Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=SoCalSkinsFan;232610]I have an idea: tackle the guy with the f-ing ball. And enough with the stupid penalties. Brunell didn't contribute to either of those factors in losing the game. And somehow Greg Williams doesn't seem to get enough blame. We give up almost 25 points a game! JC, Brunell or whoever, we ain't winning too many games with that type of D.

And someone please put Arculetta and Samuels out of their misery. They're done.[/quote]

I agree that Samuels is overrated but he is no worse than a top 5 tackle. Archuletta is garbage. Unfortunately, we are stuck with them for a while. I would like to see Archuletta benched, at least we will find out if the guy has any pride.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

The OL has had only 1 solid game this season. Samuels and Jansen are having horrible seasons. They both gave up sacks today, for the second week in a row. Most probowl tackels give up less than 5 a season. Its hard to trash Brunell when he can't even set his feet to throw because he's running for his life.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

I CANT DEAL WITH THIS CRAP ANYMORE. Everything bothers me about the skins right now. Because im so frustrated im going to go ahead and say it but I still blame it all on Norv Turner

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

I think you are right. FA's that played great, sucked after they came here, we had stupid penalties and we never performed to our ability. It's the curse of Turner

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[QUOTE=CPDAMAN;232615]I think you are right. FA's that played great, sucked after they came here, we had stupid penalties and we never performed to our ability. It's the curse of Turner[/QUOTE]
Why is he a curse? Is it because he was from Dallas or is b/c he sucked so bad.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote]I remember at one point in the first half Brunell was 10 of 15 with ?? yards. Then they gave the sacks/hurries numbers. There were 10 hurries. That means, in spite of all the dump-offs, he only had 5 unpressured passes. So can you try to go downfield if your OLine is so weak that you get pressured doing just short dump-offs? My feeling is that Saunders doesn't call the downfield plays because he doesn't trust the OLine to hold up long enough. And remember all those holding penalties? There's a lot more of them when the line has to pass protect for more time.[/quote]

Yeah, I remember when they showed that. Peytons hit was higher and hurried was the same. Really kept him from doing anything,

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

Gee, I seem to remember Peyton's was lower. Since you bring this up, and I don't have the videotape, could someone please post the corresponding stat(s) for Peyton, i.e. attempts, completions, and hurries. Thanks.

[QUOTE=Daseal;232622]Yeah, I remember when they showed that. Peytons hit was higher and hurried was the same. Really kept him from doing anything,[/QUOTE]

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

I'm not going to bother defending Brunell right now, because no one else around the league thinks this is his fault. The offense is generally very good, and the only thing thats inconsistent about this offense is O Line play. In the first half, it was generally very good, and so was the offense. But in the second half, it wasn't, and neither was the offense. Those guys up front need to play with some more consistency.

As for the D, they took huge strides in the first half this week. As for the 2nd half performance, I don't care who they are playing. Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Terry Bradshaw, Johnny Unitas, Marino, Elway...you DO NOT give up 3 TDs on the first 3 drives of the half that easily. The D Line was a huge bright spot in the first half and when they came out for the 2nd, it was an entirely different unit. They made Addai look like Edge. There are no bright spots on this defense right now.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=GTripp0012;232625]I'm not going to bother defending Brunell right now, because no one else around the league thinks this is his fault. The offense is generally very good, and the only thing thats inconsistent about this offense is O Line play. In the first half, it was generally very good, and so was the offense. But in the second half, it wasn't, and neither was the offense. Those guys up front need to play with some more consistency.

As for the D, they took huge strides in the first half this week. As for the 2nd half performance, I don't care who they are playing. Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Terry Bradshaw, Johnny Unitas, Marino, Elway...you DO NOT give up 3 TDs on the first 3 drives of the half that easily. The D Line was a huge bright spot in the first half and when they came out for the 2nd, it was an entirely different unit. They made Addai look like Edge. There are no bright spots on this defense right now.[/quote]


We were scared of manning. Gregg Williams was scared. you don't put 3 guys down to rush manning and think you can make a zone blanket he can't pick apart given all day.

The running... well everyone has been doing that to us...

We need to start playing in our opponent's backfield constantly like we did 2 years ago....

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

Another thing that's happened this year is that Saunders's system doesn't allow for many audibles at the line of scrimmage. Brunell did that (I believe effectively) in prior years. As you saw, Peyton changed many plays at the line of scrimmage. As it is, there is now no way to adjust a play for the defensive set. This has got to make life harder for the offense.

The offense is averaging 20 points/game. 21/game two years ago would have gone 13-2-1. But our defense is allowing 26/game!
Who has allowed more total points than we have(171)? The Jets, Lions, and 49ers. That's it!
To contrast, at Denver's current rate, their defense would take 1 1/2 years to yield 171 points.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=hesscl34;232386]It's not Brunell, at all..

Sorry Skins. It's all about TEAM. And our TEAM isn't playing well. To be honest, I think it's ego. We are up at the 1/2, our guys feel good and they let it go. Time and Time again. It's all about thought, and these guys believe they are great so when they are up they let down and think it's a cake walk and we lose = Titans = Vikings.
[/quote]

wow, time to put down the pom-poms. "it's not brunell [B]AT ALL[/B]"???. Wrong answer. no throws deep = 10 in the box = no running or screen game. Either he can't throw long or he won't, but strictly horizontal offenses don't work in the NFL.

defense and OL played horribly too, but even with that, it's time for brunell to go back home now.



and it's not ego, it's lack of talent or bad playcalling (or both, your choice). they were LUCKY to be up, lucky to get a return TD, and lucky that they didn't get bombed to death earlier.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=mike340;232624]Gee, I seem to remember Peyton's was lower. Since you bring this up, and I don't have the videotape, could someone please post the corresponding stat(s) for Peyton, i.e. attempts, completions, and hurries. Thanks.[/quote]

after the first half it was the same. peyton's better and the colt's DL is better, but honestly, if not for garbage time, brunell would have had another 160 yard game. People around here act like facing a good DE is an automatic excuse for brunell, even though plenty of other teams are able to cope, it's somehow okay that our QB can't. yes, the OL wasn't great, but seriously, less koolaid please, he's just not that good.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

those 5 yard passes were pretty obvious yasterday when even aikman was wondering out loud about them. 3 steps and the ball comes out isnt going to win alot of games in the nfl.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

The only thing that makes MBs stats look even half way decent is all the garbage time yards he picked up. It isnt all MBs fault. The fault lies with the overpaid and over aged coaches that cant seem to find a way to make the system work with the players they have. The fault also lies with the front office that signs players onl to find out later they cant do what the coaches need them to do.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[QUOTE=Grim21Reaper;232612]I agree that Samuels is overrated but he is no worse than a top 5 tackle. Archuletta is garbage. Unfortunately, we are stuck with them for a while. I would like to see Archuletta benched, at least we will find out if the guy has any pride.[/QUOTE]


In all fairness to Samuels I thought the coaching staff should have found a way to give him some help with Freeney knowing he has problems with speed rushers. It not like they don't know, so some help should have been there.

I'm not going to talk about Brunell anymore because everything that can be said about him has already been said ,except for the fact we have nine more games to talk about him some more.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

Bring back Bill Musgrave!!!!

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

What's Brunell's starting record during his three years with the Redskins? Even with last year's 9-6 (he didn't start the first game), he has a losing record. That's the bottom line: He is a losing QB who has lost the ability to make plays every game.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=TAFKAS;232738]Bring back Bill Musgrave!!!![/quote]

he seems to have helped vick this year. i'd say he's pretty good.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=That Guy;232755]he seems to have helped vick this year. i'd say he's pretty good.[/quote]

I agree. Living down here in Atlanta, the Falcons' fans are split between loving and hating Vick. But, hell, he makes plays and wins games like yesterday against the Steelers. Makes me envious at times.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=mike340;232632]Another thing that's happened this year is that Saunders's system doesn't allow for many audibles at the line of scrimmage. Brunell did that (I believe effectively) in prior years. As you saw, Peyton changed many plays at the line of scrimmage. As it is, there is now no way to adjust a play for the defensive set. This has got to make life harder for the offense.

The offense is averaging 20 points/game. 21/game two years ago would have gone 13-2-1. But our defense is allowing 26/game!
Who has allowed more total points than we have(171)? The Jets, Lions, and 49ers. That's it!
To contrast, at Denver's current rate, their defense would take 1 1/2 years to yield 171 points.[/quote]All good points. As far as MB this week, I'm not sure what you (the Warpath collective) would want from him? More deep incompletions? Is that what makes a great QB? Let's see who can throw down the field out of the reach of everyone. Then the D will really respect us! Sadly, this is really what some of you want.

Brunell went down the field twice in the first half, completed one, and the other seemed like a pretty good throw that Santana almost got to. I think we were all victim of some questionable third down playcalling in the 3rd Quarter.

The guy is averageing OVER 7 yards an attempt (7.11 yards/attempt) on the year with less than a pick every two games. (For comparisons sake: Peyton Manning 7.87, Tom Brady 6.49, Jake Delhomme 6.62, Drew Bledsoe 6.71, Brett Favre 6.22) Hell, with those stats, I'd throw every play if I didn't have CP in the backfield.

So why throw down the field anymore than they are? If the offense is based on safe passes (which it is), and the goal of the offense is to move the ball efficently (which they have been doing), why the hell is a lack of fly routes a problem?

There is a lot to like about the offense from this game. Cooley appears to be reemerging. Brunell is spreading the ball, as Randle El, Moss, Lloyd, Betts, Portis, and Cooley all caught multiple passes. They go up and down the field with relative ease. I think the OLine struggled in the 2nd half and Brunell got beat up.

But if 73% completion and an interceptionless game doesn't satisfy you, then I mean WHAT THE HELL WOULD?

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

Oh and to answer the thread topic question:

It's not Brunell's fault because...see for yourself

[url=http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/1032]NFL.com - Mark Brunell[/url]

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=That Guy;232652]no throws deep = 10 in the box = no running or screen game. Either he can't throw long or he won't, but strictly horizontal offenses don't work in the NFL.[/quote]

watching the game, that's what hurt the most. i thought portis was playing well given what he had. what he had was everyone up on the line. 3/4 of the way through the game my roommate (a pats fan who rarely watches redskins games) comments, "holy crap. does he ever throw it more than 5 yards?"

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

Yeah, its Brunnl's fault. Let's go break his legs. Why can't he cover the oher team's recievers. And the field goals he has missed recently. He is not very good at stopping the run either. And have you noticed how he cant block the defensive line. One would hope he could call his own plays better.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

At a cursory glance at the numbers, it seems MB is having a better year than most. As far as "garbage time", all QB's numbers are padded with a certain amount??? As stated earlier, it's a team sport and, and this team (with VERY few exceptions) shares the wealth. Can Brunell save us? No. Is it his fault? No------------Bring on JC. 2007 is NOW

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=GTripp0012;232785]All good points. As far as MB this week, I'm not sure what you (the Warpath collective) would want from him? More deep incompletions? Is that what makes a great QB? Let's see who can throw down the field out of the reach of everyone. Then the D will really respect us! Sadly, this is really what some of you want.

Brunell went down the field twice in the first half, completed one, and the other seemed like a pretty good throw that Santana almost got to. I think we were all victim of some questionable third down playcalling in the 3rd Quarter.

The guy is averageing OVER 7 yards an attempt (7.11 yards/attempt) on the year with less than a pick every two games. (For comparisons sake: Peyton Manning 7.87, Tom Brady 6.49, Jake Delhomme 6.62, Drew Bledsoe 6.71, Brett Favre 6.22) Hell, with those stats, I'd throw every play if I didn't have CP in the backfield.

So why throw down the field anymore than they are? If the offense is based on safe passes (which it is), and the goal of the offense is to move the ball efficently (which they have been doing), why the hell is a lack of fly routes a problem?

There is a lot to like about the offense from this game. Cooley appears to be reemerging. Brunell is spreading the ball, as Randle El, Moss, Lloyd, Betts, Portis, and Cooley all caught multiple passes. They go up and down the field with relative ease. I think the OLine struggled in the 2nd half and Brunell got beat up.

But if 73% completion and an interceptionless game doesn't satisfy you, then I mean WHAT THE HELL WOULD?[/quote]

is this a joke? i really hope it is.

if you can't complete deep, no one is going to keep guys out of the box. you're mistaking stats for facts. the stats are nice, but they're garbage. without the last drive, he has 160 yards for the game. he kept throwing for 4 yards when he needed 8. he refuses to throw over the middle of the field. he refuses to throw deep. it looks like he's just out there to be out there. his numbers are more YAC inflated than most.


and no, qbs on bad teams rack up a LOT more garbage time stats on winning teams.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[QUOTE=That Guy;232810]he refuses to throw over the middle of the field. he refuses to throw deep. it looks like he's just out there to be out there. his numbers are more YAC inflated than most.[/QUOTE]

So a lot of people like to say Brunell either refuses to throw deep or is scared to, but isn't it entirely possible that's what's being asked of him? I mean, what happens if Campbell comes in and starts doing the same thing? Then what do we say?

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=TAFKAS;232815]So a lot of people like to say Brunell either refuses to throw deep or is scared to, but isn't it entirely possible that's what's being asked of him? I mean, what happens if Campbell comes in and starts doing the same thing? Then what do we say?[/quote]

I would hope he's being ask to win, and he ain't doing that at 2-5.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=Twilbert07;232819]I would hope he's being ask to win, and he ain't doing that at 2-5.[/quote]

Teams win, individuals don't, ask Elway?

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=Hog1;232807]At a cursory glance at the numbers, it seems MB is having a better year than most. As far as "garbage time", all QB's numbers are padded with a certain amount??? As stated earlier, it's a team sport and, and this team (with VERY few exceptions) shares the wealth. Can Brunell save us? No. Is it his fault? No------------Bring on JC. 2007 is NOW[/quote]This is pretty accurate. Brunell is not going to be a savior. Unfortunately, neither is Campbell. So as long is Brunell is playing well, and we are within 2.5 games of first place, I think GW has earned the ability to right the ship over the bye week.

If he can't none of this will matter, so then I'd say, yeah, bring on Campbell.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=TAFKAS;232815]So a lot of people like to say Brunell either refuses to throw deep or is scared to, but isn't it entirely possible that's what's being asked of him? I mean, what happens if Campbell comes in and starts doing the same thing? Then what do we say?[/quote]

chicken or egg? possibly it's being asked of him because the coaching staff feels that's what's suited to his skills.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[QUOTE=TAFKAS;232815]So a lot of people like to say Brunell either refuses to throw deep or is scared to, but isn't it entirely possible that's what's being asked of him? I mean, what happens if Campbell comes in and starts doing the same thing? Then what do we say?[/QUOTE]

what do we say?

what every Brunell defender on warpath has been saying when making excuses for MB. "it takes a year to learn Saunder's new offense". which i never quite understood because that meant Brunell would've mastered it by the ripe age of 37...

regardless, losing teaching this offense to Campbell is much better for us than losing teaching Brunell.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=Hog1;232821]Teams win, individuals don't, ask Elway?[/quote]

Yeah I know, but the QB gets the credit either way. Brunell would have been a great backup.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[QUOTE=Hog1;232807]At a cursory glance at the numbers, it seems MB is having a better year than most. As far as "garbage time", all QB's numbers are padded with a certain amount??? As stated earlier, it's a team sport and, and this team (with VERY few exceptions) shares the wealth. Can Brunell save us? No. Is it his fault? No------------Bring on JC. 2007 is NOW[/QUOTE]

fuck "garbage time". no really.

late in the 4th quarter if you're behind, is not "garbage time" its time you should be throwing to your playmakers to try and win the game. again, ask Elway about "garbage time".


even if it's totally hopeless to catch up, and it really is worthless to even try, how many QBs around the league get themselves in that position on a weekly basis? should we be on par with Arizona and Oakland??

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[QUOTE=illdefined;232828]what do we say?

what every Brunell defender on warpath has been saying when making excuses for MB. "it takes a year to learn Saunder's new offense". which i never quite understood because that meant Brunell would've mastered it by the ripe age of 37...

regardless, losing teaching this offense to Campbell is much better for us than losing teaching Brunell.[/QUOTE]

What I'm saying is suppose Campbell comes out there and he's throwing the same passes, 3 step drop and screen. And we see that whoever is at QB we're still running the same offense, then who do we blame-Gibbs, Saunders, Campbell, the O-line? All I'm saying is we all assume that Campbell is going to come in and launch bombs all game long, but isn't it entirely possible that may not be the case?

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

exactly, brunell is the perfect backup nothing more

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=That Guy;232810]is this a joke? i really hope it is.

if you can't complete deep, no one is going to keep guys out of the box. you're mistaking stats for facts. the stats are nice, but they're garbage. without the last drive, he has 160 yards for the game. he kept throwing for 4 yards when he needed 8. he refuses to throw over the middle of the field. he refuses to throw deep. it looks like he's just out there to be out there. his numbers are more YAC inflated than most.


and no, qbs on bad teams rack up a LOT more garbage time stats on winning teams.[/quote]But he did complete deep. Weren't you watching? And for your garbage time arguement, without it, he now has a ridiculously low TOP for the game, and consequently a low attempts number. I don't know if you think the Colts stopped trying or something, but I don't think garbage time should be discredited simply because the D is no longer blitzing anymore.

I enjoy your tell it like it is style, That Guy, but I'm afraid your garbage time arguement holds little water. The game is 60 minutes long, but realistically, we were dead in the water after 38. Brunell endured a few series in which he was fighting a losing battle simply because Freeney and Co. were pinning their ears back. He was playing much of the half without Portis and got killed. So I would argue that the garbage time actually should have HURT his stats overall. And with all that beating, poor pass blocking, and stiff defense, he still kept the ball out of the defenses hands and kept completeing passes.

Oh yeah, I would like to see your response to your last four sentences had someone else said them. You would probably tear them and their generalizations apart.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=Twilbert07;232832]Yeah I know, but the QB gets the credit either way. Brunell would have been a great backup.[/quote]
I would like to see him get that oppurtunity, as I like most figure this seasons done and bring on JC and 2007

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=TAFKAS;232837]What I'm saying is suppose Campbell comes out there and he's throwing the same passes, 3 step drop and screen. And we see that whoever is at QB we're still running the same offense, then who do we blame-Gibbs, Saunders, Campbell, the O-line? All I'm saying is we all assume that Campbell is going to come in and launch bombs all game long, but isn't it entirely possible that may not be the case?[/quote]

if that's the case, then wtf is saunders here? if they're not asked to throw deep in the first place, than those coaches shouldn't be running the offense. It doesn't need to be 60's raiders, but show me something instead of dump offs 5 yards short on every other 3rd down.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=Hog1;232845]I would like to see him get that oppurtunity, as I like most figure this seasons done and bring on JC and 2007[/quote]

I agree 100%. I bet most of the 90,000-plus will express their displeasure when Brunell runs onto the field Nov. 5.

Re: It's not Brunell's fault!
 

[quote=illdefined;232836]fuck "garbage time". no really.

late in the 4th quarter if you're behind, is not "garbage time" its time you should be throwing to your playmakers to try and win the game. again, ask Elway about "garbage time".


even if it's totally hopeless to catch up, and it really is worthless to even try, how many QBs around the league get themselves in that position on a weekly basis? should we be on par with Arizona and Oakland??[/quote]You get your guys hurt trying to win a losing battle. Moss has a hamstring injury, Randle El came up funny and we didn't even try hard to come back at the end.