Immortality on hold (warning, this will tick you off)
 

[url="http://espn.go.com/classic/s/2004/0805/1852886.html"]http://espn.go.com/classic/s/2004/0805/1852886.html[/url]

As [url="http://espn.go.com/classic/s/2004/0805/1852825.html"][color=#0000ff]Barry Sanders[/color][/url] and [url="http://espn.go.com/classic/s/2004/0805/1852491.html"][color=#0000ff]John Elway[/color][/url] bask in the glow of the hideously colored yet still oddly drab yellow blazers they will wear when inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame, Art Monk will be home again, waiting for a call that may never come.

So will Harry Carson, who is so unhappy at having been passed over so often that he has allegedly expressed his unhappiness with the process to the Hall officials themselves.

[img]http://sportsmed.starwave.com/i/page2/photos/040115monk.jpg[/img][font=verdana, arial, geneva][size=1][color=#666666][b]Art Monk did make it to 1,000 catches, but he did have more than 1,000 yards receiving five times in his career.[/b][/color][/size][/font]


And then there are Steve Young, Dan Marino, Troy Aikman and Reggie White, the next four slam-dunks in the Hall of Fame queue.
Not that any of this has anything to do with Sanders or Elway, whose nominating speeches last January were the typical state-the-name-and-then-sit-down specials, or [url="http://espn.go.com/classic/s/2004/0804/1851903.html"][color=#0000ff]Carl Eller[/color][/url] or [url="http://espn.go.com/classic/s/2004/0805/1852837.html"][color=#0000ff]Bob Brown[/color][/url], both of whom thought they had been forgotten by the panel, and whose elections came as surprises.

This is life on the cusp of immortality, more or less. Some are born to it, others have to earn it, and still more don't get there even when it seems like they've done plenty.

The question that arises, though, is whether plenty is ever enough.

Carson has credentials worthy of any Hall of Fame debate, although the outrage over his annual omission seems to taper off quickly once the New York skyline disappears from the rear view mirror.

Monk's name has been brought up several times, with the leading argument being his 940 receptions and his noticeable contributions in Super Bowl XXVI (the one where the Redskins dope-slapped the Broncos). And yet his candidacy seems to have stalled too.

This does not bode particularly well for, say, Michael Irvin, who is eligible this year, or for Andre Reed, who comes up next, or for Tim Brown, still looking to keep his day job even after 1,000 catches and being released by the Raiders this week. Jerry Rice is, of course, a different story.

Which brings us to the Hall of Fame selection process itself, which is just arcane enough (39 people in a room, one from each of the 32 NFL cities, the president of the Pro Football Writers of America, and six at-large voters), just secretive enough (not even the voters know who got how many votes) and just capricious enough (a bad presentation in the room on Super Bowl Eve can doom a candidate, just as a really good one can elevate him) to make everyone scratch their heads in wonder at the process, and the result.

Now nobody in their right mind would argue against Sanders or Elway's induction, and those old enough to remember football P.M. (Pre-Madden) would cheerfully vouch for Brown and Eller as well. Nobody snuck in through the service entrance, is what we're saying here.

But Monk is the most curious case, because if his numbers say no, then it's hard to see a much more compelling case for Irvin, Reed or Brown. It is almost as if 900 catches is the 500-homer plateau in baseball -- not nearly as impressive as you would think it should be.

It isn't as though his case hasn't been made effectively or forcefully enough (voters on both sides agree they have gotten the full measure of Monk's body of work). Or for that matter, that Carson's C.V. has been properly presented.

Still, they wait, as do Rayfield Wright, Lester Hayes, Jim Marshall, Bob Hayes and a growing backlog of others who will find that the required 32 votes may as well be 32 million. As Halls of Fame go, this one is far tougher to crowbar into than the basketball or hockey versions, and only slightly less rigorous than baseball's.

The Hall might be better served by a more open policy, one in which the voters must account for their votes, and that the final vote totals are released. Then we would know just how close Monk or Carson are to actual inclusion. For that matter, so would they.

This would be particularly helpful given that after Young and Marino next time, and Aikman the year after, there are no slam-dunks. Not Deion Sanders. Not Warren Moon. Not Thurman Thomas. Nor any of the massive human clot of previously considered candidates who didn't make their nut. This isn't going to get easier for them, but harder.

And maybe that's as it should be, some argue. The Hall of Fame ought to be the final measure of a man's career, and it ought to be a high bar to clear. Really high.

But for those still with their faces pressed against the window in Canton, Ohio, the question of how high that bar really is remains a mystery.

[i]Ray Ratto is a columnist with the San Francisco Chronicle and a regular contributor to ESPN.com[/i]

Monk was a great player, and I think players that shouldn't get chosen above him, however I'm not sure if he is a shoe in for the HoF. Most non-skins fans know of Monk, but don't hold him in quite the same regard we do.

How many receivers have over 900 receptions though? Is it just Brown and Rice that do?

Cris Carter finished with over 1,000 and Andre Reed has 900+, not sure how many but I know he has more than Monk

Of the top 10 receivers of all time, 5 have played with the Redskins at some point: Reed, Monk, Irving Fryar, Larry Centers, and Henry Ellard

Here's the top 20 all-time

[url]http://www.profootballhof.com/history/stats/top20/receivers.jsp[/url]

that'd be #4, 5, 6, 7, and 10.

I would have never guessed Terance Mathis in the top 20 all time

Look at where Harrison is, he's got a great shot at climbing pretty high the way he's going. He has a legit shot at 1000.

Mathis is a surprise, I'm also kinda surprised to see McCardell in there. Some people just sneak up on ya I guess.

Check out the stats on Mathis, 8 seasons of at least 50 catches, and one 100+ catch season too.

[url]http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/1189[/url]

Art Monk was probably in the top 3 receivers ever when he hung it up. He was the first man to catch 100 balls in a season and he even did it twice. Not to mention 5th all time in receptions. He belongs in the Hall.

The thing is, Lynn Swann and John Stallworth are both in who have far less that Art Monk in terms of numbers. But since they were part of that magical Steelers dynasty, they basically get a free pass. Perhaps it's because they shined in the Super Bowl.

I think eventually Monk will get in. The article itself states that the issue simply will not go away especially with Andre Reed and Michael Irvin coming up for eligibility.

It is an outrage that Monk is not in the Hall. If I could I would have held up a "42-10" sign at Elway's induction in protest of Monk not being inducted.

I hope that the sportswriters have some secret plan to vote in Darrell and Art in the same class and they are just waiting for Darrell to become eligible.

[QUOTE=Cowboyhater]It is an outrage that Monk is not in the Hall. If I could I would have held up a "42-10" sign at Elway's induction in protest of Monk not being inducted.

I hope that the sportswriters have some secret plan to vote in Darrell and Art in the same class and they are just waiting for Darrell to become eligible.[/QUOTE]

Interesting theory. It would be cool to have both of them inducted at the same time. However, I believe that Art Monk will get in there eventually, its just that this year's class had some really heavy hitters.

First of all, I believe Art Monk belongs in the HoF. If I had a vote, I would support him.

One thing working against him is that the voters seem to overvalue players who were on championship/playoff teams that had some "cachet". The Steelers' of the 70s were great teams but some of the players in the HoF from those teams do not measure up to the standards of players who have not been inducted. Now that Carl Eller is in the Hall, look for a big push to get Jim Marshall in there soon.

Monk's teams that appeared in 4 Super Bowls and won 3 of them had no national "presence". "The Hogs" were a local phenomenon; "The Diesel" didn't have a national following; "The Fun Bunch" was annoying back in its time even though it would hardly be considered "cutting edge" today. So Monk languishes...

Another thing working against him (and others mentioned in Ratto's column) is that the NFL HoF tries to limit the number of inductees each hear so that you rarely have an induction class of 8 or 10. The thinking is that by limiting numbers, you keep out the marginal selections. Oops, I guess that one did not work out quite right.

A third thing working against Monk is that he was never a "go to guy" for the writers/broadcasters. Monk was and is a quiet, introspective and reflective man; he had no bombast; he was not a journalist's dream. And who does the voting on HoF entry???

A fourth thing that is held against Monk is that he did not catch a lot of TD passes. Of course, those 950 or so catches did set up a lot of first downs that led to TDs scored by others, but I guess that's just a detail.

Cowboyhater, do not be surprised if Monk gets a big push the year Darrell Green is eligible. That is the kind of thing that can work with these voters because it gives them sone great storylines...

I'm going to channel the spirit of SportsCurmudgeon for a second here and ask: Who's to say Darrell Green belongs in the Hall of Fame himself?

I used to think he was a lock. A first-ballot lock no less. 20 years with one team. 17th all-time in INTs, 3 SB wins. But if it's been this hard for Monk to make it I admit I have my doubts about Green getting in, or at least easily getting in

One thing I have read repeatedly is that the HoF voters often look for "that defining moment" (ie, highlight reel) on the field during the big game. Swan and Stallworth definitely had theirs.. how many times have you seen Swan's over the shoulder catch as he's going down in against the Cowrhoids in the 1979 SB? Plenty. Monk didn't really have any of those. For that matter, neither did Steve Largent that I can remember. All I remember about him was (like Monk), he caught everything that came his way. Those two guys had very similar careers, with one major difference. Monk has rings. But Largent's in. As SportsCurmudgeon pointed out, Monk was not exactly a press friendly person and they're the ones doing the voting.

I do think the voters' need of wanting the one defining "picture perfect play" along with a career long body of consistent work is a crime. Pure unadulterated bullshit, actually. Unfortunately, I also think that if Monk had retired when his Skins career was over, he may have gotten in already. With Jerry Rice (hands down, best receiver ever) coming through at the end of Monks career and just annihilating all the records like he has, it's probably not hard to put on the blinders and compare everyone from here on out to Jerry. That is damn unfair, just like all shooting guards will always be compared to Jordan. You could be incredible, but compared to those transcendental types of players, you're not going to look like the best.

As far as DG getting in, he'll be a first ballot inductee. Hell, even Dr Z said he's a lock. I've even seem him referred to as the second greatest corner (don't dare say who was the best) to ever play the game by a HoF voter.

I'm pretty sure he has a few highlight reel performances of Mr. Green that'll get played over and over again on ESPN when he gets in!

;)

And Monk, unfortunately was never a big factor in any of the Super Bowls:

XVII: Didn't play
XVIII: Let's not even talk about this game
XXII: Overshadowed by Williams, Clark, Sanders, and Smith
XXVI: Had the first touchdown in the game overruled by instant replay

I don't agree that he didn't have an impact in SB XXVI, that TD drive where his catch was overuled he totally dominated on that drive and he had 7-113 for the game.

Monk just wasn't a flashy or sexy enough player. He did all the dirty work in Gibbs' system. He made the tough underneath catches to move the chains and he was a great blocking WR. While he didn't catch a ton of TD passes his presence in the lineup opened things up for Clark and Sanders. He will get in eventually, but it's a shame he's been shut out so far. Especially with the weak arguments (excuses) that HOF voters are giving.

When I think of Darrell Green three higlights come to mind.

1. Chasing down Toney Dorsett
2. The hurdle on the punt return against Chicago
3. Breaking up the pass in the playoffs against Minnesota

Also, let's not forget Green's character. He is MAN among men

Matty, you're right I should have worded my post differently. Clearly he was a factor. As you point out, he opened things up for Clark and Sanders. Unfortunately though I don't remember him having that defining play(s), a Mike Jones tackle, a John Taylor TD, etc.

He's sort of like J.R. Redmond (did I just compare Monk to Redmond???) But you know, a couple of years ago Brady was marching the Pats down the field, throwing often to Redmond. Vinatieri gets the credit for the game winning field goal, Brady the credit for marching the team down the field.

Those are great D. Green highlights:

I'll add the interception return for a TD in the 51-7 rout of the Rams, and the INT-TD against the Cowboys (I think it bounced off someone's foot maybe)

To add fuel to the fire, how about this comment from Peter King about Tim Brown? Says Brown isn't Hall-Worthy either.

[url]http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/writers/peter_king/08/09/mmqb/index.html[/url]

[i]Tim Brown was three people in front of me at the Hertz No. 1 Gold counter at the Oakland airport. I guess he'd just flown in from somewhere, Dallas probably. All I could think of when I saw him was: dead man walking.

A few days after he got whacked, I saw Woody Paige -- the ESPN Around the Horn guy, Denver columnist and fellow Hall of Fame voter -- talking about Brown on TV. He said he didn't think there was any way Brown would make the Hall of Fame. I thought, wow. A guy catches 1,070 balls, the second-most in NFL history, and the ink's not even dry on the newspaper that reported his whacking and already he's not a Hall of Famer. I'm not sure if he is or not. I just don't get how he gets consigned to Art Monk-ville without his day in court.
[/i]

Monk-ville? Where does that never-played-a-down-in-his-life fat-a$$ get off? I think it's time for a letter writing campaign to change to way people get into the hall. I think the legends in the Hall of fame should be doing the final voting. They know who belongs in their with them... not the sad sacks who won't vote for a guy because he refused to talk to him.

:soapbox:

So is he saying Tim Brown doesn't belong, or is Woody Paige saying that?

Either way, you're right it is a shame that the numbers alone aren't enough. That there has to be this media-friendliness as well. Baseball you don't have that problem. That's why guys like Eddie Murray and Steve Carlton make it no problem. Because their numbers say they belongs even though they were quiet in front of the camera

How about those that are in the Hall that maybe don't belong?

I'll give you one:

Howie Long. I'm sorry, but he just doesn't cut it. I think that's a clear case of somebody who's currently popular, is in a bunch of TV commercials, and has a knack for talking into the camera on a pregame show that a lot of people watch -- who gets in the HoF basically because he's the 'flavor-of-the-month'.

[url]http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/alltime/leaders[/url]

Accorcding to the article they claim that Aikman and Young are shoe-ins for the HOF, but go and look at the all time leader page and see where they fall on all of the lists. I am not saying that they dont belong or they were not any good. But look at the reciever all time list and see how art monk fairs against the all time leaders.

smootsmack:

Thanks for channeling me. I don't know about you, but I thought it was fantastic; was it good for you too... :)


If Darrell Green does not make the HoF, then they ought to close the doors and turn off the power to the building. I think he will be a first time eligible inductee but even if he misses that first time, he will go in soon after that.

The writers who vote can be a bit priggish in their votes, but Green did nothing in his entire career to turn any of them against him. He's as close to a mortal lock for entry as there is.

[QUOTE=sportscurmudgeon]smootsmack:

Thanks for channeling me. I don't know about you, but I thought it was fantastic; was it good for you too... :)
[/QUOTE]

Ummm......

Are non-flashy linemen inducted into the HOF? Of course. Monk should be in.

Darrell Green practically invented the super-fast shut-down corner. He should be a first ballot inductee. If he had switched teams or retired earlier, I could see him being overlooked for a couple years, but the longetivity, especially all with one team, should get him in his first year of eligibility.