Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

After the McNabb trade fiasco which was an absolute fail, I dont think I want Shanny sending more draft picks for Orton. Hanyesworth I would be more willing to give for Orton, but would Orton be a good fit? I just dont think so. Is Orton better than Rex/Beck, yes.

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=Mattyk;812450]Orton was injured and they went with Tebow the rest of the way to evaluate him. It's not like he was benched due to performance reasons.[/quote]


It doesn't matter. I still would not waste draft picks just to get Orton. If he was a FA, then that might be a different story. As it is, hell no.


edit: Would he even be a good QB in this system?

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=NC_Skins;812454]It doesn't matter. I still would not waste draft picks just to get Orton. If he was a FA, then that might be a different story. As it is, hell no.[/quote]

lol well it matters if that's your reasoning behind not wanting him as you just stated.

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=Mattyk;812456]lol well it matters if that's your reasoning behind not wanting him as you just stated.[/quote]

I was merely pointing out he got benched. Don't care about the reasons. I'm willing to bet you good money that both Beck and Grossman would outperform Orton in this offense this next year. You have 2 QBs that have experience with the system, and to bring in a QB that didn't know it? We saw how that worked with McNabb. Also, is Orton really a fit for this type of offense?

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=NC_Skins;812459]I was merely pointing out he got benched. Don't care about the reasons. I'm willing to bet you good money that both Beck and Grossman would outperform Orton in this offense this next year. You have 2 QBs that have experience with the system, and to bring in a QB that didn't know it? We saw how that worked with McNabb. Also, is Orton really a fit for this type of offense?[/quote]

Orton's experience in the system is of course a concern.

But if you look at Orton's numbers over the last two seasons, he has done remarkably well. He has a TD/INT ratio of 2:1, for example.

You are being too hard on poor Orton. Besides, Denver is DT hungry and likely would love to pick up Haynesworth.

Haynesworth for Orton.

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=NC_Skins;812448]You do realize Orton was BENCHED for TIM TEBOW??? TIM FREAKING TEBOW!!! He also was benched in favor or Rex Grossman back when he was on the Bears.


Yeah, I'll take Rex/Beck over Orton.[/quote]

1. But the Broncos were stupid enough to draft him that high, they have to make him the starting quarterback to they will catch a sh!t storm.

2. Kyle was benched because he was 22 years old, new to the NFL and still learning. Rex had already been in the league.

3. Stats - Kyle Orton - Age 28
SEASON - TEAM - GP -- CMP --- ATT --- CMP% ----- YDS ---- AVG --- TD - LNG - INT - FUM -- RAT
2005 ------ CHI -- 15 -- 190 --- 368 ----- 51.6 ----- 1,869 --- 5.08 ---- 9 -- 54 --- 13 --- 6 ---- 59.7

2007 ----- CHI --- 3 --- 43 ----- 80 ----- 53.8 ------- 478 ---- 5.98 ---- 3 -- 55 ---- 2 --- 1 ---- 73.9

2008 ----- CHI -- 15 -- 272 --- 465 ----- 58.5 ------ 2,972 --- 6.39 --- 18 - 65 ---- 12 -- 3 ---- 79.6

2009 ----- DEN -- 16 - 336 --- 541 ------ 62.1 ----- 3,802 --- 7.03 --- 21 - 87 --- 12 --- 3 ---- 86.8

2010 ----- DEN -- 13 - 293 --- 498 ----- 58.8 ------ 3,653 --- 7.34 --- 20 - 71 ---- 9 ---- 1 ---- 87.5

[B]Career ---------- 62 - 1134 - 1,952 ---- 58.1 ----- 12,774 --- 6.54 -- 71 - 87 --- 48 --- 14 -- 79.6[/B]


Rex Grossman - Age 30
SEASON - TEAM - GP -- CMP --- ATT --- CMP% ----- YDS ---- AVG --- TD - LNG - INT - FUM -- RAT
2003 ------ CHI -- 3 ---- 38 ----- 72 ----- 52.8 ------- 437 ---- 6.07 ---- 2 -- 59 ---- 1 --- 1 ---- 74.8

2004 ------ CHI -- 3 ---- 47 ----- 84 ----- 56.0 ------- 607 ---- 7.23 ---- 1 -- 40 ---- 3 --- 2 ---- 67.9

2005 ------ CHI -- 2 ---- 20 ----- 39 ----- 51.3 ------- 259 ---- 6.64 ---- 1 -- 54 ---- 2 --- 0 ---- 59.7

2006 ------ CHI - 16 --- 262 ---- 480 ---- 54.6 ----- 3,193 --- 6.65 ---- 23 - 62 --- 20 --- 5 ---- 73.9

2007 ------ CHI -- 8 --- 122 ---- 225 ---- 54.2 ----- 1,411 --- 6.27 ---- 4 -- 59 ---- 7 --- 4 ---- 66.4

2008 ------ CHI -- 4 --- 32 ----- 62 ----- 51.6 ------- 257 ---- 4.15 ---- 2 -- 29 ---- 2 --- 0 ---- 59.7

2009 ------ HOU - 1 ----- 3 ------ 9 ----- 33.3 -------- 33 ---- 3.67 ---- 0 -- 21 ---- 1 --- 0 ---- 5.6

2010 ------ WSH - 4 ---- 74----- 133 ---- 55.6 ------- 884 --- 6.65 ---- 7 - 64 ---- 4 ---- 4 ---- 81.2

[B]Career ----------- 41 --- 598 -- 1,104 --- 54.2 ------- 7,081 --- 6.41 --- 40 -- 64 -- 40 -- 16 ---- 70.9[/B]




Man, guess I was wrong, Grossman is just so much better than Orton. Mute.

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=Lotus;812462]Orton's experience in the system is of course a concern.

But if you look at Orton's numbers over the last two seasons, he has done remarkably well. He has a TD/INT ratio of 2:1, for example.

You are being too hard on poor Orton. Besides, Denver is DT hungry and likely would love to pick up Haynesworth.

Haynesworth for Orton.[/quote]


I very well may be hard on Orton, but after the shit I've saw this past year. Bringing in a new QB to learn the system AND waste draft picks? Absolutely not. Again, if he's a FA, fine.

Also, there is no way in hell they'll trade straight up. They want at least a 2nd rounder for Orton so the person being traded would have to have the greater or equal value. We'd be lucky to get a pack of nabs and a molded sandwich for Haynesworth at this point.

Also, after this last year, no more trading for other QBs. Let's draft/groom our own.

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=NC_Skins;812459]I was merely pointing out he got benched. Don't care about the reasons. I'm willing to bet you good money that both Beck and Grossman would outperform Orton in this offense this next year. You have 2 QBs that have experience with the system, and to bring in a QB that didn't know it? We saw how that worked with McNabb. Also, is Orton really a fit for this type of offense?[/quote]

Ok, well you seemed to be insinuating he was benched for performance reasons, I was just clearing that up. Did you see the numbers he was putting up last year in an offense that basically had no running game?

I really don't see why he wouldn't fit in this offense. He's a perfect kind of guy for a WCO. Accurate, good short to mid range passer, smart guy, doesn't turn the ball over, works hard on and off the field. Why the heck not? And he's a quality locker room guy who's respected by his teammates.

For the long run I'd feel better about our QB situation with Orton vs. what we're looking at right now. He's 28 and ready for his prime years.

Grossman definitely isn't a long term answer and Beck is still a major question mark.

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=theJBexperience;812396]Evan Silva & Jason LaCanfora reporting that Skins could be interested in trading for Kyle Orton. Anyone else hear anything about this?

Would Orton be welcome as our QB? Would he get us to the Super Bowl?[/quote]

I would welcome Kyle Orton. He did great in Denver with an almost non-existent running game. Bring in Santonio and re-sign Moss our offense will be golden (in theory) That's because our o-line is still suspect.

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=SkinzWin;812463]1. But the Broncos were stupid enough to draft him that high, they have to make him the starting quarterback to they will catch a sh!t storm.

2. Kyle was benched because he was 22 years old, new to the NFL and still learning. Rex had already been in the league.

Man, guess I was wrong, Grossman is just so much better than Orton. Mute.[/quote]


I can post you McNabb's numbers compared to both of them and would you want McNabb in this offense? Not sure why you even posted the numbers, I never said statistically that Orton wasn't a better QB. In OUR offense, I'd rather have Rex/Beck (who knows the system) than to waste draft picks for yet another QB who'll have to come in and learn the system and potentially be a flop.


Insanity is doing the same things over and over expecting different results.

How about this. We KEEP our draft picks, roll with Rex/Beck and draft and groom our own QB. You know, most good teams do that.

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=Mattyk;812466]For the long run I'd feel better about our QB situation with Orton vs. what we're looking at right now. He's 28 and ready for his prime years.

Grossman definitely isn't a long term answer and Beck is still a major question mark.[/quote]

I'm absolutely 100% against any trade giving up a pick higher than a 4th rounder. I've seen that story too many times the past decade to know how it ends. It never ends well with us. Never.

If he were on the open market, I wouldn't be opposed to it. Ask yourself this, why is it that they are getting rid of Orton if he's that good? I know you can't go the Tebow route because there was much speculation that they were drafting a QB this past draft. You honestly think Elway believes Tebow is their QB of the future? If he thought that Orton was the man, don't you think he'd keep him?

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=NC_Skins;812465]I very well may be hard on Orton, but after the shit I've saw this past year. Bringing in a new QB to learn the system AND waste draft picks? Absolutely not. Again, if he's a FA, fine.

Also, there is no way in hell they'll trade straight up. They want at least a 2nd rounder for Orton so the person being traded would have to have the greater or equal value. We'd be lucky to get a pack of nabs and a molded sandwich for Haynesworth at this point.

Also, after this last year, no more trading for other QBs. Let's draft/groom our own.[/quote]

There are reasons why Haynesworth is the $41 mil. man. His troubles here came from dissatisfaction with the 3-4 (which Denver no longer runs), not from performance. Don't underrate AH's value. The fact that Denver is desperate for DT's makes his value even greater.

Haynesworth for Orton.

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=NC_Skins;812471]I'm absolutely 100% against any trade giving up a pick higher than a 4th rounder. I've seen that story too many times the past decade to know how it ends. It never ends well with us. Never.

If he were on the open market, I wouldn't be opposed to it. Ask yourself this, why is it that they are getting rid of Orton if he's that good? I know you can't go the Tebow route because there was much speculation that they were drafting a QB this past draft. You honestly think Elway believes Tebow is their QB of the future? If he thought that Orton was the man, don't you think he'd keep him?[/quote]

The pre-draft speculation of them taking a QB was nonsense. I do think it's very possible they are convinced Tebow is their guy. Why is that hard to believe? If they thought otherwise why would they shop Orton?

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

[quote=Lotus;812474]

Haynesworth for Orton.[/quote]

It almost makes too much sense. Orton really is the Rodney Dangerfield of the NFL.

Re: 2011 NFL Free Agency Thread
 

AH in Denver would actually be pretty funny... sucking on that thin air. I'd love to see us get something for him, I'm not convinced Fox wants to take on that project though.