Anyone still think Portis "was a product of Denver's system"?
 

I heard a lot of talk out here from non-Skins fans, that he will not put up the numbers he did in Denver and that he was good, but a product of Denver's "system". I take nothing away from Shanahan, but Portis really is "that damn good"! :food-smil

hes a product of the Miami Hurricanes (and perhaps genetic altering on test tube babies, a theory I have aobut UM players). Enough said

163yds clearly shows he's nothing more than another denver back :D :D :D at that rate we're looking at 2,400 rushing yds this season... everyone should shut up with that crap now.

I don't think that Portis was simply a product of the Broncos' system; he is a tremendous back.

However, I have to say that I was somewhat disappointed with the run-blocking today. Portis had a great game and I do not mean to take anything away from him. But, if you take away the 64-yard TD run, he was averaging about 2.5 yards per carry. I wasn't too pleased with that.

Only the haters believed that he was a product of Denver's system, and I don't think that they believed it either deep down.

[QUOTE=Ramseyfan]I don't think that Portis was simply a product of the Broncos' system; he is a tremendous back.

However, I have to say that I was somewhat disappointed with the run-blocking today. Portis had a great game and I do not mean to take anything away from him. But, if you take away the 64-yard TD run, he was averaging about 2.5 yards per carry. I wasn't too pleased with that.[/QUOTE]
Running on the Bucs D isn't an easy thing to do, considering we put up 166 yards on their run D that's nothing to be ashamed about.

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]Running on the Bucs D isn't an easy thing to do, considering we put up 166 yards on their run D that's nothing to be ashamed about.[/QUOTE]

I have to agree, could you imagine having Trung back there! :vomit-smi
Portis is definitely the real deal. One of the amazing things I realized about him today is that he runs faster sideways than most people do period. INfreakingCREDIBLE! :biggthump

Now I'll just be glad that Portis will be making his yards as a product of the Gibbs offensive system. Tampa Bays D is for real. Don't think for a second that they did not do everything they could to prepare for that game. Still, Portis rushes for over 140 yards...

What I think is nice is that he got them even with the Skins offense not totally clicking. Just wait till we get a few games into the season!

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]Running on the Bucs D isn't an easy thing to do, considering we put up 166 yards on their run D that's nothing to be ashamed about.[/QUOTE]

Yeah... exactly. The Bucs were playing tremendous D in this game as well. Anybody with any common sense and/or football knowledge knows that Portis is the real deal and a great running back... he simply is.

And while his average isn't great taking that first run away, the thing that really impressed me with him was at the end of the game when he got the big yards and big first downs to keep the clock moving and put the game away.

[QUOTE=Ramseyfan]I don't think that Portis was simply a product of the Broncos' system; he is a tremendous back.

However, I have to say that I was somewhat disappointed with the run-blocking today. Portis had a great game and I do not mean to take anything away from him. But, if you take away the 64-yard TD run, he was averaging about 2.5 yards per carry. I wasn't too pleased with that.[/QUOTE]

Unduly harsh judgement on the run blocking IMHO - usually, when a back runs for a 150 yards, there's 1-2 long runs in there. I think it's unfair to take out those two runs from the total rushing and point out the low avg yards per carry on the remaining rushes. You almost never see a case where someone has 30 carries for 150 yards that comprises 30 runs for 5 yards each.

Also, as was rightly pointed out by someone else, this was TB we ran for 166 yards against - pretty damn good considering their run defense.

Further, atleast 6-7 carries that Portis had came right at the end when our objective was to get short runs to get first downs and run out the clock. So, if you take away those 6-7 small yard carries at the end along with the 64 yd run, he had about 21 carries for 80-84 yards, which is a pretty decent yards per carry.

[QUOTE=Winskins]One of the amazing things I realized about him today is that he runs faster sideways than most people do period. INfreakingCREDIBLE! :biggthump[/QUOTE]

Exactly. His acceleration and moves were amazing.

to all the bowen haters.... lol ... i told ya from the start he's not to bad

2 sacks and some hard ass hittin'

what is amazing is the broncos plug a 5'8" 190lb RB in there tonight and he is running it pretty well.
Don't get me wrong, Portis is an amazing talent and the real deal but:
talent + scheme = 149yds

Portis is one of the best backs in the league, no question. The only thing that I dont like about him is his tendancies to have these really bad carries where he loses like 5 yards. We never had to worry about that with Stephen Davis. Im not saying SD > CP, but just putting it out there.

I'm not going to even start comparing Griffin to Portis, but Quentin ain't lookin' too shabby tonight. Then again, it's KC's defense.

11 carries 110 yds 2tds
1 catch 1td
yeah, not too shabby

That system defiently had a lot to do with the amount of success he had, Portis has a lot of ability, but take a look at what Griffin did tonight for denver, Griffin isn't as talented as Portis, but look at what he accomplished, big time number's, Denver block's down on almost every running play, then they pull the guard to kick out the end, then it is up to the back to follow the play and cut back when the hole emerges, back's who have good running instinct's, and quick cutting ability, are perfect for that type of blocking, I would hope Gibb's and Buge's get together and put in a couple of down blocking pattern's, to take a bigger advantage of his skill's, straight ahead smash mouth football is not in Portis's best interest, I know he's tough for a small guy, but he need's to be able to take advantage of his cut back skill's, and his ability to excellerate through the hole. He can play smash mouth, but I don't think he will be nearly as productive, or healthy, take a look at his TD run, he used his cut back ability to make that happen, we have to put him in those type's of situation's as often as we can.

To OFFISS and also to all you characters bitching about our OL - try to remember: We were playing against an EXCELLENT defense. Give them at least a LITTLE credit. And comparing it with Griffin's numbers, try to remember he was going against arguably the WORST defense in the NFL. Did you guys even notice the horrible, erratic, disorganized defensive play by KC and the poor tackling??? I was extremely disappointed in Gunther's defense, and have to believe he will improve it over the next several weeks. It was pitiful. Hell, *I* could have gained 50 yards against them, and I'm 63 years old!! It will be interesting to see how the Denver "system" compares to our RB stats next week when we go against the Giants and they are up against the Jags. I expect some MUCH different numbers then.

The only surprise I got in either of these 2 games was in the coverage scheme Denver used to totally shut down the KC passing game. I have never seen another team have the genius to put their top CB on Gonzalez for an entire game. I bet we'll see a lot more of it from here on out.

After today, I think everyone is happy. We got what we desperately needed: a stud RB (never mind we let one go a year ago, but we pretty much need to wipe the slate clean)
Denver got a shutdown corner.
I still would have made the trade, like I heard some announcer today say: "you don't give up a guy that scores a lot of points for a guy the prevents a few".
How about some credit for our O-line? The same group that last year got Ramsey almost killed, with a lot of better coaching and game planning, blocks for 160yds and 0 sacks!!!! Wow.

Brunell Fan is right we never had to wory about SD going backwards but I didn't see Portis doing too mutch of that either last night. One thing we did have to wory about is SD had to have nearly30 carriers in a game before he was effective he would cough up the ball in key situations and in big games he would simply just not turn up.

Portis is for real. Look, he's a constant big-play threat. That's part of the way he gained 1500 yards a season. He's got serious speed and excellent moves. 64-yard TD runs are a big part of what he does. As for the day-to-day grind it out stuff, I thought he had his moments, but the TB D basically stacked the line. I was surprised that we only threw one screen, and we didn't get much out of our play action. Once that starts to kick, Portis will have even more room to move. And believe this: the giants are right now worriedly scheming to deal with Portis. And he doesn't play for the Broncos.

[QUOTE=Hogskin]To OFFISS and also to all you characters bitching about our OL - try to remember: We were playing against an EXCELLENT defense. Give them at least a LITTLE credit. And comparing it with Griffin's numbers, try to remember he was going against arguably the WORST defense in the NFL. Did you guys even notice the horrible, erratic, disorganized defensive play by KC and the poor tackling??? I was extremely disappointed in Gunther's defense, and have to believe he will improve it over the next several weeks. It was pitiful. Hell, *I* could have gained 50 yards against them, and I'm 63 years old!! It will be interesting to see how the Denver "system" compares to our RB stats next week when we go against the Giants and they are up against the Jags. I expect some MUCH different numbers then.

The only surprise I got in either of these 2 games was in the coverage scheme Denver used to totally shut down the KC passing game. I have never seen another team have the genius to put their top CB on Gonzalez for an entire game. I bet we'll see a lot more of it from here on out.[/QUOTE]

I don't know if I would call it genious, they don't have anyone else who's a threat, Eddie Kennison? Hall? WR is much more skilled than kick return's.

I'd like to also say griffin got his yards on frikkin KC, wait till they play a real defense...

[QUOTE=hurrykaine]Unduly harsh judgement on the run blocking IMHO - usually, when a back runs for a 150 yards, there's 1-2 long runs in there. I think it's unfair to take out those two runs from the total rushing and point out the low avg yards per carry on the remaining rushes. You almost never see a case where someone has 30 carries for 150 yards that comprises 30 runs for 5 yards each.

Also, as was rightly pointed out by someone else, this was TB we ran for 166 yards against - pretty damn good considering their run defense.

Further, atleast 6-7 carries that Portis had came right at the end when our objective was to get short runs to get first downs and run out the clock. So, if you take away those 6-7 small yard carries at the end along with the 64 yd run, he had about 21 carries for 80-84 yards, which is a pretty decent yards per carry.[/QUOTE]
I agree, you can pick apart almost any RB's performance and say, well if you take away this run he only had X amount of yards.

the great majority of runs are for under 5 yards... anyone with 5.0+ ypc averages has them because they're home run threats, and those home runs pad their one yarders.

I think people aren't giving the Bucs D and their coaching staff enough credit.

The Bucs have a really good D and they will prove it against Seattle next week who looks like they may not have shaun Alexander. But Portis is not a product of Denver, He is a quality back who played in that scheme in which you can put any back there and get 1000 yards. But Portis did it in college and has done it in the pros He is the product of Mommy and Daddy Portis.

[QUOTE=bridaman51] He is the product of Mommy and Daddy Portis.[/QUOTE]

lol.

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]I think people aren't giving the Bucs D and their coaching staff enough credit.[/QUOTE]

true, It's tough to gauge right now, we have nothing to go off of, they are missing some guy's from last year, but I know we have to give it some time for a fair evaluation, but we have to talk about something. :D

[QUOTE=offiss]I don't know if I would call it genious, they don't have anyone else who's a threat, Eddie Kennison? Hall? WR is much more skilled than kick return's.[/QUOTE]

Well, maybe you don't recognize it as genius, but most would. After 2 years and almost 40 games of having no real competition as the #1 offense in football, NONE of the other great football minds came up with this strategy against them, and no one else succeeded in bogging them down. I call that genius. It is certainly a huge step above the other top strategists in the league, and is certain to be copied for the rest of the season. (Much to my dismay!!! I drafted Gonzalez!! LOL)

Now, maybe another great mind will come along and put their #2 CB on Priest LOL - he is their only other receiving threat!!

EK will still get 1000 yards, not a bad FF pickup, he's available late.

[QUOTE=Mattyk72]I agree, you can pick apart almost any RB's performance and say, well if you take away this run he only had X amount of yards.[/QUOTE]

So right, Matty. If you took away his 30+ yard carries in Denver, his average looks a WHOLE lot different. Without those, his average puts him with bums. He made his rep on all the breakaway runs he got. This is not a Riggo-type runner who grinds it out, and very seldom breaks a big one. He is the other side of the spectrum, and every bit as valuable doing that.

It bothered me at the top of this thread to see the criticism of the OL. My gosh, how could the turnaround in the OL have been more dramatic from one season to the next????? And with the top performer on the line out for the year!! Bugel is amazing. I give him 100 out of 10! And it's going to get even better, guys.

Enough about Denver's system. What about Gibbs' and Bugel's system? Why doesn't anyone talk about that? Who really thinks they don't know how to use Portis and showcase his strenghts and minimize his weaknesses? The way some people (not on this board) talk you'd think Denver invented the running game

And to think the Skins accomplished all this without their best offensive lineman.

[QUOTE=Hogskin]Well, maybe you don't recognize it as genius, but most would. After 2 years and almost 40 games of having no real competition as the #1 offense in football, NONE of the other great football minds came up with this strategy against them, and no one else succeeded in bogging them down. I call that genius. It is certainly a huge step above the other top strategists in the league, and is certain to be copied for the rest of the season. (Much to my dismay!!! I drafted Gonzalez!! LOL)

Now, maybe another great mind will come along and put their #2 CB on Priest LOL - he is their only other receiving threat!![/QUOTE]


The one advantage denver did have is champ, he has the size to go along with the covering skill's, most other corner's Gonzalez should man handle, regardless of their speed.

[QUOTE=offiss]The one advantage denver did have is champ, he has the size to go along with the covering skill's, most other corner's Gonzalez should man handle, regardless of their speed.[/QUOTE]

Champ is a solid CB (especially going against ANY TE). But almost any team's #1 CB staying on Gonzo all day is going to cut way back on his production. You've got to remember - over the past few years, he has been making a living and building a rep going against mainly LB's - pass coverage is a secondary skill for them. As far as manhandling, he can't do any of that until he grabs the ball. That is where the CB can make the difference - keeping the ball from him. Again, I expect to see a lot more of this from other teams, because KC's WR's are pitiful, and because it WORKED. If some don't pick it up, shame on them. Remember how fast everyone learned that constant blitzing was the way to beat Spurrier? Everyone sees the films, and they have no qualms about borrowing strategies that work.

Holmes wasn't too bad either

Holmes’ 100-Yard Game: RB Priest Holmes topped the 100-yard rushing mark in the regular season for the 27th time in his career. It was his 20th 100-yard rushing game with Kansas City. Holmes’ 151 yards were the most ever by a Chiefs back on Opening Day, surpassing the previous mark of 143 yards established by RB Christian Okoye vs. Atlanta (9/1/91).

P.S. He's from my hometown so gotta bragg a little, afterall he plays for the OTHER TRIBE :D

[QUOTE=Hogskin]Champ is a solid CB (especially going against ANY TE). But almost any team's #1 CB staying on Gonzo all day is going to cut way back on his production. You've got to remember - over the past few years, he has been making a living and building a rep going against mainly LB's - pass coverage is a secondary skill for them. As far as manhandling, he can't do any of that until he grabs the ball. That is where the CB can make the difference - keeping the ball from him. Again, I expect to see a lot more of this from other teams, because KC's WR's are pitiful, and because it WORKED. If some don't pick it up, shame on them. Remember how fast everyone learned that constant blitzing was the way to beat Spurrier? Everyone sees the films, and they have no qualms about borrowing strategies that work.[/QUOTE]

Gonzo should be able to body up on any CB in the league, and make the catch, he's to big and to athletic for most corner's.

[QUOTE=offiss]Gonzo should be able to body up on any CB in the league, and make the catch, he's to big and to athletic for most corner's.[/QUOTE]

Not sure if you heard about this year's rule enforcement. It works for the offense as well as the defense. The only time there is going to be that type of play, is when the officials miss it. Yeah, Champ is good, but look at his 2003 play, and look at the coverage last weekend going against a TE. Night and day. As I said before, I believe almost everyteam's top CB can effectively take TG out of the game IF they use this strategy. I guess we'll find out if they do use it. Of course, Vermiel is a very good offensive mind, and will probably come up with SOMETHING to try to force opponents OUT of that strategy.

[QUOTE=Hogskin]It bothered me at the top of this thread to see the criticism of the OL. My gosh, how could the turnaround in the OL have been more dramatic from one season to the next????? And with the top performer on the line out for the year!! Bugel is amazing. I give him 100 out of 10! And it's going to get even better, guys.[/QUOTE]
I agree 100%. Look at how far the OL has come in such a short time, PLUS they are missing Jansen. Bugel has yet again done a masterful job in getting this unit ready to play and at a high level.

No false starts, only 1 holding call (and it was a good hold by the way that prevented a safety) and we dropped a buck sixty on the ground against a solid defense. Oh yeah I almost forgot no sacks allowed.

I don't see how we can ask for much more. This unit still has plenty of room for improvement too, that's the scary part.