Re: Domestic terrorism
 

The shooter was an American. Just something to keep in mind. Don't have to be a redneck to commit domestic terrorism. This whole thing is bigger than Obama.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

What I don't understand is how the fuck would a guy interviewed by the fbi for sympathetic statements about Isis by allowed to buy a gun. Makes zero sense.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Chico23231;1144181]What I don't understand is how the fuck would a guy interviewed by the fbi for sympathetic statements about Isis by allowed to buy a gun. Makes zero sense.[/quote]

Because rich guys who want to keep their toy guns have bought off Congress:

[url=http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/gop-blocks-bill-stop-terrorists-buying-guns]GOP blocks bill to stop terrorists from buying guns | MSNBC[/url]

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1144182]Because rich guys who want to keep their toy guns have bought off Congress:

[url=http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/gop-blocks-bill-stop-terrorists-buying-guns]GOP blocks bill to stop terrorists from buying guns | MSNBC[/url][/quote]

This makes no sense to me and now we have paid the price. Logic says suspected terrorists and citizens who make a conscious effort to connect with a terrorist, terrorist organization, or have any known ties to this enemy should not be allowed to purchase a weapon. that's common sense.

Another thing I have noticed is the shift in the narrative saying" because this person was influenced by a terrorist org to commit this attack but not actually a full fledge member or not born outside the US" that this is somehow "more acceptable and less serious" NO NO NO NO. People need to understand the strategy of ISIS...this terror organization optimal strategy is to inspire the homegrown attack. They lay out idea and directions...provide the ideological support. This fuck [B]Mateen is a terrorist [/B] just a like any other isis fighter taking up arms today across the world. there is no difference....American citizen, Canadian citizen, Pakastain, Afghani, Syrian....its all the same folks.


Its time to focus on why (radical islam). the hows (guns and security) aren't gonna stop this.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

His parents and others are saying he was a homophobe and the Islamic stuff is a smoke screen.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=MTK;1144184]His parents and others are saying he was a homophobe and the Islamic stuff is a smoke screen.[/quote]

But he said ISIS. That's all you can really go on.

Either way, we have two significant problems:

1) it's too easy for American citizens to get their hands on guns. Murder and suicide rates are lower in other developed countries who have gun control laws. Some find another way, but overall the rate is lower. That screams that we need major gun control and that the 2nd amendment needs to go.

2) If you create a paper trail or voice recording that shows you pledge allegiance to ISIS, you should be treated as an enemy of the state and a combatant. You should be captured and tried for treason, or killed just as an enemy soldier would on a battlefield. We should be at war with these people within our own borders. It matters not whether they are/were US citizens.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=MTK;1144184]His parents and others are saying he was a homophobe and the Islamic stuff is a smoke screen.[/quote]

While its quite obvious he was anti-gay, there is substantial evidence he was certainly attracted to radical Islamic ideology. The FBI twice investigating him, possible ties to Moner Mohammad Abu-Salha, the call to pledge support to ISIS, Boston Bombers talk of support, the shouting of "god is great" during the shoot up with police....its clear. I certainly think it can be dual motives...certainly we know the torture of gays by ISIS and the persecution of gays in the middle east in general.

I not buying into the narrative by his father, I think folks who want to believe that will. In looking into the father's background, WP has found some interesting things: [url]https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the-orlando-shooters-afghan-roots/2016/06/13/d89a8cd0-30e4-11e6-ab9d-1da2b0f24f93_story.html[/url]

"But Seddique Mateen appeared to maintain a strong affiliation to Afghanistan, hosting a television show broadcast from California that weighed in on the country’s political affairs.

He also filmed dozens of sparsely viewed, rambling YouTube videos portraying himself as an important Afghan analyst and leader.

[B]In one video, the elder Mateen expresses gratitude toward the Afghan Taliban while denouncing the Pakistani government.[/B]

[Shifting portraits emerge of shooter as authorities seek clues of terrorism ties]

“[B]Our brothers in Waziristan, our warrior brothers in [the] Taliban movement and national Afghan Taliban are rising up,[/B]” he said. “Inshallah, the Durand Line issue will be solved soon.”


Tough to believe a guy like this...

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

There's all that, and there's also, I don't know, the little fact that 20 minutes after he started shooting he called 911 and told the 911 operators that he pledged allegiance to ISIS.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Schneed10;1144185]But he said ISIS. That's all you can really go on.

Either way, we have two significant problems:

1) it's too easy for American citizens to get their hands on guns. Murder and suicide rates are lower in other developed countries who have gun control laws. Some find another way, but overall the rate is lower. That screams that we need major gun control and that the 2nd amendment needs to go.

2) If you create a paper trail or voice recording that shows you pledge allegiance to ISIS, you should be treated as an enemy of the state and a combatant. You should be captured and tried for treason, or killed just as an enemy soldier would on a battlefield. We should be at war with these people within our own borders. It matters not whether they are/were US citizens.[/quote]

I agree with you that these two points are a problem. Unfortunately, many people are going to use point #2, to disregard or take the focus away from point #1.

It seems that even the threat of terrorism, which has led this country to do some questionable things, will not be strong enough to negatively affect the political power of the gun lobby in this country.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

Can we please not be to quick to use....."that which cannot be named"?
Could there not be some other explanation? Perhaps, The dreaded Amish on a weekend bender??
Really??? Some of the Sons of Islam that have adopted the mantra of Radical Islamic Teaching could be terrorists. They need to be Profiled and Hunted down and killed like the cock roaches they are. Sorry Mr. President, that's right....they're RADICAL ISLAMIC TERRORISTS..... Try saying that a couple times. You'll feel better!
It's not about guns now any more than it was about "Pipe" in the pipe bombs in Boston. Or any more than it was about Jetliners.....Or box cutters on 9/11.
Remember the expression "When guns are outlawed, only Outlaws will have guns"? Truth. Do we expect Issis to turn theirs in? Or not just bring their's across our wide ass open borders? They've proven time and again, there are...far more effective means available.
What do we want it ban? Pipe? Passenger jets...box cutters(how would we open boxes)
It's about people. People we do not understand. We cannot apply conventional thinking to them or this problem. As has been stated, we are at war. They understand that, but to date.....sadly we do not.
God Bless those that lost their lives needlessly, those that still suffer and the families that always will.......

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Hog1;1144190]Can we please not be to quick to use....."that which cannot be named"?
Could there not be some other explanation? Perhaps, The dreaded Amish on a weekend bender??
Really??? Some of the Sons of Islam that have adopted the mantra of Radical Islamic Teaching could be terrorists. They need to be Profiled and Hunted down and killed like the cock roaches they are. Sorry Mr. President, that's right....they're RADICAL ISLAMIC TERRORISTS..... Try saying that a couple times. You'll feel better!
It's not about guns now any more than it was about "Pipe" in the pipe bombs in Boston. Or any more than it was about Jetliners.....Or box cutters on 9/11.
Remember the expression "When guns are outlawed, only Outlaws will have guns"? Truth. Do we expect Issis to turn theirs in? Or not just bring their's across our wide ass open borders? They've proven time and again, there are...far more effective means available.
What do we want it ban? Pipe? Passenger jets...box cutters(how would we open boxes)
It's about people. People we do not understand. We cannot apply conventional thinking to them or this problem. As has been stated, we are at war. They understand that, but to date.....sadly we do not.
God Bless those that lost their lives needlessly, those that still suffer and the families that always will.......[/quote]

The Aurora, Columbine, UCLA, Newton, Navy Yard, Charleston, **insert mass shooting location here** were not radical Islamic terrorists. Part of the problem is that we have a powerful political organization that prevents the government from having any type of conversation about gun control.

[url]https://www.buzzfeed.com/adolfoflores/man-arrested-weapons-said-he-was-headed-to-la-pride-festival?utm_term=.yt3xaw02N#.bxD3dDeN1[/url]

The guy in this article, apparently was going to do the same thing that they Orlando lunatic did, and I doubt that he is an radical Islamic terrorist.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1144191][B]The Aurora, Columbine, UCLA, Newton, Navy Yard, Charleston,[/B] **insert mass shooting location here** were not radical Islamic terrorists. Part of the problem is that we have a powerful political organization that prevents the government from having any type of conversation about gun control.

[url]https://www.buzzfeed.com/adolfoflores/man-arrested-weapons-said-he-was-headed-to-la-pride-festival?utm_term=.yt3xaw02N#.bxD3dDeN1[/url]

The guy in this article, apparently was going to do the same thing that they Orlando lunatic did, and I doubt that he is an radical Islamic terrorist.[/quote]

Would have gun control measures stopped these attacks?

the piece of shit in Charleston should never have been able to buy a gun but the back ground check failed because of big government. So you cant even complete valid gun checks...

So say we do eliminate assault weapons and high capacity mags...the terrorists gonna stop killing us? Is Chicago (strictest gun laws in the history of the country, also murder capital the last 10 years) killings gonna stop?
No and No.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Hog1;1144190]Can we please not be to quick to use....."that which cannot be named"?
Could there not be some other explanation? Perhaps, The dreaded Amish on a weekend bender??
Really??? Some of the Sons of Islam that have adopted the mantra of Radical Islamic Teaching could be terrorists. They need to be Profiled and Hunted down and killed like the cock roaches they are. Sorry Mr. President, that's right....they're RADICAL ISLAMIC TERRORISTS..... Try saying that a couple times. You'll feel better!
It's not about guns now any more than it was about "Pipe" in the pipe bombs in Boston. Or any more than it was about Jetliners.....Or box cutters on 9/11.
Remember the expression "When guns are outlawed, only Outlaws will have guns"? Truth. Do we expect Issis to turn theirs in? Or not just bring their's across our wide ass open borders? They've proven time and again, there are...far more effective means available.
What do we want it ban? Pipe? Passenger jets...box cutters(how would we open boxes)
It's about people. People we do not understand. We cannot apply conventional thinking to them or this problem. As has been stated, we are at war. They understand that, but to date.....sadly we do not.
God Bless those that lost their lives needlessly, those that still suffer and the families that always will.......[/quote]

Its like folks have forgotten the USS Cole and 9/11. [B]Apologist for terrorists[/B], I never would have thought it...but if you read the internet yesterday they were out in full force. folks were so upset this guy was muslim because the narrative they wanted wasn't gonna come true. Pathetic. absolutely pathetic.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Chico23231;1144192][B]Would have gun control measures stopped these attacks?
[/B]
the piece of shit in Charleston should never have been able to buy a gun but the back ground check failed because of big government. So you cant even complete valid gun checks...

So say we do eliminate assault weapons and high capacity mags...the terrorists gonna stop killing us? Is Chicago (strictest gun laws in the history of the country, also murder capital the last 10 years) killings gonna stop?
No and No.[/quote]

You can't know until you try. We can't even try, that's my whole point. NRA is always buying off politicians, who block any type of reform.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Chico23231;1144193]Its like folks have forgotten the USS Cole and 9/11. [B]Apologist for terrorists[/B], I never would have thought it...but if you read the internet yesterday they were out in full force. folks were so upset this guy was muslim because the narrative they wanted wasn't gonna come true. Pathetic. absolutely pathetic.[/quote]

So why doesn't media call the Aurora, Newton, and Charleston domestic terrorists? The only time someone is called a terrorist is when the person is Muslim. No one is apologizing for terrorists; it's just seems that in this country, you are only called a terrorist when you are of a certain religion.

The Orlando shooter was first and foremost a homophobe, the same as the Christian right, the same as the people behind the Bathroom bills in NC, and the same as the people that oppose gay marriage. Except, that some people don't want to make that comparison period, hence the focus on the fact that he was also a radical Muslim terrorist.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1144194]You can't know until you try. We can't even try, that's my whole point. NRA is always buying off politicians, who block any type of reform.[/quote]

Gun-control advocates have been pushing for a ban on assault weapons for more than 25 years. This proposal is essentially a political gimmick that confuses people. That is because the term is an arbitrarily defined epithet. A federal ban was in place between 1994 and 2004,[B] but Congress declined to renew it after studies showed it had no crime-reducing impact.[/B]

[url=http://www.cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/costs-consequences-gun-control]The Costs and Consequences of Gun Control | Cato Institute[/url]

good stuff here if you get a chance.

I think we should close the gun show loop hole so we can just align existing policies. I don't think suspected terrorist should have the ability to get a weapon and I also strongly believe people who have serious mental illness should not be allowed to own or posses a fire arm. That being said, It will not stop the amazing high shooting in Chicago, most likely will not limit mass/spree killings and certainly will not stop terrorist from attacking this country.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1144195]So why doesn't media call the Aurora, Newton, and Charleston domestic terrorists? The only time someone is called a terrorist is when the person is Muslim. No one is apologizing for terrorists; it's just seems that in this country, you are only called a terrorist when you are of a certain religion.

The Orlando shooter was first and foremost a homophobe, the same as the Christian right, the same as the people behind the Bathroom bills in NC, and the same as the people that oppose gay marriage. Except, that some people don't want to make that comparison period, hence the focus on the fact that he was also a radical Muslim terrorist.[/quote]

I believe Charleston was a terrorist and I heard folks call him that. those folks in militia men thingy up in Oregon or Washington state were widely called terrorists. So don't know...people tend to hear what they want.

Clearly Aurora was nut, someone who was insane likewise Newton. Newton's case is interesting...folks should read or watch the dateline or 60 minutes about that kid's up bringing, terrible fucking parents. Kid was terribly neglected and that mother was a money grubbing pig. Mom was a gun nut who didn't properly take care of her firearms.


You sound like your mad about the guy being a terrorist, sound like you wanted the religious, white southern guy to go in kill everybody. I know tough, you just gotta face the facts. Guy was a Islamic terrorist who just committed the big mass shooting in US history and the biggest terrorist attack since 9/11.

Eventually you will have to realize we are in a war with Islamic Terrorist. Right now they are committing unprecedented acts of Genocide in the middle east...proudly too. they film it..they enjoy it.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Chico23231;1144197]I believe Charleston was a terrorist and I heard folks call him that. those folks in militia men thingy up in Oregon or Washington state were widely called terrorists. So don't know...people tend to hear what they want.

Clearly Aurora was nut, someone who was insane likewise Newton. Newton's case is interesting...folks should read or watch the dateline or 60 minutes about that kid's up bringing, terrible fucking parents. Kid was terribly neglected and that mother was a money grubbing pig. Mom was a gun nut who didn't properly take care of her firearms.


[B]You sound like your mad about the guy being a terrorist, sound like you wanted the religious, white southern guy to go in kill everybody. I know tough, you just gotta face the facts.[/B] Guy was a Islamic terrorist who just committed the big mass shooting in US history and the biggest terrorist attack since 9/11.

Eventually you will have to realize we are in a war with Islamic Terrorist. Right now they are committing unprecedented acts of Genocide in the middle east...proudly too. they film it..they enjoy it.[/quote]

Well a non-Islamic terrorist (or potential terrorist) was just stopped on his way to a pride event in L.A. with weapons and bombs.

I do realize we are at war with Islamic Terrorism. You also need to realize that even if you were to solve the problem with Islamic Terrorism, there are PLENTY of people in the US that would do the same thing that this lunatic did in Orlando, and THAT is also a problem.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Ruhskins;1144199]Well a non-Islamic terrorist (or potential terrorist) was just stopped on his way to a pride event in L.A. with weapons and bombs.

I do realize we are at war with Islamic Terrorism. You also need to realize that even if you were to solve the problem with Islamic Terrorism,[B] there are PLENTY of people in the US that would do the same thing that this lunatic did in Orlando, and THAT is also a problem.[/B][/quote]

Yeah I don't know, that's a mighty big assumption you're making...bit unfair.

I think the response and the outpouring support across the country has been great. People forget the strides we've have made...I think the country as a whole has grown very tolerant to the point folks are now getting married in same sex marriages. Things are changing for the better. Sure, you will always have folks who don't want to see that, but I see a lot of tolerance across the country. Thankfully.

Now, you should take a look at the videos of ISIS and their policy with gay folks.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

Enough is enough. I'll use Switzerland as an example. Everyone in that country is packing. You don't see this shit happening over there? Do you?

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

Fuck guns.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

This clown was interviewed by the FBI 3 times but was allowed to get/carry a gun?? I don't care if he was a security guard. The FBI and the govt completely fucked this all up. Ridiculous.

My prayers go out to those families who lost their loved ones. Really despicable what that coward did.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

we've never seen a terror group as sophisticated, organized and deadly as Isis. As long as they have their caliphate in Iraq and Syria, expect more attacks. Unfortunately, we have an administration that could have done more to confront and stop Isis, they chose not too. They let them embed and provided a safe haven for terrorists to come around the world to train, set up logistics, network and commit genocide.


All this was preventable...Obama, Hillary, John Kerry, and the entire administration dropped the ball.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1144201]Enough is enough. I'll use Switzerland as an example. Everyone in that country is packing. You don't see this shit happening over there? Do you?[/quote]
STOP IT!!!!
AND they are required to remain qualified.

Perhaps we can look to highly successful programs such as the "War on Drugs" for inspiration?
Sorry folks, the Genie's out of the bottle and not going back. The most intelligent thing I have heard any left winger suggest is my man Bernie early in his campaign. He offered to open a line of communication with the NRA to see if they could co-develope a plan rather the usual BS saber rattling.....smart...but alas came to nothing.

In reality the AR-15, AK-47, etc or any So-called assault weapon is essentially the same as any other semi automatic weapon(and there are...many). It and similar brother and sister weapons are commonly used to scare an ignorant public.
At this particular time, I don't think you'll have much success trying to disarm a law abiding public, but if handled right, there could be some traction made in background check.
Not sure under the current administration how much good they do as apparently the FBI investigated him several times and wiped the record along with 100's of others?
Have not seen the actual info on that one........

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Chico23231;1144204]we've never seen a terror group as sophisticated, organized and deadly as Isis. As long as they have their caliphate in Iraq and Syria, expect more attacks. Unfortunately, we have an administration that could have done more to confront and stop Isis, they chose not too. They let them embed and provided a safe haven for terrorists to come around the world to train, set up logistics, network and commit genocide.


[B]All this was preventable...Obama, Hillary, John Kerry, and the entire administration dropped the ball.[/B][/quote]

Could not agree more.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Schneed10;1144188]There's all that, and there's also, I don't know, the little fact that 20 minutes after he started shooting he called 911 and told the 911 operators that he pledged allegiance to ISIS.[/quote]

That doesn't mean he's affiliated with ISIS though. I can call anybody and pledge allegiance to whoever. That said, seems this dipshit pledged allegiance to many organizations. Even ones that are enemies with one another.


[url]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/06/13/omar-mateen-may-not-have-understood-the-difference-between-isis-al-qaeda-and-hezbollah/[/url]



Much like Matty said, that other shit was a smoke screen. Come to find out, the guy was most likely gay himself. I wonder how ISIS thinks about them taking credit for a homosexual's act?

[url]http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-orlando-nightclub-shooter-visited-222620444.html[/url]

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Chico23231;1144204]we've never seen a terror group as sophisticated, organized and deadly as Isis.


All this was preventable...Obama, Hillary, John Kerry, and the entire administration dropped the ball.[/quote]




:laughing2


This is pretty hilarious if you actually think this. The only reason ISIS even exists is because we armed/trained them to help in our proxy war with Syria. (history repeating itself no doubt) The reason we continue to have these ragtag extremist groups is because of our shitty foreign policy. A policy we've maintained since the mid 40s. Let this former CIA counterterrorism agent (Amaryllis Fox) explain some things to you.


[url]https://www.facebook.com/ajplusenglish/videos/744058605735649/?pnref=story[/url]


I can't even fanthom why people are up here blaming Obama and his administration for this crap.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Chico23231;1144204]we've never seen a terror group as sophisticated, organized and deadly as Isis. As long as they have their caliphate in Iraq and Syria, expect more attacks. Unfortunately, we have an administration that could have done more to confront and stop Isis, they chose not too. They let them embed and provided a safe haven for terrorists to come around the world to train, set up logistics, network and commit genocide.


All this was preventable...Obama, Hillary, John Kerry, and the entire administration dropped the ball.[/quote]


How?This was a guy who was a closet homophobe and passed the FBI interviews,a whack job,if you want to blame anyone blame the parents and the wife all who knew he was shit crazy and did nothing.Obama,Hillary,John Kerry....seriously???

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=skinsfan69;1144207]Could not agree more.[/quote]


How?

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

Before I get into this...what is this smoke screen? First, why would he(mateen the evil Islamic terrorist) have a smoke screen? Second, why would your president then go along with this smokescreen and declare it a terrorist attack?

I love how folks are stereotyping the stereotype they supposedly hate. He wasn't orthodox-y terrorist enough to call himself a proper terrorist.

Like I've repeatedly stated, when the narrative doesn't appease the left, they say fuck the facts, we need to make it up to support our cause. No ability to think objectively.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

There very likely could be a combination of two things going on here, but I don't see how guns aren't PART of this equation. Not sure who reads Reddit, but it is absolutely overrun with morons saying guns weren't part of the problem. I just don't understand how we can't limit the sales of these types of guns. People instantly hear ban and they assume it's everything. Will criminals still get guns if they want them? Absolutely. If a ban on assault rifles, extended magazines, etc. saves even ONE life, wouldn't it be worth it?

I don't imagine he would go through the channels to somehow get a black market assault rifle if it was illegal. The death toll could have been cut in half.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Chico23231;1144213]Before I get into this...what is this smoke screen? First, why would he(mateen the evil Islamic terrorist) have a smoke screen? Second, why would your president then go along with this smokescreen and declare it a terrorist attack? [/quote]


Nobody said it wasn't a terrorist act. Just that it's not some radical Islamic terrorist attack.



[quote=Chico23231;1144213]I love how folks are stereotyping the stereotype they supposedly hate. He wasn't orthodox-y terrorist enough to call himself a proper terrorist. [/quote]

Just because he isn't some jihadist doesn't mean he still isn't a terrorist. I'd say it was more of a hate crime/massacre than anything. Targeting a specific minority group for his destruction falls under that category.


[quote=Chico23231;1144213]Like I've repeatedly stated, when the narrative doesn't appease the left, they say fuck the facts, we need to make it up to support our cause. No ability to think objectively.[/quote]

What facts are those? We've heard from plenty of people that say he wasn't really religious (ex-wife/family). Just because he calls into 911 and pledges allegiance to some nutjob faction doesn't make him apart of that faction.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Giantone;1144212]How?[/quote]

I'm going to step out of this. I come here to talk Redskins and football. I probably should have kept my mouth shut.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=NC_Skins;1144210]:laughing2


This is pretty hilarious if you actually think this. The only reason ISIS even exists is because we armed/trained them to help in our proxy war with Syria. (history repeating itself no doubt) The reason we continue to have these ragtag extremist groups is because of our shitty foreign policy. A policy we've maintained since the mid 40s. Let this former CIA counterterrorism agent (Amaryllis Fox) explain some things to you.


[url]https://www.facebook.com/ajplusenglish/videos/744058605735649/?pnref=story[/url]


I can't even fanthom why people are up here blaming Obama and his administration for this crap.[/quote]


Your seriously gonna make a blanket statement like that to dismiss the notion this Administration has made very serious errors and steps in their handling of not only the ISIS, but the Syrian War and the Arab Spring as a whole? Very foolish.

First to your point of CIA or US Military training groups that support our interest...yes it happens, everyone knows that. Did the military train the 50K ISIS army under there Shonda flag, in between beheadings? ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NOT. THEY NEVER DID. They trained moderate* militias that break apart, get absolved by other militias overtime that fight the Assad regime...its not crazy to think that someone who was trained by the US eventually pledged allegiance to isis and joined their group...a lot of time over fear.

ISIS didn't just start with the Syrian war...their roots were the sectarian violence in Iraq and underground war vs the Iraq government and US forces. The one Bush put down after he rebuilt troop levels back up there. A lot of leadership within ISIS were/are x-Iraqi Army leadership.

Specifically to the mishandling of the Syrian War and the ISIS breakout from Syria into Iraq...Remember these words "JV team" by Obama? This is the same type of complicity that have lead to attacks here at home. The Presidents own words: [url=http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/aug/28/obama-admits-isil-dilemma-we-dont-have-strategy-ye/]Obama confesses: 'We don't have a strategy yet' for dealing with Islamic State - Washington Times[/url]

Look Im not gonna get into what we should have done, that's the Presidents job and his administration. He and his crew have failed egregiously. Peoples lives are in danger here in this country and especially Europe. This was certainly preventable.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=NC_Skins;1144215]Nobody said it wasn't a terrorist act. Just that it's not some radical Islamic terrorist attack.





Just because he isn't some jihadist doesn't mean he still isn't a terrorist. I'd say it was more of a hate crime/massacre than anything. Targeting a specific minority group for his destruction falls under that category.




What facts are those? We've heard from plenty of people that say he wasn't really religious (ex-wife/family). Just because he calls into 911 and pledges allegiance to some nutjob faction doesn't make him apart of that faction.[/quote]

He was certainly inspired by ISIS. He is certainly an Islamic terrorist, look above in the thread for the clear facts Ive listed. But your a terrorist apologist.

Was this anti-gay, hate crime...lol, well of course! No one is disputing this, the target selection is clear!!! You know he was casing other targets right????

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=NC_Skins;1144215]Nobody said it wasn't a terrorist act. Just that it's not some radical Islamic terrorist attack.





Just because he isn't some jihadist doesn't mean he still isn't a terrorist. I'd say it was more of a hate crime/massacre than anything. Targeting a specific minority group for his destruction falls under that category.




What facts are those? We've heard from plenty of people that say he wasn't really religious (ex-wife/family). [B]Just because he calls into 911 and pledges allegiance to some nutjob faction doesn't make him apart of that faction[/B].[/quote]

Folks this is the liberal left talking "Nutjob faction"...these aren't even a terrorist organization to these people. Wow This organization is openly committing genocide and attacking the west...nutjob faction. This is the same complicity of how we got here.....wow

Pledging allegiance to a terror organization twice over the phone does not make you a terrorist? DA FUQ.....

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;1144214]There very likely could be a combination of two things going on here, but I don't see how guns aren't PART of this equation. Not sure who reads Reddit, but it is absolutely overrun with morons saying guns weren't part of the problem. I just don't understand how we can't limit the sales of these types of guns. People instantly hear ban and they assu me it's everything. Will criminals still get guns if they want them? Absolutely. If a ban on assault rifles, extended magazines, etc. saves even ONE life, wouldn't it be worth it?

I don't imagine he would go through the channels to somehow get a black market assault rifle if it was illegal. The death toll could have been cut in half.[/quote]

Assault weapons are essentially the same as any other semi-automatic weapon (handgun or rifle). Some are just scarier looking than others. The previous assault weapon ban had little or no effect on crime (depending on which lies you subscribe to). Another will likely have the same effect. As you stated, the people that you want to be deprived of guns.....won't be.
What is it you really expect to achieve?
We have a people problem and until we attack it from that angle, we'll see nothing progressive and we'll haven plenty more of the same. The gun is just a tool easily replaceable with bombs....anthrax.....nukes.....jetliners...fertilizer, etc.
Who knows? You cannot ban everything....or can you?
These people and groups have proven to highly inventive when confronted with such choices.
Hell, we can't get our borders under control. Until AT LEAST that happens, we cannot hope to stem the importation of bad guys and things we do not want them to have.

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=Hog1;1144220]Assault weapons are essentially the same as any other semi-automatic weapon (handgun or rifle). Some are just scarier looking than others. The previous assault weapon ban had[B][SIZE="4"] little [/SIZE][/B]or no effect on crime (depending on which lies you subscribe to). Another will likely have the same effect. As you stated, the people that you want to be deprived of guns.....won't be.
What is it you really expect to achieve?
We have a people problem and until we attack it from that angle, we'll see nothing progressive and we'll haven plenty more of the same. The gun is just a tool easily replaceable with bombs....anthrax.....nukes.....jetliners...fertilizer, etc.
Who knows? You cannot ban everything....or can you?
These people and groups have proven to highly inventive when confronted with such choices.
Hell, we can't get our borders under control. Until AT LEAST that happens, we cannot hope to stem the importation of bad guys and things we do not want them to have.[/quote]

This is enough for me. Even a little is worth it. It always comes down to, "Well, it probably won't work so let's just not try it." I mean, why not? That's my question, why NOT try?

And trust me, I don't think guns are the sole problem nor do I think all guns should be banned. Obviously, this is pure speculation, but say we had an assault gun ban in effect, do you think the death toll would have been as high? I really don't think it would have been. I think your serious terrorist would do whatever they could to acquire bomb building materials, assault rifles, etc.

Again, if it lowered these types of crimes by .0000001% that's worth it because really, what is the cost?

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

understood...
Thanx for the clarification

Re: Domestic terrorism
 

[quote=TheMalcolmConnection;1144221]This is enough for me. Even a little is worth it. It always comes down to, "Well, it probably won't work so let's just not try it." I mean, why not? That's my question, why NOT try?

And trust me, I don't think guns are the sole problem nor do I think all guns should be banned. Obviously, this is pure speculation, but say we had an assault gun ban in effect, do you think the death toll would have been as high? I really don't think it would have been. I think your serious terrorist would do whatever they could to acquire bomb building materials, assault rifles, etc.

Again, if it lowered these types of crimes by .0000001% that's worth it because really, what is the cost?[/quote]

I think we need to separate a couple things...these assault weapons tend to be used in these activity shooter, mass killing.

"normal" gun violence tends to be hand guns and long guns.

The mass killings are headline makers...normal gun violence isn't talked about much.

We talk about mass killings a lot...we don't talk about everyday gun violence which affect more folks across the country. Chicago, Baltimore...? Are we good with this? Would assault weapons bans stop this violence? probably very little.

The mass killings are usually mentally unstable, mental illness...some terrorists. I think these people would still want to kill regardless of a ban of assault weapons. Is it the act or gun?

These are tough questions for sure