Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=Grayacre]I agree that it's way too early to start bashing Campbell's ability. However, his ability really isn't the point. Even if he's the second coming of Joe Montana, we gave up an awful lot of picks to relieve Hasselbeck of clipboard duty ...[/QUOTE]

No we gave up all those picks in the hope that Campbell will lead us to a future Superbowl victory. Even if it is in two years or five years; if it happens, it will have been worth it.
Gibbs is doing something the FO and loose lipped Cerrato have not done since day one, Gibbs is building with an eye to the future, not this minute.

Re: We need to document the yeh's vs. the ney's concerning Campbell
 

We should not bash hime untill we see the progress on the field. He will spend a few years on the bench/clipboard, by then Ramsey's play should speak for itself. I think now it is a good move. At first I totally disagreed, but think for the big picture it is correct. Now if they both fail then we shall be singing the blues. But the pick of Rodgers over Williams has me baffled.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

Does well in school (3.0 grade point average). His first Wonderlic test score (14) was lower than you like from a player at the quarterback position, but he then scored a much-improved 28 at the Combine in February

doesnt sound like a complete idiot to me.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

I don't care how good Campbell is.. THE PRICE WAS WAY TOO STEEP.. As alwayz our illustroius FO has fu**ed up again. How can u draft a QB when u have 3 on ur roster n u have more needs in DE, WR and other areas.. I just want to know what Gibbs and rest were smoking when they decided on this..
No wonder nobody wants to play for our organization. There is no clear direction from the mangement.. nobody knows where they are going or why they make such bonehead moves.. Can u imagine what Ramsey must be going thru? This guy has given everything asked of him n more n all he gets back from the coaching staff is it's not good enough.. I am saying we r gonna regret this.. C'MON 3 PICKS FOR A QB WHO IS UNPROVEN!! He was rated average and he had 2 great RB's in college. This whole offseason has me down.. I'm not even looking forward to when we start playing..
I"M VERY PISSED ABOUT THIS!!!


[QUOTE=Defensewins]No we gave up all those picks in the hope that Campbell will lead us to a future Superbowl victory. Even if it is in two years or five years; if it happens, it will have been worth it.
Gibbs is doing something the FO and loose lipped Cerrato have not done since day one, Gibbs is building with an eye to the future, not this minute.[/QUOTE]

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=ArringtonRules]I don't care how good Campbell is.. THE PRICE WAS WAY TOO STEEP.. As alwayz our illustroius FO has fu**ed up again. How can u draft a QB when u have 3 on ur roster n u have more needs in DE, WR and other areas.. I just want to know what Gibbs and rest were smoking when they decided on this..
No wonder nobody wants to play for our organization. There is no clear direction from the mangement.. nobody knows where they are going or why they make such bonehead moves.. Can u imagine what Ramsey must be going thru? This guy has given everything asked of him n more n all he gets back from the coaching staff is it's not good enough.. I am saying we r gonna regret this.. C'MON 3 PICKS FOR A QB WHO IS UNPROVEN!! He was rated average and he had 2 great RB's in college. This whole offseason has me down.. I'm not even looking forward to when we start playing..
I"M VERY PISSED ABOUT THIS!!![/QUOTi

i love ramsey very much and want nothing more in the world than to see him succeed but what has he done in the last three years to give us reason not to want some insurance. its time for him to shit or get off the pot. if he succeeds we end up with a great young back up quarterback if not we got someone who might succeed. the draft is not just about filling holes you have this year its about building for the future and holes you may end up having down the road. think about it say we didnt draft a quarterback and ramsey sucks next year then what do we do. go find the next brunnell. great quarterbacks dont come in free agency very often because teams tend to hang onto them. this was a smart move by a brilliant man who i have all the confidence in the world in. i just wish more of us did.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=redskinsskickazz]Does well in school (3.0 grade point average). His first Wonderlic test score (14) was lower than you like from a player at the quarterback position, but he then scored a much-improved 28 at the Combine in February

doesnt sound like a complete idiot to me.[/QUOTE]

The first one is far more telling, players can actually learn how to take that test which doesn't make them smarter jsut more able to pass that particular test, if that makes sense.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

I would like to take this stupid test. As well as have a few friends of mine take it. Then compair those scores with the players. This way I would be able to really know what these scores really mean.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

And who here is naive enough to believe that a star college quarterback is taking all of his own tests? Anyone?

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

Everyone who is saying that we should be more pissed about the cost of the pick instead of the pick itself is right. I don't hate Campbell as a player, but for the value? C'mon. I have not heard one legitimate arguement that this was great strategy... In posting this thread, all I intended was to give you an idea of what ONE former coach of our new rookie quarterback thinks of him. You're all free to take that with a grain of salt as you wish, if you look at my initial post I state that the man probably is not completely impartial. But why bash the kid to someone for no reason? Where's the motivation? You'd have to have a huge resentment for someone to do that and I don't really see it. But who knows... Take it for what it's worth.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[/quote] the draft is not just about filling holes you have this year its about building for the future and holes you may end up having down the road. [/QUOTE]


Yes. But when we traded so many picks away for #25, we CREATED more holes in future drafts than we filled with this pick. I think that is the gripe everyone has. If we only needed a backup quarterback to provide depth, then great, it makes sense. BUT... that's not the case, is it?

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=Defensewins]No we gave up all those picks in the hope that Campbell will lead us to a future Superbowl victory. Even if it is in two years or five years; if it happens, it will have been worth it.
Gibbs is doing something the FO and loose lipped Cerrato have not done since day one, Gibbs is building with an eye to the future, not this minute.[/QUOTE]

Nobody's suggesting that Gibbs should not be thinking beyond next season. However, giving up a ridiculous amount of picks for a QB of Campbell's stature amounts to leveraging the team's future for zero immediate gain. In other words, the team will be extremely limited in next year's draft just so that we could snag Campbell today.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

He still has plenty of brains to run the offense we run!

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=BleedBurgundy]
Yes. But when we traded so many picks away for #25, we CREATED more holes in future drafts than we filled with this pick. I think that is the gripe everyone has. If we only needed a backup quarterback to provide depth, then great, it makes sense. BUT... that's not the case, is it?[/QUOTE]


Actually we should get that third rounder back next year since we lost Fred Smoot, due to the league compensation rulings.

But still no first rounder.

Re: We need to document the yeh's vs. the ney's concerning Campbell
 

[QUOTE=Longtimefan]How do you figure we gave up two first round picks for Campbell? We only had the 9th pick in the first round this year, so in essence we gave up next years 1st & 4th plus this years 3rd for him. Considering how difficult it might be to sing a 1st rounder next year anyway, this could be a good move. Only time will tell whether it's good or not so good[/QUOTE]

I'm looking at the TOTAL price, not just the subtotal. When you consider how many total draft picks were invested in Jason Campbell, you get:

1st rounder (from the Broncos), #25 overall, 2005
3rd rounder (to the Broncos), #76 overall, 2005
1st rounder, 2006 (to the Broncos)
4th rounder, 2006 (to the Broncos)

That's TWO first rounders, a 3rd rounder and a 4th rounder that the Skins weren't able to use on other players. They used them ALL to pick Jason Campbell. If it makes you feel better, you can say we used the Bronco's first-rounder this year, IN ADDITION TO our 1st rounder next year in order to pick Jason Campbell.

When the draft comes around next year, and someone asks me who the Skins picked with their first rounder, I'll tell them "Jason Campbell". When that confused individual asks, "but didn't the Skins pick him [I]last year[/I]?", I'll say, "yeah, but they spent their first rounder [I]this[/I] year to pick him with someone else's first rounder [I]last[/I] year". In other words, we spent a first rounder in 2005, AND a first rounder in 2006 in order to draft him.

You can't just toss out the pick that was acquired from the Broncos when considering the total price. That pick was spent, and it was spent on Jason Campbell.

Hope I cleared that up. :biggthump

Re: We need to document the yeh's vs. the ney's concerning Campbell
 

Campbell had two top 5 running backs in his offense, decent O-line, and an outstanding defense... Ramsey was killed at Tulane, so it's not really fair to say Jason is a better qb.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

Too many higher rated and 'much needed' prospects were on the board at twenty-five. Even if we traded down into the second we could have drafted Campbell or a draftable TE and a higher prospect at LB. :oink:

Re: Jason Campbell
 

[QUOTE=offiss]SC, surely you make me laugh! :)[/QUOTE]

lol, come on offiss...even Arrington is a better QB that Ramsey ;)

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

The Wonderlic score I saw for Campbell was 28.
I think this was just sour grapes because Auburn spanked Ole Miss this season.

Re: Jason Campbell
 

[QUOTE=offiss]Insurance? That's like buying flood insurance when you live on top of a mountain![/QUOTE]

Hardly a fair quote. Ramsey does have awesome potential, but that potential won't protect him from injuries or not resigning with the team.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

Well I talked to this guy at the grocery store who told me he has an online girlfriend who lives in dallas that has a friend whos a guy (they're totally platonic he assured me) who works for the cowboys and he said that she said that he said that Campbell was on the phone with a guy named rick that works in their front office doing underground dirty work and they're gonna pay Campbell to spy on the redskins for the cowboys so that everyone knows what they're gonna be doing in games. I think we should lynch him.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

Past good to great qbs have done terribly on this end all be all wonderlic test so I don't think anyone should take it all that seriously. Cambell seemed to do pretty good this past year dispite being under his 4th Offensive Coordinator, one of which is the guy who supposedly dissed Cambell, so like others who have posted similar opinions, I'll wait until I see the kid preform on the field. and like I said in another thread, Cambell will be working with a qb/offensive coach who recently had really good success with adjusting and furthering the abilities of a similarly talented qb in Byron Leftwich. Plus he has 2 years to learn while Ramsey tries to prove that the team should be his or to increase his potential value in a future trade next year.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

Everybody said Marino was an idiot (debatable) and he slid to the second to last pick in the first round. At this point, I wouldn't mind having an idiot QB like marino get us to the playoffs (never mind worrying about SuperBowls).

Re: (Merged) Jason Campbell
 

My final thoughts about the Campbell pick:

Gibbs said from day one when he came back: we need QB depth. After the Brunnell fiasco, and after watching Haselbeck enough, he conluded that going into the futre, we don't have QB depth. I agree with that.

So, how do you fix it? First, is FA. We do not have the cap space to get a serious QB, and wont next year. QB is expensive. We can't build with an aging vet QB, and we sucked that up already. So it's the draft.

What's out there in the draft? Well, we've got the #9, But man, we've got needs on D after losing Smoot and Pierce--the D was serious last year, and we need to maintain that. ANd we need to keep Williams happy and in the fold. Plus, the draft is chock full of CBs, so a potential rookie starter/3rd CB is going to be there. Gotta use the 9 for a CB. Ok, now what? We need a decent prospect here, or there's no point. So trade for a pick. What's available? Work the phones and the most reasonable deal is Denver's #25--you do the "value chart" and we come out pretty good (remember how insistent they were about that at the presser). Still, is there anyone likely to be at 25 and worth the pick? SF is taking a QB, but there's this kid at AUburn, projected high second rounder. Let's get Musgrave, and scout him. He impresses in the scout, and he's got the character/intangibles. 4 years, 4 diff systems, improved every year, a winner, etc. Musgrave says "I can make a Leftwich outta him."

So we make the trade, sweat it out after Pasta blows our cover, and get our guy. Was it worth it? If we could have gotten down to the high second round and still gotten him (likely, I suppose), then we paid too much. But the initial trade itself was ok value wise, so just think we used a little too much value--not this 4 picks thing. It's about this year/next year, need, etc. By the chart (if you buy that sort of thing) it's not so bad.

Now, is this kid any good? The draft is a crap shoot. We'll see. Did we even need a QB? Well, Ramsey, Brunnell, and Haselbeck ain't depth, and it aint improving. Now next year, it's all Ramsey--he can take it if he's got the skills. But 2006 is his contract year. And Brunnell is gone and Haselbeck just isnt a starting QB. So we needed to address this issue. Oh, and #25 QBs on a rookie contract is a real bargain, IF the guy is good.

So I'm ok with it. And that's all the thought I'm gonna give it.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=wewhite3]better than Brunell......everyone back of Campbell, if he was that Dumb then he was smarter than the staff, to convince them to draft him[/QUOTE]


I saw a movie that reminds me of that I believe it was called Dumb and Dumber! :laughing2

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=redskinsskickazz]Does well in school (3.0 grade point average). His first Wonderlic test score (14) was lower than you like from a player at the quarterback position, but he then scored a much-improved 28 at the Combine in February

doesnt sound like a complete idiot to me.[/QUOTE]


For a QB? I would expect better from a toll collector.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=Daseal]He still has plenty of brains to run the offense we run![/QUOTE]


You ain't kidding. If we were gonna go this route Gibbs should have just converted Gardner to QB, we could have killed 2 birds with 1 stone, we would have a QB with NFL experience, and gardner wouldn't have to drop any more passes. :headbange

Re: Jason Campbell
 

[QUOTE=SKINSnCANES]lol, come on offiss...even Arrington is a better QB that Ramsey ;)[/QUOTE]
:laughing2

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=redwagonskins]Everybody said Marino was an idiot (debatable) and he slid to the second to last pick in the first round. At this point, I wouldn't mind having an idiot QB like marino get us to the playoffs (never mind worrying about SuperBowls).[/QUOTE]


Marino didn't slide because he was an idiot, he slid because he was a coke head at the time, I was friends with guy's who went to Penn State and was friends with Curt Warner [the RB] and they all told me he was known as the cocaine cowboy, that is why his play tailed off his senior year and he dropped in the draft.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=EEich]The Wonderlic score I saw for Campbell was 28.
I think this was just sour grapes because Auburn spanked Ole Miss this season.[/QUOTE]


Who knows?

I did here he used crayons to take the test though. :pi_lightb

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=drew54]Actually we should get that third rounder back next year since we lost Fred Smoot, due to the league compensation rulings.

But still no first rounder.[/QUOTE]

Actually, I bet we get only a 5th or 6th, the draft compensation is based on PAST performance and salary. Neither of which were overwhelming for either Smoot or Pierce. I wouldn't be surprised if we only get a couple of 6's or maybe a 5 and 7.

Philly always gets good comp picks because they let aging players who have been to pro bowls and are looking for a 2nd or 3rd big payday (Vincent, Taylor, Douglas) rather than taking their first foray into unrestricted land (like Smoot and Pierce). The also avoid losing their own up and coming players by giving them good new contracts prior to their 1st contract running out. (as they are trying to do with Westbrook, and tried todo with Simon).

Re: (Merged) Jason Campbell
 

Just chiming in on the Campbell pick. Everybody has said all that really needs to be said (about 3 or 4 times).

I agree w/ JoeCrisp. If we had had the 25th pick in addition to the 9th pick already AND Campbell fell to us - fine. But to trade away next year's first, well, that's just not value.

As for Campbell himself - he could go either way. He clearly has the physical tools and the only question is whether he has the smarts to play QB in the NFL. And by smarts, of course I mean football smarts - Can he learn to recognize defenses and think quick enough to adjust to them in the 10-15 seconds he gets before the snap and the 2 -3 seconds he gets after it? Only time will tell. He has a good history, played for winners, but he had apparantly had pretty good support all around him - Comparable to having several pro-bowlers, both offense and defense, on an NFL team.

Gibbs made a living out of "coaching up" late round QB's. Rypien was a 6th, Humphries a 4th(?), Schroeder a 3rd(?). Seemed to me, w/out making the trade, their were some pretty decent QB's in the 3rd round or later.

After much contemplation - count me as a nay on the pick. But ONLY b/c of the trade to get the pick.

The draft is a crapshoot. A good quality pick at the top of the 1st can generally be counted on to be, at least, a solid starter in the first year or two. After that, it's quantity not quality. Beyond two or three players - everybody's guessing. Better to take multiple shots. This franchise's cavalier attitude towards picks drives me to drink.

With all that said, and while I still like Ramsey and hope he does well, I hope this pans out for the best. Maybe it will, but I just don't see it.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]How about we see this kid on the field before we write him off.

The overreactions on this site are almost comical lately.[/QUOTE]
No doubt.

The real upside to this year's draft, though, is the probable reduction of overinflated predictions of success. We may just do well if no one on this site calls for 14-2.

Re: (Merged) Jason Campbell
 

Williams projects to be a Tight-End at best in a few years.

Re: Inside Opinion on Campbell
 

[QUOTE=BrudLee]No doubt.

The real upside to this year's draft, though, is the probable reduction of overinflated predictions of success. We may just do well if no one on this site calls for 14-2.[/QUOTE]

Thats what I'm thinking. The past 3-4 years I've been yelling Superbowl and we suck. Well I think Playoffs would be a stretch for this season; so maybe that means we'll do good. Who knows

Re: Jason Campbell
 

[QUOTE=Duffman003]I don't think we will draft Jason Campbell for a couple reasons. 1) is I don't think Gibbs is too worried about down the road considering all the financial problems we will be in and there is almost no way to avoid. 2) If we draft Campbell we will have 4 quarterbacks on the team and I don't know too much about the cap but we would probably cut burnell and I think there's almost no way we can afford that. 3) Why would we draft a couple days before the draft to get a quarterback that may not even be there at 25?
There may be answers to this but I personally don't think we will draft him. I hope we get mike williams with the first pick and a defensive player with the second, or even one of the cornerbacks with the first pick and heath miller with the second to open up options from the tight end position.[/QUOTE]

I completely agree... Ladies and gentlemen of the supposed jury... that would not make sense... Look at chewbacca.

Re: (Merged) Jason Campbell
 

[QUOTE=Longtimefan]Williams projects to be a Tight-End at best in a few years.[/QUOTE]

yep, the coaches at all the major universities in florida also said the same thing when they were trying to bash him...