Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

Would we all agree that it is in everybodys best interest to get Campbell in there at some point this season? If we lose 2 out of the next 3 games and the offense still looks like crap, then what? Put Campbell in then? IMO if they put him in now, we dont lose that much from the qb position, and we will probably be in the same position with a losing record, but Campbell needs to play eventually.

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

with all that being said......i will be the first one in line at the crow eating contest if MB suddenly finds the fountain of youth.

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[quote=12thMan;217570]We can't say with certainty that the team will struggle with JC in there until JC actually get's in there.

It's all speculation at this point. And given the current offensive production, system or no, the drop off wouldn't be that dramatic if at all.[/quote]


its all speculation that Brunell will struggle as much with Portis in the game as much as he does with out him. Until we have the most valuable piece of this offense on the field, its unfair to blame Brunell. Look at KC, fortunately they had LJ in the wings waiting, but there offense was geared around the RB. same as when he was in St. Louis. Faulk was the man. the WR and offense just doesn't move the same unless the #1 piece is in the huddle. In our case it is Portis. I wont judge anything from this game if Portis is playing because its Houston. I want to see the whole product on the field against Jacksonville. But, I think they can use Houston as a confidence builder (if in fact we play well)

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[QUOTE=#56fanatic;217555]If we put Campbell in, you, me, and everyone else has to know that we are going to struggle just as much, if not more. JC does not have the kind of grasp of the offense needed to make the difference everyone thinks he will. [/QUOTE]

if JC struggled just as much, at least he'd be learning the offense for the future. if he struggled more, it'd still apply. do we really want Brunell to learn this offense for his 36yr old future? cuz "winning now" looks FAR from happening.

hurts to think how much JC would've grasped this offense if he took ALL the practice snaps with the first team during this year's (oh-so-productive) off/pre-season.

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[quote=#56fanatic;217582]its all speculation that Brunell will struggle as much with Portis in the game as much as he does with out him. Until we have the most valuable piece of this offense on the field, its unfair to blame Brunell. Look at KC, fortunately they had LJ in the wings waiting, but there offense was geared around the RB. same as when he was in St. Louis. Faulk was the man. the WR and offense just doesn't move the same unless the #1 piece is in the huddle. In our case it is Portis. I wont judge anything from this game if Portis is playing because its Houston. I want to see the whole product on the field against Jacksonville. But, I think they can use Houston as a confidence builder (if in fact we play well)[/quote]

I don't think you can put Brunell's inefficiency on Portis missing in the backfield. No doubt, Portis is a huge part of our offense - huge! However, Brunell couldn't get the ball to his receivers, that's not a function of Portis not lining up behind you. Brunell floated the ball and never took it deep, that's not a function of Portis not lining up behind you. He often scrambled into the pass rush or his release was either late or too early, nothing to do with Portis behind the QB.

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[quote=Stacks42;217491]Dont know if anyone has posted this yet, but haha!

[URL="http://www.bangcartoon.com/cartoons/index.cfm/fa/viewcartoon/cartoon/2004Archive%7Cpassingfancy.swf"]Cartoons | Bang Cartoon[/URL][/quote]

:laughing2

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[quote=gibbsisgod;217579]with all that being said......i will be the first one in line at the crow eating contest if MB suddenly finds the fountain of youth.[/quote]

Dude, line me up for that Crow burger. In fact, Offiss can be the Chef and serve the first meal:)

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[quote=12thMan;217590]I don't think you can put Brunell's inefficiency on Portis missing in the backfield. No doubt, Portis is a huge part of our offense - huge! However, Brunell couldn't get the ball to his receivers, that's not a function of Portis not lining up behind you. Brunell floated the ball and never took it deep, that's not a function of Portis not lining up behind you. He often scrambled into the pass rush or his release was either late or too early, nothing to do with Portis behind the QB.[/quote]

He can't get the ball to the receivers because the defenses KNOW we can't run the ball and are playing pass on every play. They're also sending blitzes because they aren't buying the playactions...and they shouldn't. Extra coverage and a pass rush that is sure they're going to get the the QB is not an easy thing to overcome for ANYONE. Add in that Betts can't block and that's a nightmare for Brunell. Saunders wanted to go deep, but Brunell didn't have the time to wait for the receivers to get downfield AND get open in double-coverage.

Proof - SIX sacks by Dallas, would've been a couple more if Brunell hadn't ducked and ran away from a few.

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[quote=12thMan;217590]I don't think you can put Brunell's inefficiency on Portis missing in the backfield. No doubt, Portis is a huge part of our offense - huge! However, Brunell couldn't get the ball to his receivers, that's not a function of Portis not lining up behind you. Brunell floated the ball and never took it deep, that's not a function of Portis not lining up behind you. He often scrambled into the pass rush or his release was either late or too early, nothing to do with Portis behind the QB.[/quote]


I will say this : When teams purposely take the deep passing game from teams, which minnesota and Dallas both did, we have to be able to run the ball. Running the ball effectively brings a safety or two towards the line of scrimmage, which in turn opens more plays down the field. If a team can sit in a 2 deep coverage the entire game you will NOT be able to throw down field. and the one time he did, what happened, it was picked, BY THE SAFETY. No one thinks Betts can run the ball. If a team can control the running attack with the front 6 or 7, the deep passing game will not exist. Betts couldn't run, the line couldn't run block, what ever happened, it goes hand and hand.

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[quote=Buster;217598]He can't get the ball to the receivers because the defenses KNOW we can't run the ball and are playing pass on every play. They're also sending blitzes because they aren't buying the playactions...and they shouldn't. Extra coverage and a pass rush that is sure they're going to get the the QB is not an easy thing to overcome for ANYONE. Add in that Betts can't block and that's a nightmare for Brunell. Saunders wanted to go deep, but Brunell didn't have the time to wait for the receivers to get downfield AND get open in double-coverage.[/quote]

Ummm....I'll buy some of that. Look, blitz or not, he's been largely ineffective. QBs get blitzed all the time, man. They adjust in the pocket, take the hit and complete the damn ball. If he did this occasionally, it would be a good thing.

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[quote=#56fanatic;217603]I will say this : When teams purposely take the deep passing game from teams, which minnesota and Dallas both did, we have to be able to run the ball. Running the ball effectively brings a safety or two towards the line of scrimmage, which in turn opens more plays down the field. If a team can sit in a 2 deep coverage the entire game you will NOT be able to throw down field. and the one time he did, what happened, it was picked, BY THE SAFETY. No one thinks Betts can run the ball. If a team can control the running attack with the front 6 or 7, the deep passing game will not exist. Betts couldn't run, the line couldn't run block, what ever happened, it goes hand and hand.[/quote]

I agree with what you're saying here. I'm denying that teams are prepared to defend us because Portis is missing. We have blocking issues as well. I totally agree. I think you're right on with your analysis of how teams have been stacking the box too.

But when the guy can't get the ball down the field,that's entierly different deal. You're telling me that these guys have Brandon Lloyd, Moss, and Randel El...and Cooley covered all the time, every play?

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

Portis should not be saving Brunell's career. people expect Portis to singlehandledly to bring the safeties up with his running, and then block the blitzers with his 220lb frame for Brunell's passes to connect? what's next, Portis actually helping Brunell with his throwing motion on the field?

young Brunell would have made some of those plays work with just his arm and legs, but that seems like ages ago.

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[quote=12thMan;217570]We can't say with certainty that the team will struggle with JC in there until JC actually get's in there.

It's all speculation at this point. And given the current offensive production, system or no, [B]the drop off wouldn't be that dramatic if at all[/B].[/quote]

You sure? Mark has thrown only 1 INT this year. Most QBS have 2 or more, looking at the stats. Simms (TB) has 6, Plummer (DEN), Collins (TEN) and Frye (CLE) have 4 each.

Brunell is in the middle of the pack in completion %. Better than Delhomme, Favre, Bulger, Collins, Vick, Roethlisberger, Alex Smith, Plummer, Tom Brady, Bledsoe, McNair, Brad Johnson, Chris Simms and all of the part-time QBs that have played.

He fumbled once but didn't lose it. Most of the QBs in the NFL have 1 or 2 LOST FUMBLES so far.

He threw for 197 yards despite being sacked 6 times against Dallas.

It could be a LOT worse.

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[quote=illdefined;217610]Portis should not be saving Brunell's career. people expect Portis to singlehandledly to bring the safeties up with his running, and then block the blitzers with his 220lb frame for Brunell's passes to connect? what's next, Portis actually helping Brunell with his throwing motion on the field?

young Brunell would have made some of those plays work with just his arm and legs, but that seems like ages ago.[/quote]

Elway and Montana stopped running a lot later in their careers too, were they trash too?

Re: Time to bench Brunell? (Mega-merge)
 

[QUOTE=Buster;217612]You sure? Mark has thrown only 1 INT this year. Most QBS have 2 or more, looking at the stats. Simms (TB) has 6, Plummer (DEN), Collins (TEN) and Frye (CLE) have 4 each.[/QUOTE]

how many TDs do those guys have? how many does Brunell have so far this year including preseason?

hmm, my posts must be easy to ignore.