Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

Okay article I found on Yahoo Sports. The last 2 lines are what get me. Just read and discuss.

[url=http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-williams-nfl-blacks&prov=ap&type=lgns]AP Interview: Doug Williams basks in landmark day for NFL - NFL - Yahoo! Sports[/url]

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

He talked about this the other day. Just how he was so wrapped up in just being a football player on Super Bowl Sunday and trying to lead his team to victory, that he didn't think of deeper signifance really while he was in the moment. I can understand that.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

does it really matter what the color of someones skin is? i cheered for doug williams the same way i cheered for jurgey

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[QUOTE=dmek25;273028]does it really matter what the color of someones skin is? i cheered for doug williams the same way i cheered for jurgey[/QUOTE]

Amen. I get frustrated when the media says things like "the first black qb in the superbowl..." or "the first black coach in the superbowl..." can't we just say that this is his first time to the big game and that he is in fact a great player or coach? Why do they continously have to point out the fact that he is black? Did they have to mention that Bart Starr was the first white qb in the superbowl back in 1967? I think not.
It just seems to me that for this country to move forward we need to not even mention what color someone is.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[QUOTE=Warpath;273034]Amen. I get frustrated when the media says things like "the first black qb in the superbowl..." or "the first black coach in the superbowl..." can't we just say that this is his first time to the big game and that he is in fact a great player or coach? Why do they continously have to point out the fact that he is black? Did they have to mention that Bart Starr was the first white qb in the superbowl back in 1967? I think not.
It just seems to me that for this country to move forward we need to not even mention what color someone is.[/QUOTE]

I understand your sentiments and respect them, but I disagree with them. But in my opinion race is still an issue in football. For years many thought that black football players were good at running and catching, but lacked the mental acumen to play QB. That stereotype persists to this day, albeit behind closed doors (I've heard people express as much). That is, IMHO, why you see so many black football players at WR, CB, RB, LB, and along the lines, but not at QB.

The reason why Bart Starr's race was not pointed out was simply because he was white, it was not unusual. The reason why Jackie Robinson's race is pointed out is that he was a trailblazer and dealt with a tremendous amount of adversity on account of his race. While I understand the belief that we shouldn't talk about race, its simply a fact that it does have an impact (albeit less and less of an impact over time as society becomes more tolerant).

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;273036]I understand your sentiments and respect them, but I disagree with them. But in my opinion race is still an issue in football. For years many thought that black football players were good at running and catching, but lacked the mental acumen to play QB. That stereotype persists to this day, albeit behind closed doors (I've heard people express as much). That is, IMHO, why you see so many black football players at WR, CB, RB, LB, and along the lines, but not at QB.

The reason why Bart Starr's race was not pointed out was simply because he was white, it was not unusual. The reason why Jackie Robinson's race is pointed out is that he was a trailblazer and dealt with a tremendous amount of adversity on account of his race. While I understand the belief that we shouldn't talk about race, its simply a fact that it does have an impact (albeit less and less of an impact over time as society becomes more tolerant).[/quote]

Couldn't have said it any better.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

Doug Williams is black?

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=TAFKAS;273025]He talked about this the other day. Just how he was so wrapped up in just being a football player on Super Bowl Sunday and trying to lead his team to victory, that he didn't think of deeper signifance really while he was in the moment. I can understand that.[/quote]


When you put it like that, it makes a lot more sense to a stoner like myself. LOL.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=SkinEmAll;273050]Doug Williams is black?[/quote]


Thats what I said! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA........oh that was great...I would LOVE for someone to say that around me and be totally serious so i could die laughing.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[QUOTE=JGisLordOfTheRings;273052]Thats what I said! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA........oh that was great...I would LOVE for someone to say that around me and be totally serious so i could die laughing.[/QUOTE]

Look, not to change the subject here but your sig makes no sense:

"I'd run over Russ Grimm's mother to get to the Superbowl too."
-Russ Grimm, on being asked about saying he would run over his own mother to get to the Superbowl

That's Matt Millen's quote (not Russ Grimm's) after Russ Grimm said he'd run over his own mother to win the Super Bowl (SB XVIII)

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=TAFKAS;273054]Look, not to change the subject here but your sig makes no sense:

"I'd run over Russ Grimm's mother to get to the Superbowl too."
-Russ Grimm, on being asked about saying he would run over his own mother to get to the Superbowl

That's Matt Millen's quote (not Russ Grimm's) after Russ Grimm said he'd run over his own mother to win the Super Bowl (SB XVIII)[/quote]

That was confusing me quite a bit earlier today.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=Warpath;273034]Amen. I get frustrated when the media says things like "the first black qb in the superbowl..." or "the first black coach in the superbowl..." can't we just say that this is his first time to the big game and that he is in fact a great player or coach? Why do they continously have to point out the fact that he is black? Did they have to mention that Bart Starr was the first white qb in the superbowl back in 1967? I think not.
It just seems to me that for this country to move forward we need to not even mention what color someone is.[/quote]
[COLOR=black]It's almost routine to make it a news flash when the first African American does anything in this country. I guess it's their way of recognizing the progress that we've made while here; that’s why we have Black History month. It often bothers me too when this is mentioned because it almost seems as if everyone is surprised that an African American has amounted to anything, but at the same time I guess they do it for a cause. It Would be nice to live in a colorless society though.[/COLOR]

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

Isn't focusing so much on the fact that Williams was the first black QB in a SB or on the two black coaches this weekend perpetuating the issue of differences between races. I think it is ironic that such an issue is made when what everyone should be striving for is an actual lack of any attention since it shouldn't be big a deal.

To me, celebrating something done by a minority, simply because he or she is a minority, just contributes to the problem be it perceived or not.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;273036]I understand your sentiments and respect them, but I disagree with them. But in my opinion race is still an issue in football. For years many thought that black football players were good at running and catching, but lacked the mental acumen to play QB. That stereotype persists to this day, albeit behind closed doors (I've heard people express as much). That is, IMHO, why you see so many black football players at WR, CB, RB, LB, and along the lines, but not at QB.

The reason why Bart Starr's race was not pointed out was simply because he was white, it was not unusual. The reason why Jackie Robinson's race is pointed out is that he was a trailblazer and dealt with a tremendous amount of adversity on account of his race. While I understand the belief that we shouldn't talk about race, its simply a fact that it does have an impact (albeit less and less of an impact over time as society becomes more tolerant).[/quote]

I agree with you but I don't see racism as much concerning QB as much as in the front office and high profile positions (coach/GM). The good thing about the SB this year is that it will most likely break down some of the stereotypes present in the hiring practices. It 10-15 years minority coaches and GM's will be everywhere.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[QUOTE=Grim21Reaper;273067]I agree with you but I don't see racism as much concerning QB as much as in the front office and high profile positions (coach/GM). The good thing about the SB this year is that it will most likely break down some of the stereotypes present in the hiring practices. It 10-15 years minority coaches and GM's will be everywhere.[/QUOTE]

Excellent point.

Also, I obviously agree with the general point that it would nice to live in a colorless society. And, to a certain extent, I agree that singling out someone as a minority for special recognition further divides the races.

Nevertheless, I feel that people like Jackie Robinson should be celebrated for their trailblazing. The simple fact is that what we want (i.e. a colorless society) is different from what we've got (i.e. a generally tolerant society, but one in which race does matter).

As I said before, I think there are legitimate arguments on both sides of this debate and I'm happy that we can discuss this civilly and intelligently.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

While there aren't that many African-American (or Latino or Asian, etc.) front office executives in the NFL, I think it was a relatively good sign that very little to no mention was made of the fact that Jerry Reese is African-American when he was named New York Giants General Manager.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[QUOTE=TAFKAS;273079]While there aren't that many African-American (or Latino or Asian, etc.) front office executives in the NFL, I think it was a relatively good sign that very little to no mention was made of the fact that Jerry Reese is African-American when he was named New York Giants General Manager.[/QUOTE]

That is a great example of how the world should work. I'd much prefer if we didn't celebrate race at all. I just think that if we are truly advancing there needs to be a point when we as a society stop celebrating accomplishments or milestones that are primarily based on race. But alas I don't think we'll ever see this because we have too many people and things we celebrate this way.

For example: Would reaching this point mean we'd have to ultimately devalue the accomplishemnets of MLK?

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=TAFKAS;273054]Look, not to change the subject here but your sig makes no sense:

"I'd run over Russ Grimm's mother to get to the Superbowl too."
-Russ Grimm, on being asked about saying he would run over his own mother to get to the Superbowl

That's Matt Millen's quote (not Russ Grimm's) after Russ Grimm said he'd run over his own mother to win the Super Bowl (SB XVIII)[/quote]


You win. I officially douche-ed myself. Pass on people....nothing to see here....

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=FRPLG;273065]

To me, celebrating something done by a minority, simply because he or she is a minority, just contributes to the problem be it perceived or not.[/quote]
i agree with this 100%

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

I wish we didn't have to discuss race, I wish people didn't see skin color, I wish we didn't have to celebrate the fact that someone of color did something, and I wish racism didn't exist. But, what I wish is different from what is and tends to be irrelevant to what should be done. I really don't know what the right answer is to this kind of question, it's definately complicated.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

:cheeky-sm I wonder when we're gonna have the first white cornerback to play in Madden...?

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

hahaha

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[QUOTE=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;273108]I wish we didn't have to discuss race, I wish people didn't see skin color, I wish we didn't have to celebrate the fact that someone of color did something, and I wish racism didn't exist. But, what I wish is different from what is and tends to be irrelevant to what should be done. I really don't know what the right answer is to this kind of question, it's definately complicated.[/QUOTE]



Judging from the expressions of both Lovie Smith and Tony Dungy when the question concerning African American coaches in the SB is mentioned, it apears they too agree with you. I get the feeling they wish that question would just go away because it shouldn't be neccessary to mention.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=canthetuna;273119]:cheeky-sm I wonder when we're gonna have the first white cornerback to play in Madden...?[/quote]

Thats funny!:laughing-

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

kill all the white people.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[QUOTE=SkinEmAll;273140]kill all the white people.[/QUOTE]

Obviously I know that you are joking, but where the hell did that one come from?

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=SkinEmAll;273140]kill all the white people.[/quote]
what the hell is that supposed to mean?

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[QUOTE=dmek25;273143]what the hell is that supposed to mean?[/QUOTE]

Either (a) the guy is a total looney and needs to be banned because he actually meant it; or (b) he was trying to make a joke who's meaning is totally indecipherable and one that is just plain dumb.

Gotta explain captain.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;273144]Either (a) the guy is a total looney and needs to be banned because he actually meant it; or (b) he was trying to make a joke who's meaning is totally indecipherable and one that is just plain dumb.

Gotta explain captain.[/quote]


Wow...chill out people. I've never been in such a goddamn smug chat room in my life...

My advice, Sherrif and dmek is to google, "sarcasm" and see what you find.

Get back to me with the results captain pointdexter

Hail

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[QUOTE=IHATECOVER2;273158]Wow...chill out people. I've never been in such a goddamn smug chat room in my life...

My advice, Sherrif and dmek is to google, "sarcasm" and see what you find.

Get back to me with the results captain pointdexter

Hail[/QUOTE]

What was the point of that?

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

yeah, and why your at it, you might think about dropping your web server into some kind of RAID array to free up some resources and better yet, go by some more RAM...Why does this site load like a one-armed skeet shooter?

oh and about Doug Williams, I'm sure he was paid by the NFL to say those words in that AP interview. Hell, the whole entire media is going to have to acknowledge the fact that two "African-Americans" did something "good". I equate this mentality to saying, "awwww, look at what they did, isn't that cute"

I agree with earlier comments in this post about our sick-ass society eventually manifesting towards a colorless schematic. That would be fantastic. The infiltration of Affirmative Action and "oh, make sure you remind TB and the gang to mention the fact that Lovie and Dungy are African-Americans..."

I'm sick of it, a man is a man, and a woman is a woman, no matter what color, creed, race or religion you are.

Hail

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[QUOTE=IHATECOVER2;273160]yeah, and why your at it, you might think about dropping your web server into some kind of RAID array to free up some resources and better yet, go by some more RAM...Why does this site load like a one-armed skeet shooter?

oh and about Doug Williams, I'm sure he was paid by the NFL to say those words in that AP interview. Hell, the whole entire media is going to have to acknowledge the fact that two "African-Americans" did something "good". I equate this mentality to saying, "awwww, look at what they did, isn't that cute"

I agree with earlier comments in this post about our sick-ass society eventually manifesting towards a colorless schematic. That would be fantastic. The infiltration of Affirmative Action and "oh, make sure you remind TB and the gang to mention the fact that Lovie and Dungy are African-Americans..."

I'm sick of it, a man is a man, and a woman is a woman, no matter what color, creed, race or religion you are.

Hail[/QUOTE]

Well I agree with the last sentence. But, as for the first sentence-first off, are a lot of people here having a problem loading this site? Secondly, IHATECOVER2 why do you keep coming back if you like to bitch so much about this site?

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

well, first off i'm flattered that you actually agree with me on something and secondly, I have had trouble loading your (do you maintain the server?) pages everytime I access the URL. On top of that, I acknowledge the fact that I am one user out of a multitude of others, but the simple fact that you, as an "admin" generate zero-interest in criticism, in any form whatsoever. If I were you I would ask the users of this site for some feedback, after all that is the purpose of a forum, you freakin' genius.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[QUOTE=IHATECOVER2;273167]well, first off i'm flattered that you actually agree with me on something and secondly, I have had trouble loading your (do you maintain the server?) pages everytime I access the URL. On top of that, I acknowledge the fact that I am one user out of a multitude of others, but the simple fact that you, as an "admin" generate zero-interest in criticism, in any form whatsoever. If I were you I would ask the users of this site for some feedback, after all that is the purpose of a forum, you freakin' genius.[/QUOTE]

I don't maintain the server. What do you mean "generate zero-interest in criticism"

As for "you freakin' genius" watch the attitude. Consider this your second warning

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=TAFKAS;273168]I don't maintain the server. What do you mean "generate zero-interest in criticism"

As for "you freakin' genius" watch the attitude. Consider this your second warning[/quote]


oh i'm sorry, is your ego bruised? do what makes you feel good tafkas, i know that's what I do, and get by just fine.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

As for the conference championship victories by Dungy and Smith, Williams said: "Winning the Super Bowl that day wasn't as significant to me as this past Sunday. I didn't see it then. I can see this. I can feel this."

to me,he seems like he is more proud of how far more important it is that dungy
and smith got to be the 1st 2 black men to be headcoach in the superbowl,than anything he or any other black athelete has done in the nfl,including the 2000 yard seasons of simpson,sanders,davis,lewis,and erick dickerson,and the mvps won by LT,Mcnair,and san diego's LT.i can see his point!

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

It would appear the point Doug was trying to make was that winning super bowl XXII and being the MVP was not as important as seeing minorities have opportunities in coaching, as well as im management.

It would be interesting to witness who in the media would ask Rex Grossman or Peyton Manning; How does it feel to be the 40th white QB to win the SB.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

It would be especially nice for Dungy, who essentially put together the team that Gruden took to the Super Bowl in Tampa. Plus you look at African-American head coaches around the NFL and they are Dungy disciples-lovie smith, herm edwards, and mike tomlin.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[Deep sigh]. At least it was an interesting, intelligent, and civil discussion at one point. Oh well, I'm done with this one.

No hard feelings SkinEmAll, I just didn't appreciate the joke.

Re: Doug Williams said Wha'?
 

[quote=Sheriff Gonna Getcha;273144]Either (a) the guy is a total looney and needs to be banned because he actually meant it; or (b) he was trying to make a joke who's meaning is totally indecipherable and one that is just plain dumb.

Gotta explain captain.[/quote]

Guys, Im sorry!! I meant to follow up with that post, but the family needed me and then company stopped by to visit. I promise Im not a looney and I guess the joke really doesnt reach far out of my little circle. Anyway there is a band,Type O Negative, who are not a racial band by the way, who have a song, Kill all the white people, that really is a joke song. It has no true meaning, and is kinda of tongue in cheek. A friend of mineback then, who was black, would always start singing the lyrics to this song anytime race was discussed, as a joke ofcoarse. So there you go, please dont be offended, and if anyone was or just thought Ive flipped my lid, I apologize sincerely. And just for the record I think it is way cool that we have two black coaches going to the superbowl, but more importantly we have two GREAT and derserving coaches going to the superbowl.