Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

the title is self-explanatory...

Actions up to this point (to me) almost make it appear that they are trying to get rid of what Gibbs instilled..

For instance, the hiring of Zorn immediately suggests a disconnect from Al Saunders.. Gibbs brought Al Saunders to Washington in hopes of producing a successful offense... IT SHOWED... look at the last 4 games of this season.. sure you can make the argument of inspired football and what not, however, its obvious with the introduction of a figure with experience (Todd Collins) this can be a top offense in the NFL as it WAS during that final stretch.. so main point: Why do you get rid of the main man in charge of the scheme: Al Saunders? .. Gibbs brought him for a reason..and we saw why at the end..

Gregg Williams is another example. It has been reported now that he is no longer in the running as head coach.. So does this comfirm the Redskins are going outside their organization for the job? Upon his arrival, Gibbs made severe roster changes and moves to start rebuilding.. who's to say that a new coach won't try the same thing? Now, there's the possibility Williams might leave, another member of the Redskins who came here for Gibbs.

Imagine: Joe Gibbs, Al Saunders, and Gregg Williams all leaving? What happened to progress and development we were going to continue with?

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

head hurting, can't take it anymore.......this is supposed to be fun!...going to bed!

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[QUOTE=CPAlltheWay012;413027]Imagine: Joe Gibbs, Al Saunders, and Gregg Williams all leaving? What happened to progress and development we were going to continue with?[/QUOTE]

Man im still shocked by this. I dont understand. At Gibbs Press Conference Snyder speaked of "continuity" and I dont see how these possible acts can be "continuity". Im scared that with a possible all new staff that a playoff team with rising expectations for 2008 might now be rebuilding.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=The Gremlin;413036]Man im still shocked by this. I dont understand. At Gibbs Press Conference Snyder speaked of "continuity" and I dont see how these possible acts can be "continuity". Im scared that with a possible all new staff that a playoff team with rising expectations for 2008 might now be rebuilding.[/quote]

He was just telling us what we wanted to hear.. He gave us the bait and we took it. Hook, line and sinker.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

at this point...the answer is "yes"

Here we go Fightin' Vinny's!!!

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

The thing that really hurts is, that I thought this team became a family after everything it endured and the way they pulled together, only to be destroyed by who knows why. We were so close to getting to a SB next year and now who knows what the future holds now, so far it doesn't look promising.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[QUOTE=DynamiteRave;413045]He was just telling us what we wanted to hear.. He gave us the bait and we took it. Hook, line and sinker.[/QUOTE]

lol. You summed this up perfect. This is exactly how it feels. Great post HTTR.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

I think things might (would?) be significantly different had Gibbs remained as President-following his head coaching stint -as he had originally planned before family priorities changed his course.

What's unfortunate is that this is the second time in his storied career that Gibbs has been unable to successfully pass the torch and establish a "Gibbs Tree"

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

If I was Gregg Williams I would have withdrawn my name from consideration when they tried to pull the trigger on that new coaching staff but were unsuccessful because the ravens blocked the lateral move of Ryan.

I applaud Gregg removing his name from consideration. He at least is professional enough to know when to move on and save face from a bad situation.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=CPAlltheWay012;413027]the title is self-explanatory...

Actions up to this point (to me) almost make it appear that they are trying to get rid of what Gibbs instilled..

For instance, the hiring of Zorn immediately suggests a disconnect from Al Saunders.. [B]Gibbs brought Al Saunders to Washington in hopes of producing a successful offense... IT SHOWED... look at the last 4 games of this season.. sure you can make the argument of inspired football and what not, however, its obvious with the introduction of a figure with experience (Todd Collins) this can be a top offense in the NFL as it WAS during that final stretch..[/B] so main point: Why do you get rid of the main man in charge of the scheme: Al Saunders? .. Gibbs brought him for a reason..and we saw why at the end..

Gregg Williams is another example. It has been reported now that he is no longer in the running as head coach.. So does this comfirm the Redskins are going outside their organization for the job? Upon his arrival, Gibbs made severe roster changes and moves to start rebuilding.. who's to say that a new coach won't try the same thing? Now, there's the possibility Williams might leave, another member of the Redskins who came here for Gibbs.

Imagine: Joe Gibbs, Al Saunders, and Gregg Williams all leaving? What happened to progress and development we were going to continue with?[/quote]

Todd Collins isn't the Redskins QB of the future, JC is and he never really showed that he truly felt comfortable in the Saunders system. True: Todd Collins came in and played well the last four games, but it was an entire team effort, not a testament to how the offensive system finally came around.

Williams, although I have never been sold that he is the best candidate for the head coaching position, does deserve better than a "smear campaign". I hope that rumor is totally false. If not, I feel sorry for him and I wonder who would want to serve under that sort of backstabbing ownership and management.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

Yes i do. We have some better character players but our team seems like it will be in the same disarray as it was before gibbs coming here. We do have good players though> Hopefully the move to zorn will be good for the development of Campbell because that is the number one priority going into the next few seasons.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

So much for continuinty!

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=DynamiteRave;413045]He was just telling us what we wanted to hear.. He gave us the bait and we took it. Hook, line and sinker.[/quote]

Yep, a bunch of BS. I don't believe anything DS or VC say right about now.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[QUOTE=BigSKINBauer;413097]Yes i do. We have some better character players but our team seems like it will be in the same disarray as it was before gibbs coming here. We do have good players though> Hopefully the move to zorn will be good for the development of Campbell because that is the number one priority going into the next few seasons.[/QUOTE]

Isn't this Campbell's last year under contract?

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=redsk1;413101]Yep, a bunch of BS. I don't believe anything DS or VC say right about now.[/quote]

What exactly has Dan Snyder or Vinnie Cerrato said at any time during the last 17 days regarding the interview process? I've heard the media say quite a bit about some rumor that was overheard by an assistant to a friend who's cousin bought a Joe Gibbs hat at the tent sale yesterday.

Right now, unless I've missed something, the only facts are that Gibbs resigned and we've hired Zorn as our OC. Everything else is assumption brought about by the frustration of not having anything to report.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=redwagonskins;413107]Isn't this Campbell's last year under contract?[/quote]
I think he has one more season beyond this one. Maybe someone can confirm. But yeah, we will have to resign him. I think the coach coming in will have to be confident in Campbell and must like him. I don't want a coach coming in and not liking campbell and wanting to put a guy he drafts or signs in. I don't want a brunell/Ramsey situation again.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

5 year $20 Million Contract signed in 2005. So maybe he gets 2 years with the new OC.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[QUOTE=724Skinsfan;413111]What exactly has Dan Snyder or Vinnie Cerrato said at any time during the last 17 days regarding the interview process? I've heard the media say quite a bit about some rumor that was overheard by an assistant to a friend who's cousin bought a Joe Gibbs hat at the tent sale yesterday.

Right now, unless I've missed something, the only facts are that Gibbs resigned and we've hired Zorn as our OC. Everything else is assumption brought about by the frustration of not having anything to report.[/QUOTE]

Some sanity! So hard to find these days

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

no because it going to be a new team next year cap 20millon over that why team and ch are getting change and start new.front of has no choice but to do this

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=goingdeep;413122]no because it going to be a new team next year cap 20millon over that why team and ch are getting change and start new.front of has no choice but to do this[/quote]
The team can easily make some moves and be under the cap. There is no such thing as cap hell for the redskins. It just always looks that way the way that the skins do their contracts. Really we won't have much trouble at all getting under the cap next year.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

If the current path of operation is continued then the answer to your question is a resounding yes.

It would apear to me it is the intent to remove all associated with Joe Gibbs, and a deeper look may reveal that the abrupt resignation of Gibbs may not have been all about the way it was spun in the media.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

The second that Gibbs walked out the door at Redskins Park everything was up in the air. Let's face it, Gibbs was the glue that held this entire operation together. With him gone, Snyder needs to find people that he is comfortable and confident working with.

If Williams isn't his guy, fair enough. No matter what happens here I'm not going to play this silly blame game and assume Snyder and Cerrato are just hatching this evil plan to undo Gibbs' work. Gibbs' work came undone the second he stepped down. Once the staff is in place I really hope Snyder will explain what exactly went down in this process so we can get some answers straight from the source, rather than all this speculation because really that's all we're going on right now.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=BigSKINBauer;413112]I think he has one more season beyond this one. Maybe someone can confirm. But yeah, we will have to resign him. I think the coach coming in will have to be confident in Campbell and must like him. I don't want a coach coming in and not liking campbell and wanting to put a guy he drafts or signs in. I don't want a brunell/Ramsey situation again.[/quote]

He is signed through 2009.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;413138]The second that Gibbs walked out the door at Redskins Park everything was up in the air. Let's face it, Gibbs was the glue that held this entire operation together. With him gone, Snyder needs to find people that he is comfortable and confident working with.

If Williams isn't his guy, fair enough. No matter what happens here I'm not going to play this silly blame game and assume Snyder and Cerrato are just hatching this evil plan to undo Gibbs' work. Gibbs' work came undone the second he stepped down. Once the staff is in place I really hope Snyder will explain what exactly went down in this process so we can get some answers straight from the source, rather than all this speculation because really that's all we're going on right now.[/quote]Anything coming out of Snyder's mouth at this point will be pure spin. At Gibbs's farewell press conference, Snyder preached continuity. Tell me how blowing up both the offensive and defensive coaching staffs lends itself to continuity?

On a different topic, we act as if there's no cap issue despite being $20M over at the moment. We [B]ONLY[/B] don't have a problem if players like Portis, Moss, and others play ball, and renegotiate. With the presumed bloodbath on the coaching front, don't be surprised if more than just Springs pass on "helping" the Skins cap situation by renegotiating. If that comes to pass, we should expect several high profile cap casualties, further destroying the continuity that The Danny preached after Gibbs stepped down.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=SouperMeister;413149]Anything coming out of Snyder's mouth at this point will be pure spin. At Gibbs's farewell press conference, Snyder preached continuity. Tell me how blowing up both the offensive and defensive coaching staffs lends itself to continuity?

On a different topic, we act as if there's no cap issue despite being $20M over at the moment. We [B]ONLY[/B] don't have a problem if players like Portis, Moss, and others play ball, and renegotiate. With the presumed bloodbath on the coaching front, don't be surprised if more than just Springs pass on "helping" the Skins cap situation by renegotiating. If that comes to pass, we should expect several high profile cap casualties, further destroying the continuity that The Danny preached after Gibbs stepped down.[/quote]Interesting point, but it's not going to come to that. Restructuring is always in the players' benefit, money-wise. It's give-take for the team.

They'd have to want out REAL bad to not restructure.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=GTripp0012;413152]Interesting point, but it's not going to come to that. Restructuring is always in the players' benefit, money-wise. It's give-take for the team.

They'd have to want out REAL bad to not restructure.[/quote]I agree that players benefit from restructuring, but let's use Portis as an example. I believe he is due somewhere around $5M in salary alone. If we convert that to a signing bonus, he has a guaranteed $5M in hand. I would argue that if he forced the Skins to cut him, he would certainly land more than $5M in SB as a free agent. He greatly helped his case by gaining 500+ yards from scrimmage over the final 4 games of the regular season. I'm not saying that he leaves, but Portis is an example of a top producer still young enough to demand a greater signing bonus in free agency than he could by restructuring.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=SouperMeister;413149][B]Anything coming out of Snyder's mouth at this point will be pure spin.[/B] At Gibbs's farewell press conference, Snyder preached continuity. Tell me how blowing up both the offensive and defensive coaching staffs lends itself to continuity?

On a different topic, we act as if there's no cap issue despite being $20M over at the moment. We [B]ONLY[/B] don't have a problem if players like Portis, Moss, and others play ball, and renegotiate. With the presumed bloodbath on the coaching front, don't be surprised if more than just Springs pass on "helping" the Skins cap situation by renegotiating. If that comes to pass, we should expect several high profile cap casualties, further destroying the continuity that The Danny preached after Gibbs stepped down.[/quote]

So basically your mind is made up no matter what anyone says once the dust settles?

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[QUOTE=Mattyk72;413138]The second that Gibbs walked out the door at Redskins Park everything was up in the air. Let's face it, Gibbs was the glue that held this entire operation together. With him gone, Snyder needs to find people that he is comfortable and confident working with.

If Williams isn't his guy, fair enough. No matter what happens here I'm not going to play this silly blame game and assume Snyder and Cerrato are just hatching this evil plan to undo Gibbs' work. Gibbs' work came undone the second he stepped down. Once the staff is in place I really hope Snyder will explain what exactly went down in this process so we can get some answers straight from the source, rather than all this speculation because really that's all we're going on right now.[/QUOTE]


You are absolutely correct, and that's why is has become apearent that everything associated with Joe Gibbs is in jepordy. Perhaps it would have been different had there been time to formulate a plan B ahead of time, but the departure of Gibbs was unexpected, therefore it shouldn't come as a suprise to anyone that changes will be forthcoming.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=Mattyk72;413162]So basically your mind is made up no matter what anyone says once the dust settles?[/quote]My point is that Snyder preached continuity, but his actions don't line up with his words. If he comes back and says that we're trying to build on the foundation that Gibbs built, then yes, I'm saying [I][B]that is spin[/B][/I].

I'm not a pure Snyder basher - look at my previous posts during the Gibbs tenure. I was one of the few defending Snyder for deferring to Gibbs on all personnel matters. I was also one of the few that blamed Gibbs for Archuleta, Lloyd, and Duckett, when many others wanted to pin those failures on Snyder and Ceratto.

What angers me, as Boswell put it so well, is that Snyder is razing the house down to the foundation for the FOURTH time this decade. If Jason Campbell ever becomes a great QB, it will have been in spite of all the organizational chaos, not because of it.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

snyder stinks

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

It's looking more and more like Gibbs 2 will be remembered as a short term gain that ushered in a long term curse. It looks as if Gibbs 2 has made Snyder into a football guru. At least in his own mind.

"If it ain't broke." OH the humanity.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[quote=SFREDSKIN;413051]The thing that really hurts is, that I thought this team became a family after everything it endured and the way they pulled together, only to be destroyed by who knows why. We were so close to getting to a SB next year and now who knows what the future holds now, so far it doesn't look promising.[/quote]



Snyder is a business man, not a football man. Look at us here in Detroit with the Fords. They never really knew football, just wanted to be hip owning a sports franchise. Now their car company is going down the tubes. Anybody with season tickets has to feel like a total ass right now. Unless he does get Cowher or asks Marty to comeback, I don't give much stock in a playoff run next season. We might lose some FA's also because of this!!!!!!

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

well it would appear Williams is gone...

thanks a f***ing lot snyder..

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

Redshikns will never win as long as Snyder is running the show. Same as Dallas and jerry jones.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

the Cowboys HAVE won with Jerry Jones...don't you remember the 90's???

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

ABSOLUTELY!!!!!!

It only Took Dan Snyder a couple of weeks to show me once again why I truly despise him: he brought Joe Gibbs out of retirement, who then turned the Redskins back from being the biggest joke in the NFL back into a playoff contender, and true to form, DANNY BOY DESTROYS EVERYTHING ONCE AGAIN! Is he truly insane? Has he absolutely no sense? I am so sick and tired of the horror he has inflicted on the team I have loved since childhood that I can no longer bear to watch. WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS MAN? WHY HIRE GIBBS AT ALL IF YOU WON'T EVEN FOLLOW THROUGH ON WHAT HE'S LEFT IN PLACE FOR THE FUTURE? There was no need to rebuild, but this jerk has demolished the building yet again. Someone please find a way to fire the owner!!!

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[QUOTE=maxiemom;413458]ABSOLUTELY!!!!!!

It only Took Dan Snyder a couple of weeks to show me once again why I truly despise him: he brought Joe Gibbs out of retirement, who then turned the Redskins back from being the biggest joke in the NFL back into a playoff contender, and true to form, DANNY BOY DESTROYS EVERYTHING ONCE AGAIN! Is he truly insane? Has he absolutely no sense? I am so sick and tired of the horror he has inflicted on the team I have loved since childhood that I can no longer bear to watch. WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS MAN? WHY HIRE GIBBS AT ALL IF YOU WON'T EVEN FOLLOW THROUGH ON WHAT HE'S LEFT IN PLACE FOR THE FUTURE? There was no need to rebuild, but this jerk has demolished the building yet again. Someone please find a way to fire the owner!!![/QUOTE]

See this is the problem right here. You have people have already decided "Everything is destroyed once again" and that this was all Snyder being evil and kicking Williams to the curb, while smearing him. All assumptions from an impatient fanbase that refuses to take a breath and wait for things to play themselves out.

Even if Williams (or his agent, as he already basically did) comes out and says "Look, we have no problem with each other, we just couldn't come to an agreement," it won't matter to anyone because people just don't want to hear it.

And I understand this is largely attributable to Snyder's past reputation, but let's not forget Williams' past reputation is not exactly a rosy one.

But this unfortunately is the eternal damage that has been done to this franchise. There is no trust or patience anymore.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

[QUOTE=DynamiteRave;413045]He was just telling us what we wanted to hear.. He gave us the bait and we took it. Hook, line and sinker.[/QUOTE]

I agree. He knew he was going to rip it apart. How does he ever expect to win if he keeps tearing down and rebuilding from scratch. If they haven't started yet, the players need to start updating their resumes.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

We have wasted the last 4 years.

We spent that time rediscovering "Redskins Values": toughness, personal responsibility, humility and the value of victory. Getting back to your values is difficult and now we have players that believe it. Players who will say "I cost us the game because I dropped the pass." "Put it on me and I will run us to victory." Now our owner has proven that he has not embraced these values, but rather has returned to his "Fantasy Football" game but with coaches instead.

I was at the Dallas game on December 30. If you want to know why Saint Joe needed to return to us, you need only look at that victory against a bigger, better team who has also returned to their values of celebrity, arrogance and victory.

GW was the heir apparent that would keep those values going but Snyder wizzed it away.

I hope I am wrong, but I believe we are once again lost.

Re: Does anyone feel as if the Redskins Organization is dismantling Joe Gibb's work?
 

I wonder how Joe Gibbs feels about all this. My guess is that he's sick over the way Williams was handled in the end. It never would have gone down this way when Gibbs was President of Football Operations. Even if Williams wasn't wanted, you don't leave a valued employee, respected by players and peers, hanging in limbo for nearly two weeks if you pride yourself for running a class organization.