Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

Not as dumb as Fisher would be if he even contemplated playing for Danny the Bozo. Best guess here is that he wouldn't.

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

[quote=joeredskin;613400]remember, belicheck was also a retread. Dungy didn't win a sb with "the team he built" in tbay. He had to be a "retread" in indy to get it. Retread j. Gruden won his sb [i]against[/i] the team he built in oakland. Retread t. Coughlin won a sb after being run out on a rail from jacksonville. Retread d. Vermeil got a sb with the rams and got damn close with kcity.

None of these coaches were successful in their first stints. You're right - patience is required [i]but[/i] there may be something to be said for hiring a coach who knows how to manage a game and build a team. Even if he doesn't bring championships, maybe as dungy did in tbay, they can set the stage for further success.

[b]but - for the record - i am with the "first gm, then hc" crowd[/b]. I just think a new gm should not discount those with hc exp. Just b/c they didn't win a gazillion sb's in their first stint.[/quote]

me toooo!

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

I like Gruden over all of them. Oalkand wins the Super Bowl, the year of the tuck rule, and who knows how many more they win. If Gruden wasnt coaching Tampa they would have never beat Oakland its well known how Gruden schemed and picked Oaklands offense apart in that game. Look how quickly Oakland fell apart after Gruden left and Tampa will look at them right now. Gruden has so much respect for the game Im sure he woud be honored to take over this franchise.

Gruden might be the only coach we can hire before a GM. He wants an organiztion willing to get the best players for what he wants. And he loves the grind of the long hours and football in general.

Gruden coaching Oakland and Dungy coaching Tampa in the Super Bowl. I go hands down Gruden. Dungy way over rated, he is mediocre coach that took him years to build a respectable defense to be to handle the of the Patriots. And he was a so called Defensive guru, P.Manning thats where his praise comes from without him he would never lead that team into success.

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

[quote=Angry;613329]GM first, coach second. If we hire a Coach before a GM, then we are back to square 1.[/quote]

Bingo, we have a winner, or was that a TD?

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

[quote=MrSpectre;613405]Not as dumb as Fisher would be if he even contemplated playing for Danny the Bozo. Best guess here is that he wouldn't.[/quote]

Yeah, I agree, it would be dumb for Jeff Fisher to come play for us.

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

[quote=Buster;613508]Yeah, I agree, it would be dumb for Jeff Fisher to come play for us.[/quote]

LOL. Well played

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;613330]And he has also gone from:

13-3 to 7-9

12-4 to 5-11

13-3 to 0-6 so far this year.

He's like a rollercoaster.[/quote]

He's a recognizable name that's why his name will be brought up in discussions here. I want to see some other things happen before even considering the thought of who the next coach might be. Too much unfinished business.

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;613346]It's like in sports, what have you done for me lately mentality. Most fans in this forum have no patience and want things turned around overnite and think this guys are saviors. I rather take my chance with a young/hungry proven coordinator (not QB coach) than this retreads who have had their chances.[/quote]

Well in response to you and Smootsmack, it's not so much that we want the 'name' but we want their system, their structure, their professionalism. Does anyone think for a minute that outside of maybe Holmgren or Floyd Reese that if Snyder hires a 'young/hungry' GM and or coach that he's not going to try to bully and big time him as soon as he feels the itch?

I'd like to think that Snyder's matured since the Schottenheimer ordeal to realize that when you've got a guy with a system, a structure and a plan, especially someone with a proven track record, you let him do what he does. I don't think he's matured to that point with just anyone though.

I think the whole 'what has Shanahan done without Elway' or 'he won with Dungy's team' argument is bunk. Each team is a different situation. Shanahan has had a winning program with clowns like Jake Plummer and Brian Griese. Gruden turned over about 35-40% of the roster in his first season and won the Super Bowl. Who is to say what happens if one of them takes over in DC? Maybe they draft the next Matt Ryan, find a Steve Slaton in the 4th or 5th round, sign 3 OL and the light comes on for one of the young WR. What's it going to be then? He is just winning because of the defense that Vinny Ceratto built?

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

[quote=calia;613402]I don't understand the original post and the reference to Cowher -- and spoecifically the statement about what's he done in 14 years at Pittsburgh. A lot, actually. He's had great teams, won a SB, and not with big name, flashy guys, but blue collar workhorses (kind of like the old Redskins teams). Pittsburgh never goes crazy in free agency, they seem to have managed the cap well, and he's done with while grooming a group of excellent young coaches ([B]Tomlin, Whisenhunt, Grimm[/B]) -- and it takes good coaching all around to win. Most of the great head coaches had great assistants, and Cowher knows how to develop them. Plus, I wouldn't mind a head coach with some fire.

Having said all of that, he's probably looking at the Redskins franchise right now and thinking to himself that there are 1000 things he'd rather do that get bogged down with this mess.[/quote]
You can give him credit for Winenhunt but Grimm really cut his coaching teeth here under Norv (although I still don't get why Redskins fans think he's such a great coach) and Tomlin was an outside hire.

Either way Cowher is the one big name I think we can completely discount as coming here. Unless Carolina turns it around in a major way, John Fox is out and Cowher is in.

Hey, maybe John Fox will be the next Redskins coach! Been to the Super Bowl, they won 12 games last year! He's a FIT!! [/sarcasm]

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

I'd actually give up the farm for Fisher. The guys knows what the hell he is doing. If we could get him just to be GM I'd be damn impressed.

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

[quote=SmootSmack;613356]I like Jeff Fisher. Great coach, better person. But that doesn't mean I want him here. I don't understand why we keep complaining that Snyder just goes after the big names...and then just talk about bringing in big names.

What we should do is find the next great coach (and it's not Zorn it seems). Maybe it's Brian Schottenheimer, maybe it's Jeremy Bates, maybe it's Kyle Shanahan, maybe it's Pete Carmichael, maybe it's Darell Bevell, maybe it's Rob Ryan...and so on

The danger of course is that it could backfire completely, but at this point why not take that chance?[/quote]

We just tried this with Zorn. One things that is abundantly clear... Snyder is a poor judge of football talent...both coaching and players. He hasn't yet made a voila football talent decision. I guess you could argue that Schottenheimer was close but then he f'd that up by canning him after one year.

DS doesn't have the chops to make football decisions. We're going to have to get lucky in that he'll hire the right guy at GM and give him all the power to make the football decisions.

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

[quote=FRPLG;613533]We just tried this with Zorn. One things that is abundantly clear... Snyder is a poor judge of football talent...both coaching and players. He hasn't yet made a voila football talent decision. I guess you could argue that Schottenheimer was close but then he f'd that up by canning him after one year.

DS doesn't have the chops to make football decisions. We're going to have to get lucky in that he'll hire the right guy at GM and give him all the power to make the football decisions.[/quote]

Your last paragraph says it all............Case Closed.

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

[quote=SmootSmack;613362]Zorn was an odd chance to take. A 55 year old with no play calling experience. [B]Meanwhile Kyle Shanahan is 29 years old and has been calling plays for a couple of years now[/B][/quote]

You know my friend screams on this guy all the time. But say that Danny feels that way too and he get's Kyle and then hires a GM. I'd be fine with it but wouldn't the masses still be upset ? It's lose lose for real but I think he'd be a pretty decent choice.

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

[quote=Longtimefan;613523]He's a recognizable name that's why his name will be brought up in discussions here. I want to see some other things happen before even considering the thought of who the next coach might be. Too much unfinished business.[/quote]

I totally agree with you, and was going to post something to the same respect. I find it funny that every HC out there who may be on the hot seat or currently doesn't have a job because of being fired, "retiring", or being pushed out the door alla Mike Holmgren is a new discussion and thread on the forum.

1st thing first.. GM... period. I can't sit here and say whole heartedly that we will be successful with coach a or b without a new FO system in place that gets danny out of the cookie jar. Look I wanted our way of doing things to work. As did everyone else here, but at this point it is not going to. We can't over pay free agents and then bitch because we have no depth. We have no money to get ourselves any depth.

Also at this point we don't have anyone who can pick good talent. AND WE NEED A SYSTEM IN PLACE TO GET THE RIGHT TALENT AS WELL. We need guys that fit our "system". Which right now isn't very clearly defined. A WC passing attack mixed with an 80's running game? You know why we have this backwards ass offensive system in place. Because we don't have a clearly defined way of running the franchise. This is what happens when you hire an OC who is only installing a passing game and then turn the guy into the HC. Remember we kept Joe Gibbs running game. So Zorn is only using half of the WCO playbook. This is so stupid. This is why the offense sux so bad. Well among many other problems with this franchise. RETARDED VINNY. Come on, hire the whole staff then try and find a HC to fit around them? What HC worth a salt would have taken the job back in 08? None. Except for washed up Jim Fassel or Steve Mariucci? A couple of winners there huh? Well this is where we are and it is time to blow up Redskin Park's inner structure.

So I could really care less about Jeff Fisher. I want to know who the next GM is, and when he is going to start getting this thing turned around. No more band aids.

Re: Here's our chance for Jeff Fisher
 

In case there was any confusion, I think Fisher is great and I wouldn't be upset if he was our next coach. I'm just saying I wish we could find our own Jeff Fisher is all I'm saying. I wish, for example, someone like Kirk Olivadotti could take over on an interim basis and then suddenly be here for the next 16 years (the same way Fisher was in Houston/Tennessee). That's all