Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1113906]Then every draft every year is filled with mistakes.

I really don't get the point you are trying to convey. I think this is what your OP and basis for this thread is:

[B]Given: the qb's we have on the roster before the draft aren't likely to be successful.
Belief: we should have used at least one pick on a qb in the draft.
Result: the fact that we didn't was a bad decision by those doing the drafting.[/B]

Is that right?[/quote]

That has been my understanding based on 30gut's posts. So allow me to beat a dead horse further.

(1) The assumed premise of the query has been a subject of much debate and, at its core, this thread is just another way for 30gut to flog this particular dead horse. I for one don't accept the premise as absolute. I don't disagree that last year's performance at the QB position was beyond problematic. At the same time, and for reasons I (and others) have stated many times in many other threads, I don't believe the poor performance by RGIII and KC over the last two years is proof positive of their inability to succeed in the NFL. Thus, for me (and I assume many others), their is a certain pointlessness to debating the inevitably speculative question posed about draft values based off a premise with which I simply do not accept as a given.

(2) For the sake of argument, even if the assumed premise is true, the facts of the current QB situation and the options available in this draft did not make taking a QB in this year's draft a [I]necessity.[/I] Bottom line, for this year, we have three guys who can play QB. Maybe not well, but they can play and do not automatically doom us to a loss - each has won games at this level. [I]Further[/I], outside of "mortgaging the future" for JW or MM, or an incredible stroke of Tom Brady lightning, no QB drafted was likely to perform as a starter [I]this year [/I]at better level than one of the three already on the roster (If you disagree with this presumption, fine. However, I would suggest that this is a substantially less debatable premise than your "none of our current QB's will succeed" premise).

As such, the implied assertion in the OP that "we should have used at least one pick on a qb in the draft" is premised upon two assumptions that are incredibly speculative: (1) there was a developmental QB in the draft that could displace one of the existing QB's on the roster and (2) the QB was available at a place in the draft where his value exceeded the value of the player actually taken.

To me, any response to this assertion is speculation upon speculation and for the OP'er to condemn folks for speculating in response to a question that cannot be answered in any way but through speculation is somewhat hypocritical. Who knows? Inevitably there will be pro bowl players passed over for guys who end up out of the league in a couple years (DeJon Gomes twelve picks before Richard Sherman comes to mind).

(3) The implied conclusion of the OP - that the failure to take a QB was a mistake/missed opportunity/whatever - is reached only through rank speculation based on a much debated premise. I mean, if it's your opinion, fine. You're entitled. However, passing off the OP as an invitation to dialogue is really nothing more than rhetorical chicanery.


Let me some up the entire thread for you:

(1) 30gut (and others) think RGIII, KC and CM suck and need to be replaced ASAP.
(2) Many people disagree.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

Let me some up the entire thread for you:

(1) 30gut (and others) think RGIII, KC and CM suck and need to be replaced ASAP.
(2) Many people disagree.

THAT's it!
Close the thread.....

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

sorry, I should let the close thread movement gain steam, but here is the definition of "mistake" from Merriam Webster:

a wrong action or statement proceeding from faulty judgment, inadequate knowledge, or inattention

So to answer the OP based on this definition:
No, I do not think it was a mistake. Yes I think that SM and others had good judgement, adequate to good knowledge, and were very focused on the task at hand.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=Hog1;1113913]Let me some up the entire thread for you:

(1) 30gut (and others) think RGIII, KC and CM suck and need to be replaced ASAP.
(2) Many people disagree.

THAT's it!
Close the thread.....[/quote]Lol, some posts in this thread are funny and slightly disturbing that people seems to be purposefully misrepresenting my posts and statements. Lol, the posrtion you quote above takes the cake because its almost verbatim opposite with a statement I made only a few posts ago.

I can't wait to read what I really mean/think next.

And oh btw

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

It's the offseason.....no worries
and I'm pretty sure I know where you stand on this!

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[COLOR="Sienna"]Tom Brady was drafted in the 6th round. [/COLOR]

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

Not drafting Hroniss Grasu was a mistake.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

30gut kinda reminds me of gary84clark....arguing and calling it dialoguing...then in a very passive aggressive way telling people they are stupid for not agreeing with him.
Harsh reminds me of gary84clark.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

i mean, tell me which QB outside the 1st round that you think is going to make it big in the league, and we'll see if you're right in a few years. I bet whoever you pick will (99%) never make a pro bowl, and probably won't end up winning 16 games (total) before retiring from the NFL. if we can't see a guy that'll be a clear upgrade over our backups in two years, then it's a bit of a wasted pick vs someone who will actually make the active roster. just my opinion.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=OnceWeWereKings;1113941]30gut kinda reminds me of gary84clark....arguing and calling it dialoguing...then in a very passive aggressive way telling people they are stupid for not agreeing with him.
Harsh reminds me of gary84clark.[/quote]

In his defense he's one of the best analytical thinkers when it comes to X's and O's we have on this site, and I don't think he has insinuated that anybody is stupid.

He's trying to get some meaningful discussion going which I appreciate, it's an enjoyable topic to discuss.

I think we've been talking past one another in this thread a lot - ultimately you can't judge whether this past draft was a success or failure until 3 years from now. As long as we keep that perspective this can still be a valuable discussion.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=That Guy;1113942]i mean, tell me which QB outside the 1st round that you think is going to make it big in the league, and we'll see if you're right in a few years. I bet whoever you pick will (99%) never make a pro bowl, and probably won't end up winning 16 games (total) before retiring from the NFL. if we can't see a guy that'll be a clear upgrade over our backups in two years, then it's a bit of a wasted pick vs someone who will actually make the active roster. just my opinion.[/quote]

I agree with this as well, and would go even further to say that because the team needed such an attitude adjustment when it comes to strength, nastiness, grit, and toughness I am supportive of passing on QBs in favor of players who will hit, block, or bounce back up after being hit.

We took two skill players in Jones and Crowder, but both of them help set the tone. Jones will pick up blitzes, he takes pride in pass pro, he even mentioned it in his press conference. And all you need to do is watch a Duke tape or two and it's easy to see Crowder fearlessly going over the middle a la Wes Welker.

Maybe the QBs available at that point will do well, but it doesn't matter to me because I like the cumulative message McCloughan sent to the locker room by drafting nothing but tough SOBs.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1113914]...a wrong action or statement proceeding from faulty judgment, inadequate knowledge, or [B][U][I]inattention[/I][/U][/B]

So to answer the OP based on this definition:

No, I do not think it was a mistake. Yes I think that SM and others had good judgement, adequate to good knowledge, and were very focused on the task at hand.[/quote]Inattention.

By not drafting a QB I believe it shows an inattention to the QB position.
Others don't, shrugs.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=That Guy;1113942]i mean, tell me which QB outside the 1st round that you think is going to make it big in the league, and we'll see if you're right in a few years. I bet whoever you pick will (99%) never make a pro bowl, and probably won't end up winning 16 games (total) before retiring from the NFL. if we can't see a guy that'll be a clear upgrade over our backups in two years, then it's a bit of a wasted pick vs someone who will actually make the active roster. just my opinion.[/quote]By this logic any pick that doesn't 'make it big' or 'doesn't make a pro-bowl' or 'won't start 16 games' or isn't a clear upgrade over the back-ups in 2 year is a wasted pick vs a player that merely makes the active roster?

Isn't that I don't know...kinda of a double standard?

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1113906]Then every draft every year is filled with mistakes.[/quote]Yeah, I said as much earlier:

[quote=30gut;1113838]...The draft is zero sum. Every draft pick can be judged as a mistake or not. Even the best GMs don't bat anywhere close to 100%. Bill Polian said that the best GMs hit at about a 60% rate give or take. So [B][I][U]every[/U][/I][/B] draft there are gonna be mistakes either or comission or omission. And no believes in BPA more then me. But most teams choose based on BPA but that doesn't mean their BPA evaluation was correct, only time can tell that answer. So speculating well they chose BPA there, doesn't mean that selection can't be a mistake.....

I just happen to think for reasons I've already expressed that not taking a QB somewhere in this draft was a mistake[EDIT: insert 'softer' phrasing here']. There is no need to jump to any wild conclusions or conjecture.

Jay's specialty is QBs and its his 2nd year and he still hasn't drafted "his" guy. And fact is many teams (especially WCO) draft a QB to develop somewhere in almost every draft. Andy Reid and Mike Holmgren were masters of the QB pump and dump scheme where they would draft a developmental QB and trade them down the line for more value. Jay wasn't happy with the QB position last year it just seems like good planning to have one of 'his guys' waiting/developing in pipeline.[/quote]

[quote]I really don't get the point you are trying to convey. I think this is what your OP and basis for this thread is:[/quote]Not trying to convey a point. I was curious as to what most fans/warpath members thought about not drafting QB.

Given: the qb's we have on the roster before the draft aren't likely to be successful. (close, I am not making a prediction on what will happen because I have no idea. But based on what actually happened...)
Belief: we should have used at least one pick on a qb in the draft.
Result: the fact that we didn't was a bad decision by those doing the drafting.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

Aside from Winston and Mariota who weren't available when we selected, I don't view any QB available in this draft as having an appreciably better chance of becoming a successful starter than any of the 3 guys we already have.

So no. I do not view this as a mistake.

Simple.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[QUOTE=30gut;1114240]Yeah, I said as much earlier:



Not trying to convey a point. I was curious as to what most fans/warpath members thought about not drafting QB.

Given: the qb's we have on the roster before the draft aren't likely to be successful. (close, I am not making a prediction on what will happen because I have no idea. But based on what actually happened...)
Belief: we should have used at least one pick on a qb in the draft.
Result: the fact that we didn't was a bad decision by those doing the drafting.[/QUOTE]
OK. So that was the start of your thread and original question and the vast majority of responses had been registered and disagreed with either your premise or your conclusion that the underlying question seems to have been a fairly resounding no it wasn't a mistake.

Sent from my S6 Edge

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=30gut;1114240]Yeah, I said as much earlier:



Not trying to convey a point. I was curious as to what most fans/warpath members thought about not drafting QB.

Given: the qb's we have on the roster before the draft aren't likely to be successful. (close, I am not making a prediction on what will happen because I have no idea. But based on what actually happened...)
Belief: we should have used at least one pick on a qb in the draft.
Result: the fact that we didn't was a bad decision by those doing the drafting.[/quote]

I find it hard to believe that one year of not drafting a QB is an automatic mistake, even with a new coach and no one being his guy. Maybe he had his eye on some QB's but didnt want to reach for them and they were gone by the time our pick came up. You cant force drafting, otherwise you end with a team full of Josh Leribeus type players. Which to me, is a much larger mistake than not reaching for a pick, even if it means you dont get one of that position in the draft.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=Schneed10;1114241]Aside from Winston and Mariota who weren't available when we selected, I don't view any QB available in this draft as having an appreciably better chance of becoming a successful starter than any of the 3 guys we already have.

So no. I do not view this as a mistake.[/quote]Its cool if you don't view passing on QB as mistake. Or should I say its cool if you dont think they should have drafted a QB somewhere. We're just talking here....

It seems to me that"appreciably better chance of becoming a successful starter ~then our guys...." is a pretty lofty measure of success for a draft pick.

Is that your criteria for making a draft selection?
Does everyone of the other draft picks meet this criteria?

My view can be summed up like this: you got to play to win. I also think we should have drafted a TE, out of curiosity what's your thought on not selecting a TE?

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=Skinzman;1114247]Maybe he had his eye on some QB's but didnt want to rejach for them and they were gone by the time our pick came up. You cant force drafting....[/quote]We can 'maybe' each other death. Its just as likely that 'maybe' they wanted a QB but miscalculated where the QBs would be available.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1114243]OK. So that was the start of your thread and original question and the vast majority of responses had been registered and disagreed with either your premise or your conclusion that the underlying question seems to have been a fairly resounding no it wasn't a mistake. [/quote]I missed your point here. People disagree with me? Okay, I'm complete my fine with that.

Was that your point?

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[QUOTE=30gut;1114264]I missed your point here. People disagree with me? Okay, I'm complete my fine with that.

Was that your point?[/QUOTE]
Mostly my point was when one person stands and repeats the same line over and over even though no one else agrees he is usually a visionary or a stubborn old man.


Sent from my S6 Edge

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=CRedskinsRule;1114265]Mostly my point was when one person stands and repeats the same line over and over even though no one else agrees he is usually a visionary or a stubborn old man.[/quote]
I didn't know asking a question and discussing the answers is the same as "standing and repeating the same line..."

But sure, whatevs.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=30gut;1114263]We can 'maybe' each other death. Its just as likely that 'maybe' they wanted a QB but miscalculated where the QBs would be available.[/quote]

We are talking about what was going on inside of someone elses head, we have no choice but to deal in maybes.

As far as miscalculating where a pick will go. You rate someone as a 5th round pick, he gets taken in the 3rd round. Using hindsight, that does not mean that you should have picked that player in round 2 (or earlier in round 3 if you pick before the team that took him). The best GM's stay true to their board and pick best available (granted thats taking into account that they are good talent evaluators in the first place).

I would consider a GM taking a player 2 or 3 rounds earlier than he had them rated because he thinks another team is high on that player a bigger mistake than staying true to your board.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=30gut;1114262]Its cool if you don't view passing on QB as mistake. Or should I say its cool if you dont think they should have drafted a QB somewhere. We're just talking here....

It seems to me that"appreciably better chance of becoming a successful starter ~then our guys...." is a pretty lofty measure of success for a draft pick.

Is that your criteria for making a draft selection?
Does everyone of the other draft picks meet this criteria?

My view can be summed up like this: you got to play to win. I also think we should have drafted a TE, out of curiosity what's your thought on not selecting a TE?[/quote]

In general I'm in favor of drafting for BPA, with quarterback being the lone exception, because when you don't have one your chances of doing anything are slim to none.

I think we have 3 QBs all of whom haven't consistently taken off in their careers, but also still have some degree of upside. Even McCoy, who I see as someone who could perform like Alex Smith if he continues to develop over time. So if we were to draft a QB I figure we'd need to cut one of the three (or trade one for below market value). I didn't see anybody in this draft, besides the top two guys, who have significantly more upside than any of our guys. So to me the pick would have been a little bit wasted that way.

Do I apply the same logic to TE? No. QB is different, it's special, I'm OK with drafting for need. If Winston fell to us I would have jumped on it.

I liked all of our picks. We're definitely thin at TE now, but if we hadn't drafted Kouandjio or Jones, just picking them as an example, then I would have said we're thin at RB and G. Wish we had another TE, but I'm glad we got what we got, and wouldn't change it.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

By the way, the TE conversation really hinges on Reed. If he's healthy then we're fine. If he's not then we're screwed.

Paul is a fine #2, especially at the price. He can keep safeties honest over the middle and outrun his fair share of LBs. And Paulsen is a solid blocker, what more can you ask of your #3 TE who makes min salary.

But if Reed gets hurt again that's where we'll wish we had someone coming up.

Of course if Alfred Morris gets hurt and we didn't have Matt Jones, we'd be in shit shape there. Same thing with Kouandjio - if Long or Lauvao get hurt I'm not in favor of trusting McLeRib.

There's risk at TE but we had so many holes that the name of the game is walking away from the draft with as few risky spots as possible.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

This poor, unfortunate thread has suffered long enough. Kept alive by the determined efforts of its desperate Daddy, it has survived much longer than its deserved one word answer - "No." - would have portended. Yet its life has been torturous - for us. Now it's time to take it off life support and let it pass away peacefully.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

The thing about discussions which require, at their core, speculation about conclusions with no definitive answers is that they can continue [I]ad nausem[/I] with someone always able to say "but, what about [insert new speculative fact]."

However, the consistent criticism of posters who offer relevant speculation different from the original speculation, simply b/c it is not the original speculation, is somewhat tedious.

The entire discussion is based on woulda, coulda, shoulda. Fun for a while on any topic but, clearly this one, has run its course.

Should we have chosen a QB in the draft?
30gut: Yes.
Everyone else (essentially): We trust in Scotty McC so probably not but maybe, only time will tell.

Let me help on the TE question to save us all some trouble.
Should we have chosen a TE in the draft?
30gut: Yes.
Everyone else: We trust in Scotty McC so probably not but maybe, only time will tell.

As a further time saver, just go back and insert "TE" for "QB" in the various posts b/c it is essentially the same premise, question and implied conclusion.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

We should have drafted Billy White Shoes Johnson.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=Skinzman;1114271]We are talking about what was going on inside of someone elses head, we have no choice but to deal in maybes.[/quote]I think we can discuss draft choices without wandering off into speculation or dealing in maybes. But as this thread illustrates, its not the only way.

[quote]As far as miscalculating where a pick will go. You rate someone as a 5th round pick, he gets taken in the 3rd round. Using hindsight, that does not mean that you should have picked that player in round 2 (or earlier in round 3 if you pick before the team that took him). The best GM's stay true to their board and pick best available (granted thats taking into account that they are good talent evaluators in the first place).[/quote]Every team has a draft board and most teams say they pick best player available. If a team says they stayed true to their board it doesn't necessarily make them right. Only time can answer that question. So back to your example lets say a team liked Russell Wilson but figured he would be available in the 5th round (or like the Redskins admitted the 4th round) but Wilson gets taken in the 3rd round then yes the teams that passed on him with the thought that he would be available later miscalculated his availability and therefore made a mistake. It happens all the time, even the best GM hit about a rate of ~60 so there will be mistakes/misses of omission or commission every draft. So extending your line of though further (even though its not my point in regards to the QB) Bill Parcels or Polian one of the 2 says 'its better to take a player you like 1 round early then 1 pick to late'

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=Schneed10;1114272]...Even McCoy, who I see as someone who could perform like Alex Smith if he continues to develop over time. So if we were to draft a QB I figure we'd need to cut one of the three (or trade one for below market value). I didn't see anybody in this draft, besides the top two guys, who have significantly more upside than any of our guys. So to me the pick would have been a little bit wasted that way.[/quote]You'd be hard pressed to find someone on this board who thinks higher of Colt McCoy then me. And yes drafting a QB would likely mean letting one of our stable of 3 QBs go which I would be fine with...QBs come and QBs go.

For me its not about degrees of upside in comparison to what we have because the draft is crap shoot you just never know. The QBs in this draft could all suck or not. For me its about process and QB development in a WCO system. I like the way Ted Thompson, Reid and Holmgren and now McCarthy approached the QB position via the draft they take (waste) at least 1 every draft.

[quote]I liked all of our picks.[/quote]In a vacuum I like all our picks. I really like the Spaight kid. I would have liked to see us come away with a QB and a TE. I like the Boyle from Delaware. Hopefully(but I would prefer not to live on hope but..) Paulsen can have a throw back/bounce back year.[YT]watch?v=WP89IjbzPQo[/YT] I've always viewed him as a poor mans Witten but last year his play slipped as a receiver and as a blocker. I like Niles and applaud his commitment to getting bigger but when it comes to blocking at the point of attack he's still a rocked up WR in my eyes.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=30gut;1114285]
For me its not about degrees of upside in comparison to what we have because the draft is crap shoot you just never know. The QBs in this draft could all suck or not. For me its about process and QB development in a WCO system. I like the way Ted Thompson, Reid and Holmgren and now McCarthy approached the QB position via the draft they take (waste) at least 1 every draft.
[/quote]

It's definitely not a bad way to go, basically roll the dice and see what you get. Of course there are also several examples of quarterbacks taking time to blossom, some bouncing around from spot to spot, like Vinny Testaverde. Alex Smith is the other one who comes to mind - definitely got better with experience.

Given that RG3 and Cousins still fit the mold of young'ns with something to prove, I'd rather have McCoy than a rookie at the 3rd spot on the depth chart.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=Schneed10;1114287]Given that RG3 and Cousins still fit the mold of young'ns with something to prove, I'd rather have McCoy than a rookie at the 3rd spot on the depth chart.[/quote]McCoy vs a rookie though is a different discussion because they serve different purposes. McCoy is like Jay's binky where vs a rookie QB would be like Jay's son or nephew or puppy.

And they wouldn't necessarily have to cut Colt; Jay/FO/Dan just need to choose between Griff or Kirk and they can't seem to be of the same accord when it comes to that decision.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=30gut;1114284]I think we can discuss draft choices without wandering off into speculation or dealing in maybes. But as this thread illustrates, its not the only way.

Every team has a draft board and most teams say they pick best player available. If a team says they stayed true to their board it doesn't necessarily make them right. Only time can answer that question. So back to your example lets say a team liked Russell Wilson but figured he would be available in the 5th round (or like the Redskins admitted the 4th round) but Wilson gets taken in the 3rd round then yes the teams that passed on him with the thought that he would be available later miscalculated his availability and therefore made a mistake. It happens all the time, even the best GM hit about a rate of ~60 so there will be mistakes/misses of omission or commission every draft. So extending your line of though further (even though its not my point in regards to the QB) Bill Parcels or Polian one of the 2 says 'its better to take a player you like 1 round early then 1 pick to late'[/quote]

If a GM is deciding who to draft based on where they think they will go, then the GM messed up. They need to scout the players and apply a ranking to them. If Shanny had Russell Wilson as a 2nd or 3rd rounder, and chose not to draft him until the 4th round for the simple reason that he thought he would be there, then he did not stay true to his board. So no... thats not my line of thought at all.

They need to base their board on their scouting acumen and not the perception of what 31 other teams will do. If you have a guy rated as a 5th rounder and then panic and grab him in the 3rd because you convinced yourself that he would be taken by another team then, then all you did was panic and not stay true to your board. You passed over a lot of players that you had rated higher due to panic. If you have a guy rated as a 3rd rounder but pass on him in rounds 3 and 4 because you believe he will be there in the 5th, then you did not stay true to your board.

If you base QB's above all else, then that will come out when you are rating players and deciding on your draft order. If you are desperate for a safety, then that will come out when you rate the player. Once you have that complete though, stay the course.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=Skinzman;1114295]If a GM is deciding who to draft based on where they think they will go, then the GM messed up...[/quote]Well GMs make that gamble all the time. They set their board and they try project where the other teams rank/rate players and they try to find out which teams like which players.That how/why teams trade up to get 'in front' of other teams.

They also adjust their board as the draft unfolds. If their is a run a certain position then naturally the other prospects at that position get moved up...etc...

No GM wants to draft a player, even if they like that player, higher then they need to. GMs talk all the time about wanting a player and thinking/hoping a player will fall to them and sweating it out..sometimes they're right but sometimes their wrong.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

again, which QB should we have taken? i still haven't seen a name that'd be better than the guys on our roster, even given 1-2 years.

so if there weren't better choices available, why would we pick one?

same with TE, who would we have taken over the guys we have? at TE there might have at least been an upgrade over depth, but then we'd lose depth at a spot we actually took.

feel free to name names though, otherwise we have to assume you want a generic replacement level player, but that's not an upgrade and we've already got a bunch of those.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=30gut;1114296]Well GMs make that gamble all the time. They set their board and they try project where the other teams rank/rate players and they try to find out which teams like which players.That how/why teams trade up to get 'in front' of other teams.

They also adjust their board as the draft unfolds. If their is a run a certain position then naturally the other prospects at that position get moved up...etc...

No GM wants to draft a player, even if they like that player, higher then they need to. GMs talk all the time about wanting a player and thinking/hoping a player will fall to them and sweating it out..sometimes they're right but sometimes their wrong.[/quote]

When you move a player from round 4 to round 2 all because there was a run on that position late in round 1, then you dont value your own ratings. You are jumping a guy 60 spots based on what other teams did, not based on what you believe.

Also, why bring up the quote of 'take a player one round early, not 1 pick late' and then turn around and talk about waiting to draft a player based on your feel of what 31 other teams will do? 2 ends of the spectrum that can never go hand in hand with each other.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=That Guy;1114298]again, which QB should we have taken? i still haven't seen a name that'd be better than the guys on our roster, even given 1-2 years.

so if there weren't better choices available, why would we pick one?

same with TE, who would we have taken over the guys we have? at TE there might have at least been an upgrade over depth, but then we'd lose depth at a spot we actually took.

feel free to name names though, otherwise we have to assume you want a generic replacement level player, but that's not an upgrade and we've already got a bunch of those.[/quote]

Had we not made the deal w/ Seattle, they could have taken Grayson in the top of the 3rd round. Give him some of Colt's reps and let him sit and learn.

To me bringing back McCoy was useless cause he's never going to be a full time starter. OK back up and all, but just can't drive the ball downfield. He was on the street and not one team wanted him. Had they kept that pick, and drafted Grayson, maybe he competes next year. That would have also given KC all or most of the 2nd team reps.

Regardless, I do believe that we'll have a new starting QB for the Redskins next year. This year was obviously about building out the rest of the roster.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=Skinzman;1114300]When you move a player from round 4 to round 2 all because there was a run on that position late in round 1, then you dont value your own ratings. You are jumping a guy 60 spots based on what other teams did, not based on what you believe.[/quote]Um yeah obviously jumping a prospect up some 60 odd spots because of a run at that position is unwise. Its also something I didn't suggest. So yeah describing an obviously poor decision doesn't have anything to do with what I was saying. Its not quite a strawman but its close.

An example of adjusting a draft board at a position happened with WRs the past 2 seasons. A team might have a say a 2nd round grade on Nelson Agoholor or Kelvin Benjamin but based on how the draft played out if you didn't take them round 1 you weren't getting them.


[quote]Also, why bring up the quote of 'take a player one round early, not 1 pick late' and then turn around and talk about waiting to draft a player based on your feel of what 31 other teams will do? 2 ends of the spectrum that can never go hand in hand with each other.[/quote]I don't understand your point here.

The draft is fluid not static.

There are many different scenarios and situations at play that are interrelated and require different means of management. So sure sometimes Bill's idiom of 'better 1 round early then 1 pick' is the right approach for certain situations or like a Russell Wilson and many other Seattle "reaches" or sometimes waiting on a hidden gem that your scouts and coaching staff have identified undervalued is the right play as in a Alfred Morris or a Keenan Robinson.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=That Guy;1114298]again, which QB should we have taken? i still haven't seen a name that'd be better than the guys on our roster, even given 1-2 years.[/quote]Your question has already been covered. And I don't profess know which QBs will or won't be better then our guys......and neither do you.

Re: Not drafting a QB a mistake?
 

[quote=30gut;1114306]Your question has already been covered. And I don't profess know which QBs will or won't be better then our guys......and neither do you.[/quote]

really, cause i've yet to see you state a name. someone else mentioned grayson, and that's been it.

I've already stated i don't think anyone pans out to do great things pages ago, so i'm accountable. you decided not to make any predictions cause then we could look back and say that you were wrong, and, well we can't have that now can we?

if you're not going to put up, then it's probably time to stop this pointless exercise. either there's someone that would be better than who we've got or there isn't. the vacuous "we should pick somebody, but i have no idea who" leads to thinking up imaginary players that might be better than the ones that were actually available in this draft.

if you're going to say you have no idea and i don't either, great, then we'll defer to the experts, which decided it wasn't a good idea. /thread.