Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[quote=freddyg12;340644]Doesn't sound like he's ratting on anybody, more the opposite if anything, that his boys are on him.

I don't think it's a light sentence for a plea deal. A deal is always a lighter sentence, or there would be no incentive for it. Is it light compared to what he might get if the feds add additional charges related to conspiring in a gambling operation? yes, but that's all the more reason the feds are threatening those charges, so they can make this deal & be done w/it.

I see him playing again. He'll get the right pr help & try to make amends w/the public. One thing he may have going for him is that it sounded from the indictment that he tried to distance himself from the operation 3 years ago when he & TAylor had the falling out. Did he get out of the business then? I guess that remains to be seen.[/quote]


Probably not a light sentence for a plea deal, but a light sentence for what he was involved with according to the indictment. I hope he doesn't take the deal and goes away for longer, but I'm sure he has good lawyers that will tell him that would be stupid (but then again obviously he is).

It is possible he implicates others, maybe not anyone we'll know, but it could be part of his deal. That is what a deal is, you give us something and plead guilty to these charges, and we'll give you a lesser sentence for cooperating.

I think it would be a big mistake for the NFL to let him play again.

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[quote=Chief X_Phackter;340646]Probably not a light sentence for a plea deal, but a light sentence for what he was involved with according to the indictment. I hope he doesn't take the deal and goes away for longer, but I'm sure he has good lawyers that will tell him that would be stupid (but then again obviously he is).

It is possible he implicates others, maybe not anyone we'll know, but it could be part of his deal. That is what a deal is, you give us something and plead guilty to these charges, and we'll give you a lesser sentence for cooperating.

I think it would be a big mistake for the NFL to let him play again.[/quote]

Why would it be a mistake for him to play in the NFL again if he pays his debt? We are talking about dog fighting. Not murder of a human being. Jeez!

Leonard Little is still playing in the NFL and what he did was so much worse than what Vick. In case you don't know about Leonard, he killed a women in a drunk driving accident. He smashed into her car after he ran a red light and he was drunk. Still playing in the NFL. Now what is worse?

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[quote=skinsfan69;340647]Why would it be a mistake for him to play in the NFL again if he pays his debt? We are talking about dog fighting. Not murder of a human being. Jeez!

Leonard Little is still playing in the NFL and what he did was so much worse than what Vick. In case you don't know about Leonard, he killed a women in a drunk driving accident. He smashed into her car after he ran a red light and he was drunk. Still playing in the NFL. Now what is worse?[/quote]


Don't forget Ray Lewis.

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[quote=70Chip;340650]Don't forget Ray Lewis.[/quote]

Well, Lewis didn't kill anybody. I think all the evidence points towards the two thugs he was with. But he covered it up and played dumb to the police. So in my view that is worse than what Vick did.

Fighting pit bulls and betting on it is wrong and I certainly don't condone it. It's disgusting. But a year or more in jail? C'mon!

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[QUOTE=mlmpetert;340616]Honestly a year is way to much. He has never been convicted of anything before. How is fighting some dogs (personal property) worth getting a YEAR is prison? Poor guy. No way he should accept.[/QUOTE]

Its not the dog fighting, its the interstate gambling that went along with the dogfighting. The gambling is why the feds are involved. The dogfighting is just a disgusting enabler for the gambling.

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;340647]Why would it be a mistake for him to play in the NFL again if he pays his debt? We are talking about dog fighting. Not murder of a human being. Jeez!

Leonard Little is still playing in the NFL and what he did was so much worse than what Vick. In case you don't know about Leonard, he killed a women in a drunk driving accident. He smashed into her car after he ran a red light and he was drunk. Still playing in the NFL. Now what is worse?[/QUOTE]

Someone would probably say that what Little did was a one-time unfortunate tragedy that was not deliberate or intentional (although I believe he's been arrested again since then for drunk driving right?) while Vick deliberately ran a dogfighting ring for several years that resulted in the brutal deaths of several living creatures.

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

If I ran the league, I would probably institute a policy of restricting felons from participating in the the league. I just don't think it sounds right for felons to be playing in the NFL.

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[quote=Chief X_Phackter;340646]Probably not a light sentence for a plea deal, but a light sentence for what he was involved with according to the indictment. I hope he doesn't take the deal and goes away for longer, but I'm sure he has good lawyers that will tell him that would be stupid (but then again obviously he is).

It is possible he implicates others, maybe not anyone we'll know, but it could be part of his deal. That is what a deal is, you give us something and plead guilty to these charges, and we'll give you a lesser sentence for cooperating.

I think it would be a big mistake for the NFL to let him play again.[/quote]

You're right, once he agrees to start talking he might inadvertently give up a lot of people.
Remember the max. sentence w/the charges right now (not the charges the feds might add) is only 5 years. 1 year out of that 5 seems reasonable. I would also think that if it went to trial & he lost (w/only the current charges) that he could get a few years w/most of it suspended. Not sure if the fed. charges have sentencing guidelines that preclude suspending parts of a sentence.

I don't see why the nfl wouldn't let him back if he's contrite & serves his time, etc. I think he's already on track to do that, as he's apologized to the falcons & fans. the only way I see this ending his career is if the gambling stuff is linked to sports, especially football. Then he'd really be screwed, and the timing of the nba ref doesn't help either.

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[quote=skinsfan69;340652]Well, Lewis didn't kill anybody. I think all the evidence points towards the two thugs he was with. But he covered it up and played dumb to the police. So in my view that is worse than what Vick did.

Fighting pit bulls and betting on it is wrong and I certainly don't condone it. It's disgusting. But a year or more in jail? C'mon![/quote]


Just so you know, I didn't establish the laws Vick broke or the potential sentencing for breaking those laws. The fact of the matter is that he faces at least $350,000 in fines and six years in prison if convicted of all the charges. So, more than a year in jail???? YES

The indictment claims that Vick and his codefendants killed no less than 8 dogs that either lost fights or failed fight tests. The method of killing ranged from electrocution, drowning, hanging to slamming a dog’s body to the ground until dead.

I have no sympathy for whatever happens to him and I really hope he gets the max.

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[QUOTE=Carnage;340635]There is no such thing as Parole from federal prison. He will do every day of his sentence.[/QUOTE]

really? Never knew that... I can gladly say my experience with Fed Prison is limited to what I read and watch on tv. :) Still, he should take the deal.

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[QUOTE=SmootSmack;340656]Someone would probably say that what Little did was a one-time unfortunate tragedy that was not deliberate or intentional (although I believe he's been arrested again since then for drunk driving right?) while Vick deliberately ran a dogfighting ring for several years that resulted in the brutal deaths of several living creatures.[/QUOTE]

I think there's an interesting point there. I'm not sure which side of this I'm on. While I see the arguement regarding lack of intent on Little's part, the reoccurences of the same behavior show an obvious lack of concern and appreciation for the loss of life he caused. Quite honestly, I believe he (Little) should be in jail right now.

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[QUOTE=mlmpetert;340616]Honestly a year is way to much. He has never been convicted of anything before. How is fighting some dogs (personal property) worth getting a YEAR is prison? Poor guy. No way he should accept.[/QUOTE]

No sense in piling on but are you serious with this post or just trolling?

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[QUOTE=BleedBurgundy;340664]I think there's an interesting point there. I'm not sure which side of this I'm on. While I see the arguement regarding lack of intent on Little's part, the reoccurences of the same behavior show an obvious lack of concern and appreciation for the loss of life he caused. Quite honestly, I believe he (Little) should be in jail right now.[/QUOTE]

I wonder if he got any jail time for the second offense? Something tells me he didn't

I remember seeing a pretty compelling piece a few years ago about the victim's husband. He's a photographer for Sports Illustrated I believe. So he has to actually attend a lot of NFL games. He said it makes him pretty sick to his stomach that he has to stand there and take pictures of the man who killed his wife making millions to run around and play a game. But at the same time, he finds it somewhat therapeutic.

Anyway, back to Vick. Something else I've heard is that if it goes to trial a lot of big names might be revealed. Major NFL, NBA, and Hollywood stars. A lot of people would prefer this doesn't go to trial.

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[quote=SmootSmack;340666]

Anyway, back to Vick. Something else I've heard is that if it goes to trial a lot of big names might be revealed. Major NFL, NBA, and Hollywood stars. A lot of people would prefer this doesn't go to trial.[/quote]


Just as I suspected. That is probably part of the deal, so we may in fact find out even if it doesn't go to trial.

Re: Vick Offered Minimum One Year Prison Sentence as Part of Plea Deal
 

[QUOTE=skinsfan69;340647]Why would it be a mistake for him to play in the NFL again if he pays his debt? We are talking about dog fighting. Not murder of a human being. Jeez!

Leonard Little is still playing in the NFL and what he did was so much worse than what Vick. In case you don't know about Leonard, he killed a women in a drunk driving accident. He smashed into her car after he ran a red light and he was drunk. Still playing in the NFL. Now what is worse?[/QUOTE]

The fact that Little and Lewis are still playing in the NFL is wrong. IMO, they both should have been banned. I think if they had committed these acts in today's NFL they would be in for significant bans. They did not and, for good or ill, Goodell is not retroactively going after bad behavior previously known to the NFL, only the bad behavior that he becomes aware of on his watch.

IMO, - b/c some who have performed reprehensible behavior and not been punished for it is not basis for failing to punish others who perform reprehensible behavior. (Following your logic - Because an admitted murderer is not convicted due to procedural or substantive errors by the State, we should never prosecute murderers).

As to the relative evil of Vick's actions, I realize there has been a series of threads about where, on the scale of evil, dogfighting should be placed. Here is my two cents on the subject: While I believe cruelty to animals is akin to cruelty to children (not the same as but of a like kind) and that those who practice it should have a special place in hell reserved for them, I recognize others do not feel this way.

I understand the crux of the argument of those who say "dogs are not human so don't apply 'human' penalties for their mistreatment". In fact, I don't disagree with the concept that animals and humans are fundamentally different and it is improper to act like killing an animal is the same as killing a human. With that said, we as humans are charged with caring for animals, particularly domesticated animals, because they are (like children) incapable of making their own choices and, in the case of domesticated animals, incapable of caring for themselves (and have been made that way by us).

Cruelty to those in your care, whether they be animals or human is simply wrong. For those who say, "it's just dogs", that has already been factored into the equation. If Vick had been accused of this type of cruelty to humans, there would be no question he would be going away for life or subject to the death penalty. Thus, to me, just on the cruelty issue, a one year prison term is not out of line for the nature of his actions. (As an extreme example of the other end of the spectrum - "cruelty to plants" wouldn't even warrant a storyline).

Finally, regardless of where you place his actions on the "evil scale", and as someone pointed out before, Vick conspired to create, participate in and fund illegal activities on a broad scale. We live under the rule of law, it is imperfect and flawed, but it is one of the driving tenets of our society.

Whether you agree or disagree that the act should be illegal, our society, as we know it, can only function if everyone accepts the proposition that acting illegally should be punished FURTHER - because to function as a society operating under the rule of law we have to trust one another to act legally, any penalty for an illegal act will be greatly enhanced when it can be demonstrated that you conspired to act illegally and, thus, attacked the very foundation of the rule of law.

As for a life time ban from football, the NFL has every right to determine, independent of the criminal penalties, that its product would be injured by allowing a convicted felon who conspired to act illegally to participate. Because of the basic deceptiveness of Vick's actions, any employer would rightfully suspect the trustworthiness and credibility of his statements. The NFL has the same right as any employer to legitimately judge Vick on his actions, independent of those of any other employee, and act appropriately.