2009 needs
 

ok a lot has been said about the offense and defensive lines and how we need an upgrade. i would agree but we have a lot of problems on this team with few answers. our lines do need upgrade our lbs other then fletcher need to be upgraded and resigning hall would give us a nice secondary. also wrs need an upgrade. now i know we just spend 2 2nd round picks on wrs but if they don't pan out early maybe we could get someone before mid season. a true 2nd or preferably 1st is needed. i think rb is good te is good and qb is STILL a question. like i said this team has a lot of improvements to make. to help our lines out the signing of gross peppers and/ or haynesworth is needed. i'm not saying we can get all three but 2 out of 3 is reasonable. then because this draft class is deep for o-linemen we use most of our picks on them. now i'm sure we could find a cheap lb in fa that would be an upgrade over washington. thats my thoughts

Re: 2009 needs
 

Our biggest need this offseason again comes on the DE spot, the lack of pass rush every season in awful... Our d finished 4th in the league, just imagine if we had a 10sack season from anyone, much less taylor or carter. Also a true number 2 WR would really help, Cooley is a beast, Moss is a true Speedster, but ARE cant get it done as a Num 2.. Thomas or Kelly either one has to step up this offseason! And finally I want to see JC under Zorn's offense again next year, It is a HUGE year for Campbell in the last year of his contract.... If we don't atleast make the playoff's he is probably gone, and who know's Zorn may be out as well...

Re: 2009 needs
 

Simple answer

Lines -- BOTH!

Re: 2009 needs
 

Two words: Aaron Curry.
Top 3 defenses are all in the championship game. This kid is the best complete LB I have ever seen. Trade up if needed.
Coach up the offense so they can have zero turnovers and score 3-4 field goals a game. Draft Curry, resign Hall, sign Haynesworth.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=markymark;519835]ok a lot has been said about the offense and defensive lines and how we need an upgrade. i would agree but we have a lot of problems on this team with few answers. our lines do need upgrade our lbs other then fletcher need to be upgraded and resigning hall would give us a nice secondary. also wrs need an upgrade. now i know we just spend 2 2nd round picks on wrs but if they don't pan out early maybe we could get someone before mid season. a true 2nd or preferably 1st is needed. i think rb is good te is good and qb is STILL a question. like i said this team has a lot of improvements to make. to help our lines out the signing of gross peppers and/ or haynesworth is needed. i'm not saying we can get all three but 2 out of 3 is reasonable. then because this draft class is deep for o-linemen we use most of our picks on them. now i'm sure we could find a cheap lb in fa that would be an upgrade over washington. thats my thoughts[/quote]


They drafted three recievers last year but none of them panned out. Like it or not they're stuck with what they have. We might get a lesser known guy in FA but I think that the draft picks we have are here for another year. ARE, Moss, and Thrash are the questions. Are you saying that we get rid of Moss in favor of a FA guy and some picks?

I'm not saying Vinny will not draft WR but the most pressing needs are out aging lines and deffense.

We only have four picks and we'll probably make some deals to get more. Look for one of our better players to get traded. If we don't pick up someone like an Alex Mack or a solid LB that will be there for years then I'm betting that Vinny will trade down.

Guys will be brought back on the cheap or they'll be cut. The only ones we will not get rid of are the ones that'll cost us an arm and a leg in dead cap. Some of these guys are not coming back regardless. I don't see them cutting everyone. If anything some of these guys should come back to add depth while the younger guys get the snaps. If they go down we've got a vet there for at least the end of the season.

After watching Filth-a-delphia beat NJG I'm not as worried about our team as I was. I was on the blow it up fence after this year but now I'm not so sure.

The two things that I can think of that can make a huge difference is a run stopping defensive player. I'd look to get a guy who can come in right away if possible. This stuck out to me after watching the Philly game. That and the fact that the O-line gave McNabb all day. This would've been helpfull this season with NJG, Pittsburgh, and Dallas. That's why I say Alex Mack or LB for the 13th pick.

I know everyone one is going to say that it takes years for a Center to get ready but we don't have years unless you want to move someone to play that position. I can see that but I wouldn't get rid of Raback outright.

Re: 2009 needs
 

i'm definitely not saying get rid of moss but he does need help. he needs someone else to take pressure off him on first and second down. cooley is great but again hes getting doubled up too. another legit wr would help us the most and allow ARE to move to the 3rd wr which would make him really dangerous. but you all are right lines have to be priority which we could build though the draft. our line is not as great as others but its also not that bad. if we could get guys to come in over the next 3 years we'd be fine. draft a guard and center this year that we could start if needed but dont need to start and help them develop. but what about the lb situation? any thoughts out there?

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=markymark;519904]i'm definitely not saying get rid of moss but he does need help. he needs someone else to take pressure off him on first and second down. cooley is great but again hes getting doubled up too. another legit wr would help us the most and allow ARE to move to the 3rd wr which would make him really dangerous. but you all are right lines have to be priority which we could build though the draft. our line is not as great as others but its also not that bad. if we could get guys to come in over the next 3 years we'd be fine. draft a guard and center this year that we could start if needed but dont need to start and help them develop. but what about the lb situation? any thoughts out there?[/quote]

If getting rid of Moss means a pick or picks that are going to help us address the offensive line, I think it is worth it. What's the point to having a good receiver, if your QB doesn't have time to throw it nor does it have a good running game to set up the pass. We could have Randy Moss and our passing game still would suffer (sadly lots of fans - including yours truly and the FO did not think of this and brought in three receivers).

Re: 2009 needs
 

so then we have a young o line that is going to have growing pains and no one to throw to... sounds like what the raiders are going though right now

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=markymark;519913]so then we have a young o line that is going to have growing pains and no one to throw to... sounds like what the raiders are going though right now[/quote]

Thats what happens when you have to rebuilt the entire Lien at one time, instead of replacing through drafting over time. The Redskins have missed that point, both at the OLine and at DEs.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=markymark;519835]ok a lot has been said about the offense and defensive lines and how we need an upgrade. i would agree but we have a lot of problems on this team with few answers. our lines do need upgrade our lbs other then fletcher need to be upgraded and resigning hall would give us a nice secondary. also wrs need an upgrade. now i know we just spend 2 2nd round picks on wrs but if they don't pan out early maybe we could get someone before mid season. a true 2nd or preferably 1st is needed. i think rb is good te is good and qb is STILL a question. like i said this team has a lot of improvements to make. to help our lines out the signing of gross peppers and/ or haynesworth is needed. i'm not saying we can get all three but 2 out of 3 is reasonable. then because this draft class is deep for o-linemen we use most of our picks on them. now i'm sure we could find a cheap lb in fa that would be an upgrade over washington. thats my thoughts[/quote]

... just because he said we still need a 1 or 2 WR doesnt mean he said get rid of moss.
Getting rid of a gamebreaker like Santana moss would be clearly going backwards. YOU ADD TO WHAT YOU GOT! KEEP SANTANA ALL DAY!
Santana needs help... not to be replaced.

Re: 2009 needs
 

Curry looks good, but I think it's a must we draft an OT at 13. Unless we're able to trade 13 for a later 1st and a 2nd, we must draft OT first.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=Skins4L;520017]... just because he said we still need a 1 or 2 WR doesnt mean he said get rid of moss.
Getting rid of a gamebreaker like Santana moss would be clearly going backwards. YOU ADD TO WHAT YOU GOT! KEEP SANTANA ALL DAY!
Santana needs help... not to be replaced.[/quote]

Moss would be filthy as a slot receiver. I think Kelly will evolve into a starter, but I'm still unsure about Thomas. Ideally, I'd like to see Kelly-#1, ?-#2, and Moss as our #3/slot receiver.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=Ruhskins;519906]If getting rid of Moss means a pick or picks that are going to help us address the offensive line, I think it is worth it. What's the point to having a good receiver, if your QB doesn't have time to throw it nor does it have a good running game to set up the pass. We could have Randy Moss and our passing game still would suffer (sadly lots of fans - including yours truly and the FO did not think of this and brought in three receivers).[/quote]

I have thought about it and just can't see giving up Moss for a second rounder. I understand why people think so, but if he is made the second reciever, he can also become the full time punt returner. He could be a true game changer there. Packaging Randle El and Betts for a pick/trade could be a better option.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=PennSkinsFan;519882]Simple answer

Lines -- BOTH![/quote]

Yes. Kicker too.

Re: 2009 needs
 

The Redskins need to upgrade at offensive line, defensive line and linebacker. The Skins invested heavily in Devin Thomas and Malcolm Kelly and they need to improve in the off season. Typically it takes wide receivers three years to breakthrough. Unfortunately, the Skins can't wait that long. They need one of these guys to step up now.

Re: 2009 needs
 

we have capable tackles right now that would be fine for the 2009 season its the interior of the line that needs the upgrade. i like randy thomas a lot but the injuries are starting to pill up and hes not as good as i think he once was. kendell i was never a big fan of and rabach hasnt panned out that well either. between jj heyer and samuels our tackles should be alright if we can move jj to right guard and draft a LG and center i think our line would be alright. but that that siad jj would have to adjust and our line would have growing pains.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=markymark;520049]we have capable tackles right now that would be fine for the 2009 season its the interior of the line that needs the upgrade. i like randy thomas a lot but the injuries are starting to pill up and hes not as good as i think he once was. kendell i was never a big fan of and rabach hasnt panned out that well either. between jj heyer and samuels our tackles should be alright if we can move jj to right guard and draft a LG and center i think our line would be alright. but that that siad jj would have to adjust and our line would have growing pains.[/quote]

Sorry but have to disagree with you. RT is a huge need. It was basically a small speed bump for pass rushers on the right side this year. If we are stuck with JJ and Heyer then it will be another long disappointing season.

I don't see any reason to add to our WR corps unless we can get a FA on the cheap. I do agree we need help here, but we have to address other areas first. Our only hope is that Devin or Kelly make huge strides this offseason and aren't the busts that I am afraid they are going to be.

IMO we have 4 picks. I would use them all on lineman and a LB depending on what is the best available at that pick.

Re: 2009 needs
 

JAKE2008: Yes I agree on lineman but what we truly need to do in the draft is trade down and accumulate alot more picks trade that bum Betts for a 3rd and 4th rd pick trade FA nd then maybe sign Edgerin James to help Portis out and maybe sign D Ward away from the Gmen

Re: 2009 needs
 

I say we sign D Hall and sign Duanta Robinson away from the texans

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=#21Taylor4Ever;520020]Moss would be filthy as a slot receiver. I think Kelly will evolve into a starter, but I'm still unsure about Thomas. Ideally, I'd like to see Kelly-#1, ?-#2, and Moss as our #3/slot receiver.[/quote]

its crossed my mind... just solely the idea of what Moss what be like in the slot....it would be disgusting i hear you...

realisticly not seeing anything from our rookie WRs leaves me with some concern that were not OK at the WR spot...
it will be clearer this year...
but id hate to have to complain about it next season if we dont see production this upcoming season... especially because most here seem to think we shouldnt worry...
im hopeful... but its not like anyone saw something i didnt...because both players seemed invisible this year.

id say.. Trade Randle El (although i dont mind him), Get Rid of James Thrash..
and scoop TJ Housh thru FA but i doubt well nab em..
(along with hoping our OLine problems are fixed in the offseason as well)
Santana/Houshmandzadeh/Thomas/Kelly= Would be a serious core.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=Skins4L;520212]its crossed my mind... just solely the idea of what Moss what be like in the slot....it would be disgusting i hear you...

realisticly not seeing anything from our rookie WRs leaves me with some concern that were not OK at the WR spot...
it will be clearer this year...
but id hate to have to complain about it next season if we dont see production this upcoming season... especially because most here seem to think we shouldnt worry...
im hopeful... but its not like anyone saw something i didnt...because both players seemed invisible this year.

id say.. Trade Randle El (although i dont mind him), Get Rid of James Thrash..
and scoop TJ Housh thru FA but i doubt well nab em..
(along with hoping our OLine problems are fixed in the offseason as well)
Santana/Houshmandzadeh/Thomas/Kelly= Would be a serious core.[/quote]

Why not put El in the slot

Re: 2009 needs
 

seriously??? really??? receivers and running backs? no. we won't win the super bowl next year so let the kids develop.

please.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=Ruhskins;519906]If getting rid of Moss means a pick or picks that are going to help us address the offensive line, I think it is worth it. What's the point to having a good receiver, if your QB doesn't have time to throw it nor does it have a good running game to set up the pass. We could have Randy Moss and our passing game still would suffer (sadly lots of fans - including yours truly and the FO did not think of this and brought in three receivers).[/quote]


At this point we have an age issue along with depth at every position. The lines are old and failing, our defensive backfield is oft banged up, our wideouts unproductive. On top of that we might really need to consider drafting a QB in 2010 if JC is given the boot, a distinct possibility if we don't do anything next season. If we could get multiple picks for Moss I agree with you that we should do it, but I am not sure we will get too many offers for an undersized WR, that will warrant such a move. I don't see anyone giving us quality mutliple picks for a guy that might be past his prime. The acquisition of Jason Taylor was in hindsight a stupid move. We desperately needed those two picks.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=#21Taylor4Ever;520020]Moss would be filthy as a slot receiver. I think Kelly will evolve into a starter, but I'm still unsure about Thomas. Ideally, I'd like to see Kelly-#1, ?-#2, and Moss as our #3/slot receiver.[/quote]

IMO, if the Eagles have proven anything it's that you can be a consistent playoff team with capable wr's. That's what we have. Wr is the most overrated position in football.

Re: 2009 needs
 

I agree that Thomas and Kelly both need to step up in a hurry. If you look around the league at the great qb-reciever tandoms, these guys spend their off-seasons working with each other on timing routes on their own time. There are a lot of little details that can be worked between the qb and reciever this way. Hopefully the rookies are serious about winning and will want to do anything they can to improve. It would be killer to have Moss in the slot running crossing patterns and quick slants. His YAC would kill defenses. As far as the offseason moves for the FO they have to draft heavy on both lines. Maybe trade back for extra picks to grab a LB.

Re: 2009 needs
 

I know this thread is about needs, but some of our top goals should be:
1) Beat the lousy teams on our schedule
2) Go at least 6-2 at home
3) Don't lose two games in a row all season (Falcons did it.)
4) Beat the Falcons, so I can get in the face of all my Falcon fan friends down here

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=PennSkinsFan;519882]Simple answer

Lines -- BOTH![/quote]


i,ve spent alot of long sleepless nights thinking this over and all i keep coming up with is both lines need the most help then add a player here and there elsewhere a 6-5 230 wr would be great too..and no not plexico either.:) ..

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=GusFrerotte;520243]At this point we have an age issue along with depth at every position. The lines are old and failing, our defensive backfield is oft banged up, our wideouts unproductive. On top of that we might really need to consider drafting a QB in 2010 if JC is given the boot, a distinct possibility if we don't do anything next season. If we could get multiple picks for Moss I agree with you that we should do it, but I am not sure we will get too many offers for an undersized WR, that will warrant such a move. I don't see anyone giving us quality mutliple picks for a guy that might be past his prime. The acquisition of Jason Taylor was in hindsight a stupid move. We desperately needed those two picks.[/quote]

Honestly, even if we get a 2nd round pick for Moss, we could trade down our first round pick to a lower 1st round and a 3rd or 4th round pick. This would give us more picks to bring in youth to the team.

Re: 2009 needs
 

MAN - there have been rumors of a secret Shanahan - Snyder meeting... has not been confirmed. regardless - if it is true - found this blog entry pretty funny -

[url=http://theworldsombudsman.blogspot.com/2009/01/coaching-ombudsman-redskins-12-step.html]The World's Ombudsman: Coaching Ombudsman: Redskins 12 step program[/url]

enjoy -#23

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=Ruhskins;520289]Honestly, even if we get a 2nd round pick for Moss, we could trade down our first round pick to a lower 1st round and a 3rd or 4th round pick. This would give us more picks to bring in youth to the team.[/quote]

That makes some good logical sense.

Don't sign Texaco Genius. The only thing he's caught lately is a bullet in the thigh.

Re: 2009 needs
 

the most pressing need we have is offensive line.

the next most pressing need is defensive line.

after those two, we need another linebacker (washington may be done and our linebacker play hasn't been great) and a solid backup runningback. betts didn't look like himself after he got hurt.

our first 3 draft picks should consist of one D lineman, one O lineman and then the third should be a RB, LB or another O/D lineman.

anything other than that will be a fail.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=Todd Bowles;520292]MAN - there have been rumors of a secret Shanahan - Snyder meeting... has not been confirmed. regardless - if it is true - found this blog entry pretty funny -

[url=http://theworldsombudsman.blogspot.com/2009/01/coaching-ombudsman-redskins-12-step.html]The World's Ombudsman: Coaching Ombudsman: Redskins 12 step program[/url]

enjoy -#23[/quote]

is this your own blog...and more importantly, do you plan on taking the Lions' coaching job?

Re: 2009 needs
 

Honestly I don't think trading Santana moss is really even an option. Per the Cap schedule on this site Moss has a pretty big contract and trading him would cost the Skins a lot to do - Schneed or Crazy Canuck or other cap experts - can you provide the cap hit the Skins would take if they did indeed trade him - would it just be the release fee which for 2009 for Moss would be 7.2 million? If this is the case there is no way the Skins could even entertain a trade for Moss.

I think Moss should be retained even if there was no cap implications as he is a great WR that if given even a little room makes the opponent pay big time - look at his return against Detroit that essentially won the Skins the game. He comes to work and never complains, for the most part has great hands and battles through injuries and he is in my opinion a great team player - why trade a guy like this?

Also on trading Betts I thought that running back is one of the easier positions to fill with many draft picks able to come in and contribute right away unlike a WR - so why would a team trade multiple draft picks for a running back that has some history of injuries and fumbling as well as quite a few years of wear and tear when they can go out and sign one via free agency or draft even in a lower round? Yeah it would be nice if some team was willing to trade multiple picks for Betts so we can shore up our lines quicker but I don't think this is too realistic and will most likely not play out.

Re: 2009 needs
 

so what do you all think about fixing our o line with the draft and fixing our d line with FA. we can sign a serviceable lb in FA as well and take care of that next year.

Re: 2009 needs
 

Smoot Smack,

I'll come clean... I am Rod Marinelli.

- Todd Bowles

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=markymark;520306]so what do you all think about fixing our o line with the draft and fixing our d line with FA. we can sign a serviceable lb in FA as well and take care of that next year.[/quote]

I would love if the Skins addressed the oline via the draft. As far as fixing the d line with FA maybe they can add one quality lineman, I just don't want them to break the bank but knowing the market for defensive lineman they will probably have to overpay.

as far as LB - I have seen many mention Dansby and if we can get him for a descent price that would be great.

Overall I don't know how crazy the skins can really be in Free Agency without having to mortgage their future even more. I would like them to start ridding themselves of these huge contracts of players who are not perfoming to what they are being paid - they just can't do it all in one offseason with all the dead cap money they would incur doing it. So over the next 2-3 years maybe the plan is to whittle away the huge contracts and release the highly paid players when the dead cap hit lessens.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=Bill B;520342]I would love if the Skins addressed the oline via the draft. As far as fixing the d line with FA maybe they can add one quality lineman, I just don't want them to break the bank but knowing the market for defensive lineman they will probably have to overpay.

as far as LB - I have seen many mention Dansby and if we can get him for a descent price that would be great.

Overall I don't know how crazy the skins can really be in Free Agency without having to mortgage their future even more. I would like them to start ridding themselves of these huge contracts of players who are not perfoming to what they are being paid - they just can't do it all in one offseason with all the dead cap money they would incur doing it. So over the next 2-3 years maybe the plan is to whittle away the huge contracts and release the highly paid players when the dead cap hit lessens.[/quote]

That makes sense. Perhaps they can have a little patience. I'm happy that they actually used the draft last year. I'm waiting to see.

Re: 2009 needs
 

[quote=Trample the Elderly;520345]That makes sense. Perhaps they can have a little patience. [B]I'm happy that they actually used the draft last year.[/B] I'm waiting to see.[/quote]

Last years draft was a pleasant surprise and I hope they continue to use the trade down philosphy to acquire more picks even more in future years. Hopefully at some point they won't trade mulitple picks away in future years as I think the draft helps teams build depth at an affordable price and also helps the team get younger. free agency should be used to bolster a few positions here and there, but long term sustainbility is pretty hard if you simply try and buy your way to a title year after year.

As far a patience - I have read some on the boards here that Synder is giving Zorn and Cerrato 2 years to fix things. My take is if that even if the team does not make the playoffs next year as long as they are showing improvement towards the end of the year and not fading away the team, coaches and FO stays intact as Synder will allow them to prove themselves the next year. Many have said it takes two full years to truely implement the WCO, so being 50% there why not let itself ride out another full year and see what happens.

Re: 2009 needs
 

what we need is a new owner!

Re: 2009 needs
 

Fly you weren't saying that when we made the playoff's last season... Snyder isn't great but atleast he has a will to win... It could be WORSE (DET, N.O. CINCY) TEAMS WITH OWNERS WHO DONT CARE.