re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=mlmpetert;923919]Just curious, why is drafting Josh Gordon not a realistic option in your opinion?[/quote]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Because we already have developing talent at the position, trying to incubate another preemie before the others have developed is kind of counterproductive. The team would almost be forced to use a roster spot on him right away because you used next year’s draft pick on him. Unless he is a hands down, no questions asked, bona-fide, potential 1st round draft pick, then using a pick on him in the current scenario just doesn't make sense for the Skins. If you take into consideration that if you wait another season to validate whether or not you need a WR, then you can have more guys to possibly choose from rather than marrying yourself to this one guy for the next 2 years only for it not to work out. If however, the consensus is that this guy is the truth then by all means take him. Honestly though, one year of production coupled with being out for a while doesn’t exactly scream “take this guy now”! Perhaps if you could snatch him in the later rounds then he might be worth it, but I would question the sanity of almost anyone who takes him before the 5th and would request an immediate psyche eval of those who suggest he might go as early as the third in the supplemental draft. [/FONT][/COLOR]

re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

^Great post.

re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

This organization seems to love wr's. I would not be shocked if they made a move for him.

re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

I wouldnt give up anything above a 5th or 6th for him. The guy is NOT a proven talent and he's got too many red flags. Besides that, we are actually pretty stocked at WR. If he made the team, it would likely be at the expense of Robinson, a hard-working guy with atleast as much promise/potential as Gordon. I just cant see any reasonable reason we'd give up our 3rd round pick in 2013 for this guy.

re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=Paintrain;924272]So based on JLC's track record, we probably have zero interest in Gordon.[/quote]

He is the worst culprit of the viral media cycle

re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

And Josh Gordon is headed to the browns with a 2nd round pick

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

wow just wow

how desperate do the browns seems for playmakers now? A 2nd rounder? yeesh

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

Were any of the other supplemental players worth signing in FA?

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

Well i would have been ok with grabbing Gordon with a 4th, but NOT with a 2nd!!

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=mbedner3420;924411]Were any of the other supplemental players worth signing in FA?[/quote]

Ed Wesley the TCU RB and Larry Lumpkin the LB from Alabama A & M

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

Nice pickup for the Browns! They have another WR for no one to throw to!


2nd is too much.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

Mike Holmgren has just proven to me that he is out of his mind. He needs to be treated for dementia. I have heard of Al Davis making more coherent decisions.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=Angry;924426]Mike Holmgren has just proven to me that he is out of his mind. He needs to be treated for dementia. I have heard of Al Davis making more coherent decisions.[/quote]

Angry, I'm with you man, this seems pretty desperate to me. The Browns are willing to give up a 2nd round pick for this guy? They will be at the bottom of their division again this year.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

Just WOW on the Browns, Did they think someone else was going to put in a 2nd round claim? I mean wouldn't they trump nearly all of the other teams in bidding for the 3rd round?

I just don't get it. I wonder if the Baylor reciever is giving grief about signing, as he is a lower first rounder that hasn't signed yet...

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

Wow indeed for the Browns. Damn them, I was really hoping Dallas would waste a pick on the guy instead.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

Yeah that's just....huh? I mean the relative worth of say Dallas's 2nd and Cleveland's is pretty significant considering one is very likely at the top of the round and the other is very likely middle of the round or later. That's just speculation of course but what isn't speculation is this: there's a good chance they just dropped a very good draft pick on a guy who hasn't played in a long time...wasn't "great" when he did...has glaring character questions...and didn't overly impress in his workouts.

The Supplemental Draft is a vortex of over-thinking. After just going through a draft where FOs have to pour over hundreds of players and make decisions quickly for practical reasons this draft comes along with like 5 guys and everyone in the FOs has to change the way they evaluate because they can spend an inordinate amount of time discussing players. In the end all it takes is one FO to decide they like a guy and they'll talk themselves into over-looking his issues. As happened here. In the regular draft this guy doesn't go in the 2nd because no team has the time to convince themselves to make the jump on such a risky player. He's a flyer with upside in the third or later at best.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

Did Vinny join the Browns staff in the off-season?

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

Greatest addition since Dennis Northcutt.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

So as it turns out, it was impossible for us to take Gordon. Per JLC Cleveland won a lottery choice ahead of us in the second. So the only way we could have taken Gordon was to spend a first rounder, which we don't have.

[url=http://www.mockingthedraft.com/2012/7/12/3155103/supplemental-draft-order-for-top-10-picks]Supplemental draft order for top 10 picks in every round - Mocking The Draft[/url]

Just sayin'. I'm am not bothered by this.

Cleveland sports fans ..... Sorry

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

How is it that the Raiders spent a 4th round pick in the supplemental draft last year on Terrell Pryor and the Browns spend a 2nd on Josh Gordon this supplemental draft? The Browns must truly be desperate to build that team. After a 4-12 showing last season, it seems they'll do anything to build their team, even if it means wasting draft picks!

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

Mike Holmgren is a very good [I]coach[/I], but a terrible GM.

[QUOTE=30gut;924478]Mike Holmgren is a very good [I]coach[/I], but a terrible GM.[/QUOTE]

He's been there what? 3 years now right? I mean something should start happening now, just like Mike and Bruce in DC

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=skinsfaninok;924479]He's been there what? 3 years now right? I mean something should start happening now, just like Mike and Bruce in DC[/quote]I guess?
But because Holmgren isn't coaching the team his litany of poor personnel decisions can't be mitigated by his coaching prowess.

And the team he's built thus far still has enough holes where success appears a longshot.

But, then again when you draft the best RB and have a decent OL all you really got to do is hand it off to him 300+ carries and use play-action.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

I always thought a selection made in the supplemental draft translated into a later draft pick. For example, a second round selection would actually garner a third round pick in the following draft.

So CLE gets Gordon for a 2013 3rd round pick. (?)

No, they get him for a second in 2013

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=RGIII;924482]I always thought a selection made in the supplemental draft translated into a later draft pick. For example, a second round selection would actually garner a third round pick in the following draft.

So CLE gets Gordon for a 2013 3rd round pick. (?)[/quote]

I believe you are thinking of the draft trade value chart. The supplemental draft is the actual round, so that Cleveland agreed to use next year's 2nd round pick on this guy.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

We really cannot criticize this move.

1) Considering we spent [U]two 2nd round picks[/U] on M.Kelly and D.Thomas in our draft a couple of years ago with Vinnnny. Wasting two draft picks on WR's who haven't done anything in 3 years --> was actually a worse move than this.

2) Considering we gave up [U]3 FIRST round draft picks[/U] a couple of months ago.


Anyway, IF Gordon is good-- then this was expensive for the Browns, but could make a lot of sense. They get one free year of experience by taking him in this draft instead of a draft pick next year, AND [U]get a starting RB, QB and WR all in one draft[/U]. Could make them dramatically better within 2 years, and they had many extra picks these last two years from the Julio Jones trade last year anyway.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=ethat001;924621]We really cannot criticize this move.

1) Considering we spent [U]two 2nd round picks[/U] on M.Kelly and D.Thomas in our draft a couple of years ago with Vinnnny. Wasting two draft picks on WR's who haven't done anything in 3 years --> was actually a worse move than this.

2) Considering we gave up [U]3 FIRST round draft picks[/U] a couple of months ago.


Anyway, IF Gordon is good-- then this was expensive for the Browns, but could make a lot of sense. They get one free year of experience by taking him in this draft instead of a draft pick next year, AND [U][B]get a starting RB, QB and WR all in one draft[/B][/U]. Could make them dramatically better within 2 years, and they had many extra picks these last two years from the Julio Jones trade last year anyway.[/quote]

While I agree that this could [B]possibly [/B]generate the offense that they are looking for in reality it was a very risky move. A "no guts no glory" type of move. If it works out for them then great, but the odds are stacked way against them. Realistically it will take about 1 season for Gordon to get back to the level that he was at. Compound that with having to learn how to play at the next level and you have a recipe for failure. It would be one of the greatest comeback stories ever if he could accelerate his learning curve and become just a productive guy in a couple of seasons. Barring a miracle I do not see it happening.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=Angry;924623]While I agree that this could [B]possibly [/B]generate the offense that they are looking for in reality it was a very risky move. [B]A "no guts no glory" type of move.[/B] If it works out for them then great, but the odds are stacked way against them. Realistically it will take about 1 season for Gordon to get back to the level that he was at. Compound that with having to learn how to play at the next level and you have a recipe for failure. It would be one of the greatest comeback stories ever if he could accelerate his learning curve and become just a productive guy in a couple of seasons. Barring a miracle I do not see it happening.[/quote]

Aka a Jack Hoffman type of move...

[YT]SSST23SGp04[/YT]

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=ethat001;924621]We really cannot criticize this move.

1) Considering we spent [U]two 2nd round picks[/U] on M.Kelly and D.Thomas in our draft a couple of years ago with Vinnnny. Wasting two draft picks on WR's who haven't done anything in 3 years --> was actually a worse move than this.

2) Considering we gave up [U]3 FIRST round draft picks[/U] a couple of months ago.


Anyway, IF Gordon is good-- then this was expensive for the Browns, but could make a lot of sense. They get one free year of experience by taking him in this draft instead of a draft pick next year, AND [U]get a starting RB, QB and WR all in one draft[/U]. Could make them dramatically better within 2 years, and they had many extra picks these last two years from the Julio Jones trade last year anyway.[/quote]

Of course we can criticize it. First of all, plenty criticized the Kelly and Thomas signings and you can't say that those were worst moves when Gordon hasn't done a thing in the NFL. And we traded multiple first rounders for a franchise level QB with impeccable off the field characteristics, not a raw, toking receiver

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

I'd be willing to bet he doesn't take a snap in the NFL. He's not even in football shape. Yeah he looks good and is in decent shape, but there's a fine line between "good shape" and football shape.

With all the WR's on the market, FA's, they would have been better going after one of them IMO.

Then again, I heard another team was about to drop a third for him :silly:

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

^ I wonder if/when we'll find out whom that team was who put in a third for him, if that team did.


As for the browns selecting this kid. Supplemental draft picks have just simply not been good the past 10 years. Not to say there won't be another good supplemental pick. This kid is Raw. He has speed. Reminds me of Hakeem Nicks without the hands...so again he's very raw. The browns need help--anything for that matter. They probably hate us as much as their division rivals, being that we took their QB from them, and their WR's (Garcon and Morgan) from them. They are looking for any hope to get their fans excited for another crappy season. They need help everywhere. Especially WR. This is that small amount 'yay!' for their fans (or more rage from the bald headed machete browns fan...this guy. [YT]aZ5pTZOHlcw[/YT]

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

I knew what team it is/was, just can't think of their name right now to save my life. Perhaps Smoot can be of assistance? It wasn't the Redskins though.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=ethat001;924621]Anyway, IF Gordon is good-- then this was expensive for the Browns, but could make a lot of sense. They get one free year of experience by taking him in this draft instead of a draft pick next year, AND [U]get a starting RB, QB and WR all in one draft[/U]. Could make them dramatically better within 2 years, and they had many extra picks these last two years from the Julio Jones trade last year anyway.[/quote]The move smacks of Holmgren mismanagement.
Its kinda shocking to me that Holmgren isn't on the hotseat.
This move was desperate and expensive in terms of draft resources.
But, it makes sense for Holmgren.
He can pin the Browns previous struggles on Colt McCoy instead of his inabilty to build a competitive team.
Gordon makes sense because IF he pans out and upgrades the Browns receiving, Holmgren looks good.
Trent Richardson is gonna help everyone in that entire offense, except for Colt McCoy ;).

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=InsaneBoost;924651]I knew what team it is/was, just can't think of their name right now to save my life. Perhaps Smoot can be of assistance? It wasn't the Redskins though.[/quote]

Believe the Dolphins did. Though there was a rumor the Bills did as well.

Though that Bills rumor could have been something leaked out of Browns camp to basically say "See? We had to take him in the 2nd because Buffalo was planning to take him in the 3rd and they pick before us in the 3rd"

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

is malcolm kelly finished?

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

did malcolm kelly ever start? i mean, he's never even done anything to merit the question.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=30gut;924481]But, then again when you draft the best RB and have a decent OL all you really got to do is hand it off to him 300+ carries and use play-action.[/quote]That's really testing Pat Shurmur's offensive gamecalling abilities.

Re: Updated: Browns Select WR Josh Gordon in 2nd Round
 

[quote=los panda;924670]is malcolm kelly finished?[/quote]

Malcolm Kelly was finished the day he was drafted. He didn't amount to anything at all. He was a wasted 2nd round pick. I haven't heard anything about him trying out for another team, another team showing interest in him, or him entering into another pro league. The dude is well done like a steak.