Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

Apparently gruden said he believes he can build a team around colt Mccoy... ok he's just asking to get fired now.

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

[quote=mredskins;1098470]Good point but the difference between Jay and Joe is that Joe's team got better as the year went on. I have literally seen no improvement from week one to now, maybe even a decline.[/quote]

Yep. Gibbs cleaned up the stupid plays and unforced errors that he could not abide. Gruden hasn't cleaned this stuff up at all. Personally it's my biggest concern about Jay.

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

[quote=Lotus;1098476]Yep. Gibbs cleaned up the stupid plays and unforced errors that he could not abide. Gruden hasn't cleaned this stuff up at all. Personally it's my biggest concern about Jay.[/quote]

The players just aren't listening. They are like children who become "mommy deaf". I believe that the coaches are trying hard to teach the players what to do but hey aren't being heard.

You can't replace all of the players at once, but you can replace some of the coaches. If Gruden were to stay and hire some new coaching "voices", maybe some of the young players who aren't getting it right now could be turned around. Turning around and keeping some of these young players would help to make the rebuilding hill less steep.

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

[quote=Mattyk;1098363]I'd be all for it. Let's have a true house cleaning. Hire a real GM, kick Allen back to team President, and let the new GM call all the shots as far as hiring a new HC and putting together a new staff.[/quote]

This is my hope

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

[quote=Mattyk;1098363]I'd be all for it. Let's have a true house cleaning. Hire a real GM, kick Allen back to team President, and let the new GM call all the shots as far as hiring a new HC and putting together a new staff.[/quote]

I'd be down for this too. We have a lot of core young players on our roster that a competent GM and HC could built upon.

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

Shouldn't the coach have the final say on who plays and who sits? At this point, what's Snyder's obsession with Griffin? Is it his ego and a failure to admit that the trade was a disaster? Or does Snyder still have a ridiculous man crush on him? What has Griffin shown that he deserves to be on the field? This is all about politics and Gruden doesn't want to play Snyder's game.

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

[quote=Bishop Hammer;1098374]Knowing The Skins luck Shanahan will have learned from his mistakes here and become a grwat coach again with The 49ers lol.[/quote]

Well that brings up the question of was Shanahan let go too hastily? I think he wore out his welcome here, but he also said his rebuild was going to take awhile.

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

[quote=BaltimoreSkins;1098488]Well that brings up the question of was Shanahan let go too hastily? I think he wore out his welcome here, but he also said his rebuild was going to take awhile.[/quote]

He absolutely was let go too quickly. The organization has been being broken for close to 20 years and no coach is going to fix it in under 5 years. Shanny inherited a mess and needed at least 5 years to just get the ship turned in the right direction. Once the ship is turned then consistent winning can begin. Shanny needed more time.

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

I don't think it takes 5+ years. Look at what Carroll did in Seattle in less than 5 years. Bellichick in NE in less than 5 . Harbaugh in SF in less than 5 . Those teams weren't loaded with talent before their arrival either. I think Shannahan had enough time to show improvement but the team was at its worst his final season in DC. I doubt he comes back and wins elsewhere - I think he's done.


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Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

[quote=calia;1098495]I don't think it takes 5+ years. Look at what Carroll did in Seattle in less than 5 years. Bellichick in NE in less than 5 . Harbaugh in SF in less than 5 . Those teams weren't loaded with talent before their arrival either. I think Shannahan had enough time to show improvement but the team was at its worst his final season in DC. I doubt he comes back and wins elsewhere - I think he's done.


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You are only looking at talent and think changing players will make a difference. It wont. This organization is a complete and total disaster from top to bottom and no matter who is brought in wont matter because there are no players and coaches who can be successful in this dysfunctional loser environment. It will take at least 5 years to change the culture of loser dysfunction in this organization.

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

I was at the game yesterday - got cheap tickets and took my son for his birthday (what a lousy present in hindsight). Seeing the game in person really altered my thinking. This team is almost unsalvageable. I had a feeling that we were going to lose during the national anthem. The Rams all stood in a line sort-of at attention, like a baseball team on the baseline. The Skins were all over the place, talking, sitting, looking at stuff. It came across as undisciplined, unfocused and unprofessional.

Not to make too much of a small detail, but I think it reflects the problems we're having on the field - our play is unfocused and undisciplined. We look surprised and caught off-guard on almost every play.

So, I've switched from the "it-would-be-premature-to-fire-Gruden" camp to the "gut-it-all" camp. At this point I'd fire the whole coaching staff - no holdovers - and bring in a coach who can instill discipline and emphasize hard work and professionalism. We also need to clean house on the player side; I don't even know how many of our players are salvageable at this point.

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

The only way I would be in favor of getting rid of Gruden is if it meant a total overhaul of the entire FO and scouting department.

As far as Griffin goes, if he isn't willing to take a backseat and learn then I'd move on from him. Like Gruden has said, he's been coddled for far too long and he has this sense of entitlement that the position is his by default. I recall another asshole (Jason Campbell) that said basically the same thing. I don't see it happening until it's too late though because his ego needs to come down a few notches.

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

So I just heard on the radio that Gruden actually had to sit down with Napoleon and show him the film on Griffin. This organization is such a shit show.

Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

[QUOTE=irish;1098496]You are only looking at talent and think changing players will make a difference. It wont. This organization is a complete and total disaster from top to bottom and no matter who is brought in wont matter because there are no players and coaches who can be successful in this dysfunctional loser environment. It will take at least 5 years to change the culture of loser dysfunction in this organization.[/QUOTE]


What is the culture beyond coaches and players? The owner? If so, he will probably own the team for the rest of my life and so I should move on now. The GM? I think Allen doesn't have it and I assume we will move on from him too. The fans? I don't see Redskins fans as any different from other NFL teams nor is the local media worse than NY.


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Re: RG3 and Gruden?
 

[quote=calia;1098504]What is the culture beyond coaches and players? The owner? If so, he will probably own the team for the rest of my life and so I should move on now. The GM? I think Allen doesn't have it and I assume we will move on from him too. The fans? I don't see Redskins fans as any different from other NFL teams nor is the local media worse than NY.


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The fans are the only good thing the Skins have.