Re: RG3 is back
 

When I say big picture i am referring not about next year but this year. Small picture - minn, bye week. Big picture - three division games, 49ers and colts down the stretch. Lets make sure Griff is prepared in every way for that stretch. TB will be a nice tune up game for Griff after the bye.

Re: RG3 is back
 

[quote=WillH;1092197]I agree with you to a point, but I think what you are not factoring in is how RG3 looked at the beginning of the season. He was struggling, and just before he got injured he started to show some signs that he was getting comfortable again. [/quote]

I am factoring that in, I'm just factoring it in as realizing the **entire team** has struggled all year up until the Dallas game. Even the Titans game was just bad, bad football; we won, but it was bad football by both teams. The defense had been putrid outside of the Jacksonville game until Dallas. The Special Teams was again striving for worst in league history; again until Dallas.

If we're to have a season all 3 phases of the team need to be on the ball. That includes Griffin. Seasons change on a whim. Momentum is a bitch. We may finally have some good momentum for the first time this year.



[quote=WillH;1092197]Now, coming back from an injury, and not having had the reps with the offense, he may not be where he needs to be to effectively lead this team. I think that is why people are saying he may not provide us the best chance of winning.
[/quote]
To me, when a coach says the guy is ready, that means:
He's medically cleared and not at risk to injure himself
He's physically good, movement/mechanics are not going to be limited
He's got enough reps with the offense to be on the same page as them
In Griffin's case, due to his age and possition, I'd add: He's not in a state where he's likely to revert to bad habits/mechanics or someone stunt his growth (or even damage it) as a young quarterback.

So if he's ready. He's ready. If he's not ready and Gruden says he's ready, then we have a problem at the HC position.

Re: RG3 is back
 

[quote=punch it in;1092201]When I say big picture i am referring not about next year but this year. Small picture - minn, bye week. Big picture - three division games, 49ers and colts down the stretch. Lets make sure Griff is prepared in every way for that stretch. TB will be a nice tune up game for Griff after the bye.[/quote]

If he's ready you put him in the game.

If he's not ready you don't. Opponent doesn't matter. Bye week doesn't matter. He's either ready or he's not.

You play the people that give you the best chance to win. The exception is when you've locked up a playoff seed, then you play people to get reps that may be needed in critical playoff positions.

We're 3-5. You play the people that give you the best chance to win.

Re: RG3 is back
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1092200]Colt got off to a rough start, not too surprising considering his first start in what 3 years? But he settled in and was as instrumental and leading the team to victory as anyone else on the team.

He got better as the game got along, something Cousins repeatedly failed to do.

If Griffin is healthy he should be the starter. He's undoubtedly our best QB, but Colt did everything asked of him. No need to dismiss him[/quote]

Agreed. Not trying to dismiss him at all. He did his job and arguably more.

But he's not the best quarterback on our team. And his performance on Monday night was not some exceptional performance that needs to be put up there as an argument that he should start over a 'ready' Griffin. And we're not a good enough team to risk that. Not yet, anyways.

There's a world of difference going into the bye 3-6 vs 4-5.

Re: RG3 is back
 

[QUOTE=tshile;1092204]If he's ready you put him in the game.



If he's not ready you don't. Opponent doesn't matter. Bye week doesn't matter. He's either ready or he's not.



You play the people that give you the best chance to win. The exception is when you've locked up a playoff seed, then you play people to get reps that may be needed in critical playoff positions.



We're 3-5. You play the people that give you the best chance to win.[/QUOTE]


Yes, however if Snyder is indeed overriding Grudens decision on Griff being ready that is a problem. You said yourself that u think we can beat Minny with Colt. On top of all of this it is a new offense to Griff. Colt has played in this scheme before. Griff looked not so great against Houston, and pretty good against the Jags. However as we all know Cousins looked like Jonny Unitas against the Jags. I have no idea if Griff has this offense down. None. So I still feel like giving him two more weeks of prep time is not the worst thing in the world. If he starts on Sunday (regardless of who is calling that shot), than I hope he does have it down. Httr.

Re: RG3 is back
 

Where is the evidence that Snyder is overriding anyone?

I hate Snyder, as a person and owner of my favorite team, as much as the next guy. But that talking point gets thrown around a lot with ZERO to back it up.

Yes, if Snyder is overriding the coach then that's a problem. But it's a different problem.

I think we can beat Minnesota with McCoy. I think Griffin gives us a significantly better chance and it's not even close. At 3-5 we don't exactly have the luxury to go with McCoy if Griffin is ready - unless you've given up on the season.

It cracks me up how hard people are falling over McCoy. The same people that were gushing over Cousins. Some of them were saying Griffin's injury was a blessing in disguise for Gruden so he could start the quarterback he really likes.

It's all a bunch of nonsense.

Re: RG3 is back
 

[quote=tshile;1092202]I am factoring that in, I'm just factoring it in as realizing the **entire team** has struggled all year up until the Dallas game. Even the Titans game was just bad, bad football; we won, but it was bad football by both teams. The defense had been putrid outside of the Jacksonville game until Dallas. The Special Teams was again striving for worst in league history; again until Dallas.

If we're to have a season all 3 phases of the team need to be on the ball. That includes Griffin. Seasons change on a whim. Momentum is a bitch. We may finally have some good momentum for the first time this year.




To me, when a coach says the guy is ready, that means:
He's medically cleared and not at risk to injure himself
He's physically good, movement/mechanics are not going to be limited
He's got enough reps with the offense to be on the same page as them
In Griffin's case, due to his age and possition, I'd add: He's not in a state where he's likely to revert to bad habits/mechanics or someone stunt his growth (or even damage it) as a young quarterback.

So if he's ready. He's ready. If he's not ready and Gruden says he's ready, then we have a problem at the HC position.[/quote]

I think Gruden is saying that right now for Griffin:

"He's medically cleared and not at risk to injure himself
He's physically good, movement/mechanics are not going to be limited"

But maybe not that:
"He's got enough reps with the offense to be on the same page as them"

And I think some of the concern is that he hasn't mastered his mechanics, and or gotten rid of bad habits.

So, what I'm getting is that you, like everyone else, dont think RG3 should start unless he is fully prepared. So, I'm not sure where the disagreement is.

Re: RG3 is back
 

[QUOTE=tshile;1092207]Where is the evidence that Snyder is overriding anyone?



I hate Snyder, as a person and owner of my favorite team, as much as the next guy. But that talking point gets thrown around a lot with ZERO to back it up.



Yes, if Snyder is overriding the coach then that's a problem. But it's a different problem.



I think we can beat Minnesota with McCoy. I think Griffin gives us a significantly better chance and it's not even close. At 3-5 we don't exactly have the luxury to go with McCoy if Griffin is ready - unless you've given up on the season.



It cracks me up how hard people are falling over McCoy. The same people that were gushing over Cousins. Some of them were saying Griffin's injury was a blessing in disguise for Gruden so he could start the quarterback he really likes.



It's all a bunch of nonsense.[/QUOTE]


Well a win is a win. No style points in the nfl. So in my mind there are a couple different scenarios. One - colt wins and keeps the season alive while Griff prepares for the home stretch and gets two more weeks to do so. Two - griff starts and looks better than Mccoy and wins.
Ofcourse either one could also shit the bed and we could lose but eff that. Lol.
So im simply taking the cautious way out here and giving Griff more time. If i had a crystal ball and knew RG-3 was going to show up strong this Sunday than of course lets get this ship rolling with the man at the helm. I dont. I said already that the fan in me wants Griff to start because I know he is the future of the franchise. But in the back of my head something tells me to give him two more weeks of prep time.

Re: RG3 is back
 

Here's a question I heard. Which I initially thought was stupid and i laughed. Then.... I started to wonder... Does rg3 make that sideline pass to reed that colt did so amazingly? Or does he take off, Fall, get hurt or fumble?
He's gotta get past his awkwardness with this system and how he's trying to become a pocket passer... He's looked awkward all season, I just hope he gets over it, and crushes the vikings. I'm fine with either qb starting on Sunday, but an extra week off that ankle couldn't hurt either ..

Re: RG3 is back
 

[quote=tshile;1092207]Where is the evidence that Snyder is overriding anyone?[/quote]

Personally, I've heard from more than enough people to believe strongly that either Snyder (and his associates) or Allen (or both?) is putting a lot of pressure on Gruden to play Griffin ASAP (just like when they told him he had to start him at the beginning of the year

[quote]I hate Snyder, as a person and owner of my favorite team, as much as the next guy. But that talking point gets thrown around a lot with ZERO to back it up.[/quote]

He's no bigger jerk than Ted Leonsis, I don't have a problem with him

[quote]Yes, if Snyder is overriding the coach then that's a problem. But it's a different problem[/quote]

Let the coach sink with his own ship, I guess

[quote]I think we can beat Minnesota with McCoy. I think Griffin gives us a significantly better chance and it's not even close. At 3-5 we don't exactly have the luxury to go with McCoy if Griffin is ready - unless you've given up on the season.[/quote]

If Griffin shows that he's not ready on Sunday, it will be disastrous for the organization. Could be a franchise altering loss

[quote]It cracks me up how hard people are falling over McCoy. The same people that were gushing over Cousins. Some of them were saying Griffin's injury was a blessing in disguise for Gruden so he could start the quarterback he really likes.[/quote]

Not me. I said from the start Cousins would be exposed as nothing more than a career backup. But yeah Gruden really did like him

[quote]It's all a bunch of nonsense.[/quote]

Where's Rex Grossman when you need him?

Re: RG3 is back
 

"Personally, I've heard from more than enough people to believe strongly that either Snyder (and his associates) or Allen (or both?) is putting a lot of pressure on Gruden to play Griffin ASAP [B](just like when they told him he had to start him at the beginning of the year"[/B]

You think Jay wanted to possibly start someone else at the beginning of the year?

You make a great point if Rg3 doesnt play well and its a bad loss at Minny.That would put alot of people at conflict within the organization im sure.

I dont see rushing RG3 if he is not ready. Makes no sense

Re: RG3 is back
 

[quote=WillH;1092208]
So, what I'm getting is that you, like everyone else, dont think RG3 should start unless he is fully prepared. So, I'm not sure where the disagreement is.[/quote]

There are people saying even if he's ready sit him because:
bye week
McCoy's performance against Dallas.

My point is - if he's ready, you play him. Until he proves he's not as good as McCoy.

Re: RG3 is back
 

[quote=SmootSmack;1092211]Personally, I've heard from more than enough people to believe strongly that either Snyder (and his associates) or Allen (or both?) is putting a lot of pressure on Gruden to play Griffin ASAP (just like when they told him he had to start him at the beginning of the year
[/quote]

More than enough epople that you personally know that are in a position to know that sort of thing?

Or more than enough people in the media?

Re: RG3 is back
 

[quote=Chico23231;1092212]"Personally, I've heard from more than enough people to believe strongly that either Snyder (and his associates) or Allen (or both?) is putting a lot of pressure on Gruden to play Griffin ASAP [B](just like when they told him he had to start him at the beginning of the year"[/B]

You think Jay wanted to possibly start someone else at the beginning of the year?

You make a great point if Rg3 doesnt play well and its a bad loss at Minny.That would put alot of people at conflict within the organization im sure.

I dont see rushing RG3 if he is not ready. Makes no sense[/quote]

Didn't I mention this before the Seahawks game? Maybe I only told the other mods. Yes, know this from very very very reliable sources who have known Jay Gruden for a looooooonggggggg time. He thought RG3 was not ready for week 1 and wanted to start Cousins against Houston

Re: RG3 is back
 

[quote=tshile;1092213][B]There are people saying even if he's ready sit him because:
bye week
McCoy's performance against Dallas.[/B]

My point is - if he's ready, you play him. Until he proves he's not as good as McCoy.[/quote]

Not trying to be contentious, but who is saying that?