to that part of a quote, out of context, and ran with it.

Similar things happened to rg3 with all of the mess this season. People latched onto the negative narrative regardless of who it came from or if it was even valid.

/threadjacking[/quote]

well said.

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[quote=Mattyk;1056996]It's as if 2012 never happened.

A guy coming off a serious knee injury with no offseason work gets no breaks I guess.[/quote]

Matty I agree with you but he should also not have had any starts ,at least for a while .

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For comparison purposes: Payton Manning's rookie numbers are as follows:

Comp. Pct. 56.7
Yards: 3,739
Yards/Game: 233.7
TDs: 26
INTs: 28
Rating: 71.2

So higher TDs, but a lot more picks too and a lower QB rating (by far) than either RGIII season.

I think folks need to give RGIII a break and see what he can do with a larger body of work (and good health).

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People around here are addicted to stats. How many games were there where RG3 was the QB and it was a struggle to get first downs? Green Bay, both Philly games, Denver, KC, San Fran, then he'd get some junk stats when the game was out of hand...he had a down year, he held the ball, he was inaccurate, he looked at one wr and pulled the ball down.... he's young and learning... it happens. The 2013 drama filled year is over. Time for RG3 to work on his craft, get better and move on.

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[quote=skinsfan69;1057063]People around here are addicted to stats. How many games were there where RG3 was the QB and it was a struggle to get first downs? Green Bay, both Philly games, Denver, KC, San Fran, then he'd get some junk stats when the game was out of hand...he had a down year, he held the ball, he was inaccurate, [B]he looked at one wr and pulled the ball down[/B].... he's young and learning... it happens. The 2013 drama filled year is over. Time for RG3 to work on his craft, get better and move on.[/quote]

IMO that is what RGIII needs to work on most. Too often he was on the move and took his eyes away from downfield, thus thwarting any opportunity for a big pass play.

He can do it. I'll bet we see a different RGIII in Sept. '14.

Yeah well CK stares down WRs all.day and Is known as the 1 read QB but winning as a team cures all of that. Griffin needs to work on a lot but so does RW, CK and luck

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[quote=skinsfaninok;1057065]Yeah well CK stares down WRs all.day and Is known as the 1 read QB but winning as a team cures all of that. Griffin needs to work on a lot but so does RW, CK and luck[/quote]

Yeah, Kaep is even worse than RGIII at the look-at-one-guy-and-take-off mode. Kaep would drive me crazy if we had him.

[QUOTE=Lotus;1057066]Yeah, Kaep is even worse than RGIII at the look-at-one-guy-and-take-off mode. Kaep would drive me crazy if we had him.[/QUOTE]

Jaws must have been drunk for saying he was going to be one of the greatest , idk what he saw but as far as a pure passer there just is no way. He's not the passer RG or RW are that's for sure

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[quote=skinsfaninok;1057065]Yeah well CK stares down WRs all.day and Is known as the 1 read QB but winning as a team cures all of that. Griffin needs to work on a lot but so does RW, CK and luck[/quote]

Well said! All these young qb's stare first option, however, first option is usually an open wr. They run slants and rub routes that weren't in the playbook for RG, the offense in 2012 and 13 was an early 90's offense w/heavy read option. SF runs the same sets but they run power, have a top five defense, better receivers, and a functioning Specials Team.

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RG3 needs to fix his footwork too, it was pretty terrible last year.

[QUOTE=whistler;1057083]Well said! All these young qb's stare first option, however, first option is usually an open wr. They run slants and rub routes that weren't in the playbook for RG, the offense in 2012 and 13 was an early 90's offense w/heavy read option. SF runs the same sets but they run power, have a top five defense, better receivers, and a functioning Specials Team.[/QUOTE]

Yep we don't have V Davis, or boldin on our team, those guys are a QBs dream

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Captain Fear, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers mascot, is rumored to be joining Bruce Allen's Washington Redskins staff in a similar capacity.

This move should complete the Redskins staff because, with the addition of Captain Fear, there will no longer be anyone who has ever worked for the Bucs who is not already working at Redskins Park.

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[quote=skinsfan69;1057063]People around here are addicted to stats. How many games were there where RG3 was the QB and it was a struggle to get first downs? Green Bay, both Philly games, Denver, KC, San Fran, then he'd get some junk stats when the game was out of hand...he had a down year, he held the ball, he was inaccurate, he looked at one wr and pulled the ball down.... he's young and learning... it happens. The 2013 drama filled year is over. Time for RG3 to work on his craft, get better and move on.[/quote]

When 80% of the time your offense only ran 2 man routes. It was kinda hard not to stare at one. Especially when the other guy is Alderick Robinson or Hankerson

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[quote=KI Skins Fan;1057133]Captain Fear, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers mascot, is rumored to be joining Bruce Allen's Washington Redskins staff in a similar capacity.

This move should complete the Redskins staff because, with the addition of Captain Fear, there will no longer be anyone who has ever worked for the Bucs who is not already working at Redskins Park.[/quote]

Lol.

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[quote=skinsfaninok;1057067]Jaws must have been drunk for saying he was going to be one of the greatest , idk what he saw but as far as a pure passer there just is no way. He's not the passer RG or RW are that's for sure[/quote]

Wilson is not a great passer. Look at his stats and remember that he has an offensive line and defense too.

Half his games are in the 40-50% completion rate range and the others are around 70%. He's not reliable and he's never asked to throw for more than 200 yards a game.

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According to JLC Fred Davis is facing a 6 game drug suspension. Later for that clown.

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[quote=KI Skins Fan;1057133]Captain Fear, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers mascot, is rumored to be joining Bruce Allen's Washington Redskins staff in a similar capacity.

This move should complete the Redskins staff because, with the addition of Captain Fear, there will no longer be anyone who has ever worked for the Bucs who is not already working at Redskins Park.[/quote]

Great post, but we did miss a few key additions...

[img]http://i2.cdn.turner.com/si/dam/assets/130903125506-tampa-bay-buccaneers-cheerleaders-ap589939272070-16-single-image-cut.jpg[/img]

[img]http://www.collegehoopsnet.com/357091018350_Panthers_at_Buccaneers.jpg[/img]

[img]http://www.strangefarmer.com/images/content/168471.jpg[/img]




Hey...it's offseason already for us.

[QUOTE=Monkeydad;1057164]Wilson is not a great passer. Look at his stats and remember that he has an offensive line and defense too.

Half his games are in the 40-50% completion rate range and the others are around 70%. He's not reliable and he's never asked to throw for more than 200 yards a game.[/QUOTE]

You , Me and quake are all in agreement on RW believe me

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Russell Wilson, 4th in yards per attempts at 8.25, completion percentage 12th at 63.1, 7th highest rated QB 101.2, 9th in TD thrown at 26, and only 9 ints thrown. 539 rushing yards as well.

Id think we would take that. I guess im not following the not great passer talk, if anything he's proven to be certainly pretty good.

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Funny thing is Russell Wilson numbers passing are much stronger than Luck's this year. Luck would be the knee jerk pick as best passer when thrown into the young QB discussion (Wilson, RG3, Kap, Luck).

And lets not talk about intangibles, thats why I would chose Wilson easily over Cutler, Romo, Dalton, A Smith, Schaub, etc.