Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;675473]What, specifically, are you asserting is a fabrication?[/quote]

Did the Roman Empire fall before or after 1066? That my friend is when Christianity was forced upon the British by descendants of Vikings living in modern day France off the WWII famous coast of Normandy.

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=tryfuhl;675498]No sir, I did not commit the same act at all. I'm not sure why you would accuse me of that.[/quote]

Initially reading your post, it appeared to me that you were denying the role that Christianity, particularly Roman Catholicism, played in preserving the knowledge of the ancient greeks and romans along with denying the role that monastaries played in preserving and teaching scholarship. If that is not what you were doing, fine. I withdraw the accusation.

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;675499]Money talks point blank. Going to courst and not understanding fullty what's going on? That my friend is called the US justice system.[/quote]

Yes it does. Consider this: How many guys who speak broken English can run for and win a public office? No matter how well his campaign is funded, he'll be perceived as a foreigner.

Say I have a construction site full of illegals. They may know how to put up a house like nobody's business. Let the county inspector show up. Do you think those illegals can site code? No they can't. The English speaking foreman who picked them up at the Lowe's Parking lot does though.

If you don't see the logic in what I'm presenting to you. You might as well SQUAWK POLLY SQUAWK! ha ha ha :laughing-

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=tryfuhl;675465]I'd probably say not to champion Christians and Catholics of those who saved knowledge as they did their fair share of destroying it as well.[/quote]

Christians did save many works which may have been destroyed in the fall of Rome.

However, ancient Christians also burned the books of Aristotle and Plato, indirectly helping to launch the so-called "Dark Ages." The only reason we still have many of these ancient Greek philosophical classics is because they were saved and studied by medieval Muslims. Of course, Muslims have since burned other books, such as "The Satanic Verses."

I'm agreeing with you, tryfuhl.

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;675514]Initially reading your post, it appeared to me that you were denying the role that Christianity, particularly Roman Catholicism, played in preserving the knowledge of the ancient greeks and romans along with denying the role that monastaries played in preserving and teaching scholarship. If that is not what you were doing, fine. I withdraw the accusation.[/quote]

Spoken quite the lawyer. :)

It's a vicious cycle, I try not to tie anyone of any belief set into the masses, sometimes it's easy or convenient though.. at least once they've presented their case.

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;675511]Did the Roman Empire fall before or after 1066? That my friend is when Christianity was forced upon the British by descendants of Vikings living in modern day France off the WWII famous coast of Normandy.[/quote]

The ignorance displayed by this statement is proof of my initial point. Do you know when the Roman Empire established itself in England? Do you know when monastaries were established in modern day england? Ever heard of Lindesfarne (without googling it)? The Saxons were Christians well before the Normans landed.

Read a f'ing book idiot.

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

JR, you usually show more restraint. whats got you fired up? :)

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=JoeRedskin;675527]The ignorance displayed by this statement is proof of my initial point. Do you know when the Roman Empire established itself in England? Do you know when monastaries were established in modern day england? Ever heard of Lindesfarne (without googling it)? The Saxons were Christians well before the Normans landed.

Read a f'ing book idiot.[/quote]

If my memory serves me well, the Vikings themselves invaded England to raid the monastaries.

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=Lotus;675518]Christians did save many works which may have been destroyed in the fall of Rome.

However, ancient Christians also burned the books of Aristotle and Plato, indirectly helping to launch the so-called "Dark Ages." The only reason we still have many of these ancient Greek philosophical classics is because they were saved and studied by medieval Muslims. Of course, Muslims have since burned other books, such as "The Satanic Verses."

I'm agreeing with you, tryfuhl.[/quote]

And I agree with you too. As I said, religion (whether muslim, christianity, hinduism or many others) has been used by men for evil purposes. It has also passed considerable benefits to civilization. If you choose to focusing on the bad, and ignore the good - so be it, that is your choice. Just don't pretend that good did not happen.

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

This my friend is how Europe escaped the Dark Ages. This answers the question why do we use the Arabic Number system instead fo the monastery number system (which includes zero), and also the reason all known stars of antiquity have Arabic names.


In his book titled, "Spain In The Modern World," James Cleuge explains the significance of Cordova in Medieval Europe:

"For there was nothing like it, at that epoch, in the rest of Europe. The best minds in that continent looked to Spain for everything which most clearly differentiates a human being from a tiger." (Cleugh, 1953, p. 70)

During the end of the first millennium, Cordova was the intellectual well from which European humanity came to drink. Students from France and England traveled there to sit at the feet of Muslim, Christian and Jewish scholars, to learn philosophy, science and medicine (Digest, 1973, p. 622). [B]In the great library of Cordova alone, there were some 600,000 manuscripts (Burke, 1978, p. 122). [/B]

Hahahahahaha! monks had one book.


This rich and sophisticated society took a tolerant view towards other faiths. Tolerance was unheard of in the rest of Europe. But in Moorish Spain, "thousands of Jews and Christians lived in peace and harmony with their Muslim overlords." (Burke, 1985, p. 38) The society had a literary rather than religious base. Economically their prosperity was unparalleled for centuries. The aristocracy promoted private land ownership and encouraged Jews in banking. There was little or no Muslim prostelyting. Instead, non-believers simply paid an extra tax!

"Their society had become too sophisticated to be fanatical. Christians and Moslems, with Jews as their intermediaries and interpreters, lived side by side and fought, not each other, but other mixed communities." (Cleugh, 1953, p. 71)

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

Kind of hard to give credit for preserving something which they horded and denied to others. Especially when they chose what to preserve and what to destroy based upon how well it meshed with their teachings and subsequent control of the masses. I'm not picking on Christianity. This goes for all organized religion. What I'm saying is that as an organization, their good works were largely self serving. Just my opinion. Love the philosophy of Christianity, but you can keep the "magic."

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=dmek25;675529]JR, you usually show more restraint. whats got you fired up? :)[/quote]

Sorry. It is the general christian bashing and judging the good works of the many by the misdeeds of the minority that has me worked up a bit. Plus, what appears to be the hypocracy of those who accuse Christians of ignoring history and then turn around and make blatantly historically inaccurate statements.

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=tryfuhl;675471]How simple minded can you be man?

What do you do for business I must ask?[/quote]

Yes it is actually very simple. I own an insurance agency and yourself.

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;675543]This my friend is how Europe escaped the Dark Ages. This answers the question why do we use the Arabic Number system instead fo the monastery number system (which includes zero), and also the reason all known stars of antiquity have Arabic names.


In his book titled, "Spain In The Modern World," James Cleuge explains the significance of Cordova in Medieval Europe:

"For there was nothing like it, at that epoch, in the rest of Europe. The best minds in that continent looked to Spain for everything which most clearly differentiates a human being from a tiger." (Cleugh, 1953, p. 70)

During the end of the first millennium, Cordova was the intellectual well from which European humanity came to drink. Students from France and England traveled there to sit at the feet of Muslim, Christian and Jewish scholars, to learn philosophy, science and medicine (Digest, 1973, p. 622). In the great library of Cordova alone, there were some 600,000 manuscripts (Burke, 1978, p. 122).
[B]
Hahahahahaha! monks had one book.[/B]


This rich and sophisticated society took a tolerant view towards other faiths. Tolerance was unheard of in the rest of Europe. But in Moorish Spain, "thousands of Jews and Christians lived in peace and harmony with their Muslim overlords." (Burke, 1985, p. 38) The society had a literary rather than religious base. Economically their prosperity was unparalleled for centuries. The aristocracy promoted private land ownership and encouraged Jews in banking. There was little or no Muslim prostelyting. Instead, non-believers simply paid an extra tax!

"Their society had become too sophisticated to be fanatical. Christians and Moslems, with Jews as their intermediaries and interpreters, lived side by side and fought, not each other, but other mixed communities." (Cleugh, 1953, p. 71)[/quote]

Both false and unfair. Monasteries were the great libraries of Europe outside of Moorish Spain. For just one example, if you have ever heard of Aesop's fables, those tales were preserved from multiple sources over centuries by Christian monasteries.

Re: Texas wants to rewrite the US History books
 

[quote=joethiesmanfan;675543]This my friend is how Europe escaped the Dark Ages. This answers the question why do we use the Arabic Number system instead fo the monastery number system (which includes zero), and also the reason all known stars of antiquity have Arabic names.


In his book titled, "Spain In The Modern World," James Cleuge explains the significance of Cordova in Medieval Europe:

"For there was nothing like it, at that epoch, in the rest of Europe. The best minds in that continent looked to Spain for everything which most clearly differentiates a human being from a tiger." (Cleugh, 1953, p. 70)

During the end of the first millennium, Cordova was the intellectual well from which European humanity came to drink. Students from France and England traveled there to sit at the feet of Muslim, Christian and Jewish scholars, to learn philosophy, science and medicine (Digest, 1973, p. 622). [B]In the great library of Cordova alone, there were some 600,000 manuscripts (Burke, 1978, p. 122). [/B]

Hahahahahaha! monks had one book.


This rich and sophisticated society took a tolerant view towards other faiths. Tolerance was unheard of in the rest of Europe. But in Moorish Spain, "thousands of Jews and Christians lived in peace and harmony with their Muslim overlords." (Burke, 1985, p. 38) The society had a literary rather than religious base. Economically their prosperity was unparalleled for centuries. The aristocracy promoted private land ownership and encouraged Jews in banking. There was little or no Muslim prostelyting. Instead, non-believers simply paid an extra tax!

"Their society had become too sophisticated to be fanatical. Christians and Moslems, with Jews as their intermediaries and interpreters, lived side by side and fought, not each other, but other mixed communities." (Cleugh, 1953, p. 71)[/quote]

I guess they forgot the years of war and slaughter that it took to kick out the Moors. El Cid wouldn't agree with this rosy utopia that you've painted.