Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=skinsguy]Don't confuse your opinions with fact. The fact is, your opinion is weak.[/QUOTE]


no it's fact not opinion which you don't want to acknowledge so you pawn it off as opinion. It's your opinion that it is not fact.

Just check Brunells TO ratio over the coarse of the past 2 seasons, and you will find he averages 1 TO a game. thats not weak thats fact.

Has Portis scored a TD this year? No! That's fact!

How many times did Portis stumble and fall down today without being hit? 2,3,4 somewhere in there, that's fact.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=offiss]no it's fact not opinion which you don't want to acknowledge so you pawn it off as opinion. It's your opinion that it is not fact.

Just check Brunells TO ratio over the coarse of the past 2 seasons, and you will find he averages 1 TO a game. thats not weak thats fact.

Has Portis scored a TD this year? No! That's fact!

How many times did Portis stumble and fall down today without being hit? 2,3,4 somewhere in there, that's fact.[/QUOTE]


Who cares what Brunell did last season? That is all you have to go by, which is why it's such a weak argument. Go ahead an admit your wrong about Brunell, most of the real men here have done so. :laughing-

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Offiss, this is what you said earlier in this thread.

[quote]Same old same old out of Brunell, 2 more fumbles today, which does happen, in fact it happens every game with him[/quote]

This simply is not true, and this is the statement we were responding to. He has 3 fumbles in 5 games on the year. 2 today, 1 last week. 3 does not = 5.

Ok, let's look at the argument you changed it to, his TO ratio over the last 2 seasons.

Going back to last year he has 8 total INTs and he's lost 6 fumbles, or 14 total turnovers in a total of 14 games. Fair enough, there's your average of 1.0 per game, but again that wasn't what you said initially.

And frankly last year is looking more and more like a pure fluke, especially considering the drastic turnaround this year. When can we finally forget about last year and focus on this year??

For the sake of the argument let's look at Ramsey's last two seasons, he has 12 INTs in 8 starts and 2 lost fumbles for a total of 14 turnovers in 8 starts, or 1.75 turnovers per start.

Comparing careers Brunell has 120 turnovers in 135 games played, or .888 turnovers per game.

Ramsey has 40 turnovers in 30 games, or 1.33 per game.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=Redskins8588]What facts apparently you didnt see Mattys post about Brunells #'s...[/QUOTE]


Here's some numbers for you, in 9 games last season Brunell turned the ball over 9 times.

In 4 and 3/4 games this season Brunell has turned the ball over 5 times. Your more than welcome to calculate the ratio and see if I presented the facts, or opinion.

Oh and by the way, Brunell has lost the last 2 games which is by far the most important stat, and both games were winnable, and lucky for him the seattle kicker choaked other wise he would be on a 3 game losing streak because of a late INT in his own end. As I said last week Brunell has squeeked out wins against below average teams, the first 2 legitamate teams we run into we lose.

I will put up a link up for Portis's TD's when he actually gets one.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Matty, what's the ol' saying, misery loves company? ;)

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

So Offiss what are you saying, are you in favor of starting Ramsey over Brunell??

Or are you just hating on Brunell for the sake of hating?

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Here's some numbers for you, in 9 games last season Brunell turned the ball over 9 times.

In 4 and 3/4 games this season Brunell has turned the ball over 5 times. Your more than welcome to calculate the ratio and see if I presented the facts, or opinion.

Oh and by the way, Brunell has lost the last 2 games which is by far the most important stat, and both games were winnable, and lucky for him the seattle kicker choaked other wise he would be on a 3 game losing streak because of a late INT in his own end. As I said last week Brunell has squeeked out wins against below average teams, the first 2 legitamate teams we run into we lose.

I will put up a link up for Portis's TD's when he actually gets one.[/QUOTE]

My lord, is there something wrong? Your not secrelty burning Redskins stuff off the board are you? Brunell has done a darn good job and I'm extremely pleased. Ramsey could not do what Brunell HAS done. Otherwise Ramsey would be out there.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Guys I hate to say this but Rock's fumble cost us the game, while Brunell's fumble just cost us points. The Skins need to convert more often in the Red Zone and they will be OK. But forget Brunell for a minute, and let's face facts, on Defense we have what 1 INT on the season and 1 fumble recovery? Am I right? The Skins need to shorten the field for the offense.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]Offiss, this is what you said earlier in this thread.



This simply is not true, and this is the statement we were responding to. He has 3 fumbles in 5 games on the year. 2 today, 1 last week. 3 does not = 5.

Ok, let's look at the argument you changed it to, his TO ratio over the last 2 seasons.

Going back to last year he has 8 total INTs and he's lost 6 fumbles, or 14 total turnovers in a total of 14 games. Fair enough, there's your average of 1.0 per game, but again that wasn't what you said initially.

And frankly last year is looking more and more like a pure fluke, especially considering the drastic turnaround this year. When can we finally forget about last year and focus on this year??

For the sake of the argument let's look at Ramsey's last two seasons, he has 12 INTs in 8 starts and 2 lost fumbles for a total of 14 turnovers in 8 starts, or 1.75 turnovers per start.

Comparing careers Brunell has 120 turnovers in 135 games played, or .888 turnovers per game.

Ramsey has 40 turnovers in 30 games, or 1.33 per game.[/QUOTE]


Do I really have to spell every little thing out for you, what do think same old means??????

It means another game another costly TO! Period!

Who's talking about Ramsey? This is about Brunell, and your going to forget about last year than do so, don't start comparing Ramsey with Brunell that in itself from your posts about Brunell doesn't say much about Brunell by comparison.

We can forget all the nonesense and ticky tack comparisons, and all the numbers, the bottom line is the past 2 games could have been won by Brunell, easily, and irregardless he lost both of them, with no help from Portis. that's the bottom line.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

The Rock fumble was definitely a huge swing. Perhaps we get at least 3 outta that drive, it definitely changed the entire course of the game. It was a 10 point swing at the least, perhaps 14.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Do I really have to spell every little thing out for you, what do think same old means??????

It means another game another costly TO! Period!

Who's talking about Ramsey? This is about Brunell, and your going to forget about last year than do so, don't start comparing Ramsey with Brunell that in itself from your posts about Brunell doesn't say much about Brunell by comparison.

We can forget all the nonesense and ticky tack comparisons, and all the numbers, the bottom line is the past 2 games could have been won by Brunell, easily, and irregardless he lost both of them, with no help from Portis. that's the bottom line.[/QUOTE]

Sorry, let me check my offiss to english translator next time.

'Same old' means '2 years'... gotcha. My bad, not sure what I was thinking.

:doh:

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

If not for Brunell, we probably wouldn't have been in position to take the game down to the wire anyway. 5 TDs in two games, not bad.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=TAFKAS]If not for Brunell, we probably wouldn't have been in position to take the game down to the wire anyway. 5 TDs in two games, not bad.[/QUOTE]

Yeah but what about last year...

oh never mind.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

it's amazing that some people hated Brunnel so much for his play last year that they can't realize this season has absolutely nothing to do with last year. That's why stats stop at the end of the season, cuz each year u r supposed to get a fresh new start. Brunnel definitely needs to learn to keep the ball tucked away when scrambling but his accuracy, his composure, and his feet have kept our team alive this year and as much as some fans love or atleast respect Ramsey, he's never shown the ability to do those things much less all of them. If the running game would help Brunnel out, I don't think there'd be anyone except for fans of other teams coming on here and bashing the team. We're all here to root on the same team, but it's starting to sound like some people want certain players to fail. This is Brunnel's team right now whether we all like it or not so can we please move onto another subject, as long as it isn't the arrington debacle,lol.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=canthetuna]How could you do that and not cut Brunell? Hell how could you bench ramsey for turning it over, and not bench brunell for the same thing?

I'm not trying to start shit and I agree that Brunell is doing a great job for the most part, but I'm just saying it would be extremely hypocritical to cut cartwright for 1 fumble, and not punish brunell for 2. Even though cartwright's went for a TD, how the hell was he supposed to control that?[/QUOTE]

Ok, because Brunell has won three games and is throwing for over 300 yards a game and he also redeems himself. All Rock did was run once and then fumble at a critical time. There is no comparison. Bad example...Cut Rock, let Nemo have the rock and the rock can go Find Nemo on the playing field.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]Brunell is a HUGE bright spot in our offense this year and his play is [b]night and day[/b] compared to last year.

I'm not even sure what some of you are suggesting, are you saying we should now go back to Ramsey??

Turnovers are never ok, but Brunell is playing lights out, a 91.5 QB rating, 9 TD vs. only 2 INT!! By the way he has 3 fumbles on the year, so it's definitely not a weekly thing with him, I know it might make your weak argument stronger to stretch the truth a bit, but let's deal with the facts shall we?

C'mon, what more do some of you want??

I guess for some it's just really hard to admit you were wrong in questioning the QB switch. It's ok to admit a Hall of Fame coach knows more than you, seriously, it's alright![/QUOTE]I want the Redskins to stop beating themselves....thats what I want...Can Joe Gibbs do no wrong to you...Whats up with this mancrush???....Stop living in the Glory Days and come back to the present...Gibbs needs to step up his game too...I know he worships God but last time I checked he wasn't the almighty.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Brunell averages 1 TO a game check his stats.

As far as Ramsey is concerned we will never know will we?[/QUOTE]
We know Ramsey is garbage..and I agree your opinion is weak...7 days of your comments makes one weak...

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Samuels may have had his worst game as a pro today...and when they moved the skinny white guy over on Jansens side, he got beat as well...offensive line was pourous at best and Rock....oh my Rock, wonder if he will apologoize in his web blog or something because that was definately a game breaker.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

I think they should Nehemiah Broughton a few carries. He kicked butt in preseason

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Do I really have to spell every little thing out for you, what do think same old means??????

It means another game another costly TO! Period!

Who's talking about Ramsey? This is about Brunell, and your going to forget about last year than do so, don't start comparing Ramsey with Brunell that in itself from your posts about Brunell doesn't say much about Brunell by comparison.

We can forget all the nonesense and ticky tack comparisons, and all the numbers, the bottom line is the past 2 games could have been won by Brunell, easily, and irregardless he lost both of them, with no help from Portis. that's the bottom line.[/QUOTE]


I'm sorry, but that is a bunch of BS! Are you completely ignoring the fact that the defense allowed Priest Holmes to catch a screen pass and run to the opposite side of the field AND run all the way for TD? How is that Brunell's fault? One of Brunell's fumbles, the first one, was not his fault. Furthermore, he fumbled deep in KC's territory. And the defense couldn't stop KC from going down field and scoring a field goal. The fact of the matter is, you can't see the forest from the trees, and the easiest thing for you to do is to blame Brunell knowing good and well it wasn't his fault.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=RedskinNation21]I want the Redskins to stop beating themselves....thats what I want...Can Joe Gibbs do no wrong to you...Whats up with this mancrush???....Stop living in the Glory Days and come back to the present...Gibbs needs to step up his game too...I know he worships God but last time I checked he wasn't the almighty.[/QUOTE]

I'm not ashamed of my Gibbs worshiping ways.

I'll put my trust in him and his staff over the media and the fans any day.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Also, how is Gibbs going to step up? Saying AGAIN to PLEASE STOP MAKING STUPID MISTAKES?! The playcalling has been money this year. It's all been a problem of execution in the red zone.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

It is most definatly NOT the same ol story. Would you rather have any of the Skins teams of the last 12 years over this one to root for? I sure as hell wouldn't. This is the first real football team we have had since 92. I love seeing a team go into Arrowhead and not jump offsides once. We are getting there...bit by bit.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Very good observation. I didn't even notice that.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

I could not agree more! The current Redskins team is playing respectable, sound football.
They are well on the way to respectability and the playoffs.

The Redskins have been a joke since Gibbs left in 92.

Gibbs' job is not done, there is still plenty if room for improvement, but you can say the same for any team.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=Kope]It is most definatly NOT the same ol story. Would you rather have any of the Skins teams of the last 12 years over this one to root for? I sure as hell wouldn't. This is the first real football team we have had since 92. I love seeing a team go into Arrowhead and not jump offsides once. We are getting there...bit by bit.[/QUOTE]The first three games were difinitely not the teams from old finding ways to win. The last two games our O looked great but we are now finding ways to lose again. I feel we need to stop that trend and start finding ways to win.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=firstdown]The first three games were difinitely not the teams from old finding ways to win. The last two games our O looked great but we are now finding ways to lose again. I feel we need to stop that trend and start finding ways to win.[/QUOTE]

We are not getting blown out like we did under Spurrier. The 31-0 beating we took from the Eagles in Spurriers last year comes to mind.
Things are not that bad right now.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Let's look at things this way, against Dallas and Seattle we won games we probably should have lost.

Now against Denver and KC we lost games we probably should have won.

Everything is just coming out in the wash, now we're even.

Now we can get back to winning this week against the 49ers. :)

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

My 2 cents...take it or leave it.

- 3 Skins turnovers equalled 10 KC Points was the difference in this game.
The Skins outplayed the Chiefs in every aspect of the game except 1...turnovers. Skins D held of the league's top backs to 18 yards on 14 carries, held their #1 wideout Eddie Kennison without a catch, and held the best TE in the league to 2 catches for 13 yards. Brunell threw for 331 yards and 3 TDs, Moss and Cooley together had 16 catches for 227 yards and 3 TDs, and our ground game was sound, as Portis and Cartwright outrushed Holmes and Johnson 91-71.

- Jared Allen had a career day.
Plain and simple. He came out fired up, and only got better as the game wore on. People mention they never heard of him...well, you don't hear of a lot of people on an overall bad defense. This kid proved he can play with the big boys. Other than him, The Chiefs have a below average day on defense.

- The Skins coaching staff isn't making the proper 2nd half adjustments for the offense.
Brunell had a great first half against a shotty Chiefs Defense, just like he did against the Broncos. And just like against the Broncos, his second half faded. Just seems to me that the other team is adjusting to our offense better than us adjusting to their defense.

- Cutting Cartwright is NOT the answer.
Antonio Brown struggled throughout the preseason. The fumble in week 1 was icing on the cake. Cartwright is mostly a special teams player, who filled in for Betts because of injury. While the fumble cost the Skins, the blame can't be squarely on him. If anything, he should have had more carries yesterday, to lighten the load off of Portis.

- It's time LaVar made it into the game.
I'm not saying start him, because it's evident that the coaching staff doesn't want to. However, he needs to be in on more 3rd down situations as an end or blitzing LB. It just seems that the defense can get to the QB, just not fast enough. I think he can turn around the turnover and sack counts.

- Gibbs is underutilizing Portis's ability to break runs outside.
After telling us he's implementing more outside runs, we've yet to really see it. Not sure if he's too comfortable throwing the ball 35+ times or just doesn't trust the ability of blocking schemes, but Portis is a slasher, not a between the tackles runner. Get Portis running outside more will open up the middle for him. I think they did it more yesterday, with good results, and hope they do it more and more.

Each week this season, this team has gotten better and better. Hopefully they continue this trend. People will point at 2 losses in a row...however, they were against tough teams and on the road in brutal environments.

3-2 after 5 games isn't bad, considering that no one except us Skins fans thought we'd be any better off. If the Skins beat the teams they're supposed to (9ers, Raiders, Cards, St. Louis), play tough against the Division opponents, and get a win against either Tampa or San Diego (or both), this team will be in the thick of it.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Apparently everyone also forgot that Dante Hall didn't do SHIT. Coverage was EXCELLENT on special teams.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Actually, Brunell put up bigger numbers in the 2nd half.

In the 1st half he was 11/14 for 110 yards with 1 TD.

In the 2nd half he was 14/27 for 221 yards with 2 TDs.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Bigger numbers but a weaker completion percentage. The Skins had to run more plays in the 2nd half to get those bigger numbers. The Skins also had to play from behind more, raising the urgency level, and throwing more passes. Brunell was on the run more in the 2nd half, and threw the ball away more as well.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

True, but regardless of the circumstances to say he faded isn't exactly accurate.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Here is this year's split for Brunell:

1st Half: 53-78 (67.9%), 517 yards, 3 TDs, 1 INT, 5 Sacks, 93.8 QB Rating
2nd Half: 50-100 (50%), 723 yards, 6 TDs, 1 INT, 7 Sacks, 89.7 QB Rating

1st Quarter: 25-33 (75.8%), 261 yards, 1 TD, 1 INT, 4 Sacks, 95.6 QB Rating
2nd Quarter: 28-45 (62.2%), 256 yards, 2 TDs, 0 INT, 1 Sack, 92.5 QB Rating
3rd Quarter: 25-44 (56.8%), 315 yards, 3 TDs, 0 INT, 3 Sacks, 102 QB Rating
4th Quarter: 23-51 (45.1%), 365 yards, 3 TDs, 1 INT, 4 Sacks, 80.9 QB Rating
Overtime: 2-5 (40%), 43 yards, 0 TD, 0 INT, 0 Sacks, 71.3 QB Rating

Maybe fading isn't the correct wording...however take away the 3 long passes to Moss (2 in the 4th quarter against Dallas, one in the 3rd against the Chiefs), and you'll see that he simply plays better in the 1st half. And quite honestly, since he doesn't call the plays, I push most of the blame on the coaching staff for not making proper adjustments.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Nice breakdown, but like you said when the team is down and he's forced to throw more, of course that will likely end up in a lower completion percentage due to more throwaways, forced throws, etc.

I'm not sure if it has more to do with the plays or just the circumstances of the game, but either way I buy your point he's played more efficiently in the first half of games.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

All it takes is the Redskins being more successful scoring TDs once they get into the red zone, early in the game. If they can actually start building leads early, then it's going to be darn near impossible to beat us with our ball controlled offense.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

We could probably nip - pick about Joe Montana, Brett Farve, etc.... when it comes down to it, Brunell is running this offense quite well and right now, he gives us the best chance at winning. We're 3-2 and have a great chance at being 4-2 after this coming weekend. That is a whole heck of a lot better than a season ago.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

[QUOTE=LadyT]I, too, am starting to wonder why it's ok for Brunell to fumble, but not ok for Ramsey. BTW - Brunell had more than his share of fumbles last year too. To paraphrase a line from George Orwell's "Animal Farm" - Every player is equal, but some are more equal than others, right?

Brunell is playing far better than he did last year, which isn't really saying much. But those fumbles are becoming an increasing concern.[/QUOTE]

The reason many prefer Brunell to Ramsey is not because he fumbles any less. In fact, they both fumble as much as the other when hit by D-linemen. The simple reason is that a healthy Brunell is more accurate and throws fewer INTs - that is indisputable.

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

Amen

Re: Same Ol' Story
 

To curse out Brunell at this point is retarded IMO.

He hasn't been perfect - but pretty damn close. Jeez what do you want from the guy? Granted the 2nd fumble was his fault but come on! Should we dump Santana cuz he dropped a pass?

Brunell has played phenomenal, and more importantly, he's running Gibbs' offense perfectly. He's making smart choices, ducking unblocked sacks, getting out of the pocket when he needs to, throwing the ball away when he needs to, and the list goes on. I mean how many times has Brunell missed an open receiver or thrown a stupid pass into double coverage?

I makes me feel stupid defending the play of our team MVP so far.