Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=GTripp0012;538215]Yeah, I'd say that's about right.

I'm sure he could handle RT, but my response would be "why?" That's just not where his true value is.[/quote]
I agree. Why play him away from where he excells? That's the same problem I would have with taking Rey-Rey to play OLB.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

If we take Mack @ 13 cuz all the OT, DE talent and Rey are off the board we still have to address RT in FA... probably an overpaid, high quality vet (preferably under 30) cut from another franchise. It would mean for one hell of an o-line and I just can't complain about that; however, we're left w/ some pretty serious questions defensively. I doubt there will ever be much LB talent available in FA this year... mainly because there isn't an abundance of LB talent in the draft for teams to replace their expensive vets. Sure we could take an OLB in the 3rd round but then we likely pass on Sidbury completely cuz he'll be gone by the time we're on the clock again... i'd hate to see us pass on that kid and obviously we're due for a talented upgrade at LDE anyway. My bottom line is the safer move in the doomsday scenario probably means taking Clay Matthews or maybe English. It's really no more of a stretch than taking Mack at 13 and at least we have a guy to fill an immediate need on defense at LB.

... like I said no matter what I think we end up w/ an upgrade at RT by start of OTAs, so we've upgraded 2 spots on the o-line this year. That's a blessing... a third upgrade would be the cherry on top but for me it can't supersede the issue at OLB.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=The Goat;538223]If we take Mack @ 13 cuz all the OT, DE talent and Rey are off the board we still have to address RT in FA... probably an overpaid, high quality vet (preferably under 30) cut from another franchise. It would mean for one hell of an o-line and I just can't complain about that; however, we're left w/ some pretty serious questions defensively. I doubt there will ever be much LB talent available in FA this year... mainly because there isn't an abundance of LB talent in the draft for teams to replace their expensive vets. Sure we could take an OLB in the 3rd round but then we likely pass on Sidbury completely cuz he'll be gone by the time we're on the clock again... i'd hate to see us pass on that kid and obviously we're due for a talented upgrade at LDE anyway. My bottom line is the safer move in the doomsday scenario probably means taking Clay Matthews or maybe English. It's really no more of a stretch than taking Mack at 13 and at least we have a guy to fill an immediate need on defense at LB.

... like I said no matter what I think we end up w/ an upgrade at RT by start of OTAs, so we've upgraded 2 spots on the o-line this year. That's a blessing... a third upgrade would be the cherry on top but for me it can't supersede the issue at OLB.[/quote]

Well damnit Goat, call Vinny and get Marcus back. :)

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=53Fan;538225]Well damnit Goat, call Vinny and get Marcus back. :)[/quote]

Oh man if we could get Marcus back that would put a lot of concerns to rest. My intuition is Marcus won't come back though even if we offered him a nice 2 year contract...

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=The Goat;538223]If we take Mack @ 13 cuz all the OT, DE talent and Rey are off the board we still have to address RT in FA... probably an overpaid, high quality vet (preferably under 30) cut from another franchise. It would mean for one hell of an o-line and I just can't complain about that; however, we're left w/ some pretty serious questions defensively. I doubt there will ever be much LB talent available in FA this year... mainly because there isn't an abundance of LB talent in the draft for teams to replace their expensive vets. Sure we could take an OLB in the 3rd round but then we likely pass on Sidbury completely cuz he'll be gone by the time we're on the clock again... i'd hate to see us pass on that kid and obviously we're due for a talented upgrade at LDE anyway. My bottom line is the safer move in the doomsday scenario probably means taking Clay Matthews or maybe English. It's really no more of a stretch than taking Mack at 13 and at least we have a guy to fill an immediate need on defense at LB.

... like I said no matter what I think we end up w/ an upgrade at RT by start of OTAs, so we've upgraded 2 spots on the o-line this year. That's a blessing... a third upgrade would be the cherry on top but for me it can't supersede the issue at OLB.[/quote]Well, the line would be significantly improved over last year, so Jansen/Heyer could battle it out and the winner would be the de-facto "weak-link" of the line, however, the overall product is still [U]significantly[/U] better.

We would have to find some sort of a backup LT though. Couldn't have a situation where both Heyer AND Jansen are on the field.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=GTripp0012;538232]Well, the line would be significantly improved over last year, so Jansen/Heyer could battle it out and the winner would be the de-facto "weak-link" of the line, however, the overall product is still [U]significantly[/U] better.

We would have to find some sort of a backup LT though. Couldn't have a situation where both Heyer AND Jansen are on the field.[/quote]

I think this is probably what I've been getting at. In no way do I think Mack is the only player who would improve our team. J. Smith, E. Monroe, M. Oher, A. Curry, R. Maualuga, T. Jackson, P. Jerry and others would be a big help and a tremendous upgrade to us. Our biggest problem was our o-line last year. By far. I just happen to think a player like Mack only comes around once in a great while. I also believe that Mack at center, even with Heyer or Jansen at RT, would benefit our line greater than having Rabach at center and an allpro at RT. We had no pocket last year. That came from pressure from the middle of the line. Remember all the "Why doesn't Zorn put in plays for J.C. to roll out"? complaints? We also could'nt run up the middle. How many times did we try to get short yardage and fail because we could'nt open any holes up the middle? If you can't stop pressure up the middle, most of the time you'll be running for your life. That's why Haynesworth was such a big deal to get. He brings pressure up the middle. I think Mack could help us more than just about any player out there. But by no means do I think he's the only one who could help our team. Hey I'm open to anyone who can help the Redskins. I just think Mack could change what this offense could do in a big way. Would he be my favorite player if he were on the Redskins? I doubt it. I'm a defense kind of guy. Linebackers in particular. Hence the 53Fan. But I can tell you I'd hate to play across from this big, aggressive SOB. And he's in the second level quite a bit. Hail Redskins!!!

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=53Fan;538242]I think this is probably what I've been getting at. In no way do I think Mack is the only player who would improve our team. J. Smith, E. Monroe, M. Oher, A. Curry, R. Maualuga, T. Jackson, P. Jerry and others would be a big help and a tremendous upgrade to us. Our biggest problem was our o-line last year. By far. I just happen to think a player like Mack only comes around once in a great while. I also believe that Mack at center, even with Heyer or Jansen at RT, would benefit our line greater than having Rabach at center and an allpro at RT. We had no pocket last year. That came from pressure from the middle of the line. Remember all the "Why doesn't Zorn put in plays for J.C. to roll out"? complaints? We also could'nt run up the middle. How many times did we try to get short yardage and fail because we could'nt open any holes up the middle? If you can't stop pressure up the middle, most of the time you'll be running for your life. That's why Haynesworth was such a big deal to get. He brings pressure up the middle. I think Mack could help us more than just about any player out there. But by no means do I think he's the only one who could help our team. Hey I'm open to anyone who can help the Redskins. I just think Mack could change what this offense could do in a big way. Would he be my favorite player if he were on the Redskins? I doubt it. I'm a defense kind of guy. Linebackers in particular. Hense the 53Fan. But I can tell you I'd hate to play across from this big, aggressive SOB. And he's in the second level quite a bit. Hail Redskins!!![/quote]

I'm sorry but I wouldn't put Mack in a category of the type of player that "only comes around once in a great while".

And I disagree that having Mack at center with Heyer/Jansen at RT is greater than having Rabach and an All-Pro at RT. First, Heyer/Jansen were the weak link out of all of starting offensive linemen, by far - and maybe the weak link from the entire team - that's a big negative at such a very important position, especially on the line. Their play (or lack of it) was a major reason why the redskins collapsed in the second half of the season. I couldn't say that about Rabach.

Second, there's a reason why Centers have a lower value than offensive tackles - tackles are expected and required to do more on a team than are centers. Hence the low grades for #1 centers than compared to #1 Right or Left tackles in [U][B]any[/B][/U] draft.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

Dude I'm not trying to convince you of anything. What category you put Mack in or I put Mack in, is just a matter of opinion and that's all it is. If you do your homework you'll see that many scouts think he is the best center to come out of the draft in years. There is a reason that Mack, a center, is being talked about as a first round pick. That's why I say a player like this only comes around once in a great while. Like Matt Birk, you don't find too many as good as he is at his position. I think you could say there was more than one weak link on this line last year. For THIS team I think Mack would be a bigger help. That's my opinion. Aren't you the same guy who said Mathews wasn't first round talent but had seen very little film of him? That's part of[B] player analysis[/B] you talked about in another thread. If you don't think Rabach and the middle of our line was part of the collapse last year...well I just don't know what to tell you. We'll just agree to disagree about Mack and how much he can help this team. [url=http://www.fftoolbox.com/nfl_draft/profile_display.cfm?Prospect_ID=1655]Alex Mack Scouting Report - 2009 NFL Draft Prospect[/url]

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

Man people sure are loving Mack. I just wonder if he would even be on our radar at #13. I think alot of people are building themselves up for a big disappointment.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=Mattyk72;538250]Man people sure are loving Mack. I just wonder if he would even be on our radar at #13. I think alot of people are building themselves up for a big disappointment.[/quote]

Matty I would be as surprised as anyone if we actually took him. Fortunately there's a lot of good players who could help us out there.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

Center is generally considered the easiest position o-line right? I've no doubt Mack is a phenom but can he make the impact that say 1) and phenom LB can make 2) a phenom DT or DE can make for a team? Or think of it this way: is there a center in the league who's made the kind of impact for his team Ray Lewis, Urlacher, Peppers or big Al have all made for their respective teams? I think if there's a potential LB, DT, DE phenom available @ 13 (assuming the top OT talent is already off the board) it think the FO has to go w/ one of those options.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

Sorry, but I cannot see using a 1st round pick on a Center.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=Angry;538282]Sorry, but I cannot see using a 1st round pick on a Center.[/quote]

Mack and Unger are being projected as low first round picks. Given our needs at RT, DE, and LB, I agree with you. Hopefully we'll get lucky and one of the top Tackles or LBs fall to us.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=The Goat;538279][B]Center is generally considered the easiest position o-line right?[/B] I've no doubt Mack is a phenom but can he make the impact that say 1) and phenom LB can make 2) a phenom DT or DE can make for a team? Or think of it this way: is there a center in the league who's made the kind of impact for his team Ray Lewis, Urlacher, Peppers or big Al have all made for their respective teams? I think if there's a potential LB, DT, DE phenom available @ 13 (assuming the top OT talent is already off the board) it think the FO has to go w/ one of those options.[/quote]

Why do you figure that?

It's probably the hardest considering the center typically makes the line calls and needs to make pre-snap reads of the D.

Re: I give you the first 12 picks, Give me your Redskins draft pick!
 

[quote=Mattyk72;538287]Why do you figure that?

It's probably the hardest considering the center typically makes the line calls and needs to make pre-snap reads of the D.[/quote]

I mean this is basically my opinion Matty however i read an ESPN article (Ross Tucker was the writer I think) that broke down the o-line by position, rating each spot by difficulty and importance etc. If memory serves he said center was the easiest to play and more or less requires the least talent to be successful. Personally I would have thought one of the guard positions is easiest. Both tackle positions are more difficult/important than center IMHO.

... I'll try to find a link to that article when I have time cuz I enjoyed reading it and thought it was pretty interesting.